TWG LXXXIX: Simplicity

[Afrobean]

Re: TWG LXXXIX: Simplicity

I'm relatively neutral to A2P, but still gonna have to go with him over panda regardless.

[Gun92]

Re: TWG LXXXIX: Simplicity

I'm relatively neutral to A2P, but still gonna have to go with him over panda regardless.

Why are you voting for a2p now? I may be reading too much into this but your first vote was on Panda, but only after someone had previously posted a safety on him. Then, you switch your vote, without much of a reason, at least that I have found, and voted for a2p, but only after two others had placed a vote on him. Care to elaborate for me please?

[Afrobean]

Re: TWG LXXXIX: Simplicity

Why are you voting for a2p now? I may be reading too much into this but your first vote was on Panda, but only after someone had previously posted a safety on him. Then, you switch your vote, without much of a reason, at least that I have found, and voted for a2p, but only after two others had placed a vote on him. Care to elaborate for me please?

I somehow accumulated like 4 votes shortly after day began.

I don't want to be lynched, and I'd rather A2P be lynched.

[Gun92]

Re: TWG LXXXIX: Simplicity

I was just asking for a reason why the change in votes because I have been gone for awhile and am trying to catch up. I just found it odd that both your votes were those that followed in the wake of a different person voting for that same person, but basically your just voting to lynch someone else instead of yourself?

[Afrobean]

Re: TWG LXXXIX: Simplicity

basically your just voting to lynch someone else instead of yourself?

I thought this was completely obvious.

[Gun92]

Re: TWG LXXXIX: Simplicity

I was making sure it was clear, chill out a little. You act like I'm accusing you of something. Just making sure I have everything sorted out and if that means stating the obvious to get an obvious answer, then I'm going to do it.

[A2P]

Re: TWG LXXXIX: Simplicity

woah wait.

Emerald, my position is that I find manti suspicious enough to lynch. Where did you get the idea that I had no stance? When people were voting for afro I gave you a counterpoint on why he shouldn't be lynched. Thoughts?

[Ruritsu]

Re: TWG LXXXIX: Simplicity

[22:29] ﾙﾘﾂ: With Afro, I'm 50/50.  The reason that Panda posted is plausable, however, it gutsy beyond reason.
[22:30] Clarinet898: true
[22:31] ﾙﾘﾂ: The idea of Afro wolfing his human support and then using that logic to prove humanity is (As afro reminded me several times via AIM) unnecessary, however, if it worked it would be well played IMO at least.
[22:33] Clarinet898: that's true, but it could also be taken into account that fic ais a good enough player to notice if afro would screw up somehow
[22:33] ﾙﾘﾂ: Next is A2P.  Emerald basically accused A2P of being active, a yesman and indifferent.  A wolf that doesn't want to make enimies.  Once again, this is fair, however, the same could be said about U84.  Further, thats the same logic we lynched Tupac under if you recall correctly, and the same logic that Afro tried to get Sc lynched under, which doesn't sit well with me.
[22:34] ﾙﾘﾂ: Finally Emerald himself, like I said above, he followed similar logic to Afro, and since I'm not sure about Afro, I by extension am not sure about Emerald.  Also, his passionate attempt to get afro lynched came from nowhere and was very strong.
[22:35] ﾙﾘﾂ: Until he randomly decides to go for A2P.
[22:36] ﾙﾘﾂ: I don't understand why his opinion changed so quickly, further, he mentioned "talking to a couple of persons" in his reasons for voting A2P, but when I asked him about it, he didn't even make an attempt to try and mention these people.
[22:36] Clarinet898: yeah. i was wondering about that too. he didnt talk to me about it
[22:37] ﾙﾘﾂ: And you know what, I should probably have just posted that.

The above pretty well summerizes my thoughts on the current dispute.

[A2P]

Re: TWG LXXXIX: Simplicity

And the reason why I find manti to be suspicious is because he kept pushing that alliance plan even though all the flaws were pointed out. I know I keep saying that, but it makes me uncomfortable that manti can just be oblivious to the risks.

I know that it's a more likely than not gamble...but there were so many flaws with that plan. A wolf could come to the seered human, or a wolf could IM someone pretending to be the seer, or the psychic's identity could be given away, not to mention the MW possibility.

I wouldn't have been suspicious if manti didn't basically say "hey if the humans lose oh well XD!"

[Ruritsu]

Re: TWG LXXXIX: Simplicity

As a matter of fact, after discussing it with multiple people, including Emerald, I find him and Afro to be most suspicious. Logs below pretty much sum up the reason.

