TWC Rules, Policies, Etc.

[pntballa18]

Re: TWC Rules, Policies, Etc.

i sent you one before i posted

i have yet to get a reply

[rzr]

Re: TWC Rules, Policies, Etc.

Since every other rule is being completely re done, here's something for fixing:

Phantoms. Ok, we all know how they work. But there are players who hold off on their voting to avoid insta or something. But their still COMPLETELY active. So it's sort of unfair to the player to still recieve phantom(s).

For example, in my current game there's a player (Bynary Fission) who's very active. But didn't want to vote right away. Well, now he has 2 phantoms. He's still been one of my most active players.

Something should be resolved about this.

[jugglinguy]

Re: TWC Rules, Policies, Etc.

Safetying until a real vote isn't a new concept...

[rzr]

Re: TWC Rules, Policies, Etc.

Yes, safetying works, but that doesn't stop situations like this from arising.

Also, with phantoms I have a question:
If insta is more than half of the amount of people to votes ratio, and a player has exactly half the votes and one phantom, is it insta?

[pntballa18]

Re: TWC Rules, Policies, Etc.

yes

[rzr]

Re: TWC Rules, Policies, Etc.

Damn, I was hoping it wouldn't be. Now I'm going to have to argue with sc.
Ok, thanks, pnt.

[devonin]

Re: TWC Rules, Policies, Etc.

Also, with phantoms I have a question:
If insta is more than half of the amount of people to votes ratio, and a player has exactly half the votes and one phantom, is it insta?

This seems to be the rule, but I'm not entirely sure it should be.

It seems to me that the thematic explanation for a phantom reads like "Because you didn't attend the meeting to decide who was a wolf, we now view you with increased suspicion because you must have something to hide"

I still don't see why less than a majority of live players should have to vote for an insta to happen. The increased suspicion about the person suggests that if the town is torn between two suspects, they'd opt for the suspicious one (IE. Phantoms break ties, and punish inactive players) not that they'd jump the gun on less than a clear majority, these are people voting to MURDER someone after all.

[flawofhumanity]

Re: TWC Rules, Policies, Etc.

This seems to be the rule, but I'm not entirely sure it should be.

It seems to me that the thematic explanation for a phantom reads like "Because you didn't attend the meeting to decide who was a wolf, we now view you with increased suspicion because you must have something to hide"

I still don't see why less than a majority of live players should have to vote for an insta to happen. The increased suspicion about the person suggests that if the town is torn between two suspects, they'd opt for the suspicious one (IE. Phantoms break ties, and punish inactive players) not that they'd jump the gun on less than a clear majority, these are people voting to MURDER someone after all.

Well, from a story stand point a lot of things don't make sense. But, from a mechanics standpoint, we can look at it like this:

6 people

3 people vote for x, who has a phantom
he now has 3.00000000000...1

Now, if the remaining three people vote on a different person person, they won't be lynched and it will be the same as an insta.

The phantom is in essence supposed to be a vote, albeit worth less than any other.

[rzr]

Re: TWC Rules, Policies, Etc.

Again with the freaking rule changing? You guys are seriously killing this game.

Look, phantoms are in place to attempt to force activity with a penalty. If player x never posts and gets 3 phantoms then player x is banned. If player x rarely posts and gets 2 phantoms they'll most likely be instad because 2 phantoms = 1.001 votes. If player x usually posts but missed once and got 1 phantom they'll accidently get instad. Like with sc.

Honestly guys, all this rule changing is making the game unenjoyable. There's no need to customize the rules because certain new players feel it should. It's worked for us all along, there's no reason it shouldn't continue to.

[Makilaz]

Re: TWC Rules, Policies, Etc.

How is this rule changing? If anything, it's rule clarification, since a lot of people weren't too certain what the rules for different things were.

[rzr]

Re: TWC Rules, Policies, Etc.

I'm just saying that if the idea of changing phantoms doesn't get tossed around this thread I'll be shocked.

[devonin]

Re: TWC Rules, Policies, Etc.

Again with the freaking rule changing? You guys are seriously killing this game.

Look, phantoms are in place to attempt to force activity with a penalty. If player x never posts and gets 3 phantoms then player x is banned. If player x rarely posts and gets 2 phantoms they'll most likely be instad because 2 phantoms = 1.001 votes. If player x usually posts but missed once and got 1 phantom they'll accidently get instad. Like with sc.

Honestly guys, all this rule changing is making the game unenjoyable. There's no need to customize the rules because certain new players feel it should. It's worked for us all along, there's no reason it shouldn't continue to.

Appeals to tradition are a logical fallacy. People spent a long time thinking the earth was flat, women were property, and whites were better than blacks. Just because it "had always" been that way doesn't mean it was right or good.

Making a clear and comprehensive ruleset is what will make the game enjoyable. Constantly having to try and see whether a given host is screwing something up, or changing something around "cuz" makes me want to not play with anybody I haven't already established plays the same way I do. It's like sitting down to play scrabble with someone to discover that they always play so that you re-use double/triple word/letter score tiles. The game becomes a chore as you constantly have to pay attention to something that was never part of the existing rules.

Having a clear ruleset that is always in force that everyone communally follows makes it much easier for people to get started, and to get skilled because the system around them remains consistant.

Don't take a suggestion that "something being done the way you like it might not be the best way" as a personal attack. It isn't.

And as to the insta/phantom thing.

Okay, 6 people, 3 vote for someone with 1 phantom 3.001

What happens when someone else in the game has 2 phantoms? If the other three people vote for THEM, suddenly they have 4.001 and MORE votes than the person you just Instad.

This is why an actual physical majority of players should have to vote for someone to be insta killed regardless of phantoms. The purpose of an insta seems to be to keep the game moving faster when someone dying is a foregone conclusion, not to screw someone over into dying. When there are three players with phantoms, and one player with -more- phantoms than the person currently just skinning over a "50%+1" percentage of the vote, I don't see how an insta is justified.

If you add up the total votes (6 players = 6.00, 1 phantom = 0.001, 2 phantoms = 1.001, 1 phantom = 0.001) you have 7.003 votes, which says to me that the "majority" requires you to have >3.5016 votes.

IE, with 6 players, and 4 total phantoms on 3 people, someone who got a) 4 votes or b) 3 votes on the 2 phantom person should be instakilled.

The statistical possibility existed for someone else to be lynched without anyone who voted for the instakilled person having to change their votes, so I don't think they should have been insta'd

[thunderstrike687]

Re: TWC Rules, Policies, Etc.

argo rzr

[rzr]

Re: TWC Rules, Policies, Etc.

Due to post 47 of jTWG XLV Player Sign-ups here I am. Let's do this thing.

[DarkManticoreX2]

Re: TWC Rules, Policies, Etc.

Rzr wants to appeal his ban on the basis that there is no absolute proof he logged onto argo's account, Although tass's IP check said they have both been on each others account multiple times.

So here's the facts.

Rzr and argo both knew each other's passwords at the start of the current TWG. It is alledged rzr signed onto Argo's account during the game and Looked at argo's PM to figure out his role. Argo claims to have messed with Rzr's account in retribution. and also may or may not have seen rzr's PM. Reguardless, they have both been on each others account during the course of the game and the opportunity to cheat was there.

The current motion is for a game ban on both Argo and rzr, seeing as how they both acted in a fashion not suitable for TWG.

* as an aside, can we have the votes in a row to make them easier to tally? all the posts inbetween make it hard to keep track *

Im for the game ban personally. They'll learn their lesson and not do it again.