Twg XXIX Postgame Wolves Win

[nforcer06164]

Re: Twg Xxix Postgame Wolves Win

Since we have a bunch of people banned... I was waiting until the weekend to start the game. Lent ends Sunday, so that is when Chardish will be back. He wants to play. I'll start the host signup thread Thurs or Fri, and Player signups will be Sunday. That cool with everyone?

No. Though Lent does end on Sunday, Tass, you fail to realize that Easter Sunday is the most important day on the Christian calendar. A lot of players may find it problematic in terms of being able to find a computer at the right time. Roman Catholics may be held up Saturday night as well.

I say open up host signups ASAP, and hold off on signups until Monday. That way, those of us that might get held up on Sunday will be able to make it.

[Tasselfoot]

Re: Twg Xxix Postgame Wolves Win

Meh... While I'm tempted to do signups on Sunday PURELY because it is Easter (which I completely didn't realize until you said it) and it'll screw over all the Catholics... I'm not that cruel.

Monday it is. But you don't see me bitching about if things were going on over Passover (1st night of which is tomorrow).

And while I realize that I am in fact taking Kilga's bait... Kilga, your death was partly your own fault... and in Hans' game as well. Frankly, you SUCK at defending yourself and are overly passive. Its WHY wolves leave you alive for the last day, because they know they can convince someone to vote you and you can't defend yourself against it. There was evidence against you, but as I said to TPS after you died... all the important pieces of coincedence fell against Blah. You need to learn how to defend yourself and accuse others in an effective manner, or this situation WILL repeat itself again. Don't compare your death with mine. No matter how much I could have defended myself (which was 0%, as I was insta'd before I got home), I couldn't have argued my way out of being lynched. Afro's false interrogation was concrete evidence against me. The best I could have done was MAYBE delayed it one day and had Jurs lynched before me. Your lynch was based on overly obvious logic and Blah's ability to be persuasive... mine was based on false information. There is a reason I never get lynched as a human... I can always defend myself against baseless accusations. When I'm a wolf, I often can't, because there actually IS evidence against me (although more often than not, I can still get it delayed multiple days).

EDIT: Also, both Hans and TPS said something in regards to you Kilga (or at least the situation). It was something to the effect of, "Man, if eb/Blah is the wolf, they played well enough to win." Basically, neither one of them was willing to make the harder lynch of eb/Blah, because you made yourself such an easy target. You were winning alot more games when you were highly respected and wolfed early or easily suspected and lynched early. I'm going to go look at something... going to compare how long you live with how well your team does. My guess is the longer you live, the worse your team does.

[Tasselfoot]

Re: Twg Xxix Postgame Wolves Win

1 - wolf, survived, won
2 - human, wolfed night 5, won
3 - human, survived, won
4 - seer, lynched day 1, lost
6 - human, wolfed night 3, lost
8 - mason, survived, won
9 - human, survived, won
10 - human, lynched day 3, won
11 - human, wolfed night 6, lost
12 - wolf, lynched day 5, lost
14 - human, survived, won
16 - human, wolfed night 4, lost
18 - wolf, lynched day 4, won
19 - human, lynched day 3, won
20 - human, wolfed night 5, won
21 - morph, wolfed night 2, won
23 - human, lynched day 1, won
24 - human, survived, won
26 - human, lynched day 7?, lost
28 - human, survived, won
29 - human, lynched day 7, lost

starting with twg 10, its 9-5, including this past game. So 2/3 the time, if Kilga dies day 1/2/3 his team wins and dies night 4+ his team loses. Before twg 10 it is 1-6...

I think that speaks for itself... as I think it was around twg 10 that we started getting into the non-n00b games of TWG, where most people understand strategy and what not.

Perhaps the next time Kilga is in a grouping of 3 with 1 confirmed human, that person WON'T kill Kilga...

[Kilgamayan]

Re: Twg Xxix Postgame Wolves Win

I was just dicking around. Jesus Christ, don't take everything so seriously.

As for defending myself, I did all that I needed to do. It wasn't my idea that Tps completely ignore our AIM dialogue the day after Afro was lynched. If he had stopped for 30 more seconds to think about that and how all the coincidences lined up against blah, the solution would've been obvious.

On the whole, I generally don't defend myself vehemently because I see it as cracking under pressure. Plus someone really shouldn't need to be told something more than once. We're all smart people here, I would hope.

