TWG CXLIV - The Freeze Wars (Sex Live)

[DaBackpack]

my mouth is literally ajar

I need to reevaluate literally everything

[DaBackpack]

tokzic even though it doesn't matter

[Tokzic]

Originally Posted by Charu

So anyways... now that's over with, Tokzic, how's it feel, you now have the power to randomly post in this thread and post random shenanigans.

except i can't because i'm not the one fakeclaiming and i'm going to be way too busy figuring out who botchi's partners are with conviction so i can atone for this colossal fucking misplay

i am so sorry town

[dLGN]

no regrets, don't claim wolf and laugh about pushing the gradiant lynch when you learn that the "slip" you called out wasn't.

i hate this game.

[Charu]

Welcome to FFR TWG.

[DaBackpack]

Originally Posted by dLGN

no regrets, don't claim wolf and laugh about pushing the gradiant lynch when you learn that the "slip" you called out wasn't.

i hate this game.

I don't like this response

[DaBackpack]

AA, tell us your thoughts, now that you are no longer super scummy

[AragakiAyase]

Originally Posted by DaBackpack

I think I explained in the post-game :P

AA, when you get to it, my question about your "we didn't lynch you" comment still stands

because he was a very strong townread in serious danger of being lynched and I was relieved that we didn't flip him

[AragakiAyase]

Originally Posted by Tokzic

except i can't because i'm not the one fakeclaiming and i'm going to be way too busy figuring out who botchi's partners are with conviction so i can atone for this colossal fucking misplay

i am so sorry town

I've see this line a lot (in EM lmfao) and it never convinces me

[storn42]

Originally Posted by Tokzic

except i can't because i'm not the one fakeclaiming and i'm going to be way too busy figuring out who botchi's partners are with conviction so i can atone for this colossal fucking misplay

i am so sorry town

and im sure xiz's lynch based on the fact that he thoguht he had a woof and was wrong was a good reason to lynch our hobo.

[storn42]

but the important question. was he hobo #1 or #2?

[Charu]

Does the numbering even matter?

[AragakiAyase]

Originally Posted by DaBackpack

AA, tell us your thoughts, now that you are no longer super scummy

I think tokzic is the wolf. there's the possibility of botchi being instructed OR being a super clueless town, but I just don't see it happening, unless botchi comes and rescinds his claim as soon as he gets back.

I couldn't read the last few pages too carefully but dlgn has moved back onto my scum radar, something didn't feel right. He slipped heavily UTR d2 which seems odd considering how strongly he wanted to lead d1 and he went along to solidify the xiz mislynch. I'll look at his posts more carefully

I think storn is almost certainly town

Same with V as I've said before

Xel came off super scummy to me earlier but he's feeling a bit more town after I talked with him a bit, log is here. He's nowhere near in the clear though and I want people to push him hard

[quote]
aragakiayase [7:19 PM]
Hi


----- Yesterday December 7th, 2015 -----
xelnya [2:52 AM]
you suck

​[2:52]
hai

aragakiayase [11:25 AM]
so why have you been playing the way you have this game

​[11:26]
you seemed interested at first but you've completely dropped off

​[11:26]
and you backpacked onto the gradiant wagon???

xelnya [3:21 PM]
It seems like I dropped off because 1 it's OOT and you probably don't know if I've been talking to more people yet because I haven't told you and then you have to account that at the beginning of the game I was on some days off. I'm now working.

​[3:23]
If you think I'm a literal hindrance 100% I appreciate the honesty, let me know and I'll see if yoshl can get me replaced

​[3:28]
And before you like think I'm taking it personally, I'm not. Don't worry about that.

aragakiayase [3:56 PM]
I don't think you're a hindrance

​[3:56]
and work is fair and so is OOT

​[3:56]
so have you been PMing other people

xelnya [3:56 PM]
I've been sparing about it because that's usually my gameplay style anyways. I don't really interact much so I've kept it about where I think it should be.

aragakiayase [3:57 PM]
why are you trying to maintain a certain amount of interaction???

xelnya [3:57 PM]
Because a lot of it feels out of place to me

​[3:57]
Like AA, how often do I directly interact with a lot of people other than in game questions and stuff

​[3:58]
usually it's a bunch of gifs

aragakiayase [3:58 PM]
you don't

xelnya [3:58 PM]
more than straight talking

aragakiayase [3:58 PM]
but I haven't really seen you ask questions either

​[3:58]
you've posted a lot

​[3:58]
but when I look most of it is short and filler

xelnya [3:59 PM]
the thing with this game is

​[3:59]
you can't say that as anyone else

​[3:59]
with solid fact behind it

​[3:59]
like rzr couldn't say that

​[3:59]
they have no idea how I am being in pms and stuff

​[4:01]
It would take a town discussion full throttle to get that cleared and we'd see that coming I think

​[4:02]
At least, that's how it comes off to me.

aragakiayase [5:24 PM]
I don't understand

​[5:25]
basically you're saying there's no way for anyone to know how much work you're putting in unless everyone talks about it?


----- Today December 8th, 2015 -----
xelnya [2:47 AM]
The tldr is this

​[2:47]
if someone in game said

​[2:47]
"oi xel is playing his wolf meta"

​[2:47]
They couldn't fucking back it up

​[2:47]
Not with any degree promise anyways

​[2:48]
It would literally take the whole goddamned town

​[2:48]
saying hey who talked to xel

​[2:48]
which atm would only happen

​[2:48]
at one of you fucking promting it

aragakiayase [11:44 AM]
Convince me you're town because right now I think you're a wolf

aragakiayase [12:02 PM]
Any reads? Any thoughts?

