TWG XXXII - Game over (Wolves win)

[talisman]

Re: TWG XXXII - Day 1 (Tass is dead!)

A quick note on the doubt being expressed about an alliance's ability to form... maybe it's because we've been having so many indestructible seer games now, but back in the first few games after the introduction of the master this is how it was, and I think alliances still formed.

The seer has to recognize that his/her powers are essentially worthless if he/she isn't able to communicate the results somehow some way. Eventually a risk would have to be taken whereby the seer would go "ok this person is definitely human I'll go to him/her." And if someone comes back wolf the seer communicates either through votes or accusations from the seer or someone else the seer trusts. I mean, that's just the basic strategy for playing without a guardian and seer being together, and that's how games always used to work, before people figured out that wolves were always going to be too pussy to fake a seer if the real one came out.

[Kefit]

Re: TWG XXXII - Day 1 (Tass is dead!)

Sorry guys, but I have too much else on my mind right now to go through big long thought processes concerning this game, as I have done with the last two. But I will just share a few things that are on my mind:

I don't like the statue - not for its direct effects on the game, but for its indirect. There is so much uncertainty with it - if or when it is found, by whom it is found, if the channeler/seer is still alive when it is found, etc etc. You are all trying to come up with alliance strategies based on definite plans of action with this statue, and I don't think that is going to work. Indeed, I think Chardish designed this game so that alliances would not work in it.

Anyway, I don't like the way that Disco is trying to get us to pool our digs - I think it is pretty clear that such a strategy is far more beneficial to the wolves than to the humans.

[iggymatrixcounter]

Re: TWG XXXII - Day 1 (Tass is dead!)

Don't really have anything as far as voting goes.

I'll go with ddr for now though. He posted about the MW... I mean didn't this guy make it to twg without playing in jtwg? He's also played a couple games too. Why would you ask about the MW?

It's pretty far fetched, I know. I have a few others that I'm looking at but targeting people publically has gotten people VERY pissed at me in the past and almost kicked out of this game, so I'll just keep them to myself for now XD.

[Kilgamayan]

Re: TWG XXXII - Day 1 (Tass is dead!)

Ugh, pounding headache.

I don't like the way Afro has acted so far. He has done nothing but cast suspicion on other players and angrily shoot down ideas without offering any of his own.

[stretchypanda]

Re: TWG XXXII - Day 1 (Tass is dead!)

I'm pretty sure the master wolf is a character fairly unique to TWG. Just because a player doesn't know what it is doesn't make him a wolf, but I guess it's good that you gave a reason.

Afro, when you describe someone's behavior as "Tass-as-a-wolf," are you referring to last game? Because Tass behaved rather out of character for any role I've seen him play. I'm not saying that your suspicions are completely unfounded, but that comparison may not be the best.

With that out of the way, I am tired. There is an hour left in the day (yes?). I would go safety, but safety votes are lose. As far as the pooling of digging plots goes, nforcer has backed off of that idea. I'm not sure if Iggy has backed off or not, and his vote on ddr was... I dunno.. not with great reason, but I'll give him that it's day one blahblahblahblah. I'm voting for DiscoBobby, because he continues to push the pooling digs idea, despite the arguments that have taken place to prove its flaws, and really he's not making much sense. And that might be the need for sleep, it might be his style of writing, whatever. I'm going to bed.

Edit: My first comment was directed at Iggy, but Kilga ninja'd me.

[DiscoBobbyPARANOiA]

Re: TWG XXXII - Day 1 (Tass is dead!)

I'm just discussing the pros and cons because it was obviously not agreed upon by everyone, since the previous two posts had mentioned it and the uncertainty as to whether or not it was going to be done.

I'm not pushing the issue, I'm asking for people to give input, or ultimately vote (which would happen no matter what, it just might not be 'ok, do you vote for yes or no' it may just be an agreement as a majority, which is a vote.

The reason I said 110 was because that number is greater than 100 and that signifies that all the plots would be taken care of. I should have worded it better.

I've played in one jTWG as of right now, this being my second game (it was asked, that's why I'm saying this)

DDR and myself totally owned that game, and I was accepted into this game. I didn't push my way in, so don't make it sound like I did. And if you weren't, my apologies, it's the way it came off.