[Kilgamayan]

Re: Twg Xxix Postgame Wolves Win

Double post to provide conversation in question.

Tps7910: Hey.
bjstrattonIM: Hi.
Tps7910: What are your suspicions?
Tps7910: For TWG today?
bjstrattonIM: I'll have to take a look at the players remaining list.
Tps7910: Me, Blah, Tass, Tasuke, Jurs, You,Hans
bjstrattonIM: Right now, if I were to order them
bjstrattonIM: Jurs, Tass, Hans/Blah, Tasuke, you.
bjstrattonIM: Tass would be above Jurs if not for talisman's death.
Tps7910: How so?
bjstrattonIM: I had suspicions that they were working together.
bjstrattonIM: But obviously not.
bjstrattonIM: At least not as wolves.
bjstrattonIM: So Tass gets a bit of a break from me.
Tps7910: What are your thoughts on Tasuke?
bjstrattonIM: I believe I've voiced this before, but I believe he's been too dumb and too inactive to be a wolf.
bjstrattonIM: You and I aside, I'm least suspicious of him.
bjstrattonIM: Granted, Jurs has been inactive, but she has at least posted every day and she's not a complete idiot.
Tps7910: Afro came up as a wolf last night.
bjstrattonIM: Huzzah.
bjstrattonIM: Finally, I was right. ._.;
Tps7910: Unfortunately for you, the 3rd question that he had to answer regarded the name of a wolf, and he named you. : \
bjstrattonIM: I would guess that was a lie.
Tps7910: What reason would he have to lie?
bjstrattonIM: I'm already suspicious in many people's eyes.
Tps7910: He couldn't have lied.
Tps7910: 1. Only if he was the master.
Tps7910: 2. It'd give away he was a wolf
Tps7910: Which isn't worth the return product
bjstrattonIM: He gave away that he was a wolf regardless.
bjstrattonIM: Think about it.
bjstrattonIM: I was the first to vote for Afro.
bjstrattonIM: If we were working together and he knew me, then I would know him.
bjstrattonIM: And why would I dump the vote off on a fellow wolf?
Tps7910: When did you vote him?
bjstrattonIM: I voted him first yesterday.
Tps7910: Before the phantom plan?
bjstrattonIM: Yes.
bjstrattonIM: I wasn't even aware of a phantom plan.
Tps7910: That could have easily been set up.
Tps7910: Which would have been perfect.
bjstrattonIM: Yeah, I would want to set up the lynching of a teammate.
Tps7910: You realize there is no possible way Afro could have lied.
Tps7910: Mead was present and everything
bjstrattonIM: Unless he was the master.
Tps7910: He would have answered like a human then
Tps7910: so we wouldn't know
Tps7910: which outweighs framing you
bjstrattonIM: You know, it's really hard for me to defend myself without knowing what on earth was asked.
bjstrattonIM: I'm not asking to know, I'm just saying.
Tps7910: I have a log.
Tps7910: Here.
Tps7910: You have just entered room "twg."
Fhqwhgads703 has entered the room.
Afrobean16 has entered the room.
Fhqwhgads703: k
Afrobean16: wtf is this crap under the
chat
Fhqwhgads703: go
Tps7910: Ok.
Fhqwhgads703: I dunno
Afrobean16: is it an ad or something
wtf
Tps7910: 1. Are you a wolf.
Afrobean16: no
Tps7910: 2. Are you green?
Afrobean16: yes
Tps7910: 3. Have you met with another
wolf? If so, reveal his/her identity, if not, say
you haven't had any contact with any
wolf.
Afrobean16: haha
Tps7910: Invalid response.
Tps7910: Try again.
Afrobean16: that's not even one
question
Tps7910: I've used it before.
Tps7910: It's been approved.
Fhqwhgads703: IT's valid
Afrobean16: ugh fine whatever
Afrobean16: kilga
Tps7910: Thank you.
Fhqwhgads703: chat over
Tps7910: One question.
Tps7910: Am I allowed to post this chat?
Fhqwhgads703: Yes
Tps7910: Ok.
bjstrattonIM: I can only offer that he was the master.
bjstrattonIM: I can see why he did what he did.
bjstrattonIM: He's dead either way, so why not take a human down with him?
Tps7910 is idle at 5:19:00 PM.
Tps7910 is no longer idle at 5:22:39 PM.
Tps7910: Because it reveals his identity.
Tps7910: Which is far worse than taking down a human.
Tps7910: No offense.
bjstrattonIM: Not necessarily at this stage in the game.
Tps7910: It does matter.
Tps7910: If we thought all wolves were left.
Tps7910: Then it would affect the way we vote.
Tps7910: Now that we know that we have at least one more day
Tps7910: We can plan our lynched differently.
Tps7910: lynhes*
bjstrattonIM: But he knows that there wouldn't be all wolves left.
Tps7910: We wouldn't.
bjstrattonIM: So, instead of risking a situation where another wolf gets voted off, why not force a situation where a wrong lynch ends the game?
bjstrattonIM: The fact that we wouldn't isn't as important to him as the fact that they would.
Tps7910: Why take down you then?
bjstrattonIM: Because I'm an easy target.
Tps7910: Why not tasuke, or jurs?
bjstrattonIM: Because people are gunning for me and not for them.
bjstrattonIM: Plus I'm smarter than them. >_>
Tps7910: Well
Tps7910: You could have easily pre-planned this with him.
bjstrattonIM: Oh, and they have phantoms where I don't.
Tps7910: You could have pre-planned this response with him.,
bjstrattonIM: You think the two of us really could have produced beforehand a response to everything you asked?
bjstrattonIM: I just had a thought, let me read back through the rules.
bjstrattonIM: Okay, so.
bjstrattonIM: Tps7910: 3. Have you met with another
wolf? If so, reveal his/her identity, if not, say
you haven't had any contact with any
wolf.
bjstrattonIM: According to the rules, the wolves are only to meet anonymously.
Tps7910: They may reveal identitys.
bjstrattonIM: If that was allowed, what would be the point of anonymous screennames?
Tps7910: It's just advised against.
Tps7910: In case you wanted contact
Tps7910: but without knowledge of one another
Tps7910: in case of interrogation
bjstrattonIM: If the wolves want to chat, they pm me with a secret AIM name which I will forward to the other wolves, for them to contact under a false name.