​[12:02]
Which of the PR claims do you buy and why

xelnya [3:21 PM]
Best town is V hands down picking up where he did to say we shouldn't lynch the hobo claims

​[3:21]
Starting to kinda doubt tokzic because

​[3:22]
of what V and DBP posted last night

​[3:23]
I wanna see xiz go because he's playing sloppy and I wanna see him punished for it

​[3:24]
Like who the fuck clears someone because they're new, that's just horrible reasoning and is full of assumptions xiz as a plyer should be smart enough to not be making'

​[3:26]
Scummiest people in a row are probably xizu and storn third one I'm not sure of yet

​[3:26]
dbp is prob town due to the convo with v last night

aragakiayase [3:27 PM]
So you doubt toxzic but want xiz to die more because of his scummy play?

​[3:27]
Or sloppy play?

xelnya [3:27 PM]
Sloppy play because it's not characteristic of him

​[3:27]
xizu is a gimmicky player not a sloppy one

​[3:28]
But thing with doubting tokzic is

​[3:28]
we can make a move on him should be wrong about xiz, or we COULD do Botchi but no one would ever think that was a good idea so might as well go between those two because that'd get more down I think

​[3:30]
Also realizing how much I meld with v and that's not good now that I actually type my thoughts out

aragakiayase [3:32 PM]
why is melding with V not good if you townread him?

xelnya [3:34 PM]
Because mindmelding in general is fine if it's on some things but when it's a lot of them... It just feels bad

aragakiayase [3:34 PM]
does it? if I mindmeld with someone a lot that makes me feel better about them

xelnya [3:35 PM]
Sure I can see that, but it feels less like thinking for myself and more like just sitting back, agreeing, and doing nothing

​[3:35]
That is

aragakiayase [3:35 PM]
ok I can see that

xelnya [3:35 PM]
if you're like super doing it

aragakiayase [3:35 PM]
that was what I was going to ask, is it because it feels like you're just backpacking

​[3:35]
so why do you think storn is scum now

​[3:35]
because some things he did struck me as very town

xelnya [3:38 PM]
Sotrn's been utr whole game to me

​[3:38]
is that read super adjustable yes

​[3:39]
but is there someone better suited to fill that spot atm, to me no.

​[3:39]
But I can concede that one COULD be wrong.

aragakiayase [3:39 PM]
so you think xiz play is sloppy

​[3:39]
do you think he's scum because of that or that he's just sloppy?

xelnya [3:40 PM]
Inching it towards because he's being sloppy which isn't characteristic of xiz

aragakiayase [3:40 PM]
ok but lynching someone because of sloppy play doesn't seem right

xelnya [3:41 PM]
We do it with RB and Zenith all the time

aragakiayase [3:41 PM]
unless you think that sloppy play is indicative of them being scum and uncomfortable

xelnya [3:41 PM]
"which isn't characteristic of xiz"

​[3:41]
That's kinda why I added that

aragakiayase [3:41 PM]
ok I didn't interpret exactly that way but fine

​[3:41]
if xiz flips town then you think it's tokzic?

​[3:42]
with maybe botchi?

xelnya [3:43 PM]
I think if Xiz flips town we don't have a choice but to figure out between the two is full of it

​[3:43]
Would start with Tokzic tho because there's already some doubt

​[3:43]
And like I said earlier I think even messing with Botchi is a waste of time

​[3:45]
So in terms of lynch order I think it'll probably be

Xizu, Tokzic / Botchi / Maybe storn? something in that ballpark

​[3:46]
Based on the progression of things and what I think I'd do

​[3:46]
But I has a question for you tho

​[3:46]
What are your thoughts exactly on the convo dbp posted

aragakiayase [3:46 PM]
with tokzic or v

xelnya [3:46 PM]
Tokzic

​[3:46]
V is pretty much sold town

​[3:46]
he could tell me to jump, I'd probably ask how high

aragakiayase [3:46 PM]
it strikes me as weird

​[3:47]
let me look at it again

xelnya [3:47 PM]
I mean when you say it's weird like out of place, or just " a little conveniant?"

aragakiayase [3:47 PM]
I mean tokzic has said his motive was to test dbp

​[3:47]
and that he didn't think about whether or not that would actually produce results

​[3:47]
given the timing of when tokzic actually knew he'd be going into the booth

​[3:48]
he may not have had time to think it over carefully

​[3:48]
but it smells

​[3:48]
bad

​[3:48]
tokzic [10:07 PM]
alright i have a really hard time imagining red just chilling in an exhibit

​[10:08]
so i'm going to go ahead and say you're 90% town

​[3:48]
like those lines don't sound natural

xelnya [3:49 PM]
Is that directed at you, or a convo with another person

​[3:49]
by tokzic

aragakiayase [3:49 PM]
that was directed at dbp

​[3:49]
taken from convo withh tokzic

​[3:52]
so when did you come up with these reads

​[3:52]
like V town, xiz scum tokzic fishy storn scummy

xelnya [3:52 PM]
Come up with them? One does not just come up with reads. One obtains them over time

aragakiayase [3:52 PM]
yes

xelnya [3:52 PM]
lulz

aragakiayase [3:52 PM]
so at what point in the game did you have these reads

xelnya [3:53 PM]
The V one has been since he said the thing day 0 about not going through the hobos

