religion/science

[MrGiggles]

Originally Posted by ItIsAMystery

I have my beliefs. I also hold the belief that people who believe in God don't really understand science worth a damn. Doesn't mean I need to convert anyone.

You can't reason someone out of a position they didn't reason themselves into.

Seconding bluguerrilla on this. From where I'm standing the irony is delicious but you're pretty intelligent so I assume I'm misunderstanding.

[ItIsAMystery]

What I mean is that most arguments a theist will throw at you regarding God can be instantly kicked in the nuts by a scientific explanation they were probably unaware of (be it evolution (which most people don't understand despite claims that they do), necessary conditions, quantum mechanics, etc). It is clear that a God is not needed to explain anything about our universe. A theist's response to this is akin to flipping a coin 10,000 times, having them all come up heads, and then claiming "Wow, how rare! Oh well, FAITH IN THE TAILS!" without considering that it's probably a double-headed coin. If you want to put your faith in the small-probability residual that, despite all we know, a God will unify all that scientific information and explain the unexplainable, then go right on ahead. The rest of us will be over here with the right answers.

[JW Kid 9415]

Originally Posted by ItIsAMystery

I have my beliefs. I also hold the belief that people who believe in God don't really understand science worth a damn.

I would have to disagree on this since the Bible actually has scientific facts that were predicted BEFORE they proved them

[kommisar]

i respect religions that benefit communities through charities.



i disrespect religions that encourage assimilation and belittle other religions.

[bluguerrilla]

Just because you understand something doesn't mean you have to accept it.

Faith isn't something you have because a conclusion you come to rationally or by reason because if you did wouldn't it be a contradiction?

Maybe it's not even worth discussing because your argument is more of a troll basis than anything else.

[Izzy]

If a child is left alone to decide for themselves what they believe in, what do you think they will come up with?

I don't believe it is even possible for a kid today to come up with the bible out of thin air.

The only reason anyone believes in the bible is because someone told you to. Someone else other then you made you believe in what you do. If you don't think there is something wrong with that, then be my guest and have a jolly good time.

[ItIsAMystery]

Originally Posted by bluguerrilla

Just because you understand something doesn't mean you have to accept it.

Faith isn't something you have because a conclusion you come to rationally or by reason because if you did wouldn't it be a contradiction?

Maybe it's not even worth discussing because your argument is more of a troll basis than anything else.

What on earth is that garbage. I didn't even dignify that with a question mark.

"Just because you understand something doesn't mean you have to accept it?" Last I checked, the science that is true for me is true for you. There is a great deal of evidence with very strong reinforcement that explains so much about our universe compared to what we were able to explain even 50-100 years ago, and science is not something you can choose to accept or reject. We are unfortunately not the Mythbusters who reject reality and substitute their own :P

But hey if you understand that the earth revolves around the sun and want to reject it, be my guest. To reject science in favor of a God is like, as I said before, rejecting a massive-streak head-toss which is clearly indicative of a certain truth in favor of a very lucky coin. Our existence is NOT riding the wave of the 100th-sigma, here.

When it comes to extraordinarily low probabilities with great underlying magnitudes, it's a good idea to provide some sort of insurance against this -- this is part of the underlying logic of Pascal's Wager taken to a different field. However, banking on it out of blind faith is putting too great a weight on something that is absurd. It'd be like being pushed out of an airlock into space with the blind faith that there will be air and normalized pressure for you.

Don't even get me started on the Bible, btw, which is worthless as a scientific piece and only has worth as a work of allegorical fiction.

[MrGiggles]

So you don't think it's possible for someone to understand science if they believe in God?

What if someone understands and accepts science and evolution and all that gr8 stuff, but chooses to believe that God is the one responsible for it all? Believing in God doesn't necessarily mean you have to take the Bible literally. Or even seriously.

[stargroup]

the only useful post in here is that of kommisar's

the rest of the crap you guys are spewing is either useless, redundant, or fallacious.

[bluguerrilla]

Originally Posted by ItIsAMystery

What on earth is that garbage. I didn't even dignify that with a question mark.

