MapleStory

[Afrobean]

Originally Posted by Squeek

If we're just counting attacks that you'd spam to kill something, like Savage Blow and Strafe, Archers have 10, Bandits have 8 or 9. So either way, I'm still right.

You're basically saying that fourth job skills are the only worthwhile skills for any class, since each job advance (except the 2nd for most classes) pretty much only offers upgrades to previous skills. In that case, Bandits are the only class that has a fourth job with just a plethora of skills. Skills that I see as mainly pointless, but skills nonetheless. Assaulter is replaced by Assassinate. Band of Thieves is replaced by Ambush. The only unique skill is Boomerang, and that doesn't seem too useful to me. You get poison and smoke and showdown too, but those aren't spam skills. Those are pre-attack skills which are also pointless since you never spend that much time killing an opponent in the first place. On bosses, sure. Totally useful. Kinda.

Hell I just don't like Bandits OK? I've always seen them as a gimped version of Assassins with skills that just look cool to make up for their ****tyness.

Bandits are nothing like assassins rofl holy crap

[ckj846]

Being a 3rd job archer myself, I know that it is extremely hard, if not impossible to outdamage most other classes unless you have godly gear. I haven't played in a long time and maybe they added some weapons or scrolls or pots or something that make everyone insane but a 22xx damage range for a level 83 ranger sounds a bit insane, considering that that is my average range and I'm level 98 or 99. And no my equips don't suck terribly. Either you're extremely funded or I'm way behind the times. Anyways.

Archers are boring. They seem fun for a while. Sure Squeek, grinding through levels in 10 minutes is nothing. Imagine grinding and grinding for hours and hours over and over. Sure, archers may be able to kill things skillfully, but not effectively. Puppet takes a while to set up, rain makes you take too much damage, hawk is costly with rocks and isn't always reliable (and kinda annoying because it attacks awkwardly), strafe is unstable because of the 4 crits, MB is useful but a pain in the ass to level because you don't see a difference in your skills. Really, all other classes continue to shine. Warriors almost double in power. Sins get faster with FJ and strong and stable with SP. Bandits get meso explosion. Mages get mist / IS / HS / SR / ridiculous AoE attacks.

Archers just got the short end of the stick. Puppet and hawk and everything is cool for a while but having to rely on them when you are in parties or when you want to go in with brute force (ie. boss battles), archers just dont' really cut it.

4th job IS different because you get SoA and you get that critical up thing (dont' remember, haven't played in a LONG time).

Oh and my equips off the top of my head...
+17 dex 15 str zhelm
103 metus
21 ades
+9 shoes
+11 glove
0 dex earrings

Not amazing but not crappy. Just thought that would further my point. I spent millions on this stuff (then again, it was when things were inflated). An unfunded lukles priest would surpass me by FAR.

O_o

[vpr0721]

Originally Posted by ckj846

Being a 3rd job archer myself, I know that it is extremely hard, if not impossible to outdamage most other classes unless you have godly gear. I haven't played in a long time and maybe they added some weapons or scrolls or pots or something that make everyone insane but a 22xx damage range for a level 83 ranger sounds a bit insane, considering that that is my average range and I'm level 98 or 99. And no my equips don't suck terribly. Either you're extremely funded or I'm way behind the times. Anyways.

Archers are boring. They seem fun for a while. Sure Squeek, grinding through levels in 10 minutes is nothing. Imagine grinding and grinding for hours and hours over and over. Sure, archers may be able to kill things skillfully, but not effectively. Puppet takes a while to set up, rain makes you take too much damage, hawk is costly with rocks and isn't always reliable (and kinda annoying because it attacks awkwardly), strafe is unstable because of the 4 crits, MB is useful but a pain in the ass to level because you don't see a difference in your skills. Really, all other classes continue to shine. Warriors almost double in power. Sins get faster with FJ and strong and stable with SP. Bandits get meso explosion. Mages get mist / IS / HS / SR / ridiculous AoE attacks.

Archers just got the short end of the stick. Puppet and hawk and everything is cool for a while but having to rely on them when you are in parties or when you want to go in with brute force (ie. boss battles), archers just dont' really cut it.

4th job IS different because you get SoA and you get that critical up thing (dont' remember, haven't played in a LONG time).

Oh and my equips off the top of my head...
+17 dex 15 str zhelm
103 metus
21 ades
+9 shoes
+11 glove
0 dex earrings

Not amazing but not crappy. Just thought that would further my point. I spent millions on this stuff (then again, it was when things were inflated). An unfunded lukles priest would surpass me by FAR.

O_o

Thats some nice stuff you got there, should get some dex earrings, they arnt so expensive anymore...

[vpr0721]

Random SS of afro being... afro lol =)

[Afrobean]

I still haven't passed that guy yet. He stopped bugging me to get outta there so I stopped paying it any mind.

[BreatheIntoMe]

Originally Posted by Squeek

If we're just counting attacks that you'd spam to kill something, like Savage Blow and Strafe, Archers have 10, Bandits have 8 or 9. So either way, I'm still right.

