OMG!!!!!!

**OmegaOrdoss** · 03-18-2008, 03:44 AM

I just played Blooddrunk [Heavy] or w/e
...
wow

Is FFR forcing us to learn to play spread?

I play index, strict index, its the only way I am comfortable playing, am I the only one who find the 3 and 4 arrows wrong?

**foilman8805** · 03-18-2008, 03:45 AM

No one is forcing you to play spread.

Sorry it's difficult for you, but you'll either have to adapt, or just ignore the song.

EDIT: I love hands and quads. They're ****ing awesome.

**richyrich55** · 03-18-2008, 03:47 AM

^What he said.

Btw, foil, your avatar is disrespectful.

**OmegaOrdoss** · 03-18-2008, 03:50 AM

It seems preaty forcefull to me.

How do you manage to hit 3 or 4 arrows perfectly with 2 fingers, in theory it should not be possible, but it is as I can do by laying my fingers across the arrows, but not only does it hurt to hit the corners of the arrows on my keyboard, but it takes time to recover and I miss the next sets of arrows.

FFR should not have hands or freezes in my opinion.
But I guess as a player my opinion does not matter.

**richyrich55** · 03-18-2008, 03:54 AM

Dude if you can't play it index just don't play it.

If you don't want to admit defeat, try it spread, DL the FFRkeymap prog, it can reassign your arrow keys.

**foilman8805** · 03-18-2008, 03:58 AM

Tasselfoot is against songs with hands and quads for the most part. So, you're not alone, because he's the director of new music, and it's pretty much what he says is what goes.

You'll only find them in FMO and FGO songs because of the avmiss fix. It was the only way to add a high level of difficulty back into the game. You won't ever see them in anything under FMO, so it's not much of a worry.

I hope you do know that FFR was truly made for spread though, so song steps will naturally tend towards what is appropriate for that style of play.

**OmegaOrdoss** · 03-18-2008, 03:58 AM

I cannot play spread, I already gave it an honest try. Trills are impossible with same hand hitting 2 arrows. For me atleast.

These songs with hands should be added to a seperate ranking system such as token/skill are.
Simple fix.

**OmegaOrdoss** · 03-18-2008, 03:59 AM

FFR Was not truly made for spread, I used to play 1 handed and I did fine on everything but Fotbb.

It has moved to a spread orientated play base due to the growth in skill of the players.

**foilman8805** · 03-18-2008, 04:01 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by OmegaOrdoss

I cannot play spread, I already gave it an honest try. Trills are impossible with same hand hitting 2 arrows. For me atleast.

These songs with hands should be added to a seperate ranking system such as token/skill are.
Simple fix.

Yeah, it's not easy learning spread, and the pivotal weakness of most spread players is as you pointed out: 1-handed trills.

Sorry to say, but these songs are public and won't be moved. Take comfort in knowing that FFR will not be taken over by them. I mean, really, as an index player, can you honestly play FMO/FGO anyways? I mean like FCing them, not just passing.

Quote:

Originally Posted by OmegaOrdoss

It has moved to a spread orientated play base due to the growth in skill of the players.

Spread made them better. I think you should consider giving spread a second shot. Maybe?

RoastedNoob · 03-18-2008, 04:02 AM

Learn to hit two keys with one finger... or three keys even. I love Blooddrunk, though. I think it's the funnest song on FFR.

Jaito · 03-18-2008, 04:12 AM

Or, heres a suggestion, you play the song on foot, and use your hands to hit the designated arrows with your hands, thus using your feet for 2 arrows, and hands for 2 arrows, you won't miss

xXFFR_EliteXx · 03-18-2008, 04:25 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jaito

Use your hands to hit the designated arrows with your hands

Or your face.

**OmegaOrdoss** · 03-18-2008, 04:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jaito

Or, heres a suggestion, you play the song on foot, and use your hands to hit the designated arrows with your hands, thus using your feet for 2 arrows, and hands for 2 arrows, you won't miss

I tried already

I hooked my blueshark through the usb and got a key converter and eventually got it working on ffr.