​[3:53]
WHICH everyone is kind of ignoring

​[3:54]
But that was literally a "guys let's not sink time into this yetbecause more data later would be better for this so we're not mislynching"

​[3:54]
is sorta the approach he has

​[3:54]
I think

​[3:54]
Storn I haven't really liked all game

​[3:55]
Xiz I started to really dislike where noted in the thread with the head slap gif

​[3:55]
Because that line of thought

​[3:55]
is just awful

​[3:55]
clearing people because they're new

​[3:55]
It's like

​[3:56]
would you clear me in a game for busing a partner to death because it's the first time I'd done it

​[3:56]
No you wouldn't

​[3:56]
you'd be suspect as hell about that yes?

aragakiayase [3:56 PM]
yeah

xelnya [3:57 PM]
kay so I have to get ready for work now but yeh leave some stuff if you want and I'll get back to you when I get home

​[3:57]
I will HOPEFULLY be there for EoD

​[3:57]
Because phones but I won't be in slack

aragakiayase [3:58 PM]
ok

xelnya [3:58 PM]
So if you see anything super important paste it to me on skype plz

aragakiayase [3:58 PM]
one more question to leave you with

​[3:58]
if you've had these reads building why don't you say anything

xelnya [3:58 PM]
Canada is the answer

​[3:59]
Because saying something is not important unless I immensely disagree at this point in time. If I feel a need to stop us from going the wrong way then I'll say something

​[4:00]
Plus it's not like I can hard back these up without some of the peoples from OOT talking to me a little. Which I should start bugging them since they won't come to me

​[4:00]
I must be scary or something

aragakiayase [4:00 PM]
ok well it has the side effect of making you seem like you're trying to stay UTR

xelnya [4:00 PM]
Can't say that's wrong

​[4:01]
Off to get ready now tho

aragakiayase [4:01 PM]
ok[quote]

I have no idea how to read charu but the fact that he's considering alternate scenarios like botchi being an idiot town makes me think he's town. I want to push him as well though

I think roundbox could be a wolf, yeah sports game fine but most of what he's said this game has been filler. He's said he's had bad reads which gets him down but that's not an excuse not to post stuff, if we think they're bad we'll pick them apart

dbp is almost certainly town

rzr is confusing the fuck out of me now but I'm still leaning him town

[AragakiAyase]

Originally Posted by storn42

but the important question. was he hobo #1 or #2?

it doesn't matter

[Tokzic]

aragakiayase [6:41 PM]
if you're actually a hobo why did you claim there?

tokzic [6:42 PM]
because this happened

​[6:42]
tokzic [5:57 PM]
what

​[5:57]
i just read that two hobos claimed to you

dlgn [5:57 PM]
backpack thought that two claimed to me

tokzic [5:59 PM]
so just the one then

dlgn [5:59 PM]
yes

aragakiayase [6:43 PM]
oh so make it airtight so wolves can't fakeclaim?

tokzic [6:43 PM]
i thought dolgin got two claims

​[6:44]
which would mean that one of those people was not legit and we had a good lynch for today

​[6:44]
turns out dolgin was lying about even having one hobo claim to him though

​[6:44]
dlgn [6:32 PM]
here's the part where I come clean as soon as possible: I said one had claimed to me in hopes that one finally would take me up on the offer, but none have :disappointed:

​[6:32]
you were on my shortlist for possible HG's, though

​[6:33]
i think I made that clear when I initially messaged you, lmao

aragakiayase [6:44 PM]
oh

​[6:45]
so only you have claimed then?

​[6:46]
so i guess you're prime candidate for the booth now

tokzic [6:48 PM]
what i want to do

​[6:48]
is use either the kidz zone or the booth

aragakiayase [6:48 PM]
but V is kids zone

tokzic [6:49 PM]
but keep it ambiguous so wolves don't know whether they'll pop my bulletproof by targetting the booth

​[6:49]
yes v is currently cockblocking my genius plan >

aragakiayase [6:49 PM]
so V has to shove off then

​[6:49]
gl convincing him lol

tokzic [6:51 PM]
yeahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh

​[6:51]
it's kind of whatever

​[6:52]
i can use bathrooms tonight

​[6:52]
it just means that i can't use bathrooms tomorrow

aragakiayase [6:54 PM]
what do you think of gradiant

tokzic [6:54 PM]
he's near the top of my wolf list

​[6:54]
he only shows up when he gets pinged on

​[6:54]
he has barely any reads whatsoever

aragakiayase [6:56 PM]
who's your top wolf then

tokzic [6:59 PM]
dolgin for sure

aragakiayase [6:59 PM]
i see

tokzic [7:00 PM]
the fact that he was lying

tokzic [7:00 PM]
about having the one hobo come out to him

​[7:00]
strikes me really badly

aragakiayase [7:00 PM]
that does seem like he's hunting

​[7:00]
PR hunting isn't as damning in this game as it normally is

​[7:00]
but it's still ehhhh

tokzic [7:03 PM]
it feels to me like

​[7:03]
wolves were considering fakeclaiming

​[7:04]
and keeping humans in the dark about the hobo claims would make that very easy

aragakiayase [7:06 PM]
so you thought dlgn was fishing for claims to decide if wolves could safely fakeclaim

tokzic [7:07 PM]
yes

​[7:07]
and know what hobos were hiding in so that they could plan accordingly

aragakiayase [7:07 PM]
ok

​[7:08]
another question, what was up with you being pretty UTR until now?

