TWG VII Postgame Banter

[chardish]

This was so much fun. Guido, you screwed your team by revealing a bunch of crap to Stretchy. This further reinforces why I think AIM alliances (or IRL alliances, in this case) are a very very bad idea. People need to use their heads and independent thinking.

Props to Stretchy for posting under Alain's name even while he was away for a long long time. None of you people caught on that only one real, living person was left. Brilliant. Gives whole new meaning to the whole transfer-of-consciousness stuff, and lends a bit of irony to the game's ending itself. I guess none of you would have passed the test if this mission were real. ;)

I'm stopping MVP awards because I think they're pretty biased. It's basically based on who's been telling the host he's been doing the most. In reality the host does not have enough information

But mad props to Stretchy for sleeping with the enemy and winning the game. First wolf win ever where one wolf has died and the team has won anyway.

I'm sorry there were so many delays in the end but a) I've been working late nights at McDonalds and coming home exhausted and b) the wolves had it won from Night 5 on. Writing each plot takes at least an hour, the ending plot took 2 and a half to write (as do some of the more critical plots.) I put this much effort into the plot because it gives the game a lot of character (how many FOXHOUND sigs were there during the game?), gives the players a lot to be interested in, and enhances the quality of the game in amazing ways. It's about all the host can do to keep it cool. That's why I think the host should be first and foremost a storyteller and a judge second. There's not a lot the host does besides assign the roles and moderates the game.

When I host the game's sequel (if I can come up with a good way to be original and not rehash this plot), I'll probably have more time to devote to the plot. I loved this story, and I loved writing it every bit of the way. As you can see, the idea changed shape in my head as the plot went on (there was no CIA or KGB involvement in FOXHOUND, despite what my original idea was), and I'd like to have the entire plot written before the game next time. I will not be in contention for running TWG VIII - I need more time to think about it, and I need a break from this crapload of work I put into this game. I love you guys.

BTW, an issue that should be brought to your attention. The reason I had to go reissuing roles to everyone was because Tass started interrogating people about their PMs right off the bat - mere moments after I sent his out. I didn't think this was fair, and I knew it was a clear violation of the rules. I thought we firmly established after TWG V that YOU DO NOT DISCUSS YOUR PM WITH ANYONE, PERIOD. But I guess Tass didn't learn from it. To be fair, I had to reissue the roles. You guys decide what the punishment should be. Since the host from the previous game traditionally handles signups for the next, I'll follow your wishes in running TWG VIII signups.

So, postgame chat, and also voting on that issue.

NO CAMPAIGNING FOR HOST, EITHER. CHECK THE TWG VIII SIGNUPS THREAD FOR CAMPAIGN INFO.

[GuidoHunter]

I sure did screw us over, but I felt it was a risk that I was willing to take. The thought never left my mind that stretchy really was a wolf, and that she was just getting by while she was with me, but I felt I was being realistic in my assumption otherwise. I guess I should have been tipped off when she wouldn't read her PM's in front of me and how she knew who one was from even though I saw one of the popups come up, but I just figured she was a popular person here and got lots of PMs.

Also, my trying to hide information didn't help too much when stretchy auto-signed on my AIM at home and INSTANTLY got IMmed by both of the other masons revealing more information to me. Seriously, though, eyespew, "How goes the masonry?" is not a good salutation.

I apologize to all the humans for my inaction, though. I never once read through this thread critically, so I was just going day to day, voting on whims or just what I could gather from the recent posts. Hell, two TWG days and three nights have passed since I've come here. Anyway, this is because I'm on break, so I'd rather be doing other things than spending time on TWG.

Because of that, I probably won't be participating in the next TWG, since my break extends to the twelfth; I want to help my team, not just be there as another human. This decision may have to do with me getting tired of it, too. I'm not sure of that myself, but we'll see when signups for the TWG after the next comes up.

Regarding Tassel's punishment, I move for a two-game ban for Tassel, which includes playing and hosting. It was a flagrant disregard of the rules and the spirit of the game. I don't care what defense he has, if he's not going to play by our rules, he's not going to play with us at all. Two games sounds fair enough for me; it's long enough to notice (hell, I actually forgot today that I'd sat out a game), but not obscene, and fitting for the crime (I guess).

Anyway, GJ wolves, especially stretchy, since Afro got owned and alain failed to avoid suspicion (as far as I could tell, at least, and I think that was before stretchy took over). Humans, well, we were unlucky.

Until next time.

--Guido

http://andy.mikee385.com

[evilbutterfly]

and not rehash this plot


Haha, but the real creators of MGS do it! =P

Anywho, I hope my death teaches everybody that WHEN THE GUARDIAN TELLS YOU AND ONE OTHER PERSON WHO HE IS, DO NOT WOLF HIM EVER. If it weren't for me telling Afrobean who I was, all three wolves may have won. Of course, if he had never wolfed me he might have stayed alive a lot longer anyways. So guys, when you are wolves, don't kill special roles that reveal themselves to you!!

And a note on probability: people keep saying how past chances don't affect future chances, but Guido was a mason twice in a row. Before Chardish reset PMs, I was a mason, as was Guido. What are the chances that Guido would be a mason twice in a row? Not very high, but it still happened.'

So, congrats to the wolves. I can't really say they fooled me because I had Afrobean figured out as soon as I died, and I asked him who the rest were so I could watch the game pan out knowing everything. It was surprising how early on the wolves knew everything.

(Chardish already fussed at me for this, but Afro was just telling me things so I'd be able to see the big picture while the game was going on, and I did not let anything slip to the humans I talked to as well (not concerning the game, Chardish. About completely non-TWG stuff, don't worry)) As soon as I died, I asked Afrobean "was it you or Tass?" and he admitted that it was him. Actually, I had been suspicious of him because I could usually order him around and he usually random votes with no problem. This TWG he was being way more independant than ever and was like "who do you think I should vote for?" When I told him a random person to vote for, he didn't do it. However he was quickly "convinced that Tass was a wolf" even though I had nothing for evidence against him, and when I told Afro to change his vote off of Tass he refused. Hence, when I died I figured it was Afrobean.

After my death (and his the next day) we talked about the game and what we would do if we were still in. Early on I said something like "but what about the masons, they might catch the wolves" but Afro told me that the wolves already knew all the special roles. GG Guido :P. I was hoping maybe my death would help the humans win (it did kill ONE wolf, at least) but whatever. I'll be content playing in the next game and hopefully winning there.

Oh, and there's no reason to stop MVP awards. However, I think Panda and Alain both deserve one, perhaps Panda moreso because of how close she got to the enemy, hehe.

[lightdarkness]

Humans lost from day one.

Stretchy was the last person we were going to go for, and by that time... all the masons/humans would've been gone.

And Tass doesn't need a ban, he didn't break the rules.

[evilbutterfly]

Oh yeah, about Tass. I think Guido's idea is kinda good, only a 1 game ban from playing. He can host if he wants, though (and he does want to).

[Tasselfoot]

I completely agree with LD... we were screwed from the start. Guido ol' boy... you need to know your woman better. but, no hard feelings. this game was really fun, and turned out to be quite complex.

problems: emccky told about 5 people he was the psychic... no big suprise he got killed. guido told panda everything... no big suprise the humans lost. chardish's interpretation of his own rule... the 3 humans could have had a stronger 3 votes than the 2 wolves + phantom. an insta lynch is a 100% majority, ending the day earlier when there is 0 hope of the convicted saving themselves... this was not the case today. that more than anything else upsets me. it is up there with kilga ending twg5 a day early.

regarding the changing of the roles: Chardish, why did you neglect to mention the fact that Q quit? Q was a wolf and then quit... and right after that happened you decided to change the roles... not because i talked to LD. and, i ONLY talked to LD, despite your efforts to make it seem otherwise. i'll accept any penalty deemed appropriate.

[Afrobean]

Ok, now a few things make sense. Tass and LD obviously had some sort of PM sharing or something. That's why LD was so sure of Tass when Tass could easily have been a wolf.

The thing that pissed me off is that I got lynch'd basically because I went against Tass. Even if I had been human, I would have acted in EXACTLY THE SAME WAY. It's bull that everyone would assume I'm a wolf just based on the fact that I accused Tass. Whatever, though. It is just a game after all.

Since eb touched on his wolfing, I'll comment. I told Alain that we should keep him alive. Alain didn't listen though. He was convinced that the best plan was to kill the guardian. I don't see why he needed to die if we could know who he was guarding every night and just not wolf them. So, if my lynching is anyone's fault beside my own, it's Alain's. My plan would have had keeping eb alive as long as possible, finding out who he was guarding and avoiding that person. Tass probably would have been wolfed second day, because if I remember correctly eb was unsure if he was going to guard him after the first day and I'm sure I could convince him to not guard Tass. After that, we could just go crazy killing the psychic (emccky), then the masons (LD, Guido, and Jpec, if my memory serves). It would have been cake, that is unless eb figured me out, which he easily could have. Oh well, I'm ranting now and I'm sure no one wants to read all this.