You're basically saying that fourth job skills are the only worthwhile skills for any class, since each job advance (except the 2nd for most classes) pretty much only offers upgrades to previous skills. In that case, Bandits are the only class that has a fourth job with just a plethora of skills. Skills that I see as mainly pointless, but skills nonetheless. Assaulter is replaced by Assassinate. Band of Thieves is replaced by Ambush. The only unique skill is Boomerang, and that doesn't seem too useful to me. You get poison and smoke and showdown too, but those aren't spam skills. Those are pre-attack skills which are also pointless since you never spend that much time killing an opponent in the first place. On bosses, sure. Totally useful. Kinda.

Hell I just don't like Bandits OK? I've always seen them as a gimped version of Assassins with skills that just look cool to make up for their ****tyness.

Boomerang is incredibly useful. At max, its a powerful mobbing attack, and you dont have to even get close to the enemy to use it, so almost never any dmg taken unless it uses magic. I dont really have time to type up anything else. School.

[Fimbulvetr]

Originally Posted by Afrobean

Point to notice here:

You think that Archers deal around as much DPS as Hermits.

Anyone who knows anything about Hermits knows that this is not right.
.

I believe ranger/sniper damage should be about the same to hermits, or prove me wrong otherwise please. In addition ranger and sniper gear is way cheaper than hermit gear (especially sniper gear)

Originally Posted by Afrobean

Mages are well known for having weak single target damage.

In addition, Thunderspear is the weakest DPS of the third job single target attacks.

Hmm, but composition isn't much stronger here, and I was factoring in element advantage for the I/L mage using TS.

Originally Posted by Afrobean

On top of this, Mage's have higher real DPS due to being MASSIVELY more mobile. Ice Mages also are made more worthwhile with their freazing AoE, and as for Fire Mages, they have infinite potential for DPS using Mist (the only thing limiting how much DPS that Poison Mist can do is what maps/monsters are available).

Of course Fire Mages have insanely high DPS, but at the cost of extremely high pot costs.
Ice mages are more mobile and IS does freeze (which puppet can also accomplish), but its a weaker skill compared to Arrow Rain, and its slower as well.

Originally Posted by Afrobean

17k max with a min of ~5.1k, making for an average of ~11k. Factor in lack of mobility and you'll see that Archers aren't far from Mage's single target DPS. A few thousand more DPS, which is what I meant when I said "it's not much ahead of Mage's single target DPS." They have better single target damage, but it's not a whole lot better.

Yet a few thousand DPS or w/e the figure is remains significant.

Originally Posted by Afrobean

Even a fairly typical Priest would hit 6~7k per instead of my 8k.

I would believe that most priests wouldn't be just a little weaker; a hundred+ matk is huge.

Originally Posted by Afrobean

Again, a typical priest would only be a little less. You see, Magicians have relatively low, but stable damage that isn't heavily influenced by gear. In addition, being lukless means nothing other than that it's a little bit cheaper for some gear. Take a look at the top Magician ranks and notice how many of them aren't lukless at all (I'll give you a hint: a large portion of the top 5~10 are luk).

Well lets see, since I/L and F/P rely on booster, lukless doesnt really have a big (if any) advantage over luk. Lets see how many normal luk priests are here.

#1 ~ newblet23 ~ 301 points ~ Ice ~ Scania ~ DarkRitual
#2 ~ Supp3rgirl ~ 284 points ~ Ice ~ Broa ~ MapleLama
#3 ~ HolyPort ~ 274 points ~ Holy ~ Windia ~ BlackUmbrella
#3 ~ GenesisPro ~ 274 points ~ Holy ~ Scania ~ PhoenixWand -yep
#5 ~ iEnziety ~ 273 points ~ Ice ~ Bera ~ MapleLama
#5 ~ FrostyGrass ~ 273 points ~ Ice ~ Bera ~ MapleLama
#7 ~ SecksehClaw ~ 269 points ~ Holy ~ Bera ~ DoomsdayStaff - yep
#8 ~ KiwiQQQ ~ 266 points ~ Holy ~ Windia ~ MapleLama
#8 ~ SeiiShir0u ~ 266 points ~ Holy ~ Broa ~ BlackUmbrella
#10 ~ Gabdeveron ~ 264 points ~ Ice ~ Scania ~ DoomsdayStaff
#10 ~ TruffleLockx ~ 264 points ~ Ice ~ Broa ~ MapleLama
#12 ~ MRCRAWFISH ~ 263 points ~ Ice ~ Broa ~ DoomsdayStaff
#13 ~ paLe ~ 257 points ~ Holy ~ Bellocan ~ BlackUmbrella
#14 ~ aDeception ~ 256 points ~ Holy ~ Broa ~ BlackUmbrella
#15 ~ Sxemp ~ 253 points ~ Holy ~ Windia ~ BlackUmbrella
#15 ~ sproo ~ 253 points ~ Ice ~ Scania ~ NocturnalStaff
#17 ~ Memouri ~ 252 points ~ Holy ~ Windia ~ EvilWings - yep
#17 ~ eHoly ~ 252 points ~ Holy ~ Khaini ~ BlackUmbrella
#17 ~ Afrobean ~ 252 points ~ Holy ~ Bera ~ BlackUmbrella
#20 ~ Effulgentum ~ 251 points ~ Ice ~ Mardia ~ BlackUmbrella

Thats 3/11, and those normal luk priests are low luk anyways with godly staffs, so we can see that in general, lukless priest>luk priest in terms of damage.