tokzic [7:11 PM]
initially

​[7:11]
before the rules change

​[7:12]
i was hoping i could get one of the wolves to fakeclaim hobo

aragakiayase [7:12 PM]
ok that's what i thought

tokzic [7:12 PM]
because i had this play in mind

​[7:13]
where we could use kidz zone to narrow down the wolf without any risk of mislynching a hobo

​[7:13]
BUT THEN OOPS LOL NOW WOLVES CAN GO INTO KIDZ ZONE

aragakiayase [7:16 PM]
lol

​[7:16]
game was gonna be pretty easy to solve before rule change

​[7:16]
with being able to clear 3 people in one go with bathrooms

aragakiayase [7:28 PM]
who do you want to lynch more, dlgn or gradiant

tokzic [7:43 PM]
sorry, was eating

​[7:43]
dolgin looks

​[7:43]
really bad

aragakiayase [7:43 PM]
only wolves need to eat

tokzic [7:43 PM]
got me

aragakiayase [7:43 PM]
:dong:

tokzic [7:44 PM]
i'm about to talk about this in the game channel

aragakiayase [7:45 PM]
if dlgn were to flip scum who would you look at next

tokzic [7:47 PM]
dolgin flipping red would look super bad on roundbox

​[7:47]
he resisted that train super hard right off the bat in the thread

​[7:47]
with really flimsy reasoning

​[7:48]
hold on let me find that post


----- Yesterday December 7th, 2015 -----
aragakiayase [9:31 PM]
what do you think of that xel convo

tokzic [9:36 PM]
it felt excuse-y

​[9:36]
i haven't interacted with xel in pm this entire game

​[9:36]
i mean

​[9:37]
[3:56]
and work is fair and so is OOT

​[9:38]
this feels like he's listing reasons why you shouldn't vote him

​[9:38]
i don't know it's sketchy but it's not really damning like you made it out to be

aragakiayase [9:38 PM]
it really rubbed me the wrong way

​[9:38]
aragakiayase [9:04 PM]
if he has work, fine

​[9:04]
but saying that I can't know if he's put in work or not

​[9:04]
as opposed to saying "yeah I have" or "no i Haven't but I'll try" or something

tokzic [9:38 PM]
yeah and like

​[9:38]
he's saying oot is a reason why he hasn't been participating

​[9:39]
when he's talking to you

​[9:39]
oot

​[9:39]
and could be talking about reads

​[9:39]
instead of saying that oot is a reason why his reads aren't out there

aragakiayase [9:39 PM]
well if I misinterpreted badly, the conversation is there for everyone to see

​[9:39]
and they can make their own judgements

​[9:39]
but that's what I took from it

tokzic [9:45 PM]
i'm trying to read it as a red saying it and a green

​[9:45]
and i guess i can kind of see a green feeling bad about not being involved

​[9:46]
but i think your interpretation makes more sense

​[9:46]
ideally he starts making reads

​[9:47]
i feel more confident reading people on their game activity and not their excuses for lack thereof

aragakiayase [9:47 PM]
he has neither for the most part

tokzic [9:48 PM]
why do you believe xiz's claim

​[9:49]
like i was trying for a good while yesterday to entertain the possibility of botchi faking

​[9:49]
but i couldn't find even one small moment of humanity from xiz

aragakiayase [9:49 PM]
I believe him because I have a strong townread on him

tokzic [9:49 PM]
where are you seeing this townread

aragakiayase [9:49 PM]
and he explained the reasoning behind his behavior

​[9:49]
I've linked to my conversation with him in thread

​[9:49]
mindmelds

​[9:50]
tone

​[9:50]
early game and now again

​[9:50]
obviously not when he was selfing and saying kill me

tokzic [9:52 PM]
hold on i need to read that conversation

​[9:54]
ok what specifically in here makes you feel like he's town

​[9:55]
xiz [2:34 PM]
As of now i more wanna kill rzr/gradiant/??

​[9:55]
that seems like something a wolf would say

​[9:56]
​[2:33]
also xel is top town

​[9:56]
that is not where i am at with my xelnya read

​[9:56]
i think he is moderately scummy

aragakiayase [9:56 PM]
why does the killing thing seem ilke something a wolf would say?

tokzic [9:56 PM]
where in here does he look human to fyou

aragakiayase [9:56 PM]
is it because of the word kill?

tokzic [9:56 PM]
because gradiant was an awful lynch

aragakiayase [9:56 PM]
we both thought he slipped

​[9:57]
(me and xiz)

tokzic [9:57 PM]
i thought that slip was weak

​[9:57]
and i'm talking from the perspective of pre-flip

​[9:57]
because it sure ended up being weak

aragakiayase [9:57 PM]
well that combined with gradiant's lack of scumhunting sold it for me

​[9:57]
but that's not related to xiz

​[9:58]
let me go through my conversation

​[9:58]
first mindmeld on dlgn

​[9:58]
xiz [2:27 PM]
aragakiayase [10:25 AM]
see here we go with your confidence again

