A Discussion thread for difficulties of FFR ingame songs

[jimerax]

This is a thread for difficulty discussions.

If you have opinions for difficulty changes, current difficulties, or suggestions for reference songs post them in this thread.


- Borderline references (as of Jan 4, 2012)-

1 (Easiest)
High-End - Trip To The Moon

2 (For Beginners)
High-End - Computer Dreams

3 (Very Easy)
High-End - Salad For Your Tuesday, 100 Bar Blackout

4 (Easy)
High-End - Strawberry, Story of Snowman and Sunshine Girl

5 (Standard)
High-End - The Essential

6 (Tricky)
High-End - Legend of Zelda, Infinite Blue, Let Mom Sleep

7 (Difficult)
High-End - Tetris Remix, Bubble Bobble Hillbilly Rodeo

8 (Very difficult)
High-End - The Games We Played, Part 2, MAX Forever, Jurs OP

9 (Challenging)
High-End - Over the Frail Dream

10 (Very Challenging)
High-End - Bus Rides With People, Keep In Mind, Vertex BETA, Feldschlacht

11 (For Masters Only)
High-End - He's A Radical Rat, Piano Concerto 1 'ANTI-ARES', Piano Etude (Gymnastics), Blooddrunk

12 (For Guru's Only)
High-End - Almost There, A Quick Death, Winter Wind Etude


[The list of songs changed in difficulty by the voting]
Halcyon [Xi] - 11 -> 12
The earth blew up - 10 -> 11
do i smile? - 12 -> 13
In Aisles - 9 -> 8
Clash on the Big Bridge - 5 -> 6
{Satori} v2 - 9 -> 8
Fast Asleep - 10 -> 11
Fei Longer - 9 -> 10
mutant corecore - 11 -> 12
Story of Snowman and Sunshine Girl - 4 -> 5
what the f is this: - 9 -> 10
The Final Fantasy - 7 -> 8
P4U v1 - 12 -> 13
Rev Etude v1 - 12 -> 13

[Jerry DB]

I feel terror from beyond is also I high 4 because I just recently got it haha

[nois-or-e]

I believe this thread is intended for discussing the actual difficulty boundaries/guidelines, as opposed to the individual difficulty of specific files. If you wish to discuss your disagreement with the current difficulty rating of a specific file, please refer to the sticky in this sub-forum...

- When you think the difficulty rating of a song should be discussed, you can make a thread for votings in this forum. If the thread gets enough votes and percentage for the difficulty change and the staff approves them, the difficulty will be changed.
The title of the thread should be, "Song Name [N or N+1]" (For example, "Uber Rave [9 or 10]").

If you wish to discuss the difficulty of terror from beyond, you should create a thread titled "Terror from beyond 4 or 5" though, I don't think you're implying that it is the wrong difficulty as it is already a 4...

[jimerax]

I added this to the guidelines.

"Polls are optional, we will count votes in people's posts."

[alloyus]

Surprised Feldschlacht isn't on the high-end VC list, always seemed like a really hard technical file to me.

[iironiic]

10 (Very Challenging)
High-End - Bus Rides With People, Keep In Mind, Vertex BETA

In my honest opinion, I think Vertex BETA and Bus Rides With People are incomparable from each other. One highly emphasizes on stream consistency while the other focuses on tricky bursts and sudden changes in patterns. Generally speaking, because bursts are much harder to tackle than streams, I would either put Bus Rides as a low FMO and keep Vertex Beta as a high VC, or keep Bus Rides as a high VC and Vertex as a mid-VC. I am favoring the latter idea though since Vertex is a very solid VC in my opinion.

Feldschlacht should also join the list of borderline VCs. It's not as straightforward as the other VCs in the game.

I have no say for the easier levels since I can't really determine the difference between a 5 and a 6 haha.

The list generally looks good though!

[nois-or-e]

Should we also include low end files for each difficulty so that there is a semi-defined line between them?

If so...

To me, this is harder than Max Forever, but not by much. IMO max forever should be the highest 8 with Yoshiis cookie being the lowest 9.

It is short, but the fast jump patterns most certainly harder than other 8s at the top end (TGWP2, Kaliedescope, etc). Not by a LOT, but by enough that they are significantly different...

[hi19hi19]

Moving current high FGOs to low FSOs

With Metro and Rave7 "legitimizing" the 13 difficulty ranking, I think it's time to take some of the highest FGOs and give them the title they deserve as low 13s.

Files I think are worthy of this bump-
Revolutionary Etude- Jumpjacks, ending. Pretty self-explatory.
Party 4 U v1- 0framers.
Crowdpleaser- In my opinion the trill and bursts are 13 worthy no matter WHAT else you put in the file. The fact nobody has AAA'd them without overlay should be a hint.
Winter Wind Etude- long as hell, polyrhythm ending, very few SDGs as a result.
Gigadelic- this shouldn't even be in the game, but until it's removed it's a 13.


