Rarity Attempts 400 Dresses (LOOMING MIX) [75 or 77]

[TC_Halogen]

Re: Rarity Attempts 400 Dresses (LOOMING MIX) [75 or 77]

The hardest points of the file are really short 16th sprints, or the occasional anchored jumps, but that is it. The patterns contained within the song are very smooth and forgiving, and all of the 32nds can be jumptrilled easily.

As far as the argument of "rolls should be rolled", you can choose to roll the rolls if you'd like, but the fact of the matter is that they are mathematically fast enough to be jumptrilled, and likely will be done as such because they are past the speed of being manageable for just about anyone. Inflate the rating and it'll be an easy new-scale-Guru AAA for people when it simply shouldn't be a Guru level file. Leave it at 75.

EDIT: also going to add that this file really doesn't need frame fixes; if 225 BPM 16ths are two frames apart and can be jumped if timed properly, I fail to see why one/zero frame discrepancies need to be fixed; things like this cause mathematical errors of speed in charts, like the end of Tenimuhou being incorrectly timed compared to how it should be done. I don't remember there being any 0-framers on U/D jumps, but that is the only case where it really should be fixed; this over-obsession with frame fixes is getting obnoxious; just fix what is needed and move on

[qqwref]

Re: Rarity Attempts 400 Dresses (LOOMING MIX) [75 or 77]

For what it's worth, I find this song waaay harder than PXFXS, kono spoon, and Ripoff.

And Halogen, 76 is still comfortably in the FMO range.

[Lambdadelta]

Re: Rarity Attempts 400 Dresses (LOOMING MIX) [75 or 77]

I've honestly been very adamant about leaving this at 75. The files extremely straightforward and the patterns are really not that tricky, there's like ONE bad anchor that occurs twice, since the end is the same as the beginning. The middle's also an easy break so the song isn't that stamina draining, it just requires some speed. Since it doesn't require constant streaming either (actually the 16th bursts flow really well and are infrequent enough to not cause many problems) so really the song doesn't require that much speed either, just 250bpm 8th jumping. That's speed, but it's not like reality. I like to compare this song to Tsugihagi construction and Of Course I Need and Need and Need You. Tsugihagi is like a much tougher version of this song, because it requires some awkward one handed patterns, has a more varied jumpstream with lots more 16ths, and the rolls are harder to jumptrill. Tsugihagi is pretty much a tougher version of this song, so it's reasonable that it's higher than this song, making this song automatically below 77. Of Course I Need is fast, and has lots of jumps and 16th bursts as well, the only real difference in difficulty of the two songs I'd say are the 32nds in this one, but since you can straight up jumptrill them I don't see a huge difference in difficulty, and everyone does well on Of Course.

So now it looks like a 75, is definitely below 77 (since tsugihagi is the same song with more frequent and complex patterns), why not 76? Well let's look at the 76's. PianoXForteXScandal, Flesvelka, Mermaid Island, Kono Spoon, Ripoff, etc. All these songs are PA nightmares, and are far harder to PA than this song, and most I'd argue are harder to FC. No patterns in this song compare to Ripoff or Mermaid Island, or even worse, PXFXS. This song is not only easier to FC that these songs (you can mash FC this one pretty well, but the jacks in the other ones are hard, and clean FC wise I'd also argue Kono Spoon, Flesvelka, and Ripoff are harder). So these songs are a lot harder to PA, arguably harder to clean FC, and overall harder to do/score well on, by a comfortable amount. They just might not be as easy to FC if you don't have the speed. It's really a speed thing but in comparison to songs above it and below it, I think 75 suits it perfectly fine, right above Of Course You Need Me

wow... You have a very good point.

[TC_Halogen]

Re: Rarity Attempts 400 Dresses (LOOMING MIX) [75 or 77]

For what it's worth, I find this song waaay harder than PXFXS, kono spoon, and Ripoff.

And Halogen, 76 is still comfortably in the FMO range.

It is on the 13-point scale, but not in the current 20-point translation (where Guru is 76+).

[qqwref]

Re: Rarity Attempts 400 Dresses (LOOMING MIX) [75 or 77]

Hm, maybe we need to fix the 20-point scale to reflect the "old" difficulties then. I personally don't use the 20-point scale at all since I have 1-99.

[One Winged Angel]

Re: Rarity Attempts 400 Dresses (LOOMING MIX) [75 or 77]

Hm, maybe we need to fix the 20-point scale to reflect the "old" difficulties then. I personally don't use the 20-point scale at all since I have 1-99.

I've petitioned for this twice, reasons being that everyone uses the old 1-13 title ratings with the new 1-99 in-depth ratings, and no one uses 1-20 at all. Was told it's probably not going to happen. Still don't see why not, 1-13 titles with 1-99 ratings seems like the best of both worlds.

[foxfire667]

Re: Rarity Attempts 400 Dresses (LOOMING MIX) [75 or 77]

I've petitioned for this twice, reasons being that everyone uses the old 1-13 title ratings with the new 1-99 in-depth ratings, and no one uses 1-20 at all. Was told it's probably not going to happen. Still don't see why not, 1-13 titles with 1-99 ratings seems like the best of both worlds.

The 1-13 difficulties (as well as the not really used 1-20 range) are completely arbitrary anyway due to the 1-99 scale. People are just so familiar with the old 1-13 scale for giving difficulty names, and since having the 1-13 scale would have no effect on how files are rated from 1-99, I wouldn't mind the change back.

Although either way, I feel that people will eventually just start flat out using the numbers instead of difficulty names for posting accomplishments. So I guess no matter what happens, less and less will people start saying FMO/Expert/Master, and more and more will start saying their first 66 or 67.