​[10:26]
you think you're always 100% right

^ I literally said this before you typed it

​[9:58]
[2:33]
also xel is top town

​[9:58]
this was at the point when xel had been contributing

​[9:58]
a lot by xel standards

​[9:58]
I had a townread on xel initially

tokzic [9:59 PM]
but xel isn't contributing a lot

​[9:59]
even by xel standards

aragakiayase [10:00 PM]
he WAS

​[10:00]
now he isn't

tokzic [10:00 PM]
i disagree

aragakiayase [10:00 PM]
I read it as he was

​[10:00]
at the time and nothing's going to change that

tokzic [10:00 PM]
i think he's been pretty consistent about not making reads

​[10:00]
even first phase

aragakiayase [10:01 PM]
iirc xel doesn't usually do reads

​[10:01]
poking people is his way of contributing

​[10:01]
http://www.flashflashrevolution.com/...06#post4381206
TWG CXLIV - The Freeze Wars (Sex Live) The Werewolf Game

​[10:01]
things like that

​[10:01]
and talking about dlgn a bunch

​[10:06]
give me 15 I need to finish a presentation

tokzic [10:12 PM]
i'm actually gonna log

​[10:12]
i finished reading your xiz logs

​[10:12]
the only thing i got out of this is more confidence you're town

aragakiayase [10:13 PM]
you don't see why I townread xiz though

​[10:13]
I'll go dig through for specific examples while you're gone

tokzic [10:13 PM]
not at all

aragakiayase [10:13 PM]
why https://twig.slack.com/archives/D0G0...49544379000080
Jaredtokzic
the only thing i got out of this is more confidence you're town
Yesterday at 10:12 PM

tokzic [10:14 PM]
because at this point i'm 99.9% sure he's the red hobo claim

​[10:14]
and i don't think there's any chance in hell two reds would put this much effort into fake logs

​[10:14]
lmfao

aragakiayase [10:14 PM]
I see

tokzic [10:15 PM]
all i got from this log is reaffirmation

​[10:16]
the bit where he was only PRETENDING to give up

​[10:17]
his reasoning for my partner theories doesn't make any sense at all and he lists too many players

​[10:17]
just feels like reactions to you believing him

aragakiayase [10:18 PM]
yeah actually that part could easily be fabricated

​[10:18]
I'll find what I originally townread him for

​[10:18]
then I'll try going back over again and reread and see what I Get

​[10:19]
oh

​[10:19]
his willingness to reconsider his read on rzr

​[10:19]
he seemed pretty set on him being scum for the reads list but when I pointed out that rzr has done that before and goes full tryhard as town he backed off

​[10:20]
xiz [3:08 PM]
there is something very important that is telling about that phrase that i linked

​[3:08]
if you can figure out what you are locked town for me

​[10:20]
he's looking for mindmelds

​[10:21]
that feels towny because when you don't have extra info like wolves do you look for similar thoguth processes

​[10:22]
xiz [9:21 PM]
idk im not gonna die today

​[9:21]
so w/e

​[9:21]
let em

​[10:22]
confidence about not being lynched is heavily contextual but in this case he doesn't seem concerned because he knows he can convince people of his towniness


----- Today December 8th, 2015 -----
aragakiayase [11:09 AM]
V mentioned this but why have you taken a back seat this phase

aragakiayase [11:44 AM]
Nvm didn't see new posts

aragakiayase [12:04 PM]
Why did you not say immediately when botchi claimed to you

​[12:04]
You only released that info when xiz did too

​[12:05]
When you had two more claims besides you

tokzic [12:07 PM]
because our plan was to keep one of us secret until d2

​[12:07]
if i had doubted botchi's claim

​[12:07]
i probably would have publicly said that another hobo approached me

​[12:07]
but i didn't

​[12:07]
so i didn't

​[12:09]
also i don't get why v is trying to make it out like i'm inactive or passive or whatever

​[12:09]
i've already stated what i think is a good course of action

​[12:11]
i don't like how this is the second time he's pulled the spotlight off someone i highly suspect

​[12:11]
he did it with dolgin and used angleshooting to redirect to xiz

​[12:12]
now it's on xiz and he's trying to redirect it onto me

​[12:12]
literally for no other reason than i messaged the guy i seered before i reported to the thread

​[12:12]
as though that is some kind of deal

​[12:14]
like look at xiz responding to it too

​[12:14]
OH SHIT!!!!!!!

aragakiayase [12:14 PM]
V is controlling the thread for better or worse

​[12:15]
and regardless of your intention to test dbp your conversation with him looks ugly

tokzic [12:15 PM]
how

aragakiayase [12:15 PM]
i mean the logical move in my mind would be to say

​[12:15]
"you hid in this spot"

​[12:15]
I see your train of thought but it still feels ugly

​[12:18]
I'm really confused at this point

​[12:18]
your initial claim was good

​[12:18]
but if someone were to fakeclaim wouldn't the first to claim be the best choice?