I Played CIA Rave first
it was a blast

**Tasselfoot** · 03-18-2008, 04:37 AM

foil... glad to see you know all of what our opinions are on things...

anyway. as was mentioned, in general, i am against hands in FFR. that's why there hasn't been any files with them until now. BUT. there has been a strong demand for harder songs in FFR, and with the upcoming public avmiss fix... we feel that hands (when used in moderation) help to give the files uniqueness at the upper tiers. Hands will ONLY EVER APPEAR in FMO or FGO songs. These are songs that are meant to be hard! They can be hard for many different reasons or multiple reasons.

My advice... if you don't like playing a song with hands, don't play it. there are hundreds of others. If you still want to play it, but don't want to play it spread... don't. Nobody is forcing you to play it any specific way. Do ITGers complain about hands or mines in the really hard charts? No... they've adapted. You can as well, with practice.

And foil... saying that FFR is made for spread is just silly. Back in 02, almost nobody played spread. The general tendency for someone first learning a 4-arrow keyboard game is to play with 1-hand. Only after experimentation do most people switch to index or spread. Generally, the index people come from a DDR background, as it is not the most natural way to play, or the most intuitive.

Anyway... I hope that helps to explain things for you.

**OmegaOrdoss** · 03-18-2008, 04:53 AM

You can turn mines/hands off on ITG.
You cannot on FFR.

Personally I think all spread players should have been banned along time ago for using third party programs on FFR. But FFR is one of the unique games in the world where third party programs are encouraged rather then forbidden so... I dont know

As for the song goes, I hate the fact that players who basically cheat will easily acheive a higher score then I can playing the way the game was intended/coded to be played.

Also, as far as the demand for harder songs go, the songs are plenty hard enough, it all goes back to using third party programs to cheat and make these songs much more easier.

I dont know where this will lead, I'm sure you wont let it go to hell tho, so I guess I'll just kickback and see ^^

**foilman8805** · 03-18-2008, 04:53 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tasselfoot

And foil... saying that FFR is made for spread is just silly. Back in 02, almost nobody played spread. The general tendency for someone first learning a 4-arrow keyboard game is to play with 1-hand. Only after experimentation do most people switch to index or spread. Generally, the index people come from a DDR background, as it is not the most natural way to play, or the most intuitive.

Well clearly 2002 and 2008 aren't the same.

2002 was full of nubs, 2008 is full of beast players using spread.

It's kind of like natural selection - people realized the inferior playing styles quickly. They also realized how much they could expand their skill using spread. Those people that adapted and used spread became stupid good, those who didn't wallowed in their own self-loathing.

As a side note, my first instinct was to play this game with my two strongest fingers on each hand. I was spread from day one, and I'm sure I'm not the only one.

I'd dare say that FFR is now made for spread.

**devonin** · 03-18-2008, 05:02 AM

Quote:

As for the song goes, I hate the fact that players who basically cheat will easily acheive a higher score then I can playing the way the game was intended/coded to be played.

It is just as ridiculous for you to claim that the game was "coded" to be played index as it is for someone else to claim that the game was "coded" to be played spread.

For one, you can play spread without a third party program: left, down, 8 6. For two, you can now keymap from inside FFR (Subscriber only currently) If anything this lends stronger credence to the "FFR is for Spread" arguement, but I think you'll find the only correct statement in all cases is "FFR was coded for / intended for 4 inputs mapping onto 4 arrows." What you hit them with is entirely up to you.

**Tasselfoot** · 03-18-2008, 05:03 AM

Omega: the game is intended to be played using the 4 arrow keys... or, really, ANY set of 4 inputs (1 per directional arrow)...

"spread" is merely an offshoot of "4-finger", using 1 finger on each of the 4 arrow keys... spread is identical, it just alleviates some of the congestion of having 4 fingers jammed together. I, personally, played 4-finger up until we added a key-remapper in-game, which is currently on the beta, and will be public soon.

Turning mines/hands off in ITG makes the scores not valid for the machines high score tables... so, really, what's the point?

Using 3rd party programs is a fairly recent development on FFR, and is merely a solution since we didn't have our own built in key-remapper at the time. Stepmania allows you to re-do the keys as well.