"Just because you understand something doesn't mean you have to accept it?" Last I checked, the science that is true for me is true for you. There is a great deal of evidence with very strong reinforcement that explains so much about our universe compared to what we were able to explain even 50-100 years ago, and science is not something you can choose to accept or reject. We are unfortunately not the Mythbusters who reject reality and substitute their own :P

Sorry, I was too vague. I meant just because you understand arguments proving why god shouldn't exist (or something along those lines) doesn't mean you have to accept them. Didn't mean science.

Although it can also be true that you can understand the reasoning behind a derivation and what you get as a result but at the same time not be satisfied with it.

And there are plenty of times where I've read something in a published journal that I didn't agree with but you're probably just talking about widely accepted theories or whatever.

Regardless, I didn't mean science and should have been more specific but I just woke up. I should have just quoted the part of your post I meant. Whatever.

Originally Posted by MrGiggles

So you don't think it's possible for someone to understand science if they believe in God?

What if someone understands and accepts science and evolution and all that gr8 stuff, but chooses to believe that God is the one responsible for it all? Believing in God doesn't necessarily mean you have to take the Bible literally. Or even seriously.

From what I've read, there are a bunch of arguments as to why God shouldn't exist.

Like these but I don't claim to be versed in any this so I don't even know. Maybe he can tell you. :P

[ItIsAMystery]

stargroup: Thing is, what he said is obvious and is something almost anyone will agree with. It's harder to grow a sack and defend your claims.

Giggles: No. I am saying most people who believe in God are likely ignorant of much of the science we know today or simply don't understand all the arguments. Most people don't even understand the basics of evolution. Many are still Creationists, which makes me want to punt people in the kidneys. I would argue that if someone accepts/understands science, they would see that there is no need to believe that a God is "responsible for it all."

bluguerrilla: Again, I think it ties back to understanding. Someone with a strong understanding and a skepticism/dissatisfaction with an explanation is usually indicative that the explanation is missing a large piece (say, to explain all the variance as opposed to just assuming that all variables involved are accountable for 100% of the result). So many people don't even understand the basic concept of a necessary condition. It's like listening to people who argue that evolution is "random." Anyone who spews that **** or doesn't understand what a necessary condition is is ignorant of the counterarguments and loses all credibility.

[adlp]

hey ur dumb man

[Grandiagod]

shut up

[Grandiagod]

all of you shut up

[adlp]

grandi now has the floor

[GuidoHunter]

Originally Posted by ItIsAMystery

I would argue that if someone accepts/understands science, they would see that there is no need to believe that a God is "responsible for it all."

Someone who truly understands science would know better than to ever say something like this.

--Guido

http://andy.mikee385.com

[Grandiagod]

guido, "shut up all of you" applies to you as well

[Izzy]

Originally Posted by GuidoHunter

Someone who truly understands science would know better than to ever say something like this.

Nice unsupported comment.

[ItIsAMystery]

Originally Posted by GuidoHunter

Someone who truly understands science would know better than to ever say something like this.

--Guido

http://andy.mikee385.com

Can you not read? Props for proving my point.


Here's why you're retarded:

Originally Posted by ItIsAMystery

What I mean is that most arguments a theist will throw at you regarding God can be instantly kicked in the nuts by a scientific explanation they were probably unaware of (be it evolution (which most people don't understand despite claims that they do), necessary conditions, quantum mechanics, etc). It is clear that a God is not needed to explain anything about our universe. A theist's response to this is akin to flipping a coin 10,000 times, having them all come up heads, and then claiming "Wow, how rare! Oh well, FAITH IN THE TAILS!" without considering that it's probably a double-headed coin. If you want to put your faith in the small-probability residual that, despite all we know, a God will unify all that scientific information and explain the unexplainable, then go right on ahead. The rest of us will be over here with the right answers.

[Grandiagod]

If you're too stupid to understand what "shut up" means, you're too stupid to post about your religious beliefs or lack thereof.