​[12:19]
just a thought

tokzic [12:19 PM]
probably

aragakiayase [12:19 PM]
so this wasn't clear to me from the thread, you may have written it in slack https://twig.slack.com/archives/D0G0...49594430000005
Jaredtokzic
because our plan was to keep one of us secret until d2
Today at 12:07 PM

​[12:19]
is it clear to everyone else? because that would make sense

tokzic [12:20 PM]
did literally anyone read the plan i posted before even claiming

aragakiayase [12:20 PM]
I'm not doing a good job of keeping track of stuff

​[12:20]
there's too much happening

tokzic [12:20 PM]
http://www.flashflashrevolution.com/...83#post4381083
TWG CXLIV - The Freeze Wars (Sex Live) The Werewolf Game

​[12:21]
i also reposted it

​[12:21]
when i claimed

​[12:21]
http://www.flashflashrevolution.com/...06#post4381406
TWG CXLIV - The Freeze Wars (Sex Live) The Werewolf Game

aragakiayase [12:21 PM]
ok well right now it seems like I'm not the only one who forgot

​[12:22]
because V was pushing you for withholding the fact that botchi claimed

tokzic [12:24 PM]
yeah maybe that's worth pointing out

aragakiayase [12:24 PM]
do it

M]
what made you change your mind on dolgin

​[9:33]
he's still my top lynch candidate

bendetta [9:33 PM]
dude its angleshooting i cant tell you but it happened and yoshl didnt modkill dbp for it

tokzic [9:34 PM]
i understand that you're voting xiz becuase angleshooting

bendetta [9:34 PM]
no i switched off dlgn because of angleshooting

tokzic [9:34 PM]
but does that same angleshooting clear dolgin for you

bendetta [9:34 PM]
im voting xiz because he's wolfy

tokzic [9:34 PM]
oh okay

bendetta [9:35 PM]
its in the chat history but we were told not to talk about it anymore by the host

tokzic [9:37 PM]
i gotcha

​[9:38]
v i can never tell

​[9:38]
if i can feel good about townreading you

​[9:38]
every time i'm confident you're town is when i'm wrong

bendetta [9:39 PM]
dude ive played like 200-300 werewolf games dont focus on it ill prove myself out by hitting red at some point

​[9:42]
this is moving towards a CFD

tokzic [9:43 PM]
what is a cfd

bendetta [9:45 PM]
chinese fire drill

​[9:45]
botchi has been having these conversations with everyone

​[9:45]
botchi246 [5:25 PM]
Why so sure

​[5:25]
Apart from slackchat

bendetta [5:26 PM]
do you have another candidate who has a stronger motivating reason than pushing a plan that isn't actually helpful to humans, yelling at anyone who disagrees with him, lying to trick our PRs into coming out to him, and misrepresenting his vote as soon as he is voted?

​[5:26]
his vote is oppourtunistic

​[5:27]
he is only willing to anwser questions and be reasonable when it appears public perception of him shifts, otherwise he will denounce and insult the person inquiring upon him, show frame of mind

​[5:27]
shows*

botchi246 [5:28 PM]
Even if he IS town or wolf.for that matter, his approach is dangerous to town

bendetta [5:28 PM]
that is a fallacy that is pleasant to think about to rationalize potential mistakes, but should be shut out entirely as tempting as it is, you musty only care about whether or not he is a wolf

botchi246 [5:30 PM]
Im just not so confident on wolf status. He went so hard townie in the beginning

​[5:30]
But then backtrackex

​[5:30]
Like a billionx

bendetta [5:30 PM]
that is fine, vote with your confidence

botchi246 [5:30 PM]
And then went hard again

​[5:30]
And then backtracked

bendetta [5:30 PM]
to my i read that as changing behvaior based on public perception of him

​[5:30]
he is extremely worried about how he is perceived

​[5:31]
and his read on gradient is weak, and came only after forcing him to change the subject from his plan

​[5:31]
and given the timing and how he behaved when pressured again, seems oppourtunistic and it seems like he isnt scumhunting

​[5:31]
a wolf worried about how people are perceiving him, and new to the role, will act like a bee in a jar sometimes

botchi246 [5:33 PM]
But then a town could act the same way if they were in danger

​[5:33]
Im not defending him, just entertaining angles

bendetta [5:35 PM]
yes they could. it's a question of whether this fits a pattern of personal insecurity or a pattern of someone not handling their role. if he is town what does he really have to lose by being wrong, not having his plan followed, etc. why does a town need to lie? if he is a wolf and he is in the position doesnt it seem more actually beneficial to what you are doing?

​[5:35]
its a question of whether or not his unstable behavior is his personality, or it's motivated by a hidden agenda

​[5:35]
some things dont seem like personality

​[5:35]
to me

botchi246 [5:36 PM]
Ok. I see your point

​[5:39]
Well i hope you are right and you arent reading too much into it

bendetta [5:42 PM]
i hope i'm right too

botchi246 [5:44 PM]
I need to change my vote

​[5:45]
Cuz vote on storn aint helping anyone, plus i cant grill him.if he never shows up

tokzic [9:48 PM]
who is being talked about here

​[9:48]
i'm trying to figure out the subject at the start

​[9:48]
Xiz?