My thoughts on Tass being banned from the next TWGs: I think a ban should be indefinite. He's cheated in the past and still done it this game. I really don't think Tass should be allowed to play unless he convinces the hosts that he's not going to cheat anymore.

Also, Tass, you are wrong. A phantom vote is sufficient to cause an instalynch. If there's an instalynch, the day ends and no more votes count. Why can't you just accept that the humans couldn't win?

[lightdarkness]

Tass didn't do anything wrong, he asked me what I was in the game, how is that cheating? It's not my fault I was a mason, and didn't know what humans were called.

And with us being convinced Tass was a human, we weren't. I was insanly paranoid he was a wolf. But if wanted to have any chance, we had to tell him who the masons were.

It started with me contacting him from the screen name TWG 7 Masons, but then Tass said "Trust is a 2 way street", after talking with eyespew, we decided we had to tell him some information.

I revealed myself to Tass, 2 nights later we told him Eyespew, and at no point throughout the game did we tell him Guido (Although he had already figured that out)

I don't know why everyone is on Tass's back. Just because he plays the game to the best of his abilitiy. He didn't cheat at all this game. If anyone is at fault, it's Chardish for not posting what all the roles were (In terms of the story line).

[blahblah18]

her's my personal opinion...
I think I've been hardest on Tass's actions and methods for all the games, but I think that there might be a reasonable excuse for this one. The way it went down was something like tass mentioning to LD about being a fox, and since LD didn't know the term was foxhound he had to ask chardish... I could see how that would be harmless, but we all know Tass wasn't just saying it for idle conversation. Despit that though, its nothing we all haven't done before, akin to saying , "you human? you a seer?" etcetera... So based on some form of innocent until proven guilty but also considering that he was kinda on "parole" due to TWG V, give him a 2 game ban, but let him host if he wants to. Unless the majority of people here wouldn't trust him as a host, although I would... unless whorli played ;) And so if people wouldn't want him to host, then just give him a 1 game ban. LOL or better yet force him to play in the jTWG game for a while :-p

Now onto this game...
Stretchy did an amazing job and deserves an MVP and like 3 pips for this game unquestionably.
Afro's strat with EB would've been the correct one and he did a good job not jumping on EB day 1 when I gave him the chance to.
Alain I basically knew was a wolf the entire game but could never get him killed, due basicalyl on day 1 to the fact that HansSky didn't come back online and vote him like I was hoping he was going to do, then Tass wouldn't have to vote jpec in survival and Alain would've been dead day 1.

The main fault why none of this happened really though was my own, for not being around the last couple days, because I went upstate and we were supposed to have internet service but there was some problem and we didn't have any. I honestly was suspicious of panda/guido frmo the start and figured one of them had to be a wolf, but since guido was never on and my talking to panda did seem kinda suspici0ous, i couldn't shake the thought that i was jstu convincing myself tht she had to be a wolf merely to prove myself correct... not like it would have made a difference anyhow... although I think I told tass at the beginning that if her or guido didn't die day 2, then one of them had to be a wolf.

Oh well, it was a real fun game, the story was amazing, my personal opinion is that the rules for this game state that it should have been an instalynch but for future games it definately should not be, and for reasons why, you can see the actual TWG thread... basically the whole not a majority without changing votes test. This was the first storyline that I didn't just skip to the bold. Alas, time for a boring sig again. And by boring I mean I'm hilarious, its a great little quote.

[buttonkiller]

you know what.... i have no clue what that crap is

[Afrobean]

By the way, I just finished up the story from the TWG thread. Good job Chardish. Way better than I could do. It was a little long, but that really helped the story.

EDIT:
you know what.... i have no clue what that crap is
It's a game that you weren't part of and obviously weren't following. Because of this, you have NO reason to post here.

[Tasselfoot]

to clarify for you Afro.... what blah said is correct. and, because i mentioned the fox thing to LD (he was the guardian, not a mason....), he didn't know how to respond, so he asked Chardish. then he told me he was the guardian. then Q decided he didn't want to play. all of that collectively resulted in chardish re-doing the roles... not just because of me. and, after the roles were switched, LD was a mason... but there was no way that i knew that 100%. part of me though eyespew and LD were wolves trying to screw me over...

also, i forgot to mention this earlier... before night 4 started (the night i was killed), i told LD that i sent PMs to 3 different people in the game telling them all that LD/Eyespew/Guido were masons, etc... but that they couldn't open the PMs unless i died.... i told him this so that if he was a wolf, he wouldn't kill me... and if he was a mason, his reaction would give him away as such. i never sent any PMs out, but LDs reaction of "if you screwed us over, i will hunt you down and kill you IRL" convinced me he was really a mason. LD is so funny... he takes this game more seriously than i do.

And jeebs... let me host twg8. i'll even host 9 and 10 also, if y'all wish me not to play for a few games.

[evilbutterfly]

And with us being convinced Tass was a human, we weren't. I was insanly paranoid he was a wolf. But if wanted to have any chance, we had to tell him who the masons were.

THAT is why I want Tass to stop playing. The cheating and all that is in the past, but the game centers way too much around him. Thinking like that is BAD and needs to stop. If we play a couple games without Tass, maybe people will learn to stop being so dependant on one player.

[Afrobean]

Yea the thing about coming to Tass when you have a special job is this: It DOES NOT help you win. It helps Tass win. If Tass is human and you come out to him, it creates a great alliance. If you come out to Tass and he's a wolf, though, you've given him information that will basically allow him to OWN the game. I reccomend that NO ONE under any circumstance should come out to Tass just because he's Tass. It's totally illogical.

And Tass, don't argue this. You know it's true. People coming out to you only helps you win, no matter what side you're on. Even though you totally got your butt kicked this game and you knew everything...

[Tasselfoot]

see my post above... panda pwnd me big time... even though i never talked to her.

and, what it all comes down to is this.... for the humans to have a realistic chance to win, SOMEONE has to be in charge of them. be it me, LD, blah, anyone. someone needs to step forward and take charge of everyone. it has just happened to be me the past few games, because i have been loud and voiced my opinions on the subject. trust amongst humans is the only chance they have to win. so, if i'm not playing, someone else will have to take charge... not that it will matter in the 1st game i run. there won't be any blue roles. but, with that, trust will have to play an even bigger role.

[evilbutterfly]

1) buttonkiller, http://www.flashflashrevolution.com/modules/PNphpBB2/templates/PNTheme/images/lang_english/icon_pm.gif. Use it, don't spam.

2) To add to what Afrobean said: it's not that Tass is great at forming alliances or anything. The only reason going to Tass will bring you a great alliance is because everybody goes to Tass. I went to Tass because I hadn't really talked to anybody else in TWG while in a game, so I figured I'd go with somebody familiar that I might have some idea about. I went to Afrobean as well because I know him best of all the TWG players. I didn't reveal myself to Tass just because he was Tass, I did it because he was familiar. I suggest you all familiarize yourself with other players. If we can read each other better, we can trust each other better rather than just go to Tass.

3) Tass hosting looks to be a great solution. His idea is made to bring humans together (I don't know how the game will be, but it's worth a shot). Actually, any idea other than the norm seems to look good now. This was probably the best TWG yet, and I think it's not just the great story, but the new roles and different approach the game took. We should start experimenting more. May be some games will fail miserably, but it's worth a shot, no?

[blahblah18]

fairly well put EB... everyone has new ideas for games, I don't l9oike tass hosting 3 straight games cuz cypher will explode, and what tass said is definately right on.. its not that people need tass to win, but rather people need a leader to win. the games should be called wolves and sheep.. it maeks more sense for wolves to attack sheep, and the humans definately act as sheep just following someoen around.. someone needs to step up as the herder and form some cohesive opinions, run them by others, make educated guesses, and have enough influence that their vote matters. IT really only has to do with Tass because you all let him take that position of power. I feel that I do a good job in not being part of that while still being open to ideas and listening to different oppinions while trying to garner support myself.

[Tasselfoot]

i merely said about hosting 3 games in a row if that is what others wanted... i really don't want to do that either.

and, yes... everyone who is planning on hosting a game in the near future has new and different ideas for the game. i know that when cypher finally gets a change to host, his idea will be excellent (as i know what it is).

PS - blah is my sheep. baaah for me biotch!