Iffy-
Eclipse (solar)- the stream is pretty 13 worthy but the rest, idk about.
Here We Go- not entirely sure about this one either, it's dense but not that hard to read.
Magical 8bit dump- the trills, very few SDGs. A good possible candidate.
Grist- maybe, not really qualified to judge this because I can't read the bursts that well.
do i smile?- honestly, 13-worthy in my eyes but hasn't been out too long to really tell
Almost There- awkward as hell very fast stream


Others to consider (maybe I'm forgetting a few?)
J'ai
grind2
Rage Template
FREEDOM DiVE

[~Zeta~]

Almost There definitely is close.

CP should be 13 if it's going to stay public.
might I add ranks should be erased and don't allow overlay. we all know that it's
practically double setup and unfair to legit players like dossar and me.

A Quick Death might be low end of FSO or high FGO.
Then again, CCCP/Schmollbluk can be top end FGO as well.

do i smile is a low fso, I think. it's pretty damn hard.

[emulord]

do i smile is freaking nuts. That was harder for me to mashFC than rave7. Right now rave7 and metro are easier than party4u v1 or omgwtfToken, so I think those inconsistencies should be resolved, probably in favor of upping the group to 13s. Anything that a D6 player can't AAA, and is very difficult to SDG should be 13.

I still feel that crowdpleaser should be an exception. Ignoring the top top players, most low-mid level players see it as a really really weird 10. They can pass the trill, can't FC, and thats just how it goes. 12

I see Mario 8 bit 80s as the hardest 1. Offbeats? omg

[Winrar]

12 (For Guru's Only)
High-End - Revolutionaly Etude

Just a minor error.

I'm quite sure that Fast Asleep should be put as high end VC so long as it's a 10. I still think that song is an 11, but that's for another thread.

[jimerax]

CP isn't FSO because it's not that difficult to nail 20-30 goods overall, although trills/some bursts are quite difficult to AAA/combo.
"AAA difficulty for high-tier players" isn't the only factor.

P4U is similar but a lot harsher due to many 0-framers, didn't care much since it's considered to be nostalgia joke file as a token. After you memorize all 0-framers it will be a lot easier.

[TheSaxRunner05]

There are already better PA scores in Rave than DP, but it depends on where to want to draw the line for a 13. Should DP be the lowest 13, or should there be lower ones? Imo DP should be the cut off because it has been for so long

[DossarLX ODI]

http://i948.photobucket.com/albums/ad328/DossarLX/FFR/p4uanddp.png


I think this picture speaks for itself

Show me any FGO that compares to party4u v1. Revolutionary doesn't come close.

although trills/some bursts are quite difficult to AAA/combo.

Uh, that's all there is in that file lmfao

[Wiz44rd]

novo mundo should be very challenging, just sayin'

[Arbliterator]

Rather than bump Rave7 down, I think we should bump a handful of the other highest 12s UP.
RATO as a high 13, DP as a mid 13, Rave7 and Metro as mid-low 13s, then the current highest 12s as low 13s seems to make a lot of sense.

100% agreed with this, would love to see more 13 files.

[linebro]

can we have a more detailed diffficulty level system - Thirdstyle is doing well with it. im not saying copy Thirdstyle im saying have a more that 13 point system in FFR. maybe out of 50

[WTHaPOKEMON]

i think that death piano should be bumped down a little bit, it just requires you to tap very repetitively on the keyboard, which, i think many ppl would find quite easy.

[DossarLX ODI]

I'll get a list of high-end FGO cutoffs and ask if you guys agree with it, as well as a list of 13s.

This is for better use of difficulty 13. Do not use "Death Piano" as a low cutoff in this discussion.

Here we go

Difficulty 13

A Quick Death
Husigi Usagi Milk Tei
Crowdpleaser
do i smile?
Rave7
Revolutionary Etude
Death Piano
Reluctantly Accepting Temporary Overexhaustion
party 4u -holy nite mix- v1

*OMGWTFT0k3N was not included in the 13 list because another file is planned to replace it.

High-End Difficulty 12

Magical 8bit tour
Grist
grind2
Schmollbluk
Almost There
Counter Clockwise Chant Pattern
FREEDOM DiVE
Eclipse (solar)

[bballa48]

Dossar, I really like your list. I feel like you and I are always thinking alike when it comes to difficulties.

My only suggestions (and I am not very confident in these changes) are:

1) Move A Quick Death down to a high 12. It is brutal, yes, but really nothing that screams 13 to me. Furthermore, it is the only song on that 13 list that is simple to FC (mashing that is, it is tough when trying to PA).
2) Add some songs to the high end 12s, namely: Scrap Syndrome, Slashmaid, and Rain. There are probably others but those immediately come to mind. Maybe Jai Envie as well.