As for voting for me. That's great, I'm just trying to help get things out in the effing open, and have people agree. If you don't want to pool, and it's agreed, sweet, we won't. All I'm saying is I think it would be more beneficial to the humans since we'll have a FAR greater chance of getting the statue. If you don't want us to have it, great. I do.

Again, I'm not trying to force people to pool. I'm stating facts and asking that a townwide agreement (or an agreement among the majority) be made. I'll follow that, I'm not trying to mess with things.

[iggymatrixcounter]

Re: TWG XXXII - Day 1 (Tass is dead!)

With that out of the way, I am tired. There is an hour left in the day (yes?). I would go safety, but safety votes are lose. As far as the pooling of digging plots goes, nforcer has backed off of that idea. I'm not sure if Iggy has backed off or not...

Even though I thought it was a good idea to pool votes together in the first place, I've been campaigning against it for a couple of posts now. The only idea that I'm still not sure on is what the seer should do should a statue holder ever come out. (Whether he should ignore it or try to set something else up.)

[DiscoBobbyPARANOiA]

Re: TWG XXXII - Day 1 (Tass is dead!)

Oh, and if DDR were a wolf, or the MW, wondering what the MW did, I think he would have asked one of his fellow wolves, don't you think?

Rediculous reason to vote.

[DiscoBobbyPARANOiA]

Re: TWG XXXII - Day 1 (Tass is dead!)

Hmm. Come to think of it though, the wolves lying doesn't necessarily change anything. Say a wolf said it was at X, but dug at Y, and then later actually did dig at X. Now say the statue actually was at X. Either way the wolf gets it before the humans do. And if the statue were at Y? Well, presuming Y wasn't a number that another human picked, then the wolf would get to it first as well. Since there's an equal chance of it being at either X or Y... lying doesn't really change anything. Don't know why I didn't think of this earlier.

It does if all of the plots become 'dug in' as a community. Such that each plot has either been given by another person or by chardish.

Once this happens, the wolves could go back and dig the fake ones they gave out, thus giving them more spots than they would have had they given true numbers. At this point the humans must randomly dig, and the chances of them hitting the 12 spots the wolves witheld would be quite small.

Not trying to press the issue, just stating facts.

[iggymatrixcounter]

Re: TWG XXXII - Day 1 (Tass is dead!)

Oh, and if DDR were a wolf, or the MW, wondering what the MW did, I think he would have asked one of his fellow wolves, don't you think?

Rediculous reason to vote.

You're right disco, but why should you defend him? You don't know if he's a wolf or not. I really don't think he is ultimately, but the fact is, I've never believed that whole "If he was a wolf, his buddies would help him and keep him from saying things" logic.

[DiscoBobbyPARANOiA]

Re: TWG XXXII - Day 1 (Tass is dead!)

I'm just saying, there are much better people to vote for than people asking for information.

I don't know if he's a wolf or not, and he very well could be, but... Nevermind.

I was about to reiterate my post. Just read it again. If you dissagree, I'm sorry.

[iggymatrixcounter]

Re: TWG XXXII - Day 1 (Tass is dead!)

I'm just saying, there are much better people to vote for than people asking for information.

So who's your great person that you're going to vote for?

[DiscoBobbyPARANOiA]

Re: TWG XXXII - Day 1 (Tass is dead!)

I vote for Afro because the only input he's been giving is to accuse people that are trying to help and shooting down ideas. I know this is about exactly what kilga said, but if I would have said 'for the same reason as kilga' I would have been even more of a bandwagon voter. If you still think I am, I agree with the reasoning, for it is logical, so why shouldn't I vote for him?

As a count:

nforcer - 1 (afro)
Afro - 3 (nforcer, Kilga, DBP)
jurs - 1 (blah)
DBP - 2 (Kefit, Stretchypanda)
DDRdanc3r - 1 (Iggy)

[talisman]

Re: TWG XXXII - Day 1 (Tass is dead!)

ughhh it does end soon doesn't it. lame, I thought it was at like nine or something.

list time

Afrobean - definitely struck me as human right away. completely different from how he's played the last two games as a wolf and the same as how he used to play when he would go after tass day one all the time.

