So my hometown made it into Yahoo News...

[Garquillex]

Re: So my hometown made it into Yahoo News...

but the fact of the matter is the more severe a punishment, the less likely a person would commit an offense.

do you want people to refrain from bad things because of repercussions, or because they understand why it's bad to do it?

[igotrhythm]

Re: So my hometown made it into Yahoo News...

This type of punishment is some of the most illogical around, and belongs in the goddamn iron age.

It's basically them humiliating their children because they failed to either raise them reasonably, failed to address issues earlier, or failed to seek professional help.

Given the recent loss of a family member (while on duty overseas, no less), you'd think that grieving and depression would be logical conclusions, but nope, she's lazy, better give her a sandwich board and humiliate her in public. Heck, I wouldn't be surprised if Renee took that counselor completely out of context with regards to the sign idea. While I do not approve of the use of the "kids will be kids" defense that allows all sorts of unsavory behavior to go unchecked, I agree with everything else in the quote below.

"It makes me sad to think that this young girl had experienced such a painful loss recently and because she was acting out (as many, if not most young people do for a time) in response to that trauma, she was put on public display for her sins rather than receiving professional help/intervention," commented Katherine Rebecca Newlin. "How would her parents (or any ONE of us!?) feel if they were made to stand on a public corner with any number of THEIR sins plastered all over a sign for the world to see?"

In defense of the parents, they did try grounding first. Electronics was a non-option, as she never had any, and church activities were supposed to be instilling Christian values.

[Reincarnate]

Re: So my hometown made it into Yahoo News...

My point is that any upside you can list under "spanking" also exists under alternatives that come with none of the correlated downsides. If we're talking dominance principle here, it is an inferior method in every way.

edit: And yeah public humiliation = example of positive punishment

[adlp]

Re: So my hometown made it into Yahoo News...

spanking is effective and ya best be bettin that my kids will have red bums from time to time

[Reincarnate]

Re: So my hometown made it into Yahoo News...

Discussion and reinforcement need to be there, you've got to make sure the child isn't learning to 'not be punished', but is learning what is appropriate behavior.

This is well-put, IMO.

spanking is effective and ya best be bettin that my kids will have red bums from time to time

Effective to what end? The punishment has to make sense, and it needs to be done for the right reasons, if it's to be done at all.

One of the main reasons punishment never worked on me is because my father would beat me for no good reason. Spill some milk on the table by accident? Fail to be asleep 5 minutes past bedtime? Neglect to pick up your brother's dirty dishes? Didn't finish every single morsel of food on your plate? Do poorly in your football practice? Use the computer for homework when you were told to stay outside? Listen to music a touch too loud? That's a deck across the face and a belt-lashing for you, in return!

It became a textbook example of learned helplessness. It just made me fear my father, and for a long time it made me a very passive/manipulative/isolated person. I never learned how to ask people for things because my parents would just shut me down without consideration, no matter what. I found that punishments were less frequent if I just holed myself up in the room or stayed out later at school, so all I tried to do was just not get caught / stay out of my father's way as much as possible. Needless to say, I did not mourn him one bit when he died, as I had nothing but negative memories of him.

My father basically tried to raise me to be a jock-type, whereas I was the complete opposite: A cerebral computer-nerd who valued education. This, to him, was punishable. My point here is that the punishment has to fit the crime, and the crime has to actually be a crime -- and if there is a better way to get the same result, then by all means use that instead.

An interesting article:

http://www.slate.com/articles/life/family/2013/02/abusive_parents_what_do_grown_children_owe_the_mothers_and_fathers_who_made.html

[Choofers]

Re: So my hometown made it into Yahoo News...

when my mom tried to spank me when I was a kid I laughed at her

[Choofers]

Re: So my hometown made it into Yahoo News...

Is this just a stupid joke, or?
Explain yourself.

lol

[25thhour]

Re: So my hometown made it into Yahoo News...

One of the main reasons punishment never worked on me is because my father would beat me for no good reason. Spill some milk on the table by accident? Fail to be asleep 5 minutes past bedtime? Neglect to pick up your brother's dirty dishes? Didn't finish every single morsel of food on your plate? Do poorly in your football practice? Use the computer for homework when you were told to stay outside? Listen to music a touch too loud? That's a deck across the face and a belt-lashing for you, in return!

It became a textbook example of learned helplessness. It just made me fear my father, and for a long time it made me a very passive/manipulative/isolated person. I never learned how to ask people for things because my parents would just shut me down without consideration, no matter what. I found that punishments were less frequent if I just holed myself up in the room or stayed out later at school, so all I tried to do was just not get caught / stay out of my father's way as much as possible. Needless to say, I did not mourn him one bit when he died, as I had nothing but negative memories of him.

My father basically tried to raise me to be a jock-type, whereas I was the complete opposite: A cerebral computer-nerd who valued education. This, to him, was punishable. My point here is that the punishment has to fit the crime, and the crime has to actually be a crime -- and if there is a better way to get the same result, then by all means use that instead.

An interesting article:
http://www.slate.com/articles/life/f..._who_made.html

-wipes tear-

That's terrible... I had a similar sort of childhood...