Also, for the love of God please no more mentioning DP as being simple in any way. It, along with RATO (and P4Uv1, but that song is just stupid), is in an entirely different league than every other 13 (and 13 candidate). It isn't even close.

[EzExZeRo7497]

I'll get a list of high-end FGO cutoffs and ask if you guys agree with it, as well as a list of 13s.

This is for better use of difficulty 13. Do not use "Death Piano" as a low cutoff in this discussion.

Here we go

Difficulty 13
Husigi Usagi Milk Tei
Crowdpleaser
Rave7
Revolutionary Etude
Death Piano
Reluctantly Accepting Temporary Overexhaustion
Metro
party 4u -holy nite mix- v1
Almost There

*OMGWTFT0k3N was not included in the 13 list because another file is planned to replace it.

High-End Difficulty 12

Magical 8bit tour
Grist
Schmollbluk
Counter Clockwise Chant Pattern
FREEDOM DiVE
Eclipse (solar)
A Quick Death
Slashmaid [Instrumental]
do i smile?

This would be mine (do i smile and Quick Death to FGO, added Slashmaid). And yeah what bballa said; DP isn't a low 13, rofl.

[DossarLX ODI]

No what I meant was that Death Piano is more like a mid 13 if you try comparing the songs with each other. I'm sick of seeing DP as the low cutoff for 13 when you also have other hard files that would make for good low 13 use.

[bballa48]

No what I meant was that Death Piano is more like a mid 13 if you try comparing the songs with each other. I'm sick of seeing DP as the low cutoff for 13 when you also have other hard files that would make for good low 13 use.

Yeah I was agreeing with you. I was ridiculing another comment!

Also, what are the odds that we use 14 as well? It would seem to make more sense to me to bump Rato and maybe DP as well into their own category.

[DossarLX ODI]

Oh whoops, sorry about that then

As for the 14 difficulty scale thing, I made a thread about 15 difficulty scale (http://www.flashflashrevolution.com/vbz/showthread.php?t=121473) but I do remember saying that interest in helping with a 15 difficulty scale would matter on someone else getting control over setting difficulties on charts.

[reuben_tate]

I don't see do I smile as being 13 worthy. I find it much more easier to PA than a whole bunch of the "high end FGO's" like slashmaid or freedom dive.

Although if it does get bumped, it'd be nice knowing that I have sub-150 goods on an FSO. :)

[Anaru]

I think there should be a 15 diff. scale, since the area beyond 12's is very diverse..

12: current FGOs that do not need bumping
13: Crowdpleaser, A Quick Death, Scrap Syndrome, M8Bit
14: Milk Tei, Revo, Rave 7, Metro(?), do i smile, Rain
15: RATO, DP, p4u v1, Metro(?)

[hi19hi19]

Difficulty 13
Vertex BETA vrofl
party 4u -holy nite mix- v1
Reluctantly Accepting Temporary Overexhaustion
Death Piano
Crowdpleaser
Rave7
Metro
Revolutionary Etude
do i smile?
A Quick Death
Husigi Usagi Milk Tei
Almost There

*OMGWTFT0k3N was not included in the 13 list because another file is planned to replace it.

High-End Difficulty 12
Magical 8bit tour
Grist
grind2
Schmollbluk
Counter Clockwise Chant Pattern
FREEDOM DiVE
Eclipse (solar)

Added Metro to 13 list, moved Almost There to 13 status- possibly move Eclipse (solar) as well?

Also put the FSOs in approximate difficulty order. Someone with more insight than me would need to determine the bottom of the cutoff.
Basically though, this is about what I'd like to see.

[bmah]

I wonder...how many votes* are required to make the necessary difficulty changes? It's probably going to be an arbitrary decision, but it would be nice to know when enough votes is enough.

*Actually, to put it to better words, how many and what percentage of votes are required to make a difficulty change?

[jimerax]

It's difficult to set the definite lines of # of votes or percentage for the difficulty change.

If we set the nubmer of votes too high, songs people are generally uninterested (e.g. easier songs) won't get the conclusion, and if it's too low the decision can be easily biased to particular opinions.

In general, 50 votes are considered to be enough, and less than 50 votes can be okay for some songs (uninterested ones, relatively obvious ones). As for the percentage, 70% of difficulty change votes might be enough at this point (This doesn't have to be the definite number either, though). With these votes, we game staff member will make the final conlusion.

[irionman]

Moving current high FGOs to low FSOs

With Metro and Rave7 "legitimizing" the 13 difficulty ranking, I think it's time to take some of the highest FGOs and give them the title they deserve as low 13s.

