Rock Band 2

[ddranthony92]

Originally Posted by Telvanni_guard

It's harder to get a steady income at a younger age. It's still pretty easy to make money mowing grass or doing extra things around the house. Depends on how stiff your parents are and your financial situation.

Yea I'm doing stuff like this, but I'm not buying a new hard drive, I've got other things i need.

[dore]

Originally Posted by Afrobean

I thought it sounded like a strange business choice... why the hell would a person in the industry say that sort of thing if it wasn't true though?

It was just the writer talking out of his ass; I think he meant to say he would like to see that feature but, well, he didn't. The article I posted a few posts back also said the same thing but it was edited today to remove that bit of info. So either HMX is waiting to announce that bit or everyone is just talking out of their collective asses.

[Afrobean]

Now there's this:

http://kotaku.com/5022939/rock-band-...-compatibility

First things first: If you already own Rock Band and you buy Rock Band 2 all of your songs will transfer over automatically and free o' charge.

Maybe they are doing something involving installing the songs to the harddrive off the disc like I suggested. I just don't see how they could come up with an agreement after the fact to include the full setlist for RB1 online, even if the content is only available to people who already own RB1.

Or maybe they're just bastards using tricky wording. Perhaps they mean to say:

If you already own Rock Band and you buy Rock Band 2 all of your DLC songs will transfer over automatically and free o' charge.

To which I reply: is it really "[transferring] over automatically" if the file is simply stored in a format which both games can readily read and play? That'd be like saying "Winamp will automatically transfer MP3s you already have free of charge into a format playable in Winamp". This is probably what they mean, since I don't see any mention of RB1 songs playing in RB2 in the press release, apart from the DLC mention.

Then:

The new drum kit will include a metal reinforced pedal, quieter pads, velocity sensors and... be wireless.

So probably just a better version of what we have already, no new innovation. No additional functionality makes me sad, even in the face of physically improved quality of the production. It's a real shame that GH with the cymbals I desire ****ed it up by only having 3 drum pads. That, and, of course, no game in this generation saw fit to add a second foot pedal into the mix. Bastards. Do they not realize hihats have foot pedals? Do they not realize some sets have two kick pedals? Do they not realize some of the best songs make heavy use of this secondary foot action, and leaving it out does a disservice to the realism which can easily be truncated and avoided by the simple inclusion of 2 pedals?

Oh, and this:

Drum Trainer

That's right, Rock Band 2 will literally teach you how to play drums.

This is great and all, but if it's missing the functionality I've detailed as my dream goal, it won't really be too much help. It'd probably just help you get better at playing the game, but not really put you at a point where you could play the same stuff on an acoustic set. As with any sort of rhythmic based practice, it'd probably help with timing and stuff, but even FFR can help you improve your rhythm and timing, even in the somewhat unrelated field of simulated drumming.

[Telvanni_guard]

Afro has high standards and always sets himself up to be disappointed.

[Afrobean]

Originally Posted by Telvanni_guard

Afro has high standards and always sets himself up to be disappointed.

I should make my own multimillion dollar competitor to the Rock Band stage!

Gameplay controllers would be midi controller drums, midi controller keyboards, and USB electric Guitars (and of course, would require an actual bass guitar if that is what you'd want instead). Guitar play would require normal playing of a real guitar which would be recognized tonally and such by what sound would be rendered from it, rather than by "simulating" play using buttons. Charts would be written 100% accurately using a midi format which would allow for any drum or keyboard setup to be played, using user created bindings for each specific instrument (drums) or pitch (keyboard) if necessary. Singing would require a professional level microphone, and it would be scored based on pitch, timbre, and personality. The personality of the vocals would be scored in real time online by payed judges, streaming your performance and giving you a subjective score based on how much you suck or don't suck.

....