Originally Posted by Afrobean

And as for SR, it's about once per second. Combine this with teleport and you'll see that a good Priest that knows what they're doing is going to clear Dreamies faster than just about anyone (the only one who would stand a very good change in my opinion would be a VERY skillful Hermit who can throw Avengers just right to pull mobs in such a way as to pull mobs without punching often).

I would think that a PA DK would be able to kill Dreamy Ghosts/Himes faster, but prove me wrong if I'm incorrect on this.

Originally Posted by Afrobean

Faster cast rate perhaps, but you would not be able to command the map as effectively (especially if you're in a party). Your mobs would be smaller and you'd be unable to move effectively among them. Also: I know that ~100 casts per minute is the fastest of all in the game (Heal and L7), so I don't see how you could possibly be at that much faster of a rate in reality. More than 60 casts per minute, yet less than 100 casts per minute.

Its not exactly hard to get a mob of 6 dreamy ghosts, and an archer could move around effectively by using puppet/blizzard to occupy one group and then lure more with AR/AE/IA/Inferno. Archers can also achieve mobility by jump AR/AEing.

Originally Posted by Afrobean

Also: relying on MG is not a bad thing. It's actually-- gasp-- cheaper to pot MG'd MP than it is to heal HP with normal HP pots.

True, but I was under the assumption you would heal to recover HP, which I suppose was pretty stupid looking back. However, an archer can spam just spam Inferno/Bomb/IA/Blizzard (ranged KB) at dreamy ghosts and use a minimal amount of pots.

In addition, if you don't have an autopotting pet, constant potting slows one's training down; this applies less to ranged classes such as Archers and Hermits

Originally Posted by Afrobean

Shining Ray is the "strongest AoE in the game [plus] elemental advantage"? I was referring to partying a 150+ Archer back when I was 11x, before 4th job was even out. I was noticeably outkilling this Archer who was a great deal higher level than me, and I was only using SR and Dragon to do so.

I must say that's a pretty dammed weak archer o.O

Originally Posted by ckj846

Being a 3rd job archer myself, I know that it is extremely hard, if not impossible to outdamage most other classes unless you have godly gear. I haven't played in a long time and maybe they added some weapons or scrolls or pots or something that make everyone insane but a 22xx damage range for a level 83 ranger sounds a bit insane, considering that that is my average range and I'm level 98 or 99. And no my equips don't suck terribly. Either you're extremely funded or I'm way behind the times. Anyways.

Archers can outdmg CBs, nuff said, unless they waste lots of money on ME.
Archers can outdmg sins; the only reason this isn’t apparent is that our hits are 4 equal hits, whereas sins hit really high on 2 stars, with the other 2 doing half the damage.
I’m not that familiar with Sader/WK damage, but I don’t think they outdamage rangers/snipers at all (of course coma/panic do, but that’s not average damage)

DKs just Own 3rd job, so I’m not getting into that
Mages can’t outdmg archers in single target damage obviously but my level 4 Rain can match a 8x mage’s maxed IS in damage.

F/P has more DPS, only because of mist, but that makes them poor.

The average priest…is not outdamaging the average ranger anytime soon, this should be common sense -______- or you’d see all solo priests…

Originally Posted by ckj846

Archers are boring. They seem fun for a while. Sure Squeek, grinding through levels in 10 minutes is nothing. Imagine grinding and grinding for hours and hours over and over.

Very true.

Originally Posted by ckj846

Sure, archers may be able to kill things skillfully, but not effectively. Puppet takes a while to set up

It doesn’t take THAT long at all.

Originally Posted by ckj846

rain makes you take too much damage

True, but the same applies to Slash Blast, SR, Explosion (if F/Ps ever use it), BoT, etc.
The damage isn’t that bad if you know how to goby correctly, especially with puppet.

Originally Posted by ckj846

hawk is costly with rocks and isn't always reliable (and kinda annoying because it attacks awkwardly)

,
Hawk “was” extremely reliable at Vikings/Newties/wherever else high lv archers train at (until the hawks started to attack slower/less efficiently this patch due to a glitch) ; I was hearing things like

“with level 30 hawk i went from using ~200 icecream pops every 4 hours to ~850 every 4 hours, its still good exp though you just get hit more often”

That sounds pretty reliable to me

Originally Posted by ckj846

strafe is unstable because of the 4 crits, MB is useful but a pain in the ass to level because you don't see a difference in your skills. Really, all other classes continue to shine. Warriors almost double in power. (Same with DS v. Strafe 340% ->568% average damage and the addition of Rain/Inferno/Puppet/Hawk) Sins get faster with FJ and strong and stable with SP (SP doesn’t make their damage stable). Bandits get meso explosion (costly). Mages get mist (costly) / IS (not that strong) / HS / SR (weaker than IS DPS) / ridiculous AoE attacks (They all have their weaknesses).

