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Old 02-15-2008, 12:42 AM   #41
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Default Re: Another school shooting.... What is going on?!?!

if a weapon is aquired illigally it is usally through some kind of gang, or criminal organization. and will not be used to rob some average joe.

illigal weapons exist in Canada... yet the problem doesn't exist becasue the guns stay within gang warfare, nobody is dumb enough to take an illigal gun to rob some nobody.
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Old 02-15-2008, 01:19 AM   #42
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Default Re: Another school shooting.... What is going on?!?!

Madness. I hate to say it, after hearing the reports about shootings occurring at tech and university campuses, I am actually glad I go to community college.
If you look here http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/School_...#North_America There is no record of any community college school shootings. Maybe it's the smaller class sizes...

As a civilian your not allowed to carry your firearm in most places of business or school; so saying that a firearm will protect you from criminals may be true, but you will also be a criminal for carrying the firearm. Catch-22. It's the perfect answer, if you live in the middle of nowhere, in a rural environment where if you had to wait for the police you would already be dead. I think that firearms for civilians should be banned in metropolitan areas as they are usually filled with enough heavily armed police to control the crime populace. If our government does decide to become tyrannical the firearms you buy won't protect you from an organized army bent on enslaving you anyway. You may be able to fight back like the various groups in Iraq do, but you could get the weapons illegally at that point anyway.
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Old 02-15-2008, 01:26 AM   #43
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Default Re: Another school shooting.... What is going on?!?!

So very sad. Terrible that things like this have to happen.

On the discussion about gun laws, though, I don't know much about the whole issue, would making guns illegal really stop people from having them? A lot of drugs are illegal, but does that stop tons of people from using them? As I said, I don't know much about the issue, but I think that if somebody wanted to kill a bunch of people, they could very well do it without a gun.
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Old 02-15-2008, 01:36 AM   #44
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Default Re: Another school shooting.... What is going on?!?!

Well... A gun is actually the easiest way of killing groups of people. Think about it. The second easiest would be a bomb, but that requires intelligence and risking death making the bomb. Besides from that I guess you could poison people. Laws are put in place to affect the majority of society, they do have a major effect even though people will always break the law.
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Old 02-15-2008, 02:14 AM   #45
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Default Re: Another school shooting.... What is going on?!?!

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That's what the police/alarm is for. If you still feel like you have to protect yourself why not a tazer or other non-leathal (not leather) alternative to a firearm.

For protection the only gun I would use would be like a PPK or a small .22 handgun. Maybeh even a gun that has rubber bullets. Tasers, not counting the police ones, are close range, guns have longer ranges. You could always get the paintballs with pepperpowder in them...
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Old 02-15-2008, 02:57 AM   #46
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Default Re: Another school shooting.... What is going on?!?!

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Originally Posted by thegeddupnoise View Post
So very sad. Terrible that things like this have to happen.

On the discussion about gun laws, though, I don't know much about the whole issue, would making guns illegal really stop people from having them? A lot of drugs are illegal, but does that stop tons of people from using them? As I said, I don't know much about the issue, but I think that if somebody wanted to kill a bunch of people, they could very well do it without a gun.
Yes, but making guns illegal would greatly cut down on the amount of them, and usage for violence.
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Old 02-15-2008, 04:20 AM   #47
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Default Re: Another school shooting.... What is going on?!?!

I think there's a city in Kansas or somewhere where it is not only required for you to own a gun, but to have it on you at all times. Their crime rate is like 2%. Because if everyone owns and is carrying a gun, then no one will do stupid **** like robberies while people are around. Nor mugging or raping or any of that **** to other people. They'd get shot. The only sure way would be to burglarize desolate areas. Therefore, making it harder. Granted, this whole "everyone should own and carry a gun" won't work for everyone, but since when has anything worked for everyone? I'm not saying we should do this everywhere, in fact, I believe it's a very very risky thing. Cities like New York where everyone is violent and aggressive and don't pay attention to **** shouldn't be that way. Crime would probably increase. It works best for hick towns and such. In cities like New York, it'd probably be easier to make it harder to own a gun. I do believe that totally prohibiting guns, or even prohibiting guns to everyone but law enforcement officers wouldn't work so well. Mainly because the only people with guns will be the police, and the violent people who obtain them illegally strictly for illegal purposes.

If only gun control was a topic for the Regents Essay Exam...