[blahblah18]

hahaha you wish man, you wish.s. I"m the one man attempting to maintain order and reason haha

[evilbutterfly]

Sheep, nice one. It seems to be true from what I can see, but I can only really see parts of what others do. I, for the record, never fully trust Tass. In this game I was uneasy telling him that I was guardian, but I knew that if he was a wolf he wouldn't kill me. I didn't even tell him that I told Afrobean, I just said "I told somebody else, so don't try anything." I told Afrobean that I told Tass, however, and I figured if I died then it had to be Afrobean because Tass wouldn't even have anybody to lay the blame on (since I didn't tell him who I told).

Also, in TWG5 where Tass was pretty much the ringleader, I didn't trust him until Alain admitted his defeat. If Alain hadn't admitted to being wolf I still would have thought that maybe Tass and LD were trying to screw us over and that they were wolves. I've never trusted Tass completely except then when Alain was stupid and messed up :P.

Oh, and Tass, some have raised concerns that your grammar/capitalization/stuff isn't so great, and they would be kinda angered if you hosted, for that reason. Hence, if you do host, you must promise that you will go through and proofread the story and all before you post it.

And blah, I didn't agree with Tass hosting 3 games in a row. I'm just saying that we need to stop doing the same old game. Tass has his idea, Cypher (I think) has his idea that would be a major change, and I'm sure there are others. Like, I thought it would be cool to have more wolves (5, maybe) and 2 seers, and the Master Wolf can be seen as a wolf only if both seers view him. I'm not running for host, though, I just figured I'd throw that out there to see what people think.

Speaking of which, may be we should make a thread about TWG ideas? New roles to incorporate, ways to balance it out with new roles and different numbers of people. I'd like to see, all in one thread, how people think TWG should be run. Then we can pull the best of those ideas and incorporate them into TWG, with the sketchy ideas being put into jTWG perhaps. Just a thought, though.

[Tasselfoot]

No worries EB. My storylines will have proper capitalization.

[Kilgamayan]

I've already given chardish a plan to prevent PM snooping in the future. I hope he carries it out in the next game he hosts, or gives it to whoever hosts the next one.

[Tasselfoot]

my plan to prevent PM issues... I WILL NOT BE SENDING OUT PMS! makes life simple, aye?

[alainbryden]

If I had to give out mvp it would go to Stretch for going through with the effort to call me while I was away to keep me updated on the thread and get my opinion, and then post for me. Thankyou all for playing and for being played :P jk.

[chardish]

Okay, Tass, you were NOT simply asking LD what FOXHOUND was. Granted, nobody knew what it was, but the question wasn't "What's FOXHOUND?" It was stated below.

<3 AIM logs.

(00:06:53) Evan: ZOMG PM
(00:07:08) Jay: oh cool
(00:07:12) Jay: Tasselfoot is my choice (NOTE: LD was the guardian before the role switch)
(00:07:17) Evan: k
(00:08:09) Jay: what are you calling Humans?
(00:08:20) Evan: all this will be posted soon
(00:08:27) Jay: now!!!!!!
(00:08:29) Jay: pelase
(00:08:36) Evan: no
(00:08:38) Jay: ****
(00:08:41) Evan: why?
(00:08:42) Jay: i'll "brb' then
(00:08:51) Evan: WHO IS SOLICITING PM INFORMATION
(00:08:55) Jay: :-P
(00:08:56) Jay: noone
(00:08:56) Jay: lol
(00:09:03) Evan: You better not be BSing me
(00:09:07) Jay: I'm not
(00:09:11) Jay: the only person i'm talking to is tass
(00:09:14) Jay: and he hasn't goten his pm yet
(00:13:31) Jay: Tass: i am a FOX*****, you?
(00:13:53) Jay: help me

(00:31:35) Evan: you really should know better though...you essentially proved your humanity to LD because you talked to him before I posted the PM info (an unwise decision by me)
(00:31:54) TasselFoot: uh huh.

Like Guido said, I support the idea of banning Tass from any involvement from TWG8 and 9. I think that's fair. Go back and read through the TWG 5 postgame thread and you'll realize that Tass did this exact same thing and it was firmly established that it was cheating.

Yeah, I did it too in TWG 5. But it was mainly as a one-time silly experiment. I apologized for it, and I didn't do it again. Tass did neither of those things.

[blahblah18]

:(
gg?

[flypie743]

I agree with Guido's idea about Tass.

Yeah, we were screwed since Guido shared everything with Stretchy :<. I have to say I had an alliance with eyespew towards the end, but he didn't have stretchy figured out, and neither did I. I have to say, well played game, stretchy.

[eyespewgreekfire]

I agree that Tass should get a temp ban. I also think that the whole thing with panda and guido was rather unfair. Panda learned of the masons through, although unintentional, illegal ways. The different acess to information that people have is rather unfair. I think that stretchy and guido, as well as tass and whorli, should only be able to play in the same game under these conditions:
1. There is no way for them to log into the other persons AIM, ffr PMs or something by mistake (ie not in the same house).
2. They pledge before the game they will not use their possible unfair advantage.
3. They change their passwords so that they cannot log into each other's account.
This is not the first time that this has been a problem. Tass has logged into whorli's account in the past (not to mention his ordeal with chardish). Panda now unintentionally learns who the masons are, and Guido bases opinions on information he should not have acess to (even though they are wrong. Also, I think this thing with phantom votes in instalynches needs to be amended. The last day was essentially a race to get votes in first. The wolves won on a technicality which should be fixed. I propose these new instalynch rules:
Assuming there are no phantom votes, a player is instalynched when they have >n votes against them when 2n people are playing.
If there are phantom votes for a person who will possibly be instalynched, each phantom vote counts as an additional player in the game. In this protocol, shox would not have been instalynched, since his phantom vote would have added a 6th player to the pool, thus making 4 the number needed to instalynch him.
I also propose that to avoid these situations in the future, we have ffr twg "house rules." This means that official rules for all ffr twg should be written up and posted either as its own sticky or in chardish's twg history thread. I would be happy to write this up if nobody else wants to. (I will ask people to edit it before I post it of course). Any amendments to the house rules can be discussed and agreed upon as a group.


edit: I also want to say that emmcky broke some rules in this game. First he offered to show me his PM (which I of course refused), which isn't quite against the rules, since he did not actually show it. However, he pasted to me a conversation in which Chardish told him some psychic info. When I get home (I'm at my dad's office) I'll post what he sent me. Perhaps a temp ban for him too?

[chardish]

I also propose that to avoid these situations in the future, we have ffr twg "house rules." This means that official rules for all ffr twg should be written up and posted either as its own sticky or in chardish's twg history thread. I would be happy to write this up if nobody else wants to. (I will ask people to edit it before I post it of course).

I'm already working on it.

[lightdarkness]

Seriously, this banning Tass nonsense is rediculous.

He asked me what I was, it was no different than saying "I am a Hum**, You?" It's because I didn't know the role! That isn't cheating!

That'd be like saying "You in the KG*" (Oh ****, i'm in the CIA, I don't know what the last letter is!)

Is that cheating? No.

Let Tass host next game, he can't cheat, and hasn't.

[Verruckter]

Wow, looks who's talking about nonsens. Mr. "I try to find things that don't exist in other people's posts". Sry for "flaming" but that annoyed me so much. Bah, I just won't play next time.

[lightdarkness]

Wow, looks who's talking about nonsens. Mr. "I try to find things that don't exist in other people's posts". Sry for "flaming" but that annoyed me so much. Bah, I just won't play next time.

Hey, I was just trying to find something to vote on, calm yourself.

[chardish]

He asked me what I was, it was no different than saying "I am a Hum**, You?" It's because I didn't know the role! That isn't cheating!

You're wrong, because the reason he asked you that was because he wouldn't expect a non-human to know what FOXHOUND was at that very, very early stage in the game. Nor would he expect anyone to know what FOXHOUND was.

This should be obvious.

[evilbutterfly]

Let Tass host next game, he can't cheat, and hasn't.

I agree with the first part that he should be allowed to host, but you can't say he hasn't cheated. He has cheated in the past and I think he'll probably continue to cheat or "find loopholes" in the rules.

However, I don't think he should definitly host next game. Other people have been waiting to host for some time and may be they should have their chance first. Tass should host eventually though.

[CypherToorima]

I have one thing to ask the wolves. Why did you wolf me? I hardly knew any of you. I don't really consider myself a super stong player like blah are tass.