But yeah, the punishment definitely has to fit the crime, spanks every now and then are a good ass-whopping for something you won't stop doing even though you know you are not allowed to do will usually smarten a kid up.

[G.S.M]

Re: So my hometown made it into Yahoo News...

Dumb parents are dumb.

as for other things: I don't think light spankings are bad at all... anything that goes on for minutes or even if a belt is used is just completely unnecessary.

Yes I was spanked but I did deserve them as I did dumb shit sometimes (they were very very rare, mostly getting grounded). My parents/grandparents are the best, nice people, not dumb but sometimes a spanking is needed as long as it is not physically/emotionally damaging... wasn't for me

I understand there are people that were hit on hard and frequently by their parents but that wasn't me.

Sorry for anyone that had it rough

[adlp]

Re: So my hometown made it into Yahoo News...

@reincarnate

sorry about your pops

i dont plan on beating my kids. spanking kids just cause i want to doesnt sound right it's gonna have to be a last resort thing

[DossarLX ODI]

Re: So my hometown made it into Yahoo News...

Even then spanking goes overboard most of the time. Rather than a few spanks, parents will just throw a tantrum and whack away for as long as they want.

[Cavernio]

Re: So my hometown made it into Yahoo News...

I have an awkward relationship with my parents not because of their punishments which varied from spanking to grounding to no allowance, but from far more complex social and emotional issues within the family. I was a pretty happy kid, only as I got older did things bother me, but I think that happiness speaks more about who I was than how my parents treated me, (infancy not included).

I agree with what eastsideman said and one of archowl's comments in knowing the individual. A lack of love is terrible. If you punish too much, the love gets lost. I also think it's not always possible for a parent to have as much of an impact on a kid as we sometimes think they do. Many personality problems or issues are fairly innate or come into being during infancy.

In any case, I'd never make my kid go into public to recant or some other weird thing. If the kid were to just take it in stride, then the gist of the punishment is lost. If they are actually humiliated, (which seems to be the point) you're creating emotional turmoil that the parent has caused, and you could be stepping over an invisible line between punishment and abuse.

[ssbmchamp]

Re: So my hometown made it into Yahoo News...

do you want people to refrain from bad things because of repercussions, or because they understand why it's bad to do it?

Honestly I think it could go both ways depending on how you look at it. I look at it as people would initially be scared of the repercussions of their actions, therefore resulting in a reduction of offenses and "hopefully" over time it people would realize "these punishments are strict, but I can understand why because doing this certain act is wrong." Again that's just me being optimistic, and really there is no point in arguing further because our country would never implement extreme consequences on the basis of "cruel and unusual punishments"

I'm still a strong believer we need to bring back certain forms of extreme punishments like in years past when our parents and grandparents were growing up. Back then there were no school shootings, robberies were much lower and people actually had respect for each other. Today it's the complete opposite because people are like "oh if i get caught i'll have to pay a fine or get some prison time," which for majority of people, don't scare them into not committing the crime.

[Reincarnate]

Re: So my hometown made it into Yahoo News...

I'm still a strong believer we need to bring back certain forms of extreme punishments like in years past when our parents and grandparents were growing up. Back then there were no school shootings, robberies were much lower and people actually had respect for each other. Today it's the complete opposite because people are like "oh if i get caught i'll have to pay a fine or get some prison time," which for majority of people, don't scare them into not committing the crime.

This is absurd; I sincerely hope you don't believe this.

http://articles.timesofindia.indiatimes.com/2012-01-22/india/30652668_1_steven-pinker-wmds-violence

Actually read this; don't just skim the headline and go "yea ok I get it"


EDIT: Basically echoes what MrPopadopalis25 said -- it's called the availability bias.

[ssbmchamp]

Re: So my hometown made it into Yahoo News...

This is absurd; I sincerely hope you don't believe this.

http://articles.timesofindia.indiatimes.com/2012-01-22/india/30652668_1_steven-pinker-wmds-violence

Actually read this; don't just skim the headline and go "yea ok I get it"


EDIT: Basically echoes what MrPopadopalis25 said -- it's called the availability bias.

It's called an opinion, and everyone's entitled to one. Don't like mine? Sucks, don't read it or ignore it. I'm sticking to my guns when I say this country needs severe punishments to straighten some people out. Let's say for example a teenager in school beats some kid up for no reason, he should be brought to the principles office and the principle should get out a paddle and hit him repeatedly until until they get the message. Sounds cruel right? Fuck it, how do you think the kid who got his face beat in would feel to know that in today's society all that happened to that kid was he got detention (which is the biggest joke of a punishment). If you do something wrong, you deserve to be punished relative to the act you committed. Detention is the easy way out when what you did is a lot more severe....there's no doubt about that. With that said you can probably guess my views on capital punishment...if you are found guilty of murdering someone and it was found to be non-accidental, you should be put on death row, no exceptions. Quite honestly if either of you disagree with that point (capital punishment) I would say you are both out of your mind because no killer deserves to live. period.

As for that article, I did read it fully and for the most part agree with it. I guess when I was talking about the past, I wasn't factoring in wars. With all the wars of the past of course the death toll is going to be much higher than it is today. I still believe though our society continues to lose respect towards each other with every day that passes and that's not helping our country out.