Totally random, your opinions on love?

[Falcon]

TC, please bludgeon me. after that, i'll give you my full opinion.

as far as the majority of the posts here so far, it appears that they are being made by kids who have never fully experienced love. "L0v3 is STOOP1D!!!11!!" yea, thats credible. thats how alot of people felt in middle school and some in high school. for those of you who feel like that, i would encourage you to actually wait for the experience to actually make an opinion so harsh as its "stupid."

and in anticipation... whether you think so or not, when you are 13 or 14 it is HIGHLY unlikely you have actually been in love.

more later... i've got too much on my mind right now.

[MalReynolds]

I like someone, and he likes me back, (he told me) and he's moving away this month and I don't know what to do!

Here's an idea. Do what the rest of humanity does in situations like that:

Cope.

Heh. ZING!


And I do believe in true love.

I just spent seven minutes looking at my keyboard, trying to decide how to follow up my last line, and I realized I can't. I just believe.


Mal

[ThunderClaw]

TC, please bludgeon me. after that, i'll give you my full opinion.

Well, just remember. You're the one who asked for it.

To start this off, let me point out that I'm not that great looking--not ugly, per se, but I sure as heck don't win any beauty contests.

Despite this, Cele, who is so good a friend, comrade, and thinker that I vaguely suspect I gave up my heavenly inheritance for the luck to meet her (I hope I haven't, but if I have, I always have been a good bargainer), not only is my friend, but trusts me enough to ask me to pose as her fiancee. Particularly with my looks, you simply CAN NOT deny that this was almost a purely spirit to spirit, ego to ego, mind to mind response, with nothing to do with meat machine to another meat machine--'primal' urges.

I'm not saying that this is easy. It took me 16 years and over 1500 miles of travel across the United States to find a woman of Cele's calibur. I'm not saying it doesn't take time. What I do say is that people like this exist. The people that truly don't care about the way you look just because of the profound effect you have on thier hearts and minds (and vice versa). THEY EXIST.

You're probably expecting me to say something trite like "Don't give up hope" or "Things get better". Nope. I'm not. I'm gonna say what you need to hear: You need to recognize that you're simply looking for something that many people aren't. It's not that you're not worthy of the girls or guys that ignore you for whatever reason. They're just not looking for the same thing as you. It's not that they're rejecting you, it's that they realize that you're not wanting what they're wanting. At some level, many people realize this because of how disgusted they get at the idea that looks count. To some people, they do, because they're just looking for satisfaction on the meat machine level. They have simpler needs. Others want satisfaction on a mental and spiritual level, and are operating at a higher level.

If you wanted to dicker about it, you'd eventually come to the conclusion that the latter group actually a lot more advanced than the girls or guys they get so frustrated about. Some of these people are as young as 16 and 18 years old. And they already realize the basic superiority of spiritual/mental stimulation over physical stimulation? Man, they're ten years ahead of thier time! A lot of people don't EVER get to that point. I got news for you, no 20, 30 or 40 year marriage gets to that point because the bride and groom turn eachother on (look familiar!?).

This is why I don't say "Its gonna get better". If you have the amazing misfortune to live around a community of people who worship physical stimulation at 30, well, that's entirely possible. It doesn't nesseceraly get better until you move.

As for first reactions, you know how they say 'Beauty is in the eye of the beholder'? If beauty was just beauty, this phrase wouldn't exist. What am I getting at? This is a rather radical idea that I've been hammering out for years. Ready?

You are not actually reacting to how someone looks when you first see them, absent sharp visible handicaps.

The movie Shallow Hal actually highlights this point rather well. The mind is a tricky and immensely powerful thing that doesn't always work the way we think it will. Getting back to the example of Cele and myself, I don't think Cele will mind if I say that she isn't a supermodel, either. I personally find very little to complain about in her looks because I'm a whole lot worse but she's not the type that will attract wolf whistles. Even so, when I first met her, I just knew there was something extremely special about her. I was heavily attracted to her and went out of my way to see to it that we had the opportunity to speak whenever we could. In hindsight, I acted very much like the geeky nerd trying to make it with a preppy popular chick that's completely out of his league. Now, a casual observer would say that I must have found her very beautiful because, that early in the relationship, I couldn't have possibly known anything else about her that would've attracted me.

Trust me, I was there--it wasn't her looks.

This, of course, begs the question: What DO you react to, then?

Once again, humans are not creatures of blood and bone alone. Humans have emotional patterns and perceptive abilities and cognitive capacities that other creatures can't even touch. We also have something that transcends all other creatures--the concept of something larger than us, a religion, a universal order. Whether we like it or not, that's been a crucial part of our lives (and deaths) ever since Abraham (and before). This spiritual concept is REALLY what drives long term relationships.

