Should the government stop abortions?

[xWnLx Crisco]

Originally Posted by stretchypanda

No, really, I have to agree with him. You seem to have some good points, but you are often expressing them so poorly that I cannot decide which side of the fence you're on.

I have a question for you then..

Why do we have to pick a "side"?

The question he asked isn't as easy as yes or no because so many little things can be debated wether it should allowed for rape victims or etc. like you said.

Ok think of it like this, If we had made it legal to only females that got raped or it was a health risk for the mother to give birth who is to judge them if they can and can't get the abortion?

Would they have to show proof they got raped? Would you let a doctor say "Well theres no physical proof you got raped so you can't have an abortion"?

Would it be ok to arrest a female for saying that she was physically unable to give birth but the doctors said she was?

The reason why my points are "poorly" given is because the average age of this board is no older than 15 years old. I have actually been in situations with friends that have been abused, raped, and needed to have an abortion becuase they could not afford to keep it and were at the time in high school. If you ever knew a mother of a child in high school you would know she wasn't the most "popular" girl in school.

Before you tell me being "popular" doesn't matter to children then tell me why the kids that are teased are always the one that bring a gun to school. And yes I have seen that first hand aswell but luckily it was a paintball gun and he wanted to shoot the Principal.

[devonin]

The reason why my points are "poorly" given is because the average age of this board is no older than 15 years old.

I have no idea a) what you're talking about (In that the average age of the people making useful contributory posts in these threads is closer to 21) or b) why a young forum participation somehow explains you making poorly phrased arguments.

[xWnLx Crisco]

Originally Posted by devonin

I have no idea a) what you're talking about (In that the average age of the people making useful contributory posts in these threads is closer to 21) or b) why a young forum participation somehow explains you making poorly phrased arguments.

I don't feel like writing essays every single time I post. I make everything simple to read and to the point that the question was given.

[devonin]

Well, the problem with that is that you don't just state your opinion in a 'critical thinking' thread. Here you have to give your opinion, give your reasons for the opinion, and if you're feeling really clever, pre-tackle some of the obvious objections to your opinion, or if nothing else, be prepared to respond to them in a useful and reasonable way.

I mean, some of the epic essays that have gone between Kilroy_X and myself aren't necessarily typical of what should be going on here, we just both take our debates seriously and tend to adhere to proper form moreso than is strictly necessary.

[stretchypanda]

If you don't feel you can give due respect to the members of this community who value thoughtful discussion, you have no place in Critical Thinking or anywhere else on the forums.

You may not stomp around insulting our users if you cannot overlook something as baseless as a person's age.

If you have something to contribute, please do so. Do not assume that just because the average user on the internet is a certain age, that average user falls into your stereotype of that given age group.

[Kilgamayan]

Originally Posted by Tyren

The biggest problem I see with defining 'person' is its rediculous relativity to the situation. Im sure the government has defined this word over and over again, however due to the vast moral scenarios that keep popping up, the term needs to continuously be redefined. Since language is just a bunch of symbols, these symbols are always going to mean something different to another. Conveying one unifying thought with a symbol becomes potentially difficult at this point, especially when it has to be voted upon.

Overall, it creates quite a task at hand, likely delaying abortion under the terms you suggest. Im not saying thats particularly a bad thing...but damned if I was the government official(s) assigned to do that job.

That's...exactly the point.

[xWnLx Crisco]

Originally Posted by stretchypanda

If you don't feel you can give due