Honestly, I don't think my desire for greatness is that extreme. A few years ago folks probably would have told you a full set band game such as RB wouldn't even be profitable. People would have expected it to be outside the cost of the average consumer. But GH broke that concept. They proved it could work. RB kicked it up a notch, proved that could work. I don't think it's that unreasonable to ask for a tiny notch kicking now, not when they've so thoroughly proven people will spend hundreds on a full set... I don't think it's so bad of me to ask them to invest a little more work on the drum sets, even if it means a higher cost for the consumer. Particularly since the things I've suggested would be playable on the RB1 kits as well.

How would you guys feel about USB midi drum set functionality? Would you still think I'm being too extreme if all I ask for is that? Doing things awesomely would also allow the game to recognize hardware created for other games (cough GH cough RR) to be used as midi controllers, even when that is not the hardware's intended function. And don't forget, GuitarFreaks and Drummania, who came before, already had midi support for drum kits. I don't think it's too much to ask for that, even if the official drum controller isn't as fully functional as I (and others) would like.

edit:

ps it looks like the cheapest of the quality full kits I've seen are about 700$. Do you really think they couldn't cut functionality (i.e. brain, midi support), and cut corners in quality in other areas and bring the production costs down low enough to make a drum controller like I'm asking for available for consumption at ~100$? Hell, there are tons of things in simple kits that I'm not even asking for-- things like sensitivity for rim shots and ability to sense different types of cymbal hits.

[Telvanni_guard]

All I was saying is from your previous post it sounds like you set the bar too high and came off as disappointed if not a bit vengeful.

[Afrobean]

Originally Posted by Telvanni_guard

All I was saying is from your previous post it sounds like you set the bar too high and came off as disappointed if not a bit vengeful.

Oh, I'm vengeful alright.

The sarcasm in my post above would be totally serious if I had the money, drive, and ability to make it happen.

Except that **** about online vocal streaming with live human judges. That was just to drive home the point that I wasn't really serious.

EDIT: something I re-stumbled across just now:

http://www.joystiq.com/2008/01/09/ro...iness-cymbals/

Proof of concept on my idea that additional cymbals would not make it harder to read, since that has the same idea I've mentioned built into a way to play it on the current infrastructure. In fact, that's not far off from what I really want. Tack a second foot pedal, and change the positioning on things to match what the typical drum positioning would really be (compare this to this), and I'd be happy as a clam. Well... I don't like the fact that people making "ultimate" mods for drum kits are building them around actual drums, rather than pads. Why the hell would you want to edrum on a real drum?

[Biff_tech]

The new drum kit will include a metal reinforced pedal, quieter pads, velocity sensors and... be wireless.

Welp i'm officially sold.

[Squeek]

So couldn't I rent or borrow Rock Band, play for two minutes for the save file, then get all the songs for free in RB2?

[dore]

I'm sure that's why it hasn't been officially confirmed yet.

[dore]

Well Afro. Your dreams have come true. GameInformer's article (photocopied here) confirms that there will be expansion slots on the new drumsets for separately sold attachable cymbals and there will also be a first party kit that can actually double as a normal electronic drum kit. There are also going to be actual Fender Stratocasters fitted with RB parts and sold.

The rest of the article is pretty much all known info, but I thought all that was pretty cool on the hardware front.

[Tokzic]

yes

harmonix kicks huge amounts of ass, ass always

EDIT: i swear that was unintentional

[ddr_f4n]

Originally Posted by dore

Well Afro. Your dreams have come true. GameInformer's article (photocopied here) confirms that there will be expansion slots on the new drumsets for separately sold attachable cymbals and there will also be a first party kit that can actually double as a normal electronic drum kit. There are also going to be actual Fender Stratocasters fitted with RB parts and sold.

The rest of the article is pretty much all known info, but I thought all that was pretty cool on the hardware front.

I'M SO BUYING THAT NEW DRUM SET!