Files I think are worthy of this bump-
Revolutionary Etude- Jumpjacks, ending. Pretty self-explatory.
Party 4 U v1- 0framers.
Crowdpleaser- In my opinion the trill and bursts are 13 worthy no matter WHAT else you put in the file. The fact nobody has AAA'd them without overlay should be a hint.
Winter Wind Etude- long as hell, polyrhythm ending, very few SDGs as a result.
Gigadelic- this shouldn't even be in the game, but until it's removed it's a 13.


Iffy-
Eclipse (solar)- the stream is pretty 13 worthy but the rest, idk about.
Here We Go- not entirely sure about this one either, it's dense but not that hard to read.
Magical 8bit dump- the trills, very few SDGs. A good possible candidate.
Grist- maybe, not really qualified to judge this because I can't read the bursts that well.
do i smile?- honestly, 13-worthy in my eyes but hasn't been out too long to really tell
Almost There- awkward as hell very fast stream


Others to consider (maybe I'm forgetting a few?)
J'ai
grind2
Rage Template
FREEDOM DiVE

grind2, rage template, and eclipse are all just high end gurus. Nothing really 13 worthy in my eyes. However, I also believe that the 13 area needs to contain a bit more. I say Here We Go would be a good low level 13 and Magical would be also. You have to remember the other songs that are in 13 now...

[rayword45]

grind2, rage template, and eclipse are all just high end gurus. Nothing really 13 worthy in my eyes. However, I also believe that the 13 area needs to contain a bit more. I say Here We Go would be a good low level 13 and Magical would be also. You have to remember the other songs that are in 13 now...

According to the Ingame Song Information list, Eclipse is harder then Magical.

Also, where would Tell v3 be? Jacks are pretty much my weakness, but those jacks just seem draining and the wall at the beginning is nonsensical.

http://www.flashflashrevolution.com/tools/nps_image.php?id=1237

The NPS is quite low for an FGO, but you have to take into context that these are 95% jacks, which can't be judged the same way as say, Vertex BETA.

[jimerax]

The difficulty order of current FGO/FSO songs (OLD 1-99 ratings) - beta

99 vrofl
-------------------
-------------------
96 RATO
-------------------
95 Death Piano
-------------------
94 Party 4U
-------------------
93 Metro
93 Revo
-------------------
92 Rave7
92 do i smile
92 Husigi
92 WWE
92 Almost There
92 A Quick Death
-------------------
91 Here We Go
91 Eclipse (Solar)
91 Grist
91 DeVouR
91 Chik Habit
91 Crowdpleaser
91 FREEDOM DiVE
-------------------
90 CCCP
90 M8BT
90 La Camp
90 Slashmaid
90 Music (for Kirby)
90 Scrap Syndrome
90 J'ai Envie de Plaisir X2
-------------------
89 RWOB
89 Pandora
89 Grind2
89 Schmollbluk
89 Rage Template
89 One Minute Waltz
89 Rain
89 St. Scarhand
89 Tell v3
89 Piano Etude (Demon Fire) [Oni]
-------------------
88 Mathsma Attack
88 Grand Galop Chromatique
88 12 Bar Bloops
88 Molto Vivace
88 Zombie Sunset
88 Saddest RMX
88 RAN
-------------------
87 Hardkore Atomic
87 Necropotence
87 Coactive [Over My Shoulder Mix]
87 Tageri
87 Mephisto Waltz
87 Einstein-Rosen Bridge
-------------------
86 STRAWBERRY SWEETZ
86 Little God Channel
86 Kidney Stone
86 Electro Rush x8 v2
86 BEER
86 11ELEVEN
86 I Hate The 80s
86 ==Planet KARMA==
-------------------
85 Integraation
85 Holy Orders
85 Blue Rose
85 Pants
85 Mourning the Lost
85 Magical Higan Tour 2009
85 Sparkle Downer
85 Across Rooftops
85 Halcyon [Xi]
85 Nomina Nuda Tenemus
-------------------
84 Indo No Sobaya (t+pazolite Remix)
84 Tsugihagi Construction
84 Ketsarku Mozgalom
84 Jamais Deux
84 Gunkienen Tarusuigin
84 honki sentai majirenjaa
84 Reality
84 Frictional Nevada
84 The Adventures Of Lolo
84 Time to Eye

suggestions?

new FGO/FSO cutoff will be 90/91 or 92/91.

ps vrofl was bumped up to 14, for now lmao

[rayword45]

I think Rave7 and Metro should be equal.

BEER seems sorta easy for an 86.

Still think TTE is an FMO.

I dunno about AAA difficulty, but Chik Habit seems very easy to FC.

[stavie33]

I don't join in on the overall discussion of difficulties because nothing seems to get done, but it seems like it might now. Prepare for long, but reasonable discussion paragraph:

Most people know my opinion, with the release of Eclipse Solar like two years ago I recommended a 15 point scale, I think that's ideal and as I've said many times, have no issues working out difficulty lists (in order of singular song difficulty) with OWA, Dossar, and anyone else who wants too as well. It's just it always just stops and dies, no one gives a shit for some reason.

