Songs of the Week 08/20/2022

**Wiosna** · 08-20-2022, 12:39 AM

Re: Songs of the Week 08/20/2022

I'm particularly curious about how players (and steppers, I suppose) feel about Rainshower. It's the most explicitly dumpy chart in the game as far as I know of -- while ghost notes have been used for bass wobbles numerous times over multiple charts, and there's the use of ghost notes to represent a solid layer of music (e.g. synth + percussion), but I don't think there have been any charts that use ghost notes for sounds with much lighter timbres like saxophone. This does set a precedent on how ghost notes can be used in the future, and even with a small discussion among multiple judges (one of which which found the ghost notes to saxophone a bit iffy but ultimately fine), I think their word is a bit too small to be consensus or representative of the player or stepper base at large.

The existing reception towards ghost notes to bass wobbles has been mostly ambivalent leaning towards positive on FFR, but I do wonder how much a step away from the most traveled maxim of "placing notes at the start of each attack" are players and steppers willing to deviate before feeling that it's intuitively offputting to play. I think this would also be a great barometer for judges in the future, especially with the dump batch closing submissions very soon that will likely delineate what is permissible for FFR stepping and what isn't in the future.

**klimtkiller** · 08-20-2022, 03:54 AM

Re: Songs of the Week 08/20/2022

Originally posted by Wiosna

I'm particularly curious about how players (and steppers, I suppose) feel about Rainshower. It's the most explicitly dumpy chart in the game as far as I know of -- while ghost notes have been used for bass wobbles numerous times over multiple charts, and there's the use of ghost notes to represent a solid layer of music (e.g. synth + percussion), but I don't think there have been any charts that use ghost notes for sounds with much lighter timbres like saxophone. This does set a precedent on how ghost notes can be used in the future, and even with a small discussion among multiple judges (one of which which found the ghost notes to saxophone a bit iffy but ultimately fine), I think their word is a bit too small to be consensus or representative of the player or stepper base at large.

The existing reception towards ghost notes to bass wobbles has been mostly ambivalent leaning towards positive on FFR, but I do wonder how much a step away from the most traveled maxim of "placing notes at the start of each attack" are players and steppers willing to deviate before feeling that it's intuitively offputting to play. I think this would also be a great barometer for judges in the future, especially with the dump batch closing submissions very soon that will likely delineate what is permissible for FFR stepping and what isn't in the future.

I am strongly against dumps being in-game. this sounds like the start of a slippery slope.

**alloyus** · 08-20-2022, 06:16 AM

Re: Songs of the Week 08/20/2022

Originally posted by Wiosna

I'm particularly curious about how players (and steppers, I suppose) feel about Rainshower. It's the most explicitly dumpy chart in the game as far as I know of -- while ghost notes have been used for bass wobbles numerous times over multiple charts, and there's the use of ghost notes to represent a solid layer of music (e.g. synth + percussion), but I don't think there have been any charts that use ghost notes for sounds with much lighter timbres like saxophone. This does set a precedent on how ghost notes can be used in the future, and even with a small discussion among multiple judges (one of which which found the ghost notes to saxophone a bit iffy but ultimately fine), I think their word is a bit too small to be consensus or representative of the player or stepper base at large.

The existing reception towards ghost notes to bass wobbles has been mostly ambivalent leaning towards positive on FFR, but I do wonder how much a step away from the most traveled maxim of "placing notes at the start of each attack" are players and steppers willing to deviate before feeling that it's intuitively offputting to play. I think this would also be a great barometer for judges in the future, especially with the dump batch closing submissions very soon that will likely delineate what is permissible for FFR stepping and what isn't in the future.

I dig it

Also how are all of the releases so sick this week??????????

**FlynnMac** · 08-20-2022, 12:29 PM

Re: Songs of the Week 08/20/2022

Originally posted by klimtkiller

I am strongly against dumps being in-game. this sounds like the start of a slippery slope.

You don't even play the game anymore lol

**XelNya** · 08-20-2022, 01:06 PM

Re: Songs of the Week 08/20/2022

Originally posted by FlynnMac

You don't even play the game anymore lol

Their concern is valid, stop trying to write it off. They expressed it nicely, and calmly. Your post is unneeded, and just bad for the actual discourse Wiosna is trying to have, and Klim's contribution towards it. It's actually something with the looming dump batch the community should be talking about.

Originally posted by Wiosna

I'm particularly curious about how players (and steppers, I suppose) feel about Rainshower. It's the most explicitly dumpy chart in the game as far as I know of -- while ghost notes have been used for bass wobbles numerous times over multiple charts, and there's the use of ghost notes to represent a solid layer of music (e.g. synth + percussion), but I don't think there have been any charts that use ghost notes for sounds with much lighter timbres like saxophone. This does set a precedent on how ghost notes can be used in the future, and even with a small discussion among multiple judges (one of which which found the ghost notes to saxophone a bit iffy but ultimately fine), I think their word is a bit too small to be consensus or representative of the player or stepper base at large.