EDIT: While I'm here I should note that I agree with stavie33 about this file. This was in my opinion much easier to not only keep combo, but to also AAA than the majority of the 76's that are in the game currently. If you can jump-trill, and deal with some minor awkward transitions after the rolls, you are pretty much golden on this file.

[qqwref]

Re: Rarity Attempts 400 Dresses (LOOMING MIX) [75 or 77]

Although either way, I feel that people will eventually just start flat out using the numbers instead of difficulty names for posting accomplishments. So I guess no matter what happens, less and less will people start saying FMO/Expert/Master, and more and more will start saying their first 66 or 67.

Yep, we're already getting there. But given that heavy/oni/scarhand (and possibly similar tokens in the future) are hitting whole ranges, it makes sense to have a good label for them. FMO is pretty clear (anything Oni unlocks); the others are less obvious, but we might as well still use the old names.

I think I already suggested this when we were sure we were going to move to 1-99, but if we are using a more detailed system, there's no reason to ALSO change the 1-13. The *only* thing wrong with the 1-13 system was that there wasn't enough detail.

[igotrhythm]

Re: Rarity Attempts 400 Dresses (LOOMING MIX) [75 or 77]

I agree with Foxfire about the 1-99 usage because, hey, signature. QQ's doing it too.

About the topic in question, I found this surprisingly difficult to FC because the file requires no small amount of vigilance--you can't let up until the WHOLE pattern is finished. Exacerbating this problem is the fact that in order to get good PA on the 32nds you have to keep your jumps coherent, not unlike the wall in Press Start (another 75) and then transition right out of that into two-handed trill patterns while maintaining that frenetic 1000 tpm rate. Those without the necessary control and anticipation will fall for the bootraps coming out of those...my best is 7-2-0-7, and going into the middle I had 4-1-0-4.

Speaking of, while the middle is a refreshing break, those with less stamina will nevertheless be worn down by whoring this file. The BPM change means that 32nd streams now have to be hit as 8ths, which can be flag bait. And when the song comes back, at around 1050 combo, it does so with a vengeance...8th trill right into a 32nd burst. More flag bait.

As the fast parts aren't as long as in most other songs of its level, combined (I want to write "comboed") with the difficulty inherent in PAing the bursts as intended, I'm fine with this song staying a 75. It has no business breathing the same rarefied air as Lolo and FN.

[bmah]

Re: Rarity Attempts 400 Dresses (LOOMING MIX) [75 or 77]

The thread isn't going to be locked just because you've made up your mind over it. There has been still a lot of debate as to whether this file is even a 76. I've seen many reasons for it to be a 75. It seems that most people can agree it isn't a 77, but whether it's a 75 or 76 hasn't been made clear.

[TC_Halogen]

Re: Rarity Attempts 400 Dresses (LOOMING MIX) [75 or 77]

I'm still unwilling to settle even with a 76 rating, honestly. The song has considerably less density than a song like NEED, which is a 74. The 32nd rolls are barely relevant because you will be jumptrilling them 99% of the time, and even if you try to roll them, the patterns into and out of the rolls are simple. As it stands, rating this file as a 75 accounts for the little sprints of 16ths/bits of jumps a bit too heavily, but I won't argue the file being any lower than 75 because the entire community will go in arms against a 74 rating.

There simply isn't anything in this file that can justify a 76 rating on its own, let alone as an entire cohesive simfile. Nearly every other 76 has something that is notably difficult in it:

Blooddrunk: huge one-handed trills
Momentary Life: easiest 76, has some 16th trills but carries some heavy layering and strange/choppy patterns
Silly Symphony: infamous 24th note stairs
Ripoff: 64th bursts that go into and out of triples
Flesvelka: many tightly placed jacks/tons of bursts/choppy patterns
Crash Up Against the Inevitable: many many bursts, lots of them having rough entries or really difficult patterns on their own
Kono Spoon, suteki desu ni: tough rolling patterns, many of them split handed without notable percussion to keep even timing
Mermaid Island: lots and lots of trills, some of which are one-handed, occasional jumpjacks
PxFxS: very long, extremely technical, contains some flourishes with colorful patterns and has a lot of jacks

Rarity simply does not fit with these songs. At most, Rarity Attempts 400 Dresses tosses short sprints of 16ths, or occasional 8th note jumps that are chained. The difficulty never ramps to an extreme point, it just holds constant. This file needs to stay at 75 like it was before.

[stavie33]

Re: Rarity Attempts 400 Dresses (LOOMING MIX) [75 or 77]

Both OWA and I want it to be a 75, but ultimately it's up to what the majority of the community thinks so more input is desired. Thanks for all your discussions so far!

not unlike the wall in Press Start (another 75)

Press Start is a 74, and a song I think should be a 72, max a 73. Compare it to Infinity Hyperspace, which is just all around a harder file.

[TC_Halogen]

Re: Rarity Attempts 400 Dresses (LOOMING MIX) [75 or 77]

This thread should be locked; the file was recently changed to a 76.

[One Winged Angel]

Re: Rarity Attempts 400 Dresses (LOOMING MIX) [75 or 77]

It's been a 76 for a few days by this point. Although 76 seemed to be the most 'agreeable' difficulty at first (averaging 75, 76, 77, the three potential difficulties in question), those who supported a shift of 77+ either changed their minds or provided weak arguments. Although thread activity's died down, with 77 out of the picture, there hasn't been a clear cut decision between 75 or 76.

Leaving this open for a few more days. If a decision can't be agreed upon for 75, it'll stay at 76 to compensate for the few outliers who find this file FGO-worthy in difficulty. Or if the thread stays dormant, it'll be locked. Either or.