Oh and my equips, pretty good but nothing godly except maybe the bow.

16/15 zhelm
3/8 dex cape
11/2 str wing boots
25/1 tai
13 attack brown work gloves
111/5 dex marine arund.
11 dex earrings

[Afrobean]

Originally Posted by Fimbulvetr

I believe ranger/sniper damage should be about the same to hermits, or prove me wrong otherwise please. In addition ranger and sniper gear is way cheaper than hermit gear (especially sniper gear)

You're asking me to prove it?

Are you freaking serious? This is a known fact. Why do you think they do full Nightlords on speed runs rather than full Archer?

They simply attack so fast, with a reasonably high average damage (thanks to better real mastery), and MUCH higher movement speed/mobility. Especially in 3rd job... Hermits just beat Archers in every department aside from purely defensive skills (a Hermit's greatest defense is to avoid the conflict in the first place by flash jumping away), and if you recall, my statements were to the effect that Archers are too weak in 3rd job, not that they haven't got good defensive skills.

Hmm, but composition isn't much stronger here, and I was factoring in element advantage for the I/L mage using TS.

Of course Fire Mages have insanely high DPS, but at the cost of extremely high pot costs.
Ice mages are more mobile and IS does freeze (which puppet can also accomplish), but its a weaker skill compared to Arrow Rain, and its slower as well.

Yet a few thousand DPS or w/e the figure is remains significant.

blah blah blah

I'm agreeing that Archers have better single target damage. This is quite obvious. All I'm saying is that Archers have such crappy real mastery that even though their max damage is WAY above, their average damage is actually only a little more.

I would believe that most priests wouldn't be just a little weaker; a hundred+ matk is huge.

You think so?

http://img263.imageshack.us/img263/3589/magicwo3.swf

900 magic attack
100 base
6127 max damage

Now compare it to one 100 magic more:

1000 magic attack
100 base
7166 max damage

Oh, look at that. An increase of 1000 damage for having 100 additional magic attack. That truly is "huge"...

Well lets see, since I/L and F/P rely on booster, lukless doesnt really have a big (if any) advantage over luk. Lets see how many normal luk priests are here.

Thats 3/11, and those normal luk priests are low luk anyways with godly staffs, so we can see that in general, lukless priest>luk priest in terms of damage.

I don't see how this has anything to do with Archers. Things like the difference in damage between lukless and luk is totally irrelevant and actually, fundamentally wrong. A luk can beat a lukless. A lukless can beat a luk. There is no absolute "lukless is better than luk" and there won't be so long as level 130 lukless weapons never show their face 'round these parts.

I would think that a PA DK would be able to kill Dreamy Ghosts/Himes faster, but prove me wrong if I'm incorrect on this.

Maybe if the monsters were magically pulled in front of them (...), but considering actual play requires the player to move around and pull mobs to get big mobs, the Priest will actually have a higher real killrate generally due to the DK's inability to from mobs as easily. A Hermit's Flash Jump combined with Avenger is the only thing that can touch a Magician's ability to pull fast moving mobs like Dreamy Ghosts, but at the same time, requires a lot more skill to land in the right spots and attack at the right time to minimize punching while maximizing monsters hit.

Its not exactly hard to get a mob of 6 dreamy ghosts, and an archer could move around effectively by using puppet/blizzard to occupy one group and then lure more with AR/AE/IA/Inferno. Archers can also achieve mobility by jump AR/AEing.

If you call jump shooting mobility, you have must have never played a thief or magician class, specifically a late 2nd job to 3rd job or beyond Magician or mid 3rd job or beyond Hermit. I doubt if you've ever even really seen a Magician or Hermit/Nightlord go at it at fullspeed if you think your jump shooting is anything close to what they've got.

True, but I was under the assumption you would heal to recover HP, which I suppose was pretty stupid looking back. However, an archer can spam just spam Inferno/Bomb/IA/Blizzard (ranged KB) at dreamy ghosts and use a minimal amount of pots.

Don't see how this is irrelevant at all. Most classes have something that can be done to avoid heavy pot costs. This was never brought up at all because I'm talking cold hard damage math, not pot costs or damage taken. I frankly don't care about how defensive an Archer can be; they're too weak regardless.

In addition, if you don't have an autopotting pet, constant potting slows one's training down; this applies less to ranged classes such as Archers and Hermits

rofl so SR is so slow that it makes for slow killing, yet at the same time, we cant manage potting inbetween casts?

And what of your setting up puppet to avoid taking damage. I am quite sure that setting up puppet takes more time, effort, and skill than potting in between less than half casts of SR.

I must say that's a pretty dammed weak archer o.O

Nope, not at all. And my damage at that time was fairly typical of a 14x Priest, so basically he couldn't kill as fast as a typical Priest ~10 levels below him.

[Lain_Iwakura]

archers are cool hehe you can make them jump while attacking that's useful right???????????????