The existing reception towards ghost notes to bass wobbles has been mostly ambivalent leaning towards positive on FFR, but I do wonder how much a step away from the most traveled maxim of "placing notes at the start of each attack" are players and steppers willing to deviate before feeling that it's intuitively offputting to play. I think this would also be a great barometer for judges in the future, especially with the dump batch closing submissions very soon that will likely delineate what is permissible for FFR stepping and what isn't in the future.

Also from a purely creative standpoint, I really like the idea of a structured dump that has rules to it a player can pick up on as they play. It sounds like the bass wobble ghost notes hit that as a method of emphasis, and is therefore really cool sounding to me. (Considering my current work as a side note is more reliant on this idea than actual layering mostly, is kind of where I am coming from.)

Though, I haven't seen the file, nor played it. But as a concept it sounds fine / well executed based on how you describe it. Tactful use of dump elements can make a file jump up a level in depth and fun, not only just adding some replay value to catch all the fun stuff you toss in.

**FlynnMac** · 08-20-2022, 02:35 PM

Re: Songs of the Week 08/20/2022

Originally posted by XelNya

Their concern is valid, stop trying to write it off. They expressed it nicely, and calmly. Your post is unneeded, and just bad for the actual discourse Wiosna is trying to have.

Nah

**ToonE156** · 08-20-2022, 03:16 PM

Re: Songs of the Week 08/20/2022

based klarion

seriously though Klimt, why are you against them?

i dig the file, keep it up

**awein999** · 08-20-2022, 03:20 PM

Re: Songs of the Week 08/20/2022

Originally posted by Wiosna

I'm particularly curious about how players (and steppers, I suppose) feel about Rainshower. It's the most explicitly dumpy chart in the game as far as I know of -- while ghost notes have been used for bass wobbles numerous times over multiple charts, and there's the use of ghost notes to represent a solid layer of music (e.g. synth + percussion), but I don't think there have been any charts that use ghost notes for sounds with much lighter timbres like saxophone. This does set a precedent on how ghost notes can be used in the future, and even with a small discussion among multiple judges (one of which which found the ghost notes to saxophone a bit iffy but ultimately fine), I think their word is a bit too small to be consensus or representative of the player or stepper base at large.

The existing reception towards ghost notes to bass wobbles has been mostly ambivalent leaning towards positive on FFR, but I do wonder how much a step away from the most traveled maxim of "placing notes at the start of each attack" are players and steppers willing to deviate before feeling that it's intuitively offputting to play. I think this would also be a great barometer for judges in the future, especially with the dump batch closing submissions very soon that will likely delineate what is permissible for FFR stepping and what isn't in the future.

i enjoyed it and felt like it fit the music despite having a really slow day and not being able to keep up with it. honestly i think the entire style of stepping needs a rebranding. 'dump' sounds too negative to me.

**XelNya** · 08-20-2022, 05:44 PM

Re: Songs of the Week 08/20/2022

Originally posted by FlynnMac

Nah

Eh, you do you then I guess.

**gold stinger** · 08-21-2022, 01:32 PM

Re: Songs of the Week 08/20/2022

Originally posted by FlynnMac

Nah

holy shit the roles are reversed.

but to put this back on-track:

I conversed a lot about this in Discord vs in-thread on the forums, but I am very much a person of the concept that as long as a dump is patterned / layered well, and retains a rigid structure, I could realistically see a lot of dump files getting into the game. There has been many songs in the past (and accepted) into FFR that have contained dump burst-y elements that have became a trend for songs that are specifically submitted to FFR since the acceptance of Vantablack & Naruto's Ninja Way (Thanks, AJ) and to me, it was really only a matter of time until the lines of what is a dump / what isn't a dump would be blurred by its usage where the question would come up: "Do we actually want dumps in FFR?".

That question was eventually asked in Judgment chat (containing all the Judges, Head Judges and Game Managers), and the answer was a "yeah, sure. Why not?". imo people have been putting dump elements in files for years now, so it's not a large leap to accept dump files.

**Lights** · 08-22-2022, 01:40 PM

Re: Songs of the Week 08/20/2022

Originally posted by klimtkiller

I am strongly against dumps being in-game. this sounds like the start of a slippery slope.

Slippery Slope Fallacy

**Tru** · 08-22-2022, 09:33 PM

Re: Songs of the Week 08/20/2022

toroidal earth society is my new favourite file in FFR. D4 really got spoiled here.

It is SO GAD DAMN GOOD.

Songs of the Week 08/20/2022

Songs of the Week 08/20/2022

Comment

Comment

Comment

Comment

Comment

Comment

Comment

Comment

Comment

Comment

Comment

Comment