[t-rogdor]

in related news, this story that i'm linking is total bullsh*t

the link is the Asteric

[Afrombean]

Originally Posted by t-rogdor

in related news, this story that i'm linking is total bullsh*t

the link is the Asteric

If Konami can sue and win, then they should be able to sue and win against ANY instrument-centric music game. Why then did they not go after Activision's Guitar Hero? Why did they not hit Harmonix back in the GH2 days when this stuff was starting to really blow up? Why did they wait until this 4th generation? Here's hoping they throw it out in favor of free market thinking-- competition is a good thing.

Also: great work with the cymbal stuff, but it's still lacking the second pedal. Overall, I'd say the second pedal is just as important. I'm honestly more floored by the "actual Fender strats built with RB functionality", since that's something else I asked for a long time ago, but never thought it'd really happen. I wonder if it will even be economically viable to sell a guitar controller for ~100$, and if it will be built 1:1. Anyone who has held a real guitar would probably know the frets at the end of the neck are a lot further apart than the fret buttons are on the controller. I'm also hoping they put frets between buttons, since that was my number one problem with the RB controller: I sometimes couldn't tell which button my finger was on due to less of a clear separation (compared to GH which has larger gaps between buttons).

[ddr_f4n]

Originally Posted by Afrombean

If Konami can sue and win, then they should be able to sue and win against ANY instrument-centric music game. Why then did they not go after Activision's Guitar Hero? Why did they not hit Harmonix back in the GH2 days when this stuff was starting to really blow up? Why did they wait until this 4th generation? Here's hoping they throw it out in favor of free market thinking-- competition is a good thing.

Hey Konami. Why don't you worry about Japan and stop making crappy US DDR CS games, and let us enjoy OUR OWN GAMES?

Jeez, Guitar Hero is more closely related and known than Rock Band. How can they miss them? And it was released in Japan already?

Well, apparently Activision pay patent licenses to Konami already, so they're safe.

Why the hell would Harmonix pay if they have to halt productions to their peripherals in the end if they do so? Obviously they are going to fight, but most likely once Activision hears about this, they'll side with Konami.

Hopefully Harmonix will win. I don't want Harmonix to end up with the same fate as ITG when Konami sued them.

[t-rogdor]

Originally Posted by ddr_f4n

Hey Konami. Why don't you worry about Japan and stop making crappy US DDR CS games, and let us enjoy OUR OWN GAMES

2nded.

also, Hey, why dont they go ahead and STOP REPLACING ALL THE AMAZING JAPANESE SONGS WITH ****TY COVERS OF AMERICAN SONGS? IMEAN, DDR EXTREME 2 HAD LA BOMBA. LA MOTHER FU*KING BOMBA. seriously, what the hell? I heard beatmania soundtrack in US release= fail

[dore]

**** they have a case

I believe the issue has to deal with the vox engine, which is basically copied straight out of Karaoke Revolution.

[Afrombean]

A video game simulating playing a musical instrument isn't exactly an original concept (nor is graded singing). Might as well put a patent on all genres so that when one company comes up with an idea for a game, no one can have a similar one. The entire gaming industry is built on developing things which are at least a little similar to things which came before it. I would say that such a patent shouldn't even be allowed. Even the very idea of the peripherals being patented... they're TOY GUITARS. You can go down to Toys R Us and find dozens of different kinds of toy guitars.

I just can't stand this sort of thing. Free market competition is only bad if you like monopolies. Freaking losers.

[Squeek]

Wow, chill out.

All you have to do is look in the patent registry to see if a patent exists for your product, or hire a patent lawyer to do it for you. It takes very little time to verify that nothing else exists in the patent registry.

For whatever reason, these companies either aren't trying hard enough to look for patents or aren't even bothering with them, and they're getting sued for it. All you have to do is spend a little time looking, find out if there's a patent, ask the patent owner if you can make something based on the patent, settle for an amount of money to pay them, then go for it. It'll be a lot less than what the courts will fine you for if they find you guilty of patent infringement.