Blahblah - seems human. well. seems normal. I lean human though.

DDRDancer - not much input from him, I'd say that he seems human. the master wolf question would be a subtle play for him as a wolf, but he asked these kinds of questions last game as well. but yeah reverse psychology blahblahblah but it's day one, so benefit of doubt.

DiscoBobbyPARANOIA - better than most of the newer players we've been getting, seems pretty human to me... has that whole self-conscious-doesn't-want-to-look-dumb thing going that alot of new players get. could be wrong I suppose, but I lean human for now.

Iggymatrixcounter - tough to say. In fact, I think I lean wolf on iggy. A bit of a vibe really... if I knew how he played as a wolf it would be much more helpful. In alot of ways the way he's been playing seems the same in other ways he seems a bit off. A bit too active? Active isn't the right word... responsive maybe? Dunno. Also his vote absolutely reeked wolf, but I guess humans have been known to make those kinds of votes before too.

JurseyRider - I like what blah said but I also think there's a genuine chance that she really didn't know about all that stuff. 50/50.

Kefit - A whole lot less active, could mean different things. I'd say I'm definitely a little wary of him.

Kilgamayan - like blah. seems normal, aka seems human, aka for now I lean human. I've gone after kilga so many times day one (and been wrong every time) I sort of ignore my feelings early on about his role and wait til late game when there's more evidence to make a judgment.

MattC - he's in the game? oh right london and whatnot. meh, 50/50.

MiniNeo - see above (minus the london part). 50/50. Although really... I have difficulty seeing him as a wolf just in general. but yeah. 50/50, like I said.

Nforcer - seems human to me, I really don't buy afro's arguement at all, but I suppose it could have some merit. this nforcer really reminds me of the nforcer 3 (?) games ago that was active and that got him wolfed day one a few games in a row there.

Omeganitros - I'm suspicious of omega. The guy has professed again and again how much he sucks at being a wolf and I'm seeing alot of the same sort of insecurity-ridden posts that he had that one game where fish (it was fish, right?) called him out early on it. more of a general vibe than anything.

Stretchypanda - Also suspicious of stretchy, but I haven't played with her for a really long time. Posting pattern and type is just what stands out to me... typical sort of one post early, one vote post later type thing, maybe one or two in the middle that don't really say much. Dunno.

Talisman - human.

Wilkin - seems human to me, but I don't know how he plays as a wolf, obviously. his first post was classic wilkin material we've come to expect with all the options weighed and counterweighed and whatnot.

so right now my top suspects are iggy, omega, stretchy, and kefit with the 50/50s floating around in the middle and then followed by kilga or blah then followed by everyone else.

For a vote: iggy, for basically what I've already said. The voting rationale in particular, but also a general vibe I've picked up.

[Afrobean]

Re: TWG XXXII - Day 1 (Tass is dead!)

I don't like the way Afro has acted so far. He has done nothing but cast suspicion on other players and angrily shoot down ideas without offering any of his own.

That's because all anyone is interested in is an alliance, and I really do not believe it can be done this game (sans lone seer coming to people he seers).

Besides pointing out holes in other people's ideas, there is nothing for me to contribute. Would you rather me allow logical fallacies to prevail and me post nothing? I'd say that punching logical holes in people I'm suspicious of is more contributive than MOST of the players have been so far.

And regarding Talisman's plan: I like it better than any of these ideas put forward so far, but don't mistake it for something it's not. Any indication of someone being protected from lynch does not necessarily mean a wolf was protected.

If it were me as a wolf this game, and I got the statue, I'd count on you guys acting just like you are about this and framing someone who had already garnered suspicion and saving them. I'd probably save it for later in the game, but yeah, saving self wouldn't be too important to me. I'd be more likely to want to save someone else, just to make them look even worse the next day and the next day would be completely wasted.

So yeah, I am behind this idea. However, I am not supporting any lynching of people based on someone being saved from lynch or not.

PS I really do not appreciate getting voted for when I'm the one pointing out how these plans benefit wolves more. Then comes iggy who supported pooling everything before and now he's saying "only seer and alliance should pool LOL." This is a given. I do not appreciate such quick flip flopping either, and even moreso, I do not like that no one else called him on it.