We currently have a 13 point scale. Making 13 a more official difficulty just remedies the idea of a joke category and the FGO gap. That's not really changing much. I still think the best way is 15 difficulty scale, with FEO (For Experts Only) taking high borderline VC's (74+) through mid FMO (79), FMO would be high FMO's and low FGO's (80-85) and then FGO would be (85-92?) with 13 representing anything harder than Almost There and CCCP (our 91's). Do I Smile would probably be the highest FGO in this case, the FSO would then be anything we deem reasonable above those points, and the 15th point would be strictly at this point for RATO, because even comparing RATO to DP is ridiculous, I can combo DP, I can't keep a 300+ combo in RATO. RATO would remain in the pinnacle 15, reserved for any other stupid file that for some reason we let in around RATO, and it will contain VROFL and other joke files. RATO still feels like a joke file to me, it's really not fair to compare it to DP, which I think is a good, but very challenging file.

EDIT: Ninja'd by JX (99 point scale), but we should meld these together with the old songs as well. Willing to do so with OWA and Dossar who iirc both showed interest. Also for song order TTE should be ahead of Reality I can't believe you have it lower than FN and Lolo lmfao and FN should be THE lowest FGO, I don't know how any song currently rated FGO could be thought of as easier. Why the hell is Music for Kirby a 90? It's like 86 max. Lots of suggestions for the list JX, post them later, but it's just my opinion

[Anaru]

BEER 85

Rave7 is much easier than Metro

Also feel like Slashmaid or Scrap Syndrome should be 91..

[stavie33]

The difficulty order of current FGO/FSO songs (OLD 1-99 ratings) - beta

99 vrofl
-------------------
-------------------
96 RATO
-------------------
95 Death Piano
-------------------
94 Party 4U
-------------------
93 Metro
93 Revo
-------------------
92 Rave7
92 do i smile
92 Crowdpleaser
92 Husigi
92 WWE
92 Almost There
92 A Quick Death
-------------------
91 Here We Go
91 Eclipse (Solar)
91 DeVouR
91 FREEDOM DiVE
91 Slashmaid
-------------------
90 Grist?
90 La Camp
90 CCCP
90 M8BT
90 J'ai Envie de Plaisir X2
90 Chik Habit
-------------------
89 RWOB
89 Pandora
89 Grind2
89 Schmollbluk
89 Rage Template
89 One Minute Waltz
89 Rain
89 Scrap Syndrome?
89 St. Scarhand
89 Tell v3
89 Piano Etude (Demon Fire) [Oni]
-------------------
88 Grand Galop Chromatique
88 Molto Vivace
88 RAN
88 Zombie Sunset
88 Hardkore Atomic
88 Saddest RMX
-------------------
87 Necropotence
87 Coactive [Over My Shoulder Mix]
87 Einstein-Rosen Bridge
87 Mathsma Attack
87 Music (for Kirby)
87 12 Bar Bloops
-------------------
86 Kidney Stone
86 STRAWBERRY SWEETZ
86 Little God Channel
86 Mephisto Waltz
86 Electro Rush x8 v2
86 11ELEVEN
86 I Hate The 80s
86 ==Planet KARMA==
-------------------
85 Integraation
85 Holy Orders
85 BEER
85 Tageri
85 Blue Rose
85 Pants
85 Mourning the Lost
85 Magical Higan Tour 2009
85 Across Rooftops
85 Halcyon [Xi]
85 Nomina Nuda Tenemus
-------------------
84 Ketsarku Mozgalom
84 Indo No Sobaya (t+pazolite Remix)
84 Sparkle Downer
84 Jamais Deux
84 Gunkienen Tarusuigin
84 honki sentai majirenjaa
84 Time to Eye
84 Reality
84 Tsugihagi Construction
84 The Adventures Of Lolo
84 Frictional Nevada

suggestions?

new FGO/FSO cutoff will be 90/91 or 92/91.

ps vrofl was bumped up to 14, for now lmao

my opinionz

[stavie33]

Surprised Feldschlacht isn't on the high-end VC list, always seemed like a really hard technical file to me.

Feldschlacht is still the hardest VC in my mind, and the absolute cutoff. It is by far the most overly technical VC throughout, and challenges you at literally everything and you can't hear most of what it goes to either.

[jimerax]

Actually I don't stick with this scale anymore, I'm just familiar with this grouping and merely wanted the difficulty order of FGO/FSO songs. 15 scale vs 99 scale discussion isn't concluded yet (due to the voting thread and staff opinions), we can consider something like 20 or 50 scales too.

okay BEER and CH can be bumped down by 1, at least.

also added Feld to VC cutoff list.