When you think of all the animals in the world, how many animals actually pair up for more than the mating period? Not many. And when they do pair up, why do they do it? It's out of duty, instinct, and survival. Well, that certainly doesn't carry over into human relationships. I could pick any of a million single mothers or fathers out of a hat and prove that it's not about survival that humans stick together, and it sure as hell isn't about instinct because of the obscene numbers of divorces we have. And duty, well, that's the exception, not the rule. The only remaining option is that humans base thier relationships around that spiritual center. Soul-to-soul. Now, if it's so blatantly apparant that long-lasting relationships rely heavily on soul-to-soul compatability, why is it so inconceivable that this relationship starts earlier? Why can I pass 100 co-eds that my roommate would give his kidneys to mount and not give a single one of them a second glance? Why can Cele walk by the entire football team of her school and feel nothing but a great swell of irritation because she knows that some of those same people were hitting on her a few hours before?

The plain, simple, undeniable answer is that you're not really responding to looks at all. You're responding to soul-to-soul communication. Souls speak without words or language, without borders or boundaries. Souls ARE the consciousness behind the narrow view that your eyes give you. Souls ARE the HUMAN ITSELF. The problem is, in short, that your soul asks things that other souls aren't willing to give and offers things that other souls aren't willing to take. The challenge in life is finding your niche. Where you belong. A place where other souls exist that offer what you need and need what you offer. Everybody feels this at one point or another--you're just feeling it a lot more strongly because there's a level of incredulousness to the situation, too. You've been at the places these girls and guys have been, and you've grown past it. It makes no sense WHY ON GOD'S GREEN EARTH they'd prefer to stay there instead of moving on to something infinately more satisfying.

This whole line of thought is what makes me literally laugh out loud every time I hear somebody say "Oh, just be yourself." I got news for you, souls do not lie. Bodies lie. Minds lie. Souls don't. I can put up as many fake personality barriers as I like (and trust me, in my time, I've run through a lot of them), but if somebody truly reacts with me on a soul to soul level, it won't matter. They see through it. A little voice inside them says "Keep at it, it's really not so bad." This is precisely what proves my point. If thier soul sees something to either be given or gained in knowing another soul, they WILL stick with it. Being yourself doesn't matter if it's a soul bond. It just makes the process a hundred times less painless.

As far as being pressured by society: there's not really a whole lot I can say about that. Largely because of the free-reign effects of democracy, people as a whole will indulge themselves in whatever physical way possible simply because they can, even if as a person, they wouldn't do this. Consequently, the communal 'soul' of society is a lot bigger and unforgiving than the sum of the souls it entails. Unfortunately, 1+1 = 11. There is not a whole lot you can do about this besides become comfortable in yourself as an indivdual soul instead of a part of the communal soul. The way I reasoned it was this: When I was born, there were a number of choices that were sort of thrust upon me without my consent. One of those choices was whether or not to be a member of society (I was forced to say yes). Now, when I realized this, I asked myself, "If I never chose to be a member of society at birth, why do I choose to be a member of it now? Do I really want to be?" I thought about it for a while and concluded that the ultimate communal soul was something I did not want to be a part of. This doesn't mean I became a hermit. This doesn't mean I became cruel and antisocial. This means that the communal soul's opinions no longer mattered to me since I had chosen not to be a part of it. The communal soul of high school said that I should smoke and drink because that was cool and if I didn't I was a sissy. Of course, I have yet to smoke and have only had about 3 glasses of wine in my life because the communal soul didn't matter. The communal soul of adolescence told me that the greatest feat for a man to accomplish is to take a woman's virginity. I decided that the greatest feat for a man to accomplish is to earn another person's trust. This also does not mean that I became a loner--I just chose, voluntarily, which communal souls I'd take part in. I've chosen to take part in the communal soul of my family. I've chosen to take part in the communal soul of my 'the guys' gang back home. I've chosen to take part in the communal soul of my dorm floor. But I still refuse to be part of the communal soul of the campus because of the pressures it tries to put on me. Just like you can refuse to be part of the communal soul of your high school because of the pressure it puts on you to have a girlfriend or boyfriend.

The part that nobody in life tells you is that it's OK to do that.

I'd also like to note that I completely blew off both the Junior AND Senior Proms (11th and 12th grade formals) to spend time with the people I REALLY cared about. I enjoyed myself immensely and even managed to get a derisive laugh off at the people who told stories of thier hangovers the next week at school.

[MalReynolds]

Glad I took the ten minutes to read that.

Nice work.