​[9:48]
Dlgn?

bendetta [9:49 PM]
dlgn

​[9:49]
its just a show of geniuneness also botchi has talked to a lot of people

​[9:49]
anyways moving on theres little time a death in the air

tokzic [9:51 PM]
yeah i think i believe botchi over xiz

​[9:51]
but i don't know if it's a good idea to make that decision in 10 minutes now or use tomorrow to figure it out

​[9:52]
we could even figure it out with seering booth

bendetta [9:54 PM]
doesnt matter just vote for someone that is not them

tokzic [9:54 PM]
yeah that's the play


----- Today December 8th, 2015 -----
tokzic [10:09 AM]
where did i withhold information

​[10:09]
can you point it out directly to me

​[10:09]
the second i had two hobo claims i made it public

botchi246 [6:45 PM]
Yo, you srsly a hobo?

tokzic [6:52 PM]
srsly

​[6:52]
making a big fat post about it now

botchi246 [6:52 PM]
And it will solidify that position?

​[6:53]
But why would you come out on d1

tokzic [6:53 PM]
because i have a good plan

botchi246 [6:59 PM]
What do you suggest the other hobo should do

tokzic [7:01 PM]
both hobos will absolutely be alive tomorrow

​[7:01]
so i think it's a little better for them to hold off on the claim until then

​[7:02]
bathrooms are where to go tonight

​[7:02]
i'd like to use kidz zone so that bathrooms are available again tomorrow

​[7:03]
but v is currently making that impossible >

botchi246 [7:07 PM]
Im the other hobo

tokzic [7:08 PM]
mah habro

​[7:08]
hobro

botchi246 [7:09 PM]
One of us needs to get in booth tonight

tokzic [7:09 PM]
yes

​[7:09]
do you want to

​[7:09]
we also have the option of

botchi246 [7:09 PM]
Im afraid dolphin wants it too

​[7:09]
And then we will get booted

tokzic [7:10 PM]
using bathrooms/kidz zone

​[7:10]
and asking a human we like to do it instead

botchi246 [7:10 PM]
But v screwed up kidx zone already

tokzic [7:10 PM]
he hasn't screwed it up yet

​[7:10]
if he shows up before eod and agrees to keep it clear

botchi246 [7:10 PM]
Why would we use the bathroom already

tokzic [7:10 PM]
wolves are probably going to be burning our bathroom charges

botchi246 [7:11 PM]
Oh yah forgot about that new twist

tokzic [7:11 PM]
so we gotta use em while we got em

botchi246 [7:15 PM]
If two use kidz zone and one is hobo, will hobo survive the collapse

tokzic [7:15 PM]
100%

​[7:15]
50% chance it'll use his freezeproof though

​[7:15]
since he'll be in main hall

​[7:15]
who are your top human reads right now

​[7:16]
i like charu, ayase, rzr, xiz most

botchi246 [7:16 PM]
Dlgn,rzr,charu,round

​[7:16]
AA is on the fence for me

​[7:17]
He just said he was xontemplating asking for security booth before you claimed

tokzic [7:17 PM]
let's not give it to him lmao

​[7:18]
are you down with rzr or charu going for it

botchi246 [7:18 PM]
Since you claimed you should go booth

tokzic [7:18 PM]
the thing about me going booth is

botchi246 [7:18 PM]
Id be more comfortable if charu went

tokzic [7:18 PM]
wolves freezing it would be

​[7:18]
completely terrible

​[7:18]
i'd lose freezeproof

botchi246 [7:19 PM]
Itd be a smart wolf plan thats for aure

tokzic [7:19 PM]
wolves would still have a huge pool of humans to hide in

​[7:19]
and we wouldn't get a seering

botchi246 [7:19 PM]
Do we still get seering if townie freezes.in booth?

tokzic [7:19 PM]
nope, they just die

botchi246 [7:19 PM]
Fuck

tokzic [7:20 PM]
no that's actually good

​[7:20]
it's kind of counterintuitive but

​[7:20]
we also have the option of sending someone we're uncertain of to booth

botchi246 [7:20 PM]
Oh yes thats a good idea

​[7:21]
How certain are you of aa

tokzic [7:21 PM]
not very

botchi246 [7:21 PM]
Send him

tokzic [7:21 PM]
i feel good about his level of participation

​[7:21]
and a lot of what he's saying

​[7:21]
but i also haven't isoed him

botchi246 [7:21 PM]
Idk why xel voted for me

​[7:22]
I have been active oot.

tokzic [7:23 PM]
you were one of my townier reads

​[7:23]
even before i claimed

​[7:24]
fuck man

botchi246 [7:24 PM]
I didnt.know what to think of you haha

​[7:24]
Had no idea

tokzic [7:24 PM]
dolgin is really really wolfy

botchi246 [7:24 PM]
You think?

​[7:24]
I was almost positive he was town

tokzic [7:24 PM]
he tried to get hobos to claim to him privately

​[7:24]
that's really weird

botchi246 [7:24 PM]
To work his plan

tokzic [7:24 PM]
but not as weird as saying one of them came out to him

​[7:24]
when they didn't

botchi246 [7:25 PM]
Hmmm that does sound odd now that I think about it

​[7:25]
Lemme see what some others say real quick

tokzic [7:25 PM]
i gotta eat i'll brb

botchi246 [7:25 PM]
Aight

botchi246 [8:14 PM]
Lol he called me outing to you

tokzic [8:16 PM]
yup

botchi246 [8:16 PM]
What is up with the votes on gradiant

tokzic [8:16 PM]
i feel bad for how emotional this is getting

​[8:17]
but i'm only getting more confident as it happens

botchi246 [8:17 PM]
Dlgn is making it emotional

tokzic [8:17 PM]
like three or four times he's said things that are basically slips