[TC_Halogen]

I'll get a list of high-end FGO cutoffs and ask if you guys agree with it, as well as a list of 13s.

This is for better use of difficulty 13. Do not use "Death Piano" as a low cutoff in this discussion.

Here we go

Difficulty 13

A Quick Death
Husigi Usagi Milk Tei
Crowdpleaser
do i smile?
Rave7
Revolutionary Etude
Death Piano
Reluctantly Accepting Temporary Overexhaustion
party 4u -holy nite mix- v1

*OMGWTFT0k3N was not included in the 13 list because another file is planned to replace it.

High-End Difficulty 12

Magical 8bit tour
Grist
grind2
Schmollbluk
Almost There
Counter Clockwise Chant Pattern
FREEDOM DiVE
Eclipse (solar)

I think AQD could qualify more as a high-end 12, seeing as how all of the patterns are easy to cheat, and the density of the file is overall manageable. Everything else here looks fine - positioning of the high 12s doesn't matter as long as we have a sample of what could be a potential cutoff.

[rayword45]

Songs that have ONLY posts agreeing with the OP (regardless of post count):

mutant corecore (11 to 12)
{Satori} v2 (9 to 8)
do I smile? (12 to 13)
Revo (debatable on what 2nd post meant) (12 to 13)
Fast Asleep (10 to 11)
what the f is this (9 to 10)
{Firestorm} (8 to 9)
The Final Fantasy (7 to 8)
Clash on the Big Bridge (5 to 6)
honki sentai majirenjaa -MAJI eurobeat version- (11 to 12)

[rushyrulz]

The song (For FFR) is relatively easy except the hard part at the end. And even then, the ending isn't very fast. Skeletor is an 11 because the roll part is faster, and the rest of the song is faster than VC songs in general.

My point exactly. At least you can jumptrill AAA Skeletor because it's fast enough. If you tried to straight jumptrill For FFR's ending you would NOT AAA, because it's too slow and it's full of weird frame gaps that prevent a jumptrill from being successful. Instead you need to do some weird jumptrill to single arrow transitional shit and then somehow nail the ending roll that is pretty offbeat just like the song in its entirety.


For FFR is a solid 10 because of its other parts that are not as hard (I would even say the song is a 9 or less without the ending.)


Mind you, this file was created back when enormous difficulty boosts were legal. I think the file without the wall would be hard enough to constitute a low 10, and then that ending is harder than the rest of the file by like 4 times.

[jimerax]

Difficulties of some songs were changed, carry on discussions.

[Elite Ninja]

Difficulties of some songs were changed, carry on discussions.

Is there a place where you log the difficulty changes? Would be nice to know what songs were changed to what difficulty.

[00Razor00]

Read first post.

[Anaru]

Whoaaa do i smile is a 13 now. Cool :D

[rayword45]

Songs that have ONLY posts agreeing with the OP (regardless of post count):

mutant corecore (11 to 12)
{Satori} v2 (9 to 8)
Revo (debatable on what 2nd post meant) (12 to 13)
Fast Asleep (10 to 11)
what the f is this (9 to 10)
{Firestorm} (8 to 9)
The Final Fantasy (7 to 8)
honki sentai majirenjaa -MAJI eurobeat version- (11 to 12)

IMO, these all should be bumped as well.

[rayword45]

1-99 scale ratings

Seeing how work on this was done for the FGOs/FSOs, I thought it would be nice to continue work on this with the lower difficulties? Any in favor?

I'll start with FMOs (Stealing OWA's list). Please notify me of missing songs and make edits yourself.

76

Novo Mundo
Colorful Course
0 (piano version)
Makiba
Ambient Angels
Heavenly Spores
Defection
Going On Spring Wind
Epidermis
Choprite
Puzzle
Lawn Wake I
Arrogant Cobbler
Largiloquent Dithyramb
World Tour 2004 (Either top or bottom)

77

Rottel-da-station
Jeanie and Caroline
Variations 2
Thrash
Determination
Disconnected Hardkore
Hajnal
The Divine Suicide of K [Heavy]
Midnight Dragon
Romance In The Club feat. Liquido
300
Battle Theme #37
JULIAN
Melonman’s OP
Black Key Etude


78

Grocery Escape Plan
Club
AIM Anthem
Radio Heads
Summer Time Perfume
The Rapids
Church Bells

79

Op.10 No.9
Starwolf
Passage D [Heavy]
Dance and Zeal
Strangeprogram
Setsujou! Hyakka Ryouran!
SOLROS

80

Blue-Violet
Final Fantasy Last Battle Festival
Kanon Medley ~Metal Wings~
Exciting Hyper Highspeed Star
Minute Waltz v2
Powerpuff Gabberz
I’m Sick of Uprock
Nanairopanda v2
Kyrie
PianoCore
Clockwork
INFINITY Hyperspace
Marisa Stole The Precious Thing
Scythe of 13
Distorted God
Gaussian Blur
Floating Hour
Cinnamon Roll
BB Evolution
Master Maid
Perfect Cherry Storm
Famicom Selecta
Document 13b
Dendrite v2
Night and Day
Flight of the Bumblebee
Over the Ocean
Overdrive
Mario Minor
Blindfolds Aside
Staring at my Spaceship

The bolded ones need to be moved accurately.