[Demon Knight]

hey how is everyone? I play maple i am just curious what would you suggest for a warrior's dex cap?

[ProtoMDS]

Maybe if the monsters were magically pulled in front of them (...)

lol
Unless a PAD(r)K has maxed haste and godly avoid, there's no way it can compete with a lukless priest/bishop of the same caliber at undead spots. Sure, it may be able to pump out more raw damage, but general lack of mobility cripples that aspect, much like it cripples archers.
No more arguing with Afro, you're not going to get very far ;o
PS where the **** is Keeto/Larry and why hasn't he mailed/PM'd me yet

[Fimbulvetr]

Originally Posted by ProtoMDS

lol
Unless a PAD(r)K has maxed haste and godly avoid, there's no way it can compete with a lukless priest/bishop of the same caliber at undead spots. Sure, it may be able to pump out more raw damage, but general lack of mobility cripples that aspect, much like it cripples archers.
No more arguing with Afro, you're not going to get very far ;o
PS where the **** is Keeto/Larry and why hasn't he mailed/PM'd me yet

This is why DKs party? (We aren't talking 4th jobs here) Not only do they deal way more raw damage, they deal that damage way faster than SR ever could...

And that 100 matk = 1600 damage if you pay attention ~6 million more damage per hour which is totally not significant.

[Afrobean]

Originally Posted by Fimbulvetr

And that 100 matk = 1600 damage if you pay attention ~6 million more damage per hour which is totally not significant.

I have no idea what the hell you're trying to say. Where the hell did you pull "100 = 1600 damage" from? And who the hell would ever consider using a "damage per hour" unit? Only someone who wants their numbers to be bigger looking than they really are. The fact is that whatever big ass number the difference is when used in a "damage per hour" unit, it's still ~1000 per hit and that simply is not ever going to help your kill rate by a large margin.

Let me reiterate for you once again. Magicians are heavily based on skill base rather than on attack stats. As an example, consider Genesis. Level 1 Genesis has a base of 430. For a Bishop with 1000 magic, his maximum damage with level 1 Genesis would be 46.2k. Now consider that same Bishop if he had level 30 Genesis with a base of 670: his max damage jumps up to 72.0k.

Pretty nice, right? Just wait, I've got a bit more science to drop. Now consider a Bishop with 800 magic, 200 less magic than the previous one (which is equivalent to 40 levels of APs). His level 1 Genesis would be 33.2k, his max would be 51.8k.

"But what does this mean, Afrobean?"

The lower magic Bishop would outdamage the better stat'd Bishop if the low stat Bishop has a much higher level of Genesis. In short: a higher level skill allows you to do higher damage moreso than higher stats does.

EDIT: oh and by the way:

Not only do they deal way more raw damage, they deal that damage way faster than SR ever could...

Everything you just said is totally wrong.

"they deal way more raw damage"
Only in theory. In reality, they'd never be able to maintain a full mob within their attacking range. It is true that a Priest also cannot absolutely hold a full mob, but the fact that SR has a larger range (funny), and a Priest can move WAY WAY WAY ****ing faster... the only way a DK would be able to beat a Priest (of equivalent stats) would be hacks.

And that's just talking DPS and kill rate.

The fact is that a Polearm DK suffers the same fate as all AoE classes. Without full mobs, they don't deal good damage. Knowing this, we can surmise that a DK's polearm attack will be relatively weak, but it's good damage will come when considering total damage applied to multiple monsters. This is the same principle that Magicians are recognized for. Long story short: their polearm per hit damage max/min won't be far off from that of a similarly stat'd Priest.

"they deal that damage way faster than SR ever could"
I don't see why you would still think this. DKs are slow as **** at moving. Yes, they can cast their attack faster (only a bit faster, might I add...), but they are slower than ass from walking. Priests can literally PLOW THROUGH ANYTHING QUICKLY. I could cut across Encounter with Buddha three times as fast as any DK, WHILE APPLYING DAMAGE TO MONSTERS BOTH IN FRONT OF AND BEHIND ME. Then, when I arrive at the other side (long before the DK would have, might I add), I will only need to sit in the middle of the mob and throw a handful of SRs at them until only a few are left. Then I repeat the process. The DK meanwhile would be trying to get through the monsters, attacking them then walking through or jumping over them. And when he finally completes his mob and is ready to go at it, he has to ****ING POSITION HIMSELF CORRECTLY BECAUSE HIS POLEARM CAN'T HIT THE MONSTERS BEHIND HIM.

Seriously, it's ridiculous that you would think a DK would stand a chance in this instance. A DK would need to be hitting 20k+ per polearm strike just to even come close to a Priest doing his best.

[ckj846]

SR is actually quite amazing if you haven't used it before. If you haven't played a mage, I don't think you could ever understand the speed and power of telecasting. I mean, that's the whole reason why I started my f/p mage, for telecasting. I don't know very much about other classes but I do know a lot about archers and they DO fall behind in 3rd job. Every single class levels faster (except CBs at 11x) and gets stronger. 8x everyone is leveling fast Fimbulvetr. I don't even remember being 8x because I breezed through it so fast. Once you hit 9x and you start maximizing skills (hawk, MB, inferno) you'll realize how archers get the short end of the stick. Maybe try out another 8x+ class and you'll see >_<

O_o

[Squeek]

So basically Local is releasing more content than it can keep up with. Pretty much everyone's getting autobanned by the system. And they're not unbanning people because they're too busy coding in new **** that will get more people autobanned. Like, fourth jobs.