Mal

[Falcon]

and you say you dont like psychology TC? (i'm a psych major...by the way)

and thats the reason i didnt post any of the things that i believe. for one, i had this weird feeling that you would hit the nail on the head. for two, you put what i think way more eloquently than i could have without spending time that i dont have writing it. for some reason i think we would be very good friends... meanwhile

you didnt touch on how your opposites feel. basically, though many say they are "their own person," the vast majority of people, in the US specifically, have fallen victim to the popculture that all of us are continually exposed to through television, magazines, and just about everything else. especially as a young teen, guys (not all guys, mind you) are of the impression that lust and sensation are the only thing that they should strive for in a relationship. TC touched on this. through a relationships with other males who are already obsessed with that specific feeling and through descriptions of how great it feels these guys are drawn in and often lose what could have been their own sense of self, or a "soul." this usually lasts through college and sometimes a couple years past, and then ends. people come to their senses and realize that if they are actually goin to spend the rest of their lives with another person they cant rely solely on the sexual aspect of a relationship. i mean really... would you want to have sex when you are 65? i dont even want to think about that. i've heard multiple stories from people who were into sex during their teens and early twenties who regretted completely doin it for one reason or another. the funny thing is, i've never had a conversation where someone said "yea, i really enjoyed having sex with 30 different girls through college. it really helped the future of my relationships."

girls, on the other hand, think completely differently from guys on this issue. the reason, i believe, for how at least one of the girls that has responded to this topic is likely because she was drawn in by one of the already mentioned guys and taken advantage of. girls, especially when they are young, go quickly into "love." they start dating this guy who is cute and spends a marginal amount of time with her and then he says "i love you" and she melts. she will do whatever he wants. and most times in a situation like this the guy will take advantage. usually soon after this the guy will dump the girl, and the girl will be left feeling empty. for this reason alot of girls hate the concept of what they believe to be "love."

as for those who still love those who beat them, it is not necessarily a disability, per se. they often come from broken families where such things have happened, and oftentimes believe that they are not good enough for one thing or another. regardless of what anyone says, females are almost always attracted to someone exactly like their father, whether he was a great father or a deadbeat. many of these relationships continue on the pretext of "i love him" or "i can change him," which in either case could be true or not, but is likely not. i've had multiple encounters with girls like this in relationships similar to this. its very hard to deal with as a friend... so i cant imagine how hard it would be to deal with if i were actually part of it.

to sum up: do not simply write off love for simply lust and pleasure. do not write off love because you havent yet experienced it truly. do not let yourself get drawn into situations under bad pretenses... such as "shes hot".

that was scattered. my mind is drained. good day.

[jewpinthethird]

Jesus...I'll set some time aside later to read all that.

[Mwerp]

Jesus...I'll set some time aside later to read all that.

[ThunderClaw]

and you say you dont like psychology TC? (i'm a psych major...by the way)

I only enjoy applying it to my own life. People like bittabe-be (the helpless victims) are who make me really not like psych.

for some reason i think we would be very good friends... meanwhile

This is actually something I said to Laharl a little while ago.

Enjoyed your post. Thanks.

[Mwerp]

I thought you and Laharl were friends?

[ThunderClaw]

I thought you and Laharl were friends?

I had mentioned how I thought Falcon and I could be friends.

[Falcon]

I only enjoy applying it to my own life. People like bittabe-be (the helpless victims) are who make me really not like psych.

yea, thats where we differ. though i get irritated with people problems a lot of times, i also really enjoy trying to help the out. and of course, it is fun to apply to myself as well. it helps make me a better person, and i learn from others mistakes at the same time.

This is actually something I said to Laharl a little while ago.

i was expecting something like "shut up, ignoramus." thats cool. i appreciate it.

[Mwerp]

I learned something new today: Love hurts

[Cenright]

I have to admit that I really enjoyed both of your posts. Thanks for sharing them. Now for some response to them.

I'm one of the people who also rejected most of the "communal soul." In fact, my entire family but one rejected it. My entire family except one is completely brilliant. At the dinner table, some families talk about the boyfriends and girlfriends of members. Not us. We get into computer networking and infinite physics and universal laws.

Our dog is almost fluent in the English language. She can put commands together and associate names in them everything. You can give her 3 commands at once and she will execute all of them in the order you gave them. Our cockatoo can pick locks and is able to sovle basic spacial problems around the house. People come over to our house and are weirded out.

Other than that, we children actually LOVE our parents. We can stand them and we even think it is great when they come to the school for errands. We can talk to them and aren't bothered that they are around when our friends are. We don't follow fads and are outside the masses. We even used to have "Nerd Fest" parties at our house and we would have pizza and a movie. It was usually the Matrix or a Star Wars movie or something. We had a serious collection of IQ point in that house at those times.

I found someone that I could have lived forever with. In life, we fit so well together and could always understand each other. We never had to speak much on our problems. We only needed to speak the first half of every sentence and the other knew exactly what the othe meant. It wouldn't have worked though.

She was my cousin.

She is now one of my greatest friends and we still tell each other everything. We understand that it will never be, so our happiness comes from being supportive of each other. We now have a different kind of love for each other.

[Varia]

There is much I would like to say, but I am in no mood to express myself.

Very good posts. The only thing I don't agree with TC about is the soul thing. They tend to be religious and love has nothing to do with religion. Of course you don't necessarily need to be involved in religion to believe in souls.

It's too bad you're not a girl, TC. I'd do you.
^If you don't get it...pfsht...

[Tasuke]

Wow. After that I guess i can't really relpy...
But i have one thing to say...
Was that really a random thought???
(not that i'm not agreeing with you, I think you are very intelligent, but it seems pretty long to be a random thought.)