Utopia or dystopia?

trillobyite · 05-27-2004, 08:51 AM

So, I was very bored one night and figured I might as well go watch Tv. On the way to it, I saw this book out of the corner of my eye, Ayn Rand's "Anthem". So, I saw that it was a very short book, only about 100 pages in big print, and sat to read it.

The book got me thinking a little. It describes a society in which every person is born only to serve his fellow humans. Basically, every moment of their lives is controlled from birth to death, and they are expected not to stray from society and do exactly what told in order to help their brothers. They would grow up learning the ideology of the power of the great "we", and sleep in large rooms with 100 beds each. At 15, they would be given a job which a government council selected. They were not allowed to prefer their own job. None of them knew what the word "I" meant, and uttering it was the only crime punishable by death.

Humans would be forced to reproduce twice in their lifetime, in configurations to produce the most average children possible. Children would never know their parents. They would work 10 hours a day, and could not interfere with another's vocation. Just imagine a group of robots doing mindless tasks all their lives. That's what this society was about.

Then, i thought of something. Is this truly a dystopia? Think about it, there is no crime, no drugs, no overcrowding, no harm to nature, etc. Everyone does what they need to do, and that is it. Every person is given code names, and refer to themselves as "we". Since their technology was severely impaired, there was no pollution or destruction of the ozone, no global warming. Basically, it was the framework of the perfect society, yet it was carried out by a philosophy of communism, an already extreme government system, taken to the extreme.

I disagree with its philosophy entirely, yet I believe that they have achieved the principles of a utopia. What do you guys think? Is this society a dystopia, since people are restricted from thinking or caring about themselves? Or is it a utopia, in that humans find their way in nature and keep peace with the land?

battle_llamma · 05-27-2004, 09:03 AM

It is a dystopia.

If you cannot assert your individuality, if you no longer are conserned with yourself you are, as trillobyte said, a mindless robot.

A utopia is about allowing everyone their INDIVIDUAL rights, not about making a society in which there is no bad.

"Without bad there is no good" and all that.

Anonymous · 05-27-2004, 09:04 AM

I wouldn't even call that a world by our standards. If I can't think for myself then I don't want to live. That is truly nothing more than a mindless life, it's very stable and clean but only until people begin to catch on that they are capable of more. That's a dystopia in my book.
Sure, our world has some problems that individuals like myself can do little about but at least I can think for myself and have an opinion about what's around me. Those people seem to have no feelings of joy/love/sadness/anger any of that! Even feelings of sadness and anger, though not the preferred feelings, let us know that we are human beings.

05-27-2004, 08:51 AM	#1
trillobyite FFR Player Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: New York Posts: 310	Utopia or dystopia? So, I was very bored one night and figured I might as well go watch Tv. On the way to it, I saw this book out of the corner of my eye, Ayn Rand's "Anthem". So, I saw that it was a very short book, only about 100 pages in big print, and sat to read it. The book got me thinking a little. It describes a society in which every person is born only to serve his fellow humans. Basically, every moment of their lives is controlled from birth to death, and they are expected not to stray from society and do exactly what told in order to help their brothers. They would grow up learning the ideology of the power of the great "we", and sleep in large rooms with 100 beds each. At 15, they would be given a job which a government council selected. They were not allowed to prefer their own job. None of them knew what the word "I" meant, and uttering it was the only crime punishable by death. Humans would be forced to reproduce twice in their lifetime, in configurations to produce the most average children possible. Children would never know their parents. They would work 10 hours a day, and could not interfere with another's vocation. Just imagine a group of robots doing mindless tasks all their lives. That's what this society was about. Then, i thought of something. Is this truly a dystopia? Think about it, there is no crime, no drugs, no overcrowding, no harm to nature, etc. Everyone does what they need to do, and that is it. Every person is given code names, and refer to themselves as "we". Since their technology was severely impaired, there was no pollution or destruction of the ozone, no global warming. Basically, it was the framework of the perfect society, yet it was carried out by a philosophy of communism, an already extreme government system, taken to the extreme. I disagree with its philosophy entirely, yet I believe that they have achieved the principles of a utopia. What do you guys think? Is this society a dystopia, since people are restricted from thinking or caring about themselves? Or is it a utopia, in that humans find their way in nature and keep peace with the land? __________________ Every hunter and forager, every hero and coward, every creator and destroyer of civilizations, every king and peasant, every young couple in love, every hopeful child, every mother and father, every inventor and explorer, every teacher of morals, every corrupt politician, every superstar, every supreme leader, every saint and sinner in the history of our species, lives here on a mote of dust, suspended in a sunbeam. http://obs.nineplanets.org/psc/pbd.html

05-27-2004, 09:03 AM	#2
battle_llamma FFR Player Join Date: May 2004 Posts: 1	It is a dystopia. If you cannot assert your individuality, if you no longer are conserned with yourself you are, as trillobyte said, a mindless robot. A utopia is about allowing everyone their INDIVIDUAL rights, not about making a society in which there is no bad. "Without bad there is no good" and all that. __________________ Welcome to Fragonomics 101, first lesson... flack cannon.

05-27-2004, 09:04 AM	#3
Anonymous FFR Player Join Date: May 2002 Posts: 1,088	I wouldn't even call that a world by our standards. If I can't think for myself then I don't want to live. That is truly nothing more than a mindless life, it's very stable and clean but only until people begin to catch on that they are capable of more. That's a dystopia in my book. Sure, our world has some problems that individuals like myself can do little about but at least I can think for myself and have an opinion about what's around me. Those people seem to have no feelings of joy/love/sadness/anger any of that! Even feelings of sadness and anger, though not the preferred feelings, let us know that we are human beings.

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