Infinity * Zero = Any Number ARGUE HERE

[LJRoX]

Re: Infinity * Zero = Any Number ARGUE HERE

Infinity x 0 = 0

1 x 0 = 0
2 x 0 = 0

40394039409 x 0 = 0

Correct?

[talisman]

Re: Infinity * Zero = Any Number ARGUE HERE

incorrect.

reread the thread.

[LJRoX]

Re: Infinity * Zero = Any Number ARGUE HERE

kkay =)


edit: ahhh now i see okay

I read shash's post.

[A2_Sauce]

Re: Infinity * Zero = Any Number ARGUE HERE

Here's another question to think about: In pi, is there a string of a googolplex 0's somewhere? Is this "probability" or is there an actual yes or no answer? Some mathmatician once told me that it was probability and that let's say in a 10 digit random number... the chances of having a string of one 0 is 1/10... therefore the chances for a googolplex 0's in pi are very slim? feed back please

[Kilgamayan]

Re: Infinity * Zero = Any Number ARGUE HERE

I would imagine that if there really was a string of 0s that long people would have long since assumed pi was rational.

[Doug31]

Re: Infinity * Zero = Any Number ARGUE HERE

Here's another question to think about: In pi, is there a string of a googolplex 0's somewhere? Is this "probability" or is there an actual yes or no answer? Some mathmatician once told me that it was probability and that let's say in a 10 digit random number... the chances of having a string of one 0 is 1/10... therefore the chances for a googolplex 0's in pi are very slim? feed back please

The way things were in my mind, since pi had an infinity of decimals, and it's transendental, I thought it would eventually use ANY pattern of numbers, as long as the pattern is only a finite number of digits long. Same with e. I may be wrong, though, but this is what I think.

Edit: But wouldn't infinity (1/10)^googolplex/1 chances come out to a chance of 1?

[Shashakiro]

Re: Infinity * Zero = Any Number ARGUE HERE

Assuming that the decimal digits of pi are truly random and non-repeating, then yes, there will be a string of a googleplex 0's somewhere in there.

[GuidoHunter]

Re: Infinity * Zero = Any Number ARGUE HERE

What do you mean by "truly random"? You know that there's a method to calculate pi to any number of digits, so I don't see where any sort of randomness is found.

--Guido

http://andy.mikee385.com

[eagleboy]

Pi's String of Zeroes?

Edit: But wouldn't infinity (1/10)^googolplex/1 chances come out to a chance of 1?

Afraid not, Doug... see, putting a number x with a value of 0<x<1 to a power will result in a DECREASE of the value, rather than an INCREASE with x>1...

For example:

1/10 -> for argument's sake, 0.1

0.1 X 0.1 becomes:

0.1
*0.1
->.01

or 1/100, which is CLEARLY visible as:

1/100<1/10.

So ((1/10)^(lim k --> inf))/1 (this, meaning basically as k gets bigger)

Will eventually become so scant that the probability turns out to be damn near 0 of that many zeroes being in a row.

But, considering probability isn't a law, I can't say that this theorem is wrong, per se, since pi is never-ending. But I can lay a HEAVY argument against it, given the variables and formulaic equations. This would also apply to the number e. It's uncertain, as, though we have computers that can calculate into the trillions of digits of the decimal portion, we have no proof for or against the argument of their irrationalities, since we have yet to find that elusive repeating digit string.

[skaterjon411]

Re: Infinity * Zero = Any Number ARGUE HERE

I don't see how Infinity is Even Usable in some maths. not as a repeating but in an equation. Ive Always have thought of it as an Idea more then an actual numbers. To me it shows something with no solution, providing a Void answer, For the fact it is a Unknown and Impossible.

My two cents

[Reach]

Re: Infinity * Zero = Any Number ARGUE HERE

Assuming that the decimal digits of pi are truly random and non-repeating, then yes, there will be a string of a googleplex 0's somewhere in there.

Pi isn't 'truely random'.

I know what you're saying though. You're trying to say that you have an infinite set of random numbers, say 0 through 9 and are generated in an infinite sequence. Random here as pertaining to no physical bound; IE the numbers are not generated by any set of rules other than probabilistic ones.

In this case then yes there will be a string of a googleplex of 0's.


It's pretty easy to imagine why if you stick to the definition of infinity. Remember, it's unbounded, so there are no bounds on this string of numbers.

[Chrissi]

Re: Infinity * Zero = Any Number ARGUE HERE

MOTHER****ER

I just finished typing out a whole long reply, then accidentally hit a button and it sent me to a random web address and erased the entire reply. That hasn't happened to me in AGES. I am SO ANGRY. MOTHER****ER.

I'm too lazy to do the whole thing again, but here we go with a bit of it:

Some of you, the less mathematically conscious, are thinking of a thing called "practical infinity" rather than "mathematical infinity". "Practical infinity" is the concept of infinity modified such that it actually makes sense in our world. "Practical infinity" is just a really really big number, bigger than any other number. Just really big.

So when you use "practical infinity", there is no problem definining 0 * infinity = 0. Because no matter how big your numbers get, anything * 0 = 0.

But then if you are talking about actual infinity, or "mathematical infinity" like the more mathematically inclined here are talking about, we're talking about a gigantic value that has no value. It's so big that we can't even comprehend it. We don't understand this infinity, so we can't assign it a value as "really big". It doesn't work. You can't just go "Okay, infinity is really big, BUT it still = 0 when multipled by zero." Because infinity is not just a really big number. It's something different than that. It's a concept, not a number.

Think of it this way...

Infinity * something = infinity
Something * 0 = 0

How do we put these two rules together when we say infinity * 0 = ? That is why infinity * 0 is not 0. We already have a rule for what stuff * infinity is. It's infinity. But wait! Conflicting rules! It's a paradox really. It's both infinity and 0 at the same time. But it's neither. It's undefined.


Also, regarding the whole "infinity - infinity = 0" business, try this on for size....

1 + infinity = infinity
2 + infinity = infinity
3 + infinity = infinity

And so on. In fact, anything + infinity = infinity.

So if you take infinity - infinity, how do you know which of these infinities you are looking at? Are they all the same?

Some infinities are bigger than others, that's just the fact of it. When you see "infinity", you have no idea what kind of infinity you are dealing with. This is why infinity - infinity is NOT zero.

Those who insist on using "practical infinity" may want to consider instead using Graham's number ( http://www-users.cs.york.ac.uk/susan/cyc/g/graham.htm ). That's a pretty big number, which might suffice for any "practical infinity" purposes. As the page explains, this number is so large that if every particle in the universe were converted to pen and ink it would not be large enough to write it down. This number might even well be LARGER than practical infinity, since this number can't even really count anything in our universe, it's too large.

[Vests]

Re: Infinity * Zero = Any Number ARGUE HERE

Well considering you can't divide by zero because there would be no existence in the lack-of-a-number zero. I'm sure you're correct in one way other another, however in a technical prespective there is no way to prove one way or another what anything divided by zero would equal since in math it is the lack of a number.

[Sneakyfeet]

Re: Infinity * Zero = Any Number ARGUE HERE

About the pi thing:

Well if pi is "truely random" and has a "mathematically infinite" amount of digits then the chances of there being a googolplex of 0's is a 100% chance.

[dreameaters]

Re: Infinity * Zero = Any Number ARGUE HERE

lol booting up an old discussion

any number * (inf)^-1 = 0 XD