Let me make it perfectly clear.... using 4 fingers to play FFR is NOT cheating. In any way, shape, or form. Using a key-remapper, so long as you are still only using 1 input per arrow, is NOT cheating. Just because you play index and are at a disadvantage does NOT mean that those who play with 4 fingers are cheating. This has been brought up countless times, discussed plenty, and has long since been set in stone as truth... nobody forces you to play one way or the other. You choose to play index. Or you choose to play 1-handed. You play for enjoyment or competition or whatever... but you have the ability to play any way you want. Just because someone plays a different style than you does NOT mean they are cheating.

**OmegaOrdoss** · 03-18-2008, 05:04 AM

Using a third party program to play with ASKL or any keyboard button combination other then 8462 or d-pad arrows is cheating until the day it is adjusted within the game itself like speed mods are.

**devonin** · 03-18-2008, 05:05 AM

Well, unfortunately for you, it IS adjusted within the game itself.

03-18-2008, 03:44 AM	#1
OmegaOrdoss FFR Veteran Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: Texas Age: 36 Posts: 92	OMG!!!!!! I just played Blooddrunk [Heavy] or w/e ... wow Is FFR forcing us to learn to play spread? I play index, strict index, its the only way I am comfortable playing, am I the only one who find the 3 and 4 arrows wrong?

03-18-2008, 03:45 AM	#2
foilman8805 smoke wheat hail satin Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: LA baby Age: 36 Posts: 5,704	Re: OMG!!!!!! No one is forcing you to play spread. Sorry it's difficult for you, but you'll either have to adapt, or just ignore the song. EDIT: I love hands and quads. They're ****ing awesome.

03-18-2008, 03:50 AM	#4
OmegaOrdoss FFR Veteran Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: Texas Age: 36 Posts: 92	Re: OMG!!!!!! It seems preaty forcefull to me. How do you manage to hit 3 or 4 arrows perfectly with 2 fingers, in theory it should not be possible, but it is as I can do by laying my fingers across the arrows, but not only does it hurt to hit the corners of the arrows on my keyboard, but it takes time to recover and I miss the next sets of arrows. FFR should not have hands or freezes in my opinion. But I guess as a player my opinion does not matter.

03-18-2008, 03:58 AM	#6
foilman8805 smoke wheat hail satin Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: LA baby Age: 36 Posts: 5,704	Re: OMG!!!!!! Tasselfoot is against songs with hands and quads for the most part. So, you're not alone, because he's the director of new music, and it's pretty much what he says is what goes. You'll only find them in FMO and FGO songs because of the avmiss fix. It was the only way to add a high level of difficulty back into the game. You won't ever see them in anything under FMO, so it's not much of a worry. I hope you do know that FFR was truly made for spread though, so song steps will naturally tend towards what is appropriate for that style of play.

03-18-2008, 03:58 AM	#7
OmegaOrdoss FFR Veteran Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: Texas Age: 36 Posts: 92	Re: OMG!!!!!! I cannot play spread, I already gave it an honest try. Trills are impossible with same hand hitting 2 arrows. For me atleast. These songs with hands should be added to a seperate ranking system such as token/skill are. Simple fix.

03-18-2008, 03:59 AM	#8
OmegaOrdoss FFR Veteran Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: Texas Age: 36 Posts: 92	Re: OMG!!!!!! FFR Was not truly made for spread, I used to play 1 handed and I did fine on everything but Fotbb. It has moved to a spread orientated play base due to the growth in skill of the players.

03-18-2008, 04:02 AM	#10
RoastedNoob FFR Player Join Date: Jul 2005 Age: 36 Posts: 620	Re: OMG!!!!!! Learn to hit two keys with one finger... or three keys even. I love Blooddrunk, though. I think it's the funnest song on FFR. __________________ - FFR's First and Only CCC -

03-18-2008, 04:12 AM	#11
Jaito FFR Player Join Date: May 2007 Location: 4,500,000,000+ Age: 33 Posts: 129	Re: OMG!!!!!! Or, heres a suggestion, you play the song on foot, and use your hands to hit the designated arrows with your hands, thus using your feet for 2 arrows, and hands for 2 arrows, you won't miss __________________ Join DDRHQ .COM! Give that link a little click. You know you want to.