It's probably going to something lame like "Eh, we knew you weren't going to be gaurdianed" ;__;

[chardish]

[17:37] Evan: riddle me this, batman
[17:38] Evan: if he wanted to know if you were human or not, why did he phrase the question involving a special term from the PM? why didn't he just ask "are you human?"
[17:38] Jay: he shouldn't be banned
[17:39] Evan: answer my question
[17:39] Jay: sec
[17:40] Jay: halo
[17:42] Jay: back
[17:42] Jay: so
[17:42] Jay: yea, he asked if I was a Fox*****
[17:42] Jay: he didn't say, fill in the stars
[17:42] Jay: I could've said i'm a Fox***** too
[17:42] Evan: [17:38] Evan: if he wanted to know if you were human or not, why did he phrase the question involving a special term from the PM? why didn't he just ask "are you human?"
[17:43] Jay: wasn't just from the PM, it was from the game
[17:43] Evan: It hadn't shown up anywhere but the PM yet
[17:43] Jay: exactly
[17:43] Jay: it should've been hoste
[17:43] Jay: posted*
[17:43] Jay: like I did the game before
[17:43] Evan: Meaning, he brought the PMs into it
[17:44] Evan: That's like saying it's my fault you got shot because I didn't give all my friends bulletproof vests
[17:44] Evan: I didn't think it was necessary because I thought that NO ONE WOULD BE SHOOTING PEOPLE
[17:44] Jay: meaning, I posted all the roles before I sent out the PMs
[17:44] Jay: rather... I told all the special roles, in their PM's, what the other roles were
[17:44] Jay: Just don't' ban him
[17:44] Evan: Tempban.
[17:44] Evan: I think it's right.
[17:44] Jay: not from hosting
[17:45] Evan: Yes from hosting. If he hosts 8 and plays 9, which is exactly what he wants, there's no punishment.
[17:45] Jay: He doesn't deserve to be banned
[17:46] Evan: Tempban.
[17:46] Evan: He should sit out two games.
[17:46] Jay: no
[17:46] Jay: I disagree
[17:46] Jay: who the hell is gonna host next game?
[17:46] Evan: It was firmly established after TWG 5 that any discussion of what's in your PMs is illegal, regardless of the precautions the host decides to take
[17:46] Evan: Cypher and Flypie have both wanted to for about 3 games now.
[17:46] Jay: Flypie says she is going to make the game retarded, and cypher wants 24 people in the game
[17:47] Jay: Oh, Guess by those guys putting the foxhound pic in their sigs is illegial, cause you can't bring in stuff from your PM's
[17:48] Evan: When those guys put the foxhound pic in their sigs, the first story post already came out, which had FOXHOUND written all over it. It was no longer solely in the domain of PMs
[17:48] Jay: lol, I voted Guido day 1
[17:48] Jay: lol
[17:48] Jay: so
[17:48] Jay: you are allowed to talk about your PM
[17:48] Jay: once the roles are annouced?
[17:48] Evan: no
[17:49] Jay: you contradicted yourself
[17:49] Evan: but just because FOXHOUND shows up in the PM doesn't mean you can never say "FOXHOUND" once everyone knows what it is
[17:49] Jay: exactly
[17:49] Jay: so if you would've posted the roles
[17:49] Jay: noproblem
[17:50] Evan: if i don't lock my doors, it's still against the law to come into my house and take my stuff
[17:51] Evan: regardless of the precautions i put in place, cheating is cheating
[17:51] Jay: It's your definition of cheating against mine
[17:51] Evan: we'll see what the others have to say

[flypie743]

[17:45] Evan: Yes from hosting. If he hosts 8 and plays 9, which is exactly what he wants, there's no punishment.

Agreed. He should sit out for two games-hosting and playing.

[eyespewgreekfire]

is everyone here forgetting about emmcky? I think he should get a temp ban too. Here is what he pasted to me: (note: this is not full convo, just the incriminating part)
pntblr54: complete proof i am the psychic
pntblr54: pntblr54: You have no new messages. < im not supposed to be seeing that XD<HR>Auto response from Sindacollion: you are mine besides<HR>
Sindacollion: I was just about to PM you
Sindacollion: So I guess I'll tell you here
Sindacollion: 3 wolves left
pntblr54: k
pntblr54: ahh
pntblr54: ok

[blahblah18]

I gotta agree with Chardish on this one... I also think Jay wants Tass to host for personal reasons immediately which is making the whole thing seem kinda weird.

Awesome how Cypher consideres me a good player even though my win % is ridiculously bad so therefore I must really suck

24 people won't make the game bad LD, we have plenty of players that will play it and in a kinda combo of cypher's (my) idea and Tass's, you can have 3 wolves and a Serial Killer and then you would only need 20 players, which as we all know would be ridiculously easy to get... Or I could host and have some real cool ideas but I wouldn't put time into the stories cuz I just don't have good ideas in that realm, I"m always more of a gameplay guy myself, but heh thats why i'm not asking to moderate.

[roopert]

I also agree with the two game ban for Tass. Yes, Chardish should have posted all of the roles before he sent out the PMs, but that still doesn't give Tass the right to go around it and find a loophole to use to his advantage. It was Just like in game V, he doesn't view it as being wrong and defeating the entire point of the game, rather clever and innovative. I saw him make a post, and while I'm not going to go find it to quote, it said this game isn't about fun, but about winning. That might have been in last game, I'm not sure. I just remember him saying that and going "WTF?". Well, if winning is all you care about, I'll make you a nice pretty banner in paint with a cool title such as "KING OF THE WORLD" or something else to help your ego. Do you think you are the only one who can come up with clever ways to cheat? It really isn't that hard. Yes, you have to do a little bit of thinking, but anyone who sets out to get an unfair advantage and has someone who views the game in the same way they do (LD) can easily do it. Why don't they then? Not because they can't; they would rather play the game with some dignity and win, or lose, fair, knowing they had just as good a chance as someone else to win, and they only lost because they were outplayed. Quit ruining the game for everyone else by trying to cheat so you can get a cool looking sig.

As for new game ideas, I'm all for that. I would love to see some new and innovative ideas incorporated into the future games. I don't want to host, but one of the ideas to be thrown out there is have no seer or masons, instead have one or two humans who, if attacked, somehow fend off the wolves and kill one of them and stay alive, or die with them. Could be interesting, not sure how well it would work.

Chardish, awesome story.

EDIT: Sorry thank sounded a bit harsh, Tass. I just thought it was the best way to get my point across nice and clear.

[Kilgamayan]

It's because I didn't know the role!

That's exactly why it's cheating.

And with the way you've been acting about this, I'm starting to think you have ulterior motives for Tass not getting banned.

[HansSky]

I'm still stuck on my two picks for wolves these last two games. First game, Cypher. Last game, stretchy. I'm seriously starting to think that all of this 'guessing' isn't just a coincidence anymore.

Don't worry, I'll get over it.

And people: When I said I had IRL issues that prevented me from taking this game so seriously, and making me rack up votes, I wasn't lying. I wouldn't do that **** just to get people's votes off of me. I think that's wrong, to use RL as an excuse to keep you in the game longer. Sure, I wouldn't have minded if I didn't get lynched, but I WASN'T LYING.

Ok, now on to current events.

I really don't like what I'm hearing, and I think Tass needs a break from the game period. Not indefinite, but a few(2) games. No hosting, no playing. So many people are tired of people playing ring around the rosie as he sings and dances. That's not what this game should be about. I think he needs a break, and I moreso, I think WE need a break from him.


[[17:46] Evan: Cypher and Flypie have both wanted to for about 3 games now.
[17:46] Jay: Flypie says she is going to make the game retarded, and cypher wants 24 people in the game


GG LD. I love how you make it sound like the game will suck if Cypher hosts. Flypie said she'll make it retarded. Ok, there are other choices. O noes...we can't pick Cypher because his game will have 24 PEOPLE. WOW. THE ICEBERG HAS HIT. WOMEN AND CHILDREN FIRST.

No. I'm very interested in what Cypher is willing to do with the game. Yes, I am also curious what Tass has to say, but not without punishment. Let him sit out two games(COMPLETELY), and then he can host if he wants.

[flypie743]

[[17:46] Evan: Cypher and Flypie have both wanted to for about 3 games now.
[17:46] Jay: Flypie says she is going to make the game retarded, and cypher wants 24 people in the game


GG LD. I love how you make it sound like the game will suck if Cypher hosts. Flypie said she'll make it retarded. Ok, there are other choices. O noes...we can't pick Cypher because his game will have 24 PEOPLE. WOW. THE ICEBERG HAS HIT. WOMEN AND CHILDREN FIRST.


I never said I would make the game retarded. I have no idea what he is talking about.

[Tasselfoot]

whatever y'all decide, i'm fine with. you want me out for 2 games, i'm out. you want me only not to play, i'll host. i have multiple great ideas, including my current proposal for twg8, with the storyline thought out fairly well so far.

and, as far as i know, LD has no extra incentive to defend me. i have no asked him to, i have not promised him anything, nor will his defense of me gain him any favors if/when i host a twg.