Me? I'm autobanned for... I don't know. They won't tell me. They won't tell ANYONE.

So I give up. It was fun while it lasted. Got to see the whole game, got to mess around with all the characters, etc. Not the ending I was hoping for, but it'll do.

[banditcom]

This is in response to this thread: http://www.sleepywood.net/forum/show....php?t=1417138

As many know, recently, i've been accused of being a 'dupe hacker', and i've also suffered some major blows (being kicked from my old guild) as a result from these rumors.

Actually you were kicked for following the money trail, among other things, which I will get to.

Also, why is anyone listening to someone who keeps trying to frame NatLove? First tip-off as you shouldn't take his word for things... Wow...

See a background on Armand (Facelt) was that he was a begger. He wanted to be the best at no matter what the cost. Jonnie gave Armand a godly top and bottom, but that wasn't enough. Weeks go by and he's still begging Jonnie to make him a spear and he'll buy it from him. Armand was only his "friend" to get items. He got a godly top and bottom. He got comfort from Jonnie when he was all upset that Pinakas were out and thus he probably wasn't the second best equipped anymore (behind BSUCLA), and wanted to move to Khaini where he'd be the best. Then one night, Daniel (iRunz), who also pretended to be Jonnie's friend, keylogged Jonnie. What did Armand do? He got all up on Daniel's nuts now instead of Jonnie's. He said he was his friend for a while and that's why he went to his side.

But wait... Daniel just keylogged a guy with countless white scrolls, perfect equips, and 4th job scrolls which NPC for 5m. This could really **** up the economy if this was let loose. Don't you care Armand? No, he didn't. He only cares about getting godly and becoming the best.

What everyone was pissed about is how he turned his back on Jonnie and the community. How he didn't give a flying **** whether or not all this **** was released into Bera. He had his eyes set on becoming the best, no matter who he betrays, no matter how ****ty it would turn the community. So congrats on achieving all of that, Armand. You buying duped scrolls, no one cares about that except the Nazi-anal people who think you have to be Jesus about this game and not contribute a meso to a hacker, and would trash you for doing it even if you didn't know it but should have known it. What you did was turn your back on a supposed friend who helped you, as well as the community. Know why people could be friends with Jonnie and be just fine? Because he wasn't releasing 2000+ white scrolls into the community. He wasn't just giving everyone and anyone all these things. Not only that, he talks to GMs personally and helps them fix issues. No, he's not perfect, but at least he wasn't bending the community over and ****ing its ass like Daniel did. And while Daniel was on Jonnie's accounts, I was whispering Armand asking what was happening. He ignored me. I went to FM with them all and whispered again and Armand continued to ignore me while moving around and hanging out with Daniel, who was stealing all of Jonnie's duped items. I'll get the SS from Kelsey of Armand saying he's paying 1.3b for unlimited white scrolls from Daniel, which happened while I was whispering Armand what was happening.

Let's see.... Sammy's (PoIarity) items.... Hmmm, now that we put to rest your "getting kicked from Imperials and being divorced my Kelsey (Fappachino) for buying illegit white scrolls" rumor, since that isn't true (reasons stated above, i.e., you're a bogus person)...

Okay so.. he bought items... for an expensive price. Big deal? He bought items using stuff he worked hard on: an account and mesos. Shame on him... >_>

Kelsey was given some items to try out. She didn't ask for them, unlike Armand who was begging to buy them (I see nothing wrong with buying them, as I saw nothing wrong with buying items from a store full of hacked Zakum drops; oh, and zhelms are like no other item, excluding pendants... they are completely different and obtaining them is completely different.. numerous things such as untradeable and needing people to attack, etc). Oh wow he ended up giving them to her for free. Who wouldn't take an item that is dropped in front of you, other than the Nazi-like people I mentioned previously (who won't even interact with anyone who did anything remotely "illegit" note: illegit meaning in their anal eyes)? I know Armand would take the item, as he has a top and bottom for free. But he failed to mention that... Yet is bashing her? Oh and she doesn't have 18 dex earrings. That SS with the earrings and cape she was transferring for Jonnie and showed Armand. Like usual, Armand likes to spin things.

TheMsThief was taken out of context, obviously. He knew that was Daniel. lol @ that screenshot.

As for me, yep, I have a 67 rab for free. Did I ask for it? Nope. Have I asked to buy a godly rab? Actually no, cause I didn't have that much money. I still don't. Though now I have 800m + another 400m coming to me. Guess what? I'd have at least 1.1b + 500m owed to me. Why don't I? Let's see.... Oh, that's right. Since I got it for free, I've been spending my money on my friends, slowly, but surely.