81

Brandish Headless
JULIA
Aim Burst
Otaku Speedvibe [Oni]
Dead and Direct
3020
4 Chord Touhou
Yorukumoryuu Yamikaze
Hellhounds On My Trail
RunnyMorning (SGX Mix)
Caprice
Mermaid Island
Piano Etude (Demon Fire)

82

Big Blue
October
Momentary Life
Silly Symphony
BB Revenge
Flesvelka
Of course you Need and…NEED ME
Bloodmeat [Heavy]
Mermaid Island
bmv.578

83

Toxiferous Dystopia
Skeletor
Eradication
Ripoff
Kono Spoon, Suteki Desu Ne
No Purpose Flour
Piano Concerto 1 ‘ANTI-ARES’ (For Kirby)
He’s A Radical Rat
Piano Etude (Gymnastics)
mutant corecore

[hi19hi19]

Flight of the Bumblebee to 82 or at least 81
Final Fantasy Last Battle Festival down to around 77 +/- 1

Those are the ones that stick out to me most, I'm sure others will have strong opinions as well.

[bmah]

Hi guys. I've updated several songs with new difficulties. Please post if you have strong objections against these. I've picked a number of songs from which the community seemed to strongly agree upon for the most part. In other words, only files with a nearly unanimous consensus.

{Satori} v2: 9 ---> 8
Fast Asleep: 10 ---> 11
Fei Longer: 9 ---> 10
mutant corecore: 11 ---> 12
Story of Snowman and Sunshine Girl: 4 ---> 5
what the f is this: 9 ---> 10

If there are no issues with these files, then their respective difficulty threads will be locked shortly.

[DarknessXoXLight]

Story of Snowman and Sunshine Girl: 4 ---> 11***



:)

[Xx{Midnight}xX]

I think SSSG should be knocked up one more notch but eh. When I get around to it I'll figure out a good post for why. Great start and thank you much Bmah.

[bmah]

SSSG was really quite tricky. Looking at people's response from that thread, opinions on how far it should move up went everywhere. A lot of people said 6, but 5 seemed to be a slightly stronger opinion, not to mention you cannot deny that it's safe to at least bump it up one. AAAing is a different story though, but you can't rely on AAAing as a decent factor of measuring difficulty.

You can always make a new case though if the difficulty still isn't "proper" to the majority. Bitching gets you results!

[jimerax]

Well final fantasy can be also changed after I look at it.
Revo and P4U might be the ones that can be in 13 zone out of these, might be.

also Gruntilda's Lair is like 7/8 and current one looks apparently wrong so will be changed too.

[jimerax]

so, changed like this.

The Final Fantasy - 7 -> 8
Gruntilda's Lair - 6 -> 7 (still debatable w/ 8)
P4U v1 - 12 -> 13
Revo - 12 -> 13

[justin_ator]

Looks good to me, I definitely knew from my sightread that Lair wasn't a 6.

[reuben_tate]

Gruntilda's lair could be a low-8, but I wouldn't mind it as a 7. As for Entry of the Gladiators, Op.68...how is that not an 8 or an 9? rofl

[jimerax]

9, are you joking?

8 is possible for jacky/js patterns though. maybe changing.

[bmah]

Needs more discussion before a further change.

[jimerax]

Needs more discussion before a further change.

If the person who rated/is responsible for difficulty rating think the initial rating is apparently wrong, difficulties can changed independent of threads.

Other than this, discussions in threads are needed basically.

ps updated.

[rayword45]

Just sayin, you should update the OP.

[EzExZeRo7497]

Bumping thread since the general discussion was at the AT thread... I honestly feel that the 1-15 system is actually decent enough. A 1-100 system would be redundant in my opinion, there will always be a high 88 and a low 88, no matter how diverse.

[mrpreggers]

Bumping thread since the general discussion was at the AT thread... I honestly feel that the 1-15 system is actually decent enough. A 1-100 system would be redundant in my opinion, there will always be a high 88 and a low 88, no matter how diverse.

You would think with a scale from 1-100 that the difference between a high 88 and a low 89 would be so little that it wouldn't matter.

[bmah]

Well here's the thing. I was rooting for a 1-15 difficulty system, but jimerax said it'd eventually change to a 1-100 system. Why it seems that this has already been decided is beyond me. It's not like the community has made a solid consensus on this yet. I have to consult a bit more on this topic.