[Tps222]

I say that whoever participated in TWG 7 should vote on Tass's fate, as it seems he is willing to serve whatever his penalty is.

[evilbutterfly]

a few(2) games

No. A few is 3. 2 is a couple.

And how about let's stop arguing about whether he should be banned from hosting. A temp ban from the game is fine with me, but I think the hosting should be left to vote as usual. He can try and host, but if nobody votes for him (and from the looks of it, people won't) then oh well, he won't host.

[lightdarkness]

24 people will be chaos.

Too many humans, will take to long, to many wolves will guarentee victory.

16 is the perfect number.

And I said retarded because she said "I have some tricks up my sleve" or whatever. She won't tell me what the storyline will be about, nor what roles will be involved. Thats why I called it retarded.

If Tass gets banned, I doubt I will play, because I personally don't like the way the others that want to host are approaching. Perhaps if flypie says what she plans on doing, i'll vote/play. But until then, count me out.

[Kilgamayan]

Stop trying to pass this game off as if the entire process of setting it up and playing it revolves solely around you and/or Tass.

[lightdarkness]

Stop trying to pass this game off as if the entire process of setting it up and playing it revolves solely around you and/or Tass.

Um, it doesn't.

I just don't like the way it's going to be played. It's not like others will follow.

[evilbutterfly]

The 24 person game will have 3 teams, if I understand correctly. There won't be too many wolves, there will be more confusion and more fun, I think.

[lightdarkness]

Well then, people need to explain how they would run the game, because just hearing bits and pieces from various sources doesn't help

[roopert]

If you find 24 ACTIVE people then it will work fine. Sign-ups last less than an hour these days. Finding 24 is easy. Find 24 good players is a bit more challenging.

[chardish]

Excuse me, LD? Flypie won't tell you what she has planned because she wants it to be a surprise. You therefore assume she's going to screw everything up and you claim that "she said it's going to be retarded."

You're being very, very aggressive about this. Squeek has even just put in his bid for host as well.

I propose that Tass be banned for the next 2 games from either playing or hosting. All in favor, say aye. All opposed, say nay.

Emccky is also guilty of sharing private communications from me with others as well. I propose that he be banned for the next 2 games as well.

I'm not going to make claims about who should and shouldn't be allowed to vote but if you're not a TWG regular it would be in your best interests to keep your mouth shut.

I vote YES on 2-game ban for Tass.
I vote YES on 2-game ban for Emccky.

If you want a longer ban period, make your beliefs known and if there's enough support, we'll adopt that timeframe instead.

[lightdarkness]

Nay for Tass, Yay for Emccky.

I don't care what you think, I'm not voting for something I don't know about. Would you vote for a president that said "Vote for me, trust me, i'll be good."

Stop ****ing jumping on my back.

[chardish]

Would you vote for a president that said "Vote for me, trust me, i'll be good."

No, but I wouldn't call her ideas "retarded" until I had heard them.

[flypie743]

YES for emccky.
YES for Tass.

[whorlichan]

I'm not going to vote on this--two games and a bias does not really give me the right mindframe to do so. I will let you all know that if Tass is allowed to host his game (whether next, or in two games, or whatever) it sounds like an excellent idea and I will be joining it if I can make the sign-ups in time.

I haven't played in the last several games because I've been busy (moving across the country and starting at a new school take up loads of time) but I do want to come back and join more TWGs when I'm settled. Yay for wolfdom!

[eyespewgreekfire]

Yes for Tass, Yes for Emmccky
And, LD, if you ever host a TWG again, how about Family guy theme?
It would fit perfectly with tass's lone wolf idea also, with stewie being wolf. A bit of writing skill and we have utter hilarity. (yes I know this is semi off topic)

[HansSky]

YES for Tass.
YES for emccky.

[CypherToorima]

ld, how do you know 16 is the "perfect number" We've played once with 21, it was a bit drawn out, but there weren't 3 teams. I've sent Chardish my basic outline. Once he posts it, you'll have your explination.

[lightdarkness]

ld, how do you know 16 is the "perfect number" We've played once with 21, it was a bit drawn out, but there weren't 3 teams. I've sent Chardish my basic outline. Once he posts it, you'll have your explination.

I've said before, I think 24 is too many.

k?

[Afrobean]

My thoughts on Tass being banned from the next TWGs: I think a ban should be indefinite. He's cheated in the past and still done it this game. I really don't think Tass should be allowed to play unless he convinces the hosts that he's not going to cheat anymore.
No one else seems to share this opinion, though.

Whatever though 2 games of not hosting and not playing is ok with me. Two games for emccky sounds fair too.

[blahblah18]

LD you're missing the point.. read the sticky man... you don't nkow the ideas yet for the TWG's cuz we were told specifically not to advertise them.. chardish will list each person that wants to host and his/her idea when signups open... you got your sneak peek at mine/cypher's though.. basically its 24 people 3 teams, so there are 2 killings a night... game time is exactly the same and usually 1 day quicker actually.

This is tough for me but if these are the choices I will vote
YAY tass (but I think for the second game he can try hosting, doesn't mean yhe'll be chosen)
YAY emccky (although I think it should only be a 1 game suspension considering Tass got a warning at least)

[roopert]

I vote yes for Tass and no for emccky. This was emccky's first offense and the game didn't change for what he tried to do thanks to EB.

[eyespewgreekfire]

I think afro does have a point. This is strike 3 for tass and cheating. 1. Looking at whorli's PM
2. Letter games with Chardish 3. The deal with LD in this game. Although a permaban is rather harsh, and I personally think 2 games is fine for now, I think that if tass cheats ever again, permaban. He takes winning too seriously, at the expense of the game.

[Afrobean]

This was emccky's first offense and the game didn't change for what he tried to do thanks to EB.
Good point. I'm changing my vote for emccky to no penalty. However, my vote for Tass to be banned from the most possible games still stands.

[alainbryden]

I think Tass, LD and Emmcy are wolves.

oh wait.

and I obstain my vote.

[lightdarkness]

I think Tass, LD and Emmcy are wolves.

oh wait.

and I obstain my vote.

Your attempt at humor failed.

[Tsuteto]

Meh, probably the only part I read of this game was between Afro and Tass, their PM thing. It was quite funny.

Must... sign up... for next game. I'm going to kill somebody if they post the times during my school hours.

[Omeganitros]

Must... sign up... for next game. I'm going to kill somebody if they post the times during my school hours.


I've been there, man. I've been there...

[roopert]

Funny, me too :). I'm pretty sure they have remedied that though.

[Tsuteto]

Funny, me too :). I'm pretty sure they have remedied that though.

Doubtful. I mean, everyone lives in different timezones. That and they have different things to do throughout the day.

[CypherToorima]

I think ld needs a nap

[lightdarkness]

I think ld needs a nap

Shut the **** up, you have no idea what i'm dealing with.

[Tsuteto]

I think ld needs a nap

Shut the $*%# up, you have no idea what i'm dealing with.

No, but we can wonder :D

[lightdarkness]

Has it been annouced when sign ups will start? I can't seem to find it, and I want to be sure I'm in.

[Tsuteto]

I can't believe I might say this to an admin...

Take your cursor, point to this threads link. Good. Now go to the top stickied link. Click it. Now read and enjoy.

[lightdarkness]

I can't believe I might say this to an admin...

Take your cursor, point to this threads link. Good. Now go to the top stickied link. Click it. Now read and enjoy.

Yea, that was yesterday. I didn't know if it was posted in this thread. Idiot.

And that comment on page 5 was uncalled for.

[Tsuteto]

I'm sorry?
...
...
...
Well, not really.

[lightdarkness]

Great, i'm so glad you care.

[Tsuteto]

You're welcome.

Oh, and to stay on topic... I still think the little argument between Tass and Afro was funny.

[GuidoHunter]

Yea for Tass.
Nay for emccky. Maybe a one game ban, but like blah said, it's a first offense, and if this doesn't get through to him, then it's serious.

--Guido

http://andy.mikee385.com

[evilbutterfly]

Hey guys, how about you stupid acting like little children and stay on topic.

YES for Tass, though I think he should be able to try to host. He won't get enough votes anyway, so it won't matter either way.

NO for emccky. I cheated in TWG5 and nothing happened. Others have cheated in the past and nothing happened. Also, there hasn't been a really official declaration of the rules yet, so those who haven't really played much before don't know all the rules 100%. I think this should just be a warning. Any further badness and he gets a temp ban.