Let's see... my old rab was sold at a big discount of 125-200m less than what it could easily be sold for to a friend who desperately needed a rab (that's the 400m coming to me, as he's yet to pay me). I gave a friend who lost her stuff on her account from her ex 10 ilbis, cause her rebuilding she was short of that. Hmm, I'm still trying hard to get over 100k nx for a friend to reset her 4th job points that were lost when ex-friends of hers scammed her and used them pre-4th job; though, she's too stubborn to let me at the moment... I bought Kelsey's new wedding for her. I bought TT 20 for a guildmate. I gave another guildmate 2 steelies, and am going to buy him more once I have time to. And there are some other small things which I've forgotten, but many more to come.

Oh, and where has my money come from? I Zakum. Been saving for months. Old cuts were around 15-20m each and we ran more often. We run slightly less but gain 20-30m per run + drop cuts sent to us later, which have been 20m-50m a week. I do countless Zakum quests (6m for pq+jq, 5m for just jq). So in all, each Zakum run, if I combine everything, nets me 30-40m. I easily make 100-200m a week. It builds quickly. I'm spending all this money on my friends. Least I'm "buying from them" instead of the money going to someone who ****ed up the community (you buying from Daniel).

The best thing about all of this is that I've wanted to npc the rab numerous times. But then I wouldn't be spending all my money on friends. I compared keeping the rab and spending all the money I worked my ass off for on friends (dealing with buyers day in and day out, doing their quests (which are a pain in the ass cause this is like double the work as one of the hosts... dealing with one thing and then another, constantly)). I picked keeping it and helping my friends. I probably should have SS'd Jonnie saying he wants to fully equip me when he leaves and I said no to it.

So Armand, go back to being two-faced, skipping details such as your free top and bottom, and spinning it around like people are being hypocrites and kicking/divorcing you for "buying duped white scrolls". It wasn't that. It's that you're a scumbag and pretend to be a person's friend just to benefit and leech off of them.

None of the people you were trashing ever begged for free items. I'm not sure if you begged or not for free items; maybe just purchasing them, which I don't think negative about. It's the fakeness and the backstabbing to a "friend" and the community is what really pissed off a lot of people. Not to mention leading a group that doesn't give a **** about anyone but themselves, which was very apparent with how the Vent guild went around crashing runs, bagging people, and dumping loads of duped items into the community. We all know about this and your attempts to frame NatLove, which again, you blatantly show.

Can't believe I wasted my time defending myself and my friends to someone who harasses people in game and lead a guild which harasses the community. Scumbag. Nice job trying to attack someone who is a big part of the Bera community and has done a lot, said or unsaid, when all you've done is **** on it. You fail Armand. I've worked my ass off for the Bera and thief community for years. I've contributed so much. What have you contributed? Nothing but bad things. You have no ground to stand on, let alone attack me and my friends.

[vpr0721]

Originally Posted by banditcom

This is in response to this thread: http://www.sleepywood.net/forum/show....php?t=1417138



Actually you were kicked for following the money trail, among other things, which I will get to.

Also, why is anyone listening to someone who keeps trying to frame NatLove? First tip-off as you shouldn't take his word for things... Wow...

See a background on Armand (Facelt) was that he was a begger. He wanted to be the best at no matter what the cost. Jonnie gave Armand a godly top and bottom, but that wasn't enough. Weeks go by and he's still begging Jonnie to make him a spear and he'll buy it from him. Armand was only his "friend" to get items. He got a godly top and bottom. He got comfort from Jonnie when he was all upset that Pinakas were out and thus he probably wasn't the second best equipped anymore (behind BSUCLA), and wanted to move to Khaini where he'd be the best. Then one night, Daniel (iRunz), who also pretended to be Jonnie's friend, keylogged Jonnie. What did Armand do? He got all up on Daniel's nuts now instead of Jonnie's. He said he was his friend for a while and that's why he went to his side.

But wait... Daniel just keylogged a guy with countless white scrolls, perfect equips, and 4th job scrolls which NPC for 5m. This could really **** up the economy if this was let loose. Don't you care Armand? No, he didn't. He only cares about getting godly and becoming the best.

What everyone was pissed about is how he turned his back on Jonnie and the community. How he didn't give a flying **** whether or not all this **** was released into Bera. He had his eyes set on becoming the best, no matter who he betrays, no matter how ****ty it would turn the community. So congrats on achieving all of that, Armand. You buying duped scrolls, no one cares about that except the Nazi-anal people who think you have to be Jesus about this game and not contribute a meso to a hacker, and would trash you for doing it even if you didn't know it but should have known it. What you did was turn your back on a supposed friend who helped you, as well as the community. Know why people could be friends with Jonnie and be just fine? Because he wasn't releasing 2000+ white scrolls into the community. He wasn't just giving everyone and anyone all these things. Not only that, he talks to GMs personally and helps them fix issues. No, he's not perfect, but at least he wasn't bending the community over and ****ing its ass like Daniel did. And while Daniel was on Jonnie's accounts, I was whispering Armand asking what was happening. He ignored me. I went to FM with them all and whispered again and Armand continued to ignore me while moving around and hanging out with Daniel, who was stealing all of Jonnie's duped items. I'll get the SS from Kelsey of Armand saying he's paying 1.3b for unlimited white scrolls from Daniel, which happened while I was whispering Armand what was happening.