I hope people read this because it provides a bit of enlightenment on both sides of the argument, and even raises a potentially controversial argument on it, that to me sounds kind of reasonable.
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Old 02-15-2008, 09:13 AM   #48
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Default Re: Another school shooting.... What is going on?!?!

So, in general, increased gun control or the lack thereof would be a lose/lose situation. If we control guns, people can still get them illegally and attack the now defenseless population. Without further gun control, people can still attack innocent lives, but some of the victims may have a lethal method of self-defense to throw back at them in certain cases.

In my opinion, the latter is still better.
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Old 02-15-2008, 10:29 AM   #49
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Default Re: Another school shooting.... What is going on?!?!

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Originally Posted by Revolversaid View Post
Madness. I hate to say it, after hearing the reports about shootings occurring at tech and university campuses, I am actually glad I go to community college.
If you look here http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/School_...#North_America There is no record of any community college school shootings. Maybe it's the smaller class sizes...
Wrong. A woman walked into a classroom at Louisiana Technical College (a community college) and shot and killed two female classmates.

It's not that there are no shootings at community colleges, it's that the national media doesn't care unless the tragedy occurs at a large university and large numbers of people are involved. CNN misreported that the shooting occurred at Louisiana Tech UNIVERSITY, and shortly after correcting the mistake, took the story down. Community college? That's not news!

@Fido: Burglarizing a house while the occupants are away is (I think) a misdemeanor (or at the very least, not a huge legal deal). Breaking into a house when the occupants are home is a felony. How many times have you heard of a person being killed because he or she "surprised" a burglar? If someone breaks into a home and discovers that there are people there, the burglar is going to want to make sure those people don't talk. Sure, there are instances when just the presence of a homeowner is enough to scare away the thief, but often it's not and the consequences wind up being tragic. I would like to own a gun for the simple purpose of intimidation. Sure, I can barricade myself in my room and call the police and hope they don't break down my door. Or I can blow a hole through my ceiling and, if necessary, some punk's kneecaps and get a much stronger message across.

You are completely right that guns should be unnecessary. Unfortunately, your ideal world does not exist. People commit crimes against other people. I never thought I would want a gun until my house was burglarized. In Texas, I have the right to protect my home from intruders, and I intend to exercise that right if ever I am presented with such a difficult situation.
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Old 02-15-2008, 10:59 AM   #50
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Default Re: Another school shooting.... What is going on?!?!

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****

lol weapon triangle

Automatic > Sidearm
Sidearm > ???
High-explosion > Automatic?

Modern-day weapon triangle.
Wow this almsot makes me feel like making an entirely new triangle of combat.
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Old 02-17-2008, 02:19 AM   #51
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Default Re: Another school shooting.... What is going on?!?!

Thanks for the info. Another point on the gun is that if you do have a family where do you keep a gun so that your children will not get to it? If you do have to keep it in such a secluded place how can you get to that place under the shock and stress of being burgled in the middle of the night. One could also point to the high amount of domestic violence involving firearms in this country as well. This article is educational.

www.endabuse.org/resources/facts/Guns.pdf

"A gun is the weapon most commonly used in domestic homicides."

The information about a town in Kansas is extremely vague and there has been no name given. A gun used for self defense in metropolitan areas could in fact kill others nearby by accident. Bullets travel far. In Los Angeles they frequently talk about people being killed by "stray bullets." In close quarters settings such as inside a house, a knife may in fact be more practical. The only problem is it takes a great amount of courage to knife someone. A security system is also effective, especially in neighborhoods because all of a sudden everyone is aware of the break in. If you are out in the middle of nowhere, I would be for owning a gun as it takes too long for law enforcement to come to your aid nor are their people close by to give you aid. If someone does in fact break in they are not likely to make a great amount of noise as they do not want to get arrested, more then likely you will be asleep, the gun will be of no use to you then. If you feel safe with a gun great, but that safety is more faith than reality. The biggest problem with letting anyone buy a gun is that there are alot of people who are insane in this country who have not been diagnosed. These people can plot to kill a large amount of people and go to a wal-mart to get the gun. They do not have to make contacts in the criminal world, which is not exactly easy. Getting a gun illegally is far more difficult and dangerous then walking into a store and waiting two weeks. They will not be stopped either unless they have a criminal record. People snap, look at the post office shootings. The greater good would be served if guns were not available to everybody. People get raped and killed even if they do own guns, so that is not really a valid argument. If you do pull a gun on a hardened criminal when it comes down to it you may be the one getting killed because you escalated the situation as well. All food for thought. I am not completely opposed to firearms and their are always exceptions.
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Old 02-17-2008, 02:37 AM   #52
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Default Re: Another school shooting.... What is going on?!?!