And yeah, if you want to post your own ideas for hosting and all that, go to the thread I made. Keep all that discussion out of this. Also, Tsuteto, repeatedly saying the convo was funny is NOT staying on topic. And I better get in on the next game! I've died Night 1 and 2 in the past two games, and I want to actually play next time!!

[lightdarkness]

There needs to be more rules for TWG.

Like a warning system, what is defined as cheating, and soforth.

[Tsuteto]

And yeah, if you want to post your own ideas for hosting and all that, go to the thread I made. Keep all that discussion out of this. Also, Tsuteto, repeatedly saying the convo was funny is NOT staying on topic. And I better get in on the next game! I've died Night 1 and 2 in the past two games, and I want to actually play next time!!

Yeah, I know. But it's more on topic if I say it than don't.

And I know what you mean. From the jTWG, I got killed the first night. I'm just saying that it was because the wolves feared me. XD

[lightdarkness]

I would like the use this thread to appoligize for my behavior yesterday. I was out of line, and it was uncalled for.

I was having an EXTREMELY rough day yesterday, for reasons I would rather not go into on the forums. I'd be glad to chat on AIM about it, as it will help me cope.

But still, Tass should be allowed to host.

[Tsuteto]

Meh, you're allowed to have bad days. That's one of the reasons why I rarely care as to how my life goes though.

As for this whole Tass ordeal... I'm not saying anything about this, mostly due to me not knowing what has happened. I'll have to go back and read the TWG.

And yay! I should be able to signup! 5:00 PM EST is 3:00 PM MST, which is my time I believe.

[stretchypanda]

see my post above... panda pwnd me big time... even though i never talked to her.

At least not about anything related to the game.. and I'm told you sent the one conversation we had to someone else for "analysis."

As much as Tass annoys me during this game (I wanted to keep you alive to the end just to rub that "allstar" bull**** in your face), I don't think he should be banned. He takes it FAR too seriously, but it should be his choice to quit playing, not ours.

AS FOR THE REST OF YOU:
The fact that you follow someone so blindly makes it outrageously easy to kill you. This game was put in the CT forum because it was supposed to spark our creativity and (dare I say it!) ability to THINK CRITICALLY. I'm starting to agree with Q that it should be taken from this forum, because it really has nothing to do with critical thinking. Yes, this latest story was excellent and should have inspired us to great works of thought and roleplaying, but it DIDN'T. It was a bunch of sheep following the sort-of intelligent-sounding guesses of one person. I'm suspicious that LD continued to rely on Tasselfoot's judgement even after we killed Tass. That's freaking ridiculous, people. Play this game for YOURSELF. The power you give Tass makes it possible for him to manipulate any of you, whether he is a human or a wolf.

Chardish mentioned getting rid of alliances. All I have to say about that is, in the real game, with cards, a narrator, and people sitting in a circle in their living room, there are no alliances. I'm a purist. Whatever.

And as for this nonsense about my gathering of information being illegal. Bull. Guido originally told me he was human. The conversation went a little like, Panda: "Damn, nothing special. Again. You?" Guido: "Nope. I was a mason last time." And then I voted for LD and Jpec died. Jpec had been a mason before the role-reassigning, and Guido got a little confused and thought he, LD, and Jpec were masons, so he mentioned that he'd messed up in letting Jpec die, and when I asked why, he told me he was a mason. After accidentally signing into AIM under Guido's screenname (curse you, auto log-in!), I got the already mentioned IMs from LD and Eyespew. Guido told me LD was a mason so that I wouldn't vote to lynch him anymore. You make it sound like I performed sexual favors in return for the information I received. There was nothing illegal about it -- that kind of information is shared in alliances, and I (albeit accidentally and unwillingly) found myself sort of wedged in an alliance. I will admit I felt sort of ashamed when, after being asked if he had seen my PM, Guido replied, "No, we have honor." Oops.

As for killings.. Cypher was kind of a random pick. At the time the vote to kill him was sent, Alain didn't even know he was playing the game. I just mentioned to Afro that I thought Cypher would make a good night 1 (and then I felt guilty when I learned about your cool siggie). Afro, I think, thought all the wolves had to send in a PM about who should die, so he PMed Chardish and told him to kill Cypher. Whoops. Game on! Sorry, buddy.

I should mention, now, that I had an elaborate post typed up, but my computer has been blocked from the intarweb, so I'm using my roommate's computer. Sigh.

Anyway. After night 1, things got tricky. The three wolves had one AIM chat together where we shared strategy. Then we decided that, since I would be at Guido's house for a large part of the game, conversation with me and either Alain or Afro would be too risky, since (to Guido's knowledge, at least), I've never spoken to either of them, and since Guido knows I think the alliances are a bad idea, he'd know I couldn't have any good reasons to talk to them at this point. So when I left for Waco, all I knew was that EB was the guardian and he was the next pick for a violent death. :/ I was tired enough when Guido announced the next death that I actually found it kind of hard to feign surprise.

When I found out the special roles (save for Eyespew), I had maybe five minutes to myself, while Guido was distracted by family, to have a quick IM conversation with Afro and to send very cryptic, short PMs to Alain giving him the information I had, and a tidbit I'd picked up reading over Guido's shoulder (Eyespew: If me or LD dies, it was Tass). Alain chose the next two kills (Emccky and Tass), and the night I left Guido's house was the night Alain went out of town. He sent me a PM with his plan for the rest of the game, his password, a phone number where I could reach him, and a post he'd written.

This is where I panicked. I didn't think I could do it -- I had to work, I had to avoid the suspicions of my boyfriend, and now I had to be two people?

But, like I said, the blind following the blind made it pretty easy. I just had to play into the image of the simple-minded girlfriend-of-genius many people have made for me, and watch how the bandwagons went. Instalynches became my best friend.

While I ultimately enjoyed playing this, and got lots of laughs from my conversations with clueless humans...
Panda: I think you're right about Afro, Blah, and Hans
Eyespew: It's definitely more information than we've had any other game. Being a mason lets you use the process of elimination.
(note: above conversation is from memory, all the logs are on my worthless, blocked computer)
...I will most likely be sitting out for a while. School is starting, and I have to get my ass in gear if I have a prayer of successfully transferring to a much, much better school. I've also been cast in a play that will take up most of my time starting Monday, and I'm still on the crew team, and spring is always very busy for us. So it's possible that I may come here just to play or to watch Guido on the cam I got him for Christmas. =)

Thank you many, TWG.

[blahblah18]

well said , and I don't think I'm a follower, despite how much tass wishes I would baa, but you make the correct arguemnt, and i hope some people take it to heart.

[Afrobean]

If I had stayed in the game, I would have been sure to NOT wolf Tass. That's another mistake I think Alain made. If Tass never got wolf'd, eventually all the humans would be like "OK, Tass would be wolfed under all circumstances except if he's a wolf." Then Tass would get lynch'd. That would be an even greater blow to Tass ego than merely not winning- his team losing and him gettting lynch'd.

Also:
A lot of stuff that I'm not going to quote
Very well put.

[evilbutterfly]

At least not about anything related to the game.. and I'm told you sent the one conversation we had to someone else for "analysis."

As much as Tass annoys me during this game (I wanted to keep you alive to the end just to rub that "allstar" bull**** in your face), I don't think he should be banned. He takes it FAR too seriously, but it should be his choice to quit playing, not ours.

AS FOR THE REST OF YOU:
The fact that you follow someone so blindly makes it outrageously easy to kill you. This game was put in the CT forum because it was supposed to spark our creativity and (dare I say it!) ability to THINK CRITICALLY. I'm starting to agree with Q that it should be taken from this forum, because it really has nothing to do with critical thinking. Yes, this latest story was excellent and should have inspired us to great works of thought and roleplaying, but it DIDN'T. It was a bunch of sheep following the sort-of intelligent-sounding guesses of one person. I'm suspicious that LD continued to rely on Tasselfoot's judgement even after we killed Tass. That's freaking ridiculous, people. Play this game for YOURSELF. The power you give Tass makes it possible for him to manipulate any of you, whether he is a human or a wolf.

Chardish mentioned getting rid of alliances. All I have to say about that is, in the real game, with cards, a narrator, and people sitting in a circle in their living room, there are no alliances. I'm a purist. Whatever.