bjstrattonIM: That doesn't say anything about "I advise you use a fake name but if you want to use your real one it's okay."
bjstrattonIM: It says "Use a fake name."
Tps7910: I've asked mead.
Tps7910: He's confirmed that they may if they choose to.
bjstrattonIM: It would've been nice to know that beforehand.
Tps7910: It probably would have been nice to know that this entire conversation was a big test on you.
Tps7910: beforhand
bjstrattonIM: Yeah, it would have.
Tps7910: Narrowing down the suspects.
Tps7910: Oh, and btw
Tps7910: The last question had MW instead of wolf
Tps7910: and Tass was named.
Tps7910: instead of you
bjstrattonIM: o_O
bjstrattonIM: Wow.
Tps7910: I know.
Tps7910: Don't tell anyone.
bjstrattonIM: I won't.
Tps7910: I'm leeking info out slowly
Tps7910: I want tass to post in a normal environment
bjstrattonIM: Right.
Tps7910: The more info the better.
Tps7910: I also plan on testing everyone the same I did on you.
bjstrattonIM: Good, everyone else can feel the same way I do right now. >_>
Tps7910: Hehe.
Tps7910: Lets see how jurs responds.
Tps7910: Especially since she is in a rush
bjstrattonIM: Anyway, do you need me further?
bjstrattonIM: I want to go to dinner but I can stick around for a little bit.
Tps7910: No, go right ahead.
bjstrattonIM: k
bjstrattonIM: I'll be back in about 30.
Tps7910: Nothing will be happening
Tps7910: until sunday
bjstrattonIM: Okay.
bjstrattonIM: Jeez, Sunday is a big day.
bjstrattonIM: a0.com apocalypse is Sunday.
bjstrattonIM: My housing selection is Sunday.
bjstrattonIM: Now this is Sunday. >_>
Tps7910: Well
Tps7910: Perhaps late saturday
bjstrattonIM: However it goes.
bjstrattonIM: Be back in a bit
Tps7910: Ok
Tps7910: You there?

Auto response from bjstrattonIM: Not here.

And no, telling me I am here is not going to magically make me stop not being here.

Tps7910: yes it will
bjstrattonIM: I am now.
Tps7910: it worked.
Tps7910: Anyways, Jurs is the last wolf.
bjstrattonIM: Wow, nice.
bjstrattonIM: What a turnaround.
Tps7910: I know.
Tps7910: Saved the conversation.

There was a little more after than but it isn't important to this situation.