I don't necessarily believe guns should be banned...rather I believe that having optional ownership of guns is what causes the problems...If you look at countries where guns are banned, they have lower murder rates than optional gun usage. On the other hand, most people don't seem to realize that the country with the lowest murder rate (by far) is Switzerland, a country that requires all of its citizens to have one. I believe you need to eliminate the advantage that makes people feel superior to a point of murder by putting everyone on a level playing field, whether that be everyone having guns or nobody having guns. (keep in mind the later of the two means many people will turn to alternate means of murder because they don't have as much of a threat of people being able to effectively defend themselves against attack)
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Old 02-17-2008, 03:50 AM   #53
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Default Re: Another school shooting.... What is going on?!?!

It's the law of averages.
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Old 02-17-2008, 04:58 AM   #54
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Default Re: Another school shooting.... What is going on?!?!

I don't see why school shooting topics always have to turn into gun control topics. It's really not useful to talk about it unless you've got a reason that isn't something to the effect of "Guns are bad, mmkay...?".

I'm going to be honest here. The problem by this point isn't guns -- these people don't just want to shoot people for the **** of it. All of these shootings, as far as I know, ended with the gunner taking their own life as well. What's driving these people to suicide? I'm really not sure, but I can take a guess.

First, it might be depressive problems with a lack of social support. I've seen this with my own eyes. I understand that people with severe depression are not easy to deal with a lot of the time, but that's when they need support the most. If that support isn't there, they stop thinking rationally and begin acting impulsively.

Second, it could be social rejection in general. Treating people like ****, believe it or not, will piss them off. And people don't seem to ****ing understand that. I've watched people walk all over other people, or ignore them, or something else like that. Again, I know there's some people out there who you just don't want anything to do with. But it's perfectly possible to clench your teeth and be minimally decent towards them.

So my point here is, gun control isn't a solution. It won't take weapons out of the hands of desperate people, the same way laws won't take marijuana or meth out of people's hands. The real problem here is finding out what we as individuals can do to stop this bull****.

Everyone gasps and moans over it after it's happened. And then they "wish they could do something." Well, maybe you can, you know? Giving someone a little bit of positive attention could end up saving people one day.

I hope this post made sense, it's late.
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Old 02-17-2008, 11:43 AM   #55
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Default Re: Another school shooting.... What is going on?!?!

I bet the ATF has nothing better to do than go to these school shootings.
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Old 02-17-2008, 11:50 AM   #56
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Default Re: Another school shooting.... What is going on?!?!

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leather
That's what happens when I'm half asleep at the keyboard and trying to spell lethal Q_Q


I know nothing of weapons but wouldn't rubber bullets be enough to get the message across? It wouldn't kill them but injure then enough to drop to the ground.

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Old 02-17-2008, 11:59 AM   #57
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Because killing animals for weapons is just wrong.
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Old 02-17-2008, 12:15 PM   #58
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Default Re: Another school shooting.... What is going on?!?!

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That's what happens when I'm half asleep at the keyboard and trying to spell lethal Q_Q


I know nothing of weapons but wouldn't rubber bullets be enough to get the message across? It wouldn't kill them but injure then enough to drop to the ground.

as it was pointed out earlier, the person breaking into yuor house is prolly a better shot then you or at least as good as you, that being said pointing a gun that looks real at a person that has a gun that IS real would be the worsat thing you can do. you best bet is to not show any weapons and to cooperate with the robber. someone stealing from your house doesn't go thier to kill a person, they simply have the gun for protection as well. not every robber has it in them to kill, sometimes they need to steal to make ends meet and have no interest in killing.
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Old 02-17-2008, 12:17 PM   #59
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Default Re: Another school shooting.... What is going on?!?!

Question: "What is going on?"
Answer: Guns are easily available. People are being bullied. Push someone far enough and they will break. Even if bullying isn't the cause, there are still guns.
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Old 02-17-2008, 12:24 PM   #60
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Guns should've never existed. -.- We should all be trained in a weapon of choice, walking around with swords and stuff. That's the world I want. lol
Ahaha Yes! That would be epic. Peoples bones are made to protect from that kind of stuff, just sharp weapons and blunt things, bullets are too powerful to even stand a chance against anyone... At least if we used swords people would have a chance to defend themselves.
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