And as for this nonsense about my gathering of information being illegal. Bull. Guido originally told me he was human. The conversation went a little like, Panda: "Damn, nothing special. Again. You?" Guido: "Nope. I was a mason last time." And then I voted for LD and Jpec died. Jpec had been a mason before the role-reassigning, and Guido got a little confused and thought he, LD, and Jpec were masons, so he mentioned that he'd messed up in letting Jpec die, and when I asked why, he told me he was a mason. After accidentally signing into AIM under Guido's screenname (curse you, auto log-in!), I got the already mentioned IMs from LD and Eyespew. Guido told me LD was a mason so that I wouldn't vote to lynch him anymore. You make it sound like I performed sexual favors in return for the information I received. There was nothing illegal about it -- that kind of information is shared in alliances, and I (albeit accidentally and unwillingly) found myself sort of wedged in an alliance. I will admit I felt sort of ashamed when, after being asked if he had seen my PM, Guido replied, "No, we have honor." Oops.

As for killings.. Cypher was kind of a random pick. At the time the vote to kill him was sent, Alain didn't even know he was playing the game. I just mentioned to Afro that I thought Cypher would make a good night 1 (and then I felt guilty when I learned about your cool siggie). Afro, I think, thought all the wolves had to send in a PM about who should die, so he PMed Chardish and told him to kill Cypher. Whoops. Game on! Sorry, buddy.

I should mention, now, that I had an elaborate post typed up, but my computer has been blocked from the intarweb, so I'm using my roommate's computer. Sigh.

Anyway. After night 1, things got tricky. The three wolves had one AIM chat together where we shared strategy. Then we decided that, since I would be at Guido's house for a large part of the game, conversation with me and either Alain or Afro would be too risky, since (to Guido's knowledge, at least), I've never spoken to either of them, and since Guido knows I think the alliances are a bad idea, he'd know I couldn't have any good reasons to talk to them at this point. So when I left for Waco, all I knew was that EB was the guardian and he was the next pick for a violent death. :/ I was tired enough when Guido announced the next death that I actually found it kind of hard to feign surprise.

When I found out the special roles (save for Eyespew), I had maybe five minutes to myself, while Guido was distracted by family, to have a quick IM conversation with Afro and to send very cryptic, short PMs to Alain giving him the information I had, and a tidbit I'd picked up reading over Guido's shoulder (Eyespew: If me or LD dies, it was Tass). Alain chose the next two kills (Emccky and Tass), and the night I left Guido's house was the night Alain went out of town. He sent me a PM with his plan for the rest of the game, his password, a phone number where I could reach him, and a post he'd written.

This is where I panicked. I didn't think I could do it -- I had to work, I had to avoid the suspicions of my boyfriend, and now I had to be two people?

But, like I said, the blind following the blind made it pretty easy. I just had to play into the image of the simple-minded girlfriend-of-genius many people have made for me, and watch how the bandwagons went. Instalynches became my best friend.

While I ultimately enjoyed playing this, and got lots of laughs from my conversations with clueless humans...
Panda: I think you're right about Afro, Blah, and Hans
Eyespew: It's definitely more information than we've had any other game. Being a mason lets you use the process of elimination.
(note: above conversation is from memory, all the logs are on my worthless, blocked computer)
...I will most likely be sitting out for a while. School is starting, and I have to get my ass in gear if I have a prayer of successfully transferring to a much, much better school. I've also been cast in a play that will take up most of my time starting Monday, and I'm still on the crew team, and spring is always very busy for us. So it's possible that I may come here just to play or to watch Guido on the cam I got him for Christmas. =)

Thank you many, TWG.

QFT

And Afrobean, I think that would have been a better idea as well. You could have easily pinned it on Tass because people think he'd immediately be wolfed. When the psycic was killed, they had no way to know for sure that you were a wolf.

[Tasselfoot]

well said also panda... but, a few things.

1. i think i talked to you for about 20 seconds before you left for waco, and not about TWG... so, i had no twg conversation with you this game...
2. i talked with alain for about 20 seconds also. it went like this... Blah: i told Alain we all jumped on him. Me: WTF would you do that for?!?! Alain then votes for me... I IM Alain and try to reason with him (obviously that wouldn't do any good, same thing with Afro... but at least he got his just due)
3. who followed me blindly? EB told me and Afro he was the guardian... good plan in theory, in that 1 was the wolf, and that person was lynched for killing him... LD (and later eyespew) came to me as a mason... and i worked WITH him this game. in no way did any of the masons follow me blindly. i figured out on my own that guido was the 3rd, but i was never told that. nor did i talk to guido at all this game either.
4. i'm fairly confident that had you kept me alive, at least alain would have died. most likely you would have still won panda, but it would have just been you, and it would have been close. of course this is just my opinion...

[flypie743]

Are people from the jTWG allowed to sign up for the real TWG?

[Tsuteto]

Hey, I've already been killed the first night, so I'm pretty sure I'm allowed.

[flypie743]

Yeah, I mean the people who are still playing in jTWG. I don't think it is fair that the main players of TWG don't get spots, especially when the jTWG people are still in their own game...

[Afrobean]

Are people from the jTWG allowed to sign up for the real TWG?
Yes, Chardish came to the jTWG signups thread and said that jTWG members would not be turned away from the next TWG.

EDIT: if others feel the same as Flypie about jTWG people who are still playing, I'd gladly step out of jTWG for the real one.

[flypie743]

I mean if they are already in a game I don't think it is fair that they can be in TWO games at the same time. You know? But it they are dead that is another story. If they are active/alive in jTWG I don't think it is fair to other people that want to play in TWG.

[JurseyRider734]

I pm'd Chardish and he said I could sign up.

[Lupin_the_3rd]

I mean if they are already in a game I don't think it is fair that they can be in TWO games at the same time. You know? But it they are dead that is another story. If they are active/alive in jTWG I don't think it is fair to other people that want to play in TWG.

Some people playing jTWG have also been waiting a long time to get in...

I'd gladly step out of jTWG, but I don't see the point. Thankfully, Chardish is allowing us to play.

[alainbryden]

No matter how often you all say I screwed up, remember that my strategy kept me alive and won the game.

[flypie743]

I mean if they are already in a game I don't think it is fair that they can be in TWO games at the same time. You know? But it they are dead that is another story. If they are active/alive in jTWG I don't think it is fair to other people that want to play in TWG.

Some people playing jTWG have also been waiting a long time to get in...

I'd gladly step out of jTWG, but I don't see the point. Thankfully, Chardish is allowing us to play.

That's cool.

[blahblah18]

I'm hesittant about it.. if it was 1 person, its fine, but you now have people with 2 roles in 2 games at the same time.... I do not like it at all... people are going to f-u-c-k up ROYALLLY... they'll forget who they're talking to in waht circumstance, etcetera

[flypie743]

if it was 1 person, its fine, but you now have people with 2 roles in 2 games at the same time

:Insert ditto emoticon here:

[stretchypanda]

I'm not talking this game alone, Tass. You call yourself the allstar of the game. The fact that people depend on you to win the game is what leads to their downfall. There are plenty of instances in which players have voted with you just because you seem to know what you're doing.

Personally, I think it would have been unwise to leave you in. I wanted to. I really, really, really did, but it was just too risky. Even if I wasn't a wolf, and even if you had nothing to go on, I have no doubt that your "allstar" status alone would take me out any day. All you'd have to do is suggest to LD or someone else that you sort of suspect I might be a wolf, and I'm out. Arguing with you would have just made me seem more like a wolf, because no one but a wolf would go against the great Tasselfoot. Even in the situation with Afrobean, there was really nothing but one person's word against another's, and you happened to be the more prominent figure in the argument, so everyone sided with you. Sure, Afro didn't handle the situation well, but look back to the last game I played -- Kefit was killed, the obvious wolf seemed to be Kilga. He argued and argued, and through lies, the rest of the humans were convinced he was a wolf and he was lynched. The same thing happened here, with slightly different circumstances, and Afro ended up losing this one. Had I been at home, I would have advised him to back off of you a little. But whatever, it's over. I'm not saying it's your fault that people follow you so. It's really not. You're a smart guy, very clever, very shrewd, and quite ruthless. You're definitely someone I wouldn't mind having on my side in a game like this. I'm saying I'd love to see proof of more people actually thinking independently in this game (No more, "Well, Tass is dead, but he said he thinks ______").

And about that conversation. All I remember is talking to you about the "guido + panda = babies" comment, and telling you you win at life. Then I heard you sent it to someone else to look for anything suspicious. THAT'S a tiny bit ridiculous.

[Kilgamayan]

So people who can post in locked topics get a guaranteed spot?

rofl.

That's fair.

[lightdarkness]

So people who can post in locked topics get a guaranteed spot?

rofl.

That's fair.

Not quite.

I just stated that because I was going to be unlocking the topic, obviously I would grab a spot.

Notice I didn't put my name down offcially?

[Kilgamayan]

Yeah, but chardish did.

[lightdarkness]

Yeah, but chardish did.

Well....

Chardish is Chardish. He brought TWG to FFR, I wouldn't be opposed to it.