03-18-2008, 04:37 AM	#14
Tasselfoot Retired BOSS Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: Widget Heaven Age: 40 Posts: 25,184	Re: OMG!!!!!! foil... glad to see you know all of what our opinions are on things... anyway. as was mentioned, in general, i am against hands in FFR. that's why there hasn't been any files with them until now. BUT. there has been a strong demand for harder songs in FFR, and with the upcoming public avmiss fix... we feel that hands (when used in moderation) help to give the files uniqueness at the upper tiers. Hands will ONLY EVER APPEAR in FMO or FGO songs. These are songs that are meant to be hard! They can be hard for many different reasons or multiple reasons. My advice... if you don't like playing a song with hands, don't play it. there are hundreds of others. If you still want to play it, but don't want to play it spread... don't. Nobody is forcing you to play it any specific way. Do ITGers complain about hands or mines in the really hard charts? No... they've adapted. You can as well, with practice. And foil... saying that FFR is made for spread is just silly. Back in 02, almost nobody played spread. The general tendency for someone first learning a 4-arrow keyboard game is to play with 1-hand. Only after experimentation do most people switch to index or spread. Generally, the index people come from a DDR background, as it is not the most natural way to play, or the most intuitive. Anyway... I hope that helps to explain things for you. __________________ RIP

03-18-2008, 04:53 AM	#15
OmegaOrdoss FFR Veteran Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: Texas Age: 36 Posts: 92	Re: OMG!!!!!! You can turn mines/hands off on ITG. You cannot on FFR. Personally I think all spread players should have been banned along time ago for using third party programs on FFR. But FFR is one of the unique games in the world where third party programs are encouraged rather then forbidden so... I dont know As for the song goes, I hate the fact that players who basically cheat will easily acheive a higher score then I can playing the way the game was intended/coded to be played. Also, as far as the demand for harder songs go, the songs are plenty hard enough, it all goes back to using third party programs to cheat and make these songs much more easier. I dont know where this will lead, I'm sure you wont let it go to hell tho, so I guess I'll just kickback and see ^^

03-18-2008, 05:03 AM	#18
Tasselfoot Retired BOSS Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: Widget Heaven Age: 40 Posts: 25,184	Re: OMG!!!!!! Omega: the game is intended to be played using the 4 arrow keys... or, really, ANY set of 4 inputs (1 per directional arrow)... "spread" is merely an offshoot of "4-finger", using 1 finger on each of the 4 arrow keys... spread is identical, it just alleviates some of the congestion of having 4 fingers jammed together. I, personally, played 4-finger up until we added a key-remapper in-game, which is currently on the beta, and will be public soon. Turning mines/hands off in ITG makes the scores not valid for the machines high score tables... so, really, what's the point? Using 3rd party programs is a fairly recent development on FFR, and is merely a solution since we didn't have our own built in key-remapper at the time. Stepmania allows you to re-do the keys as well. Let me make it perfectly clear.... using 4 fingers to play FFR is NOT cheating. In any way, shape, or form. Using a key-remapper, so long as you are still only using 1 input per arrow, is NOT cheating. Just because you play index and are at a disadvantage does NOT mean that those who play with 4 fingers are cheating. This has been brought up countless times, discussed plenty, and has long since been set in stone as truth... nobody forces you to play one way or the other. You choose to play index. Or you choose to play 1-handed. You play for enjoyment or competition or whatever... but you have the ability to play any way you want. Just because someone plays a different style than you does NOT mean they are cheating. __________________ RIP

03-18-2008, 05:04 AM	#19
OmegaOrdoss FFR Veteran Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: Texas Age: 36 Posts: 92	Re: OMG!!!!!! Using a third party program to play with ASKL or any keyboard button combination other then 8462 or d-pad arrows is cheating until the day it is adjusted within the game itself like speed mods are.

03-18-2008, 05:05 AM	#20
devonin Very Grave Indeed Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: Ontario, Canada Age: 40 Posts: 10,098	Re: OMG!!!!!! Well, unfortunately for you, it IS adjusted within the game itself.

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