[22:45] emerald3x0: and my radical change was because my initial vote on afro was more or less a test to see how everyone would react to it
[22:46] ﾙﾘﾂ: Thats not the same reason you gave in the thread.
[22:46] ﾙﾘﾂ: Nor is that a good reason to vote on somebody.
[22:46] ﾙﾘﾂ: Well, at least not like that >_>
[22:46] emerald3x0: what do you mean by not the same reason?
[22:48] ﾙﾘﾂ: I finally got around to talk to a couple of persons I wanted to talk to for a while. Out of these discussions, I find A2P the most suspicious. He has yet to take position on anything. <-- That is the reason you gave for changing votes in the thread, and above for that matter, and now here, you've changed your reason to "and my radical change was because my initial vote on afro was more or less a test to see how everyone would react to it".
[22:48] ﾙﾘﾂ: Those reasons are different is what I mean.
[22:49] emerald3x0: what was posted in the thread was why I voted for A2P
[22:49] emerald3x0: the radical change is why I removed my vote from afro
[22:49] ﾙﾘﾂ: That action is one in the same.
[22:50] emerald3x0: not at all
[22:50] ﾙﾘﾂ: Your reason for changing your vote from afro and onto A2P has changed.
[22:50] ﾙﾘﾂ: *Sigh* Thats a difference in opinion, so I'm not gonna waste time.
[22:50] ﾙﾘﾂ: Plus I have to go soon.
[22:51] ﾙﾘﾂ: Don't really want to start a long winded argument.
[22:51] ﾙﾘﾂ: But thats how I feel.
[22:51] emerald3x0: I voted for afro to see the reaction of everyone --> I have seen the reaction of everyone --> I have to remove my vote then --> I can't remove my vote unless I vote for someone else --> Who might be voted? --> A2P is a good choice because...
[22:52] ﾙﾘﾂ: Forgive me for thinking thats really convinient.
[22:52] emerald3x0: I really don't get your point...
[22:54] ﾙﾘﾂ: After your really devoted display of will to get Afro lynched, this sudden change came from nowhere, and I just find you reason for it to be convinient, like it was kind of graced upon you. In other words, I don't believe you entirely.

That.

[DarkManticoreX2]

Re: TWG LXXXIX: Simplicity

The fact that you're bringing up the seer strategies again makes you really suspicious A2P. You haven't taken a stance on anything this whole game. If you wanted me dead, you would have voted me yesterday when I was up for the lynching. Instead, you picked and helped kill tupac.

You've taken no stances the entire game. When I proposed strategies to you d1, you agreed with me and then did nothing about it. When day two rolled around and afro and I fought about the seering stuff, you didn't side with anyone and basically tried not to get involved. Then today rolls around and you pull up with a tiny post

Just one quick point here: If he had a good wolf tactic, and he were a wolf, I would think that he would keep it to himself, so that he could talk it over with his wolf buddies in private. That would be the SMART thing for him to do if he were a wolf. Just throwing that out there.

Which isn't a stance at all. It's basically "hey im active but i don't want to take part in this so yeah do what you want!" - and thats what wolves do.

[clarinet89]

Re: TWG LXXXIX: Simplicity

After much thought and analyzing and conversations tonight, I've come to a few conclusions.

I don't think Afro is a wolf. He hasn't done anything yet that has hurt the human team.

Through conversations with emerald

[clarinet89]

Re: TWG LXXXIX: Simplicity

Oops lets try that again.

After much thought and analyzing and conversations tonight, I've come to a few conclusions.

1. I have been way to inactive during this game. This is a very busy week for me irl, so I apologize for my inactivity. However, I do try to be as active as I can whenever I am on AIM.

2. I don't think Afro is a wolf. I think afro is our best bet to helping us win. He hasn't done anything yet that has hurt the human team, even when he was talking wolf strategy on n1. His arguments against manti were rational, while manti failed to see the holes in his plan and pushed it anyway. That being said, we need to make a decision about manti and we need to do it soon.

3. Through conversations with emerald about A2P, he seems wolfish. With his inactivity, he seems to be playing the role of complacent wolf, as Emerald said.

emerald3x0 (8:52:58 PM):	he seems a complacent wolf
emerald3x0 (8:53:14 PM):	doesn't want to make enemies, so just become friends with everybody by agreeing
clarinet898 (8:53:42 PM):	yeah, that's wolfish
clarinet898 (8:53:59 PM):	lemme read through his posts again
clarinet898 (8:59:53 PM):	wow in the first 7 pages, he's posted like 2 times that were relevant to the game and like twice that weren't
emerald3x0 (9:00:27 PM):	exactly

A2P has been on my wolf list for quite a while and the more that I look at him, the more convinced I am that he is a wolf.

[Afrobean]

Re: TWG LXXXIX: Simplicity

wow

at first I was kind of relieved to see people flipflopping on (read: "off of") me, but now this is just ridiculous

[sc979]

Re: TWG LXXXIX: Simplicity

Okay, I got around to speaking with pretty much everybody. I'll place a vote on manti before going to sleep.