[Kilgamayan]

So that makes him above the rules?

If the guy who's laying the ground rules down doesn't want to follow them, why should the rest of us?

[blahblah18]

why must we always fight... can't we have one family dinner together without this? Kilga you're forum president, don't stand for this crap! lol

[lightdarkness]

I'm not the boss, take it up with Chardish.

[Kilgamayan]

Yeah, that'll accomplish something.

[GuidoHunter]

Fine. New rule: Last game's host is guaranteed a spot in the next.

I think it's fair. I suppose it didn't exist simply because nobody would have a problem with it. Whatever.

Regarding anyone else, though, I don't think anyone should have a spot saved for them, as that's completely unfair. Of course, I don't think anyone disagrees with me here.

Oh, and I remembered something else that should have tipped me off...when the whole Tass v. Afro thing was going on, stretchy kept saying "they're saying exactly the same thing" over and over when it was quite obvious that they weren't.

--Guido

http://andy.mikee385.com

[Kilgamayan]

Actually, I'm still of the mindset that the first night kill should get an automatic spot in the next game.

[Afrobean]

Actually, I'm still of the mindset that the first night kill should get an automatic spot in the next game.
I agree fully with this. I still feel bad for all the people I helped to kill (cypher and eb... I was lynch'd before anymore).

[Squeek]

I'm opposed to the "Host = free pass" idea, but in favor of the "First-night kill = free pass" idea.

It sucks not even being able to play, ok? Not that I've ever experienced it, but it does suck. Cypher SHOULD get a free pass, but he's a candidate. It's complex, that's for sure.

~Squeek

[stretchypanda]

Oh, and I remembered something else that should have tipped me off...when the whole Tass v. Afro thing was going on, stretchy kept saying "they're saying exactly the same thing" over and over when it was quite obvious that they weren't.

--Guido

http://andy.mikee385.com

I guess I appreciate the overwhelming trust you put in me. :p It was you, however, who once said, "Had I been a wolf, I would have killed you in a heartbeat."

[CypherToorima]

woops

Missed sign ups >.<

My brother had just gotten off the computer. Oh well. If I don't make it, I don't make it =/

[Kefit]

I was considering signing up for this game.

Yeah, I know that I said I wouldn't play again after game six, but I liked the way that game seven went, and it looks like game eight is heading in a good direction too.

Looks like I missed the sign-ups though (LD, a little hint: When you say you will open the sign-ups at 11:00pm eastern, do it FFR time. Thats the only time we all have to go by. As it is, all of the spots were filled ten minutes before it was even 11:00pm FFR time). Ah well.

Oh, and yes, being wolfed night one really does suck. I am in full support of the person wolfed night one getting automatic entry into the next game, but I suppose I am just a tad biased on this matter.

[alainbryden]

It is now exactly 11:00 EST and the signups are locked and full. BS. Cypher should host and others should be allowed in. End of story.

[Tasselfoot]

my support.... give a free spot to the MVP from the past game (if a free spot is to be given...). if the MVP is being done away with, then there shouldn't be anyone to get a free spot. obviously the person who unlocks the thread will get a spot regardless (if they want one).

and panda: i can check the PM that i sent to ld/eyespew, i don't remember what exactly i sent them from who, but everything i sent to them was 100% related to TWG. i edited/chopped out anything not related to TWG. so, no need to point the ridiculous finger at me. lastly, i would be delighted to have you on my team, when i am back from the sidelines.

[alainbryden]

If possible, I'd like to reserve a spot for when n00bs with 30 posts, no names, are ejected from the TWG8 signups.

[Squeek]

I don't know what Chardish intends to do as he is STILL away... but as for me, I've prepared my scripts, just in case. The pre-game is written and Day 1 is being written as we speak.

As for me, if I were Chardish, I'd probably say goodbye to DDRadicted and nforcer06164, but possibly consider M-A-C as an acceptable player. You two need to remain in the junior leagues, I'm afraid. Kefit, Alain, and Cypher have all missed signups due to the lack of timezone coordination (again) and deserve a chance.

Oh, also, people still alive in the jTWG should not be accepted into this TWG. Trying to play two roles at once for these people will probably get them killed in both games. Which would then put all three of the possible eliminations out in one way or another.

As a candidate for host, I will be in cahoots with Chardish until this is sorted out.

~Squeek

PS - After much deliberation, I am removing the role of Seer and replacing it with Psychic. Nothing else has changed.

[blahblah18]

so basically we're playing the same game 2 times in a row

[GuidoHunter]

That's why Cypher needs to host.

--Guido

http://andy.mikee385.com

[blahblah18]

well he would be if you chose to actually play guido... :(

[chardish]

Figuring out how to deal with this while I fetch a bowl of delicious ice cream. I have ideas.

[Squeek]

so basically we're playing the same game 2 times in a row

Uhh, no.

Was game 1 different from game 2? Were the roles different? (Hint: Answers = Yes, No)

I'm sticking with what works until I can figure out something cooler. My idea doesn't work with Cypher's idea. I can't break the teams into three.

OK?

~Squeek

[Kefit]

Figuring out how to deal with this while I fetch a bowl of delicious ice cream. I have ideas.

Dammit, now you have made me want ice cream :p

I propose that the problems be solved with a game of e-pin the tail on the donkey.

[blahblah18]

brilliant idea forum VP.. now go get the royal forum donkey for them to e-pin

[chardish]

I'm doing this.

Host gets free go at next game because host manages signups for the next game usually.

ddradicted is out cause I question his ability to play.

This leaves 15 players. Cypher is in for expressing intent. Squeek has offered to up his game size to 18, and Alain and Kefit are thus in for expressing their intent as well.

Lupin
Whorli
Jursey
EB
Tsuteto
Afro
TPS
Flypie
Chardish
LD
Blah
nforcer
Roopert
M-A-C
Kilgamayan
Alain
Kefit
Cypher

Take it, Squeek.

[Squeek]

Got it, Chardish.

The pre-game is typed and presently being revised to accomodate for 18 instead of 16. The game includes:

1 psychic.
1 guardian.
4 masons.
4 wolves.
8 regular humans.

I will post the pre-game thread tomorrow and ask a mod to immediately lock it. Nobody is allowed to post in the pre-game thread until I can actually distribute the roles. This is likely the only time I will ask a mod indirectly, even though odds are good I'll be asking one directly tomorrow anyway. I give you the authority to lock the post tomorrow without consequence, for ANY mod.

Oh, and to prove right now that this is totally random:

http://random.org/sform.html

1, 16. Refresh all you want and you'll continuously generate random numbers. I am not hand-picking anything.

Feel free to PM or AIM me if you want to discuss my rules, since they are slightly different.

Once again, I am going to bed now and NOT posting the thread until tomorrow afternoon. It's 4:20 am and I really want to sleep, considering the fact that my boss woke me up 3 hours into my slumber Tuesday morning to tell me to come in early.

Cypher, I'll hold off on the next one and let you run it, OK? Just don't force me to play in it...

~Squeek

[HansSky]

Noooo...I wanted in, but both sign ups were bad for me. Ugh...oh well.

[Tsuteto]

I got in. The sign-ups lasted only like... not even five minutes each time. Insane? Oh yeah. But it was still awesome.

[flypie743]

Guys, I still don't think that alive jTWG players should be allowed in this one. I mean wasn't the whole point of jTWG to train future TWG players? They haven't even finished one game yet!

[evilbutterfly]

Well, that wasn't clear from the start, so we can't really make it a rule. When the official rules are written up, may be that will be included.

[Afrobean]

Chardish assured that poeple who were playing jTWG would not be turned away from TWG8. I can understand not allowing ones in future games, but Chardish already said it was ok.

[evilbutterfly]

Exactly. It wasn't in the rules before, but in the future, it shouldn't happen ever.

[flypie743]

Chardish assured that poeple who were playing jTWG would not be turned away from TWG8. I can understand not allowing ones in future games, but Chardish already said it was ok.

Yes, I know this. I am speaking of future games, sorry for the confusion.

[Squeek]

I'm not kicking anybody out; not after I just spent two hours on this PM situation, OK?

They'll be going out in just a few minutes now. Be patient. Every player that is in the list on the official topic is playing. If they leave...I have problems.

~Squeek

[flypie743]

I never said to kick anyone out. I am talking about future games.

[HansSky]

Hey thanks guys. I know this all came about because I didn't make sign ups. I really appreciate it guys.









I hope you didn't take me seriously.

[roopert]

WELL GAME VIII SURE WAS A BLAST

[chardish]

WELL GAME VIII SURE WAS A BLAST

Talk about it in its postgame thread. Kthx.