[Tasselfoot]

Re: Twg Xxix Postgame Wolves Win

Some things seem worth saying more than once... must have prevented all this unneeded unpleasantries if you had said, "Hey TPS... remember that convo we had where I pretty much proved my humanity to you? Yeah... go re-read that. Blah is the wolf, not me." Or something like that.

Either way... yea. I prefaced my entire above statement with "I know I'm taking the bait." *shrugs* I take this seriously... that isn't exactly news.

[Kilgamayan]

Re: Twg Xxix Postgame Wolves Win

I did, in fact, bring up the convo that day. He chose to ignore it in favor of this:

Tps7910: Not looking good for you.
Tps7910: Haha, change of direction.
Tps7910: Blah is a reason as to why 1 wolf died.
Tps7910: He wouldn't do that as a wolf.
Tps7910: What is your response to that?
bjstrattonIM: It would depend on what he did.
Tps7910: He gave me the questions
Tps7910: that made afro reveal himself
Tps7910: and lead to the revealing of Jurs via aim
bjstrattonIM: I doubt he would've anticipated the Jurs thing.
bjstrattonIM: And Afro probably answered those questions of his on volition.
bjstrattonIM: *own
bjstrattonIM: Operating under the assumption that Afro was the MW, he could've gotten out of that questioning without revealing himself.
bjstrattonIM: He just chose a different route.
bjstrattonIM: Which could very well have turned out to be the correct one, if you think about it
Tps7910: Ok, making my vote.
bjstrattonIM: Take out the best human player and make one of your fellow wolves look really good, just for a situation like this

Our loss.

[Wilkin]

Re: Twg Xxix Postgame Wolves Win

I did, in fact, bring up the convo that day. He chose to ignore it in favor of this:

Tps7910: Not looking good for you.
Tps7910: Haha, change of direction.
Tps7910: Blah is a reason as to why 1 wolf died.
Tps7910: He wouldn't do that as a wolf.
Tps7910: What is your response to that?
bjstrattonIM: It would depend on what he did.
Tps7910: He gave me the questions
Tps7910: that made afro reveal himself
Tps7910: and lead to the revealing of Jurs via aim
bjstrattonIM: I doubt he would've anticipated the Jurs thing.
bjstrattonIM: And Afro probably answered those questions of his on volition.
bjstrattonIM: *own
bjstrattonIM: Operating under the assumption that Afro was the MW, he could've gotten out of that questioning without revealing himself.
bjstrattonIM: He just chose a different route.
bjstrattonIM: Which could very well have turned out to be the correct one, if you think about it
Tps7910: Ok, making my vote.
bjstrattonIM: Take out the best human player and make one of your fellow wolves look really good, just for a situation like this

Our loss.

Looks like SOMEONE didn't pay attention when someone else threw in the idea of Blah finally cashing in on his reputation.

Actually, I don't mean to be mean. Just something I noticed from that convo.

[talisman]

Re: Twg Xxix Postgame Wolves Win

No he knew about that, since I was the one that used that phrase and I was the angel, etc. And he was also really suspicious of blah up to that point when afro said tass.

[Wilkin]

Re: Twg Xxix Postgame Wolves Win

Ah. I couldn't find the post when I looked back, but maybe it would fall under the same category as Kilga's situation of reiterating things.

Of course, by the last day, you (Talis) weren't around to do that, anyway.

[blahblah18]

Re: Twg Xxix Postgame Wolves Win

First of all, I don't know why XXII is even an example. No one cheated. Everyone got mad and quit. Guido raised a very good point: the tribal game ended before it even began. This game was played to the end. That's not to say that things went wrong, but tricks are pulled in pretty much every game. We don't allow people who have real life interactions to play together anymore, because people railed about the unfairness and the cheating involved there, but those games were not thrown out just because one side ended up with an unfair advantage (and they were unfair advantages -- in one instance, the wolves knew all the specials by night two, and in the other, one wolf went out on the first day, and the humans were absolutely certain of it).

Blah's plan was incredible. He talked it over with the host and with a member of TWC, neither of whom saw a problem at the time. Had someone caught the flaw and pointed it out, only to have Blah go through with it anyway, this would be a different story. You can't get mad because someone exploits a loophole. You certainly can't throw out a game that lasted to the end -- especially a one-wolf victory. Give credit where it is due, get over it, and move on.

bump!

[DarkManticoreX2]

Re: Twg XXIX Postgame Wolves Win

Archived 5-21-2014 11:39 AM EST