Let's see.... Sammy's (PoIarity) items.... Hmmm, now that we put to rest your "getting kicked from Imperials and being divorced my Kelsey (Fappachino) for buying illegit white scrolls" rumor, since that isn't true (reasons stated above, i.e., you're a bogus person)...

Okay so.. he bought items... for an expensive price. Big deal? He bought items using stuff he worked hard on: an account and mesos. Shame on him... >_>

Kelsey was given some items to try out. She didn't ask for them, unlike Armand who was begging to buy them (I see nothing wrong with buying them, as I saw nothing wrong with buying items from a store full of hacked Zakum drops; oh, and zhelms are like no other item, excluding pendants... they are completely different and obtaining them is completely different.. numerous things such as untradeable and needing people to attack, etc). Oh wow he ended up giving them to her for free. Who wouldn't take an item that is dropped in front of you, other than the Nazi-like people I mentioned previously (who won't even interact with anyone who did anything remotely "illegit" note: illegit meaning in their anal eyes)? I know Armand would take the item, as he has a top and bottom for free. But he failed to mention that... Yet is bashing her? Oh and she doesn't have 18 dex earrings. That SS with the earrings and cape she was transferring for Jonnie and showed Armand. Like usual, Armand likes to spin things.

TheMsThief was taken out of context, obviously. He knew that was Daniel. lol @ that screenshot.

As for me, yep, I have a 67 rab for free. Did I ask for it? Nope. Have I asked to buy a godly rab? Actually no, cause I didn't have that much money. I still don't. Though now I have 800m + another 400m coming to me. Guess what? I'd have at least 1.1b + 500m owed to me. Why don't I? Let's see.... Oh, that's right. Since I got it for free, I've been spending my money on my friends, slowly, but surely.

Let's see... my old rab was sold at a big discount of 125-200m less than what it could easily be sold for to a friend who desperately needed a rab (that's the 400m coming to me, as he's yet to pay me). I gave a friend who lost her stuff on her account from her ex 10 ilbis, cause her rebuilding she was short of that. Hmm, I'm still trying hard to get over 100k nx for a friend to reset her 4th job points that were lost when ex-friends of hers scammed her and used them pre-4th job; though, she's too stubborn to let me at the moment... I bought Kelsey's new wedding for her. I bought TT 20 for a guildmate. I gave another guildmate 2 steelies, and am going to buy him more once I have time to. And there are some other small things which I've forgotten, but many more to come.

Oh, and where has my money come from? I Zakum. Been saving for months. Old cuts were around 15-20m each and we ran more often. We run slightly less but gain 20-30m per run + drop cuts sent to us later, which have been 20m-50m a week. I do countless Zakum quests (6m for pq+jq, 5m for just jq). So in all, each Zakum run, if I combine everything, nets me 30-40m. I easily make 100-200m a week. It builds quickly. I'm spending all this money on my friends. Least I'm "buying from them" instead of the money going to someone who ****ed up the community (you buying from Daniel).

The best thing about all of this is that I've wanted to npc the rab numerous times. But then I wouldn't be spending all my money on friends. I compared keeping the rab and spending all the money I worked my ass off for on friends (dealing with buyers day in and day out, doing their quests (which are a pain in the ass cause this is like double the work as one of the hosts... dealing with one thing and then another, constantly)). I picked keeping it and helping my friends. I probably should have SS'd Jonnie saying he wants to fully equip me when he leaves and I said no to it.

So Armand, go back to being two-faced, skipping details such as your free top and bottom, and spinning it around like people are being hypocrites and kicking/divorcing you for "buying duped white scrolls". It wasn't that. It's that you're a scumbag and pretend to be a person's friend just to benefit and leech off of them.

None of the people you were trashing ever begged for free items. I'm not sure if you begged or not for free items; maybe just purchasing them, which I don't think negative about. It's the fakeness and the backstabbing to a "friend" and the community is what really pissed off a lot of people. Not to mention leading a group that doesn't give a **** about anyone but themselves, which was very apparent with how the Vent guild went around crashing runs, bagging people, and dumping loads of duped items into the community. We all know about this and your attempts to frame NatLove, which again, you blatantly show.

Can't believe I wasted my time defending myself and my friends to someone who harasses people in game and lead a guild which harasses the community. Scumbag. Nice job trying to attack someone who is a big part of the Bera community and has done a lot, said or unsaid, when all you've done is **** on it. You fail Armand. I've worked my ass off for the Bera and thief community for years. I've contributed so much. What have you contributed? Nothing but bad things. You have no ground to stand on, let alone attack me and my friends.

Nuff said, xD.

[banditcom]

Why on earth would you quote all of that.....

[vpr0721]

Originally Posted by banditcom

Why on earth would you quote all of that.....

Cuz i can, and its free.

[Afrobean]

Originally Posted by banditcom

Why on earth would you quote all of that.....

It wasn't even that long