[bballa48]

Random thought that isn't that big of a deal in the big scheme of things... but it is bugging me today.

SOLROS needs to be moved way the hell up. It has 14 AAAs and is easily a mid to high FMO... yet it is currently rated easier than Hajnal and Epidermis.

[nois-or-e]

Make a thread balla ;D

[bballa48]

Make a thread balla ;D

Well I thought we were supposed to discuss songs in here if we didn't advocate changing from one difficulty to another?

I am not saying it is a FGO, just a higher 11.

[rayword45]

Here's a different confliction of mine.

How exactly is Sparkle Downer a 12, while Radical Rat is an 11?

Both are fairly slow, jumpjack heavy songs, but the way I see it, Rad Rat is a LOT more brutal then SD, with more anchors, longer jack/jumpjack patterns, MUCH more colorful (especially towards the ending) and being the lengthier of the 2 songs.

Subjective view: Stats

Sparkle Downer: 9-0-0-0
He's A Radical Rat: 62-21-0-51 (or 48-6-5-13)

I can't make a thread on this due to being unsure which is incorrect from my view.

[sticklydude]

Here's a different confliction of mine.

How exactly is Sparkle Downer a 12, while Radical Rat is an 11?

Both are fairly slow, jumpjack heavy songs, but the way I see it, Rad Rat is a LOT more brutal then SD, with more anchors, longer jack/jumpjack patterns, MUCH more colorful (especially towards the ending) and being the lengthier of the 2 songs.

Subjective view: Stats

Sparkle Downer: 9-0-0-0
He's A Radical Rat: 62-21-0-51 (or 48-6-5-13)

I can't make a thread on this due to being unsure which is incorrect from my view.

I feel SD is harder for me.
Sparkle Downer: 27-2-0-13
He's A Radical Rat: 29-0-0-6

[DossarLX ODI]

Just the above two posts alone are good justification to not make a 1-100 scale, lol

[Elite Ninja]

Sparkle Downer: 2-0-0-1
He's a Radical Rat: 20-0-0-1

:monkey:

[popsicle_3000]

1-15. i like how people can refer to AAAing a FMO, etc... what's it going to turn into? OH look guys i AAA'd a 74, my best before was a 72... lame to me!!

[DossarLX ODI]

1-15. i like how people can refer to AAAing a FMO, etc... what's it going to turn into? OH look guys i AAA'd a 74, my best before was a 72... lame to me!!

Or better yet 1-16, with vrofl being the only 16

1-100 is where you're open to way too much disagreement. AIM Anthem, for example, could be an 82 to someone that falls behind on long anchor jacks but then like a 65 to someone else that excels in long jackhammers like that (see: YOSHl getting it as his first FMO but then having no other FMO SDGs at the time, and I don't even think he had any VC AAAs at the time either).

[EzExZeRo7497]

1-15. i like how people can refer to AAAing a FMO, etc... what's it going to turn into? OH look guys i AAA'd a 74, my best before was a 72... lame to me!!

People can just classify a bunch of difficulties into one particular name, for example 12-13 can be For Gurus Only, 14-15 can be FSO.

[nois-or-e]

~Spoiler alert~


The system that has been decided on is a 1-20 difficulty system with files being ranked on a secondary 1-99 scale within these difficulties. Making a 1-15 system would almost pointless, considering that we are already utilising a 1-14 scale and the current ratio of 9/10/11/12 is 3:3:2:1, so effectively we'd be stretching the 9's and 10's over one extra difficulty slot. This new system has been well thought out and a lot of work has gone and will continue going into this with several people involved in making it happen. When the time comes, a sticky will be posted for user input and suggestions.

I am anticipating that it will be in place by mid-May.

~stay tuned~

[DossarLX ODI]

Thanks for the update, Jae

[nois-or-e]

np mate, I just hate seeing people get worked up on maybes when there is a lot of stuff happening in the bg ;D

Once the new system is up, it is you the player, that will be in the position to help ensure we never have such a backlog of unsorted files and misplaced files again. I just ask that people be patient and wait to see what we have in store for you~

[Magicturbo]

Oh my

[Jerry DB]

wow this is maybe the biggest update of the year along with tier points if that even happens this year lol.
Thanks Jae and everyone involved who are nameless for some reason, the mystery makes it more interesting ;D

[igotrhythm]

Damn it, Takei!

Seriously, though, I support Popsicle's argument that people should have a general idea of accomplishment along those lines, if only because I fluked the hell out of Makiba two days ago. Now people are pushing me to get another one when none of the other FMOs are less than 3 goods away. <<

[MaxGhost]

WOOT. I'm excited for this. 1-20 sounds about right.

[Jerry DB]

I'm sure there will be a way to tell what is a fmo by old terms. Just like you can tell fmo is 37-41 on dragonsfury I'm sure it will be no different