​[8:17]
then immediately backpedals

botchi246 [8:17 PM]
Hes getting all riled up.on things that shouldn't be so srs

​[8:18]
He is danger to town either way I think

​[8:18]
Whether he be town or wolf

tokzic [8:19 PM]
yeah i agree

​[8:19]
there hasn't been as much rational discussion since things blew up

​[8:19]
and i was really hoping that claiming would lead to more of that

​[8:19]
not less

​[8:20]
i have a really hard time seeing him as town though

botchi246 [8:55 PM]
If you get it, who are you gonna seer

tokzic [8:56 PM]
i'm gonna bathrooms

​[8:56]
probably

​[8:57]
if i were to go i'd check on one of the players who wolfs well

​[8:57]
like roundbox or v

​[8:57]
but it's largely gonna come down to how the lynch flips

botchi246 [9:02 PM]
So ill try for bathroom

tokzic [9:03 PM]
you'll get it

​[9:03]
i'm asking the humans not to go bathrooms tonight

botchi246 [9:16 PM]
If rng how am i gonna get it

​[9:16]
Haha oh geez

botchi246 [9:21 PM]
Do you think i could skew to get the bathrook by claiming noob and wanting to live to d2

tokzic [9:23 PM]
roundbox's idea of rnging the bathrooms is dumb

​[9:23]
we're talking about it now

botchi246 [9:24 PM]
Ok

botchi246 [10:07 PM]
Any word on b-rooms

tokzic [10:07 PM]
i still say go for it

botchi246 [10:08 PM]
Ok ill send my pm.now

botchi246 [10:16 PM]
I put it in

botchi246 [10:22 PM]
Wth xiz claimed

tokzic [10:22 PM]
yes

​[10:22]
i believe you over him

​[10:22]
you came out to me immediately and you feel genuine

​[10:23]
meanwhile xiz claims gets mad and then leaves the thread

botchi246 [10:23 PM]
Xiz is wolf

botchi246 [11:20 PM]
you should take security booth

tokzic [11:21 PM]
think i'm gonna

​[11:21]
i want to check v except there's no point because he's squatting kidz zone

​[11:22]
his vote movements

​[11:22]
were really weird


----- December 6th -----
botchi246 [3:54 PM]
Xiz is taking the booth, well if you take it you both get frozen but you will def survive. I think xiz is wolf so he would prolly die

​[3:56]
Nvm im.wrong on that

tokzic [5:14 PM]
of course he is

​[5:14]
might not even be him, might be one of his partners

​[5:14]
if he's the movie stalker

tokzic [1:38 PM]
hi charu

​[1:38]
i just wanted you to know you're my top town read right now

​[1:38]
fyi

charu [1:39 PM]
Why thank you Mr. Random thingy

​[1:39]
...I totally forgot I had this open too

​[1:39]
Wow

tokzic [1:39 PM]
keep up the good work soldier


----- December 5th -----
tokzic [11:30 PM]
hey charu

​[11:30]
do you want to seer tonight

​[11:31]
and even if you don't

​[11:31]
who do you think are good seer targets

​[11:32]
i have a funny feeling that v is maybe movie stalker

​[11:32]
and his kidz zone play is just a scare to keep people out

​[11:34]
not sure if i'm confident enough about it to check him though :<


----- December 6th -----
tokzic [12:02 AM]
ok you are offline nevermind

charu [1:05 AM]
Oh well

​[1:05]
I was AFK hard

​[1:05]
lmao


----- Yesterday December 7th, 2015 -----
tokzic [3:53 PM]
is it just me

​[3:53]
or is this the biggest slip ever seen in the history of twg

​[3:53]
https://twig.slack.com/archives/free...49462568006449

​[3:53]
why would he suddenly think he was being talked about

charu [3:55 PM]
That is a strange thing to say randomly in the middle there

charu [4:01 PM]
Sorry, work called, erm... anyways

​[4:02]
Sort of neutral response, because I know I probably share similar incidents where I assume something was said, but just misread it.

​[4:02]
Not sure how one can misread that though

tokzic [4:04 PM]
he wasn't even talking until that point

charu [4:05 PM]
Certainly is something you can't call him out for in my opinion. That would just be causing a ruckus without reason. Though you are a PR, so you can get away with causing a ruckus without too much problem

tokzic [4:05 PM]
he enters the conversation with thinking that he's suddenly the subject

charu [4:05 PM]
Well, much problem to you, dohoho

tokzic [4:05 PM]
i asked him in thread about it, guess we'll see how he responds

charu [4:08 PM]
And he responded, huh...

​[4:09]
That doesn't really answer the mystery, doesn't it? lmao

tokzic [4:09 PM]
i guess it could make sense

​[4:09]
i asked rzr if he could hook me up the conversation they were having at that time

​[4:09]
to see if it's consistent

[dLGN]

all I want to say right now is I told you d1 why charu's idea about having one homeless guy come out was fucking terrible and look where we are now

this is beyond frustrating, also backpack you can't ever think I am mafia here so get your head straight

[YoshL]

protip: put your logs in the [code] tags and things become so much easier to read

[Charu]

...Why does botchi not sound like an idiot (as much) when he talked to you?

[storn42]

Originally Posted by Charu

Does the numbering even matter?

it does to me.

[storn42]

especially since yosh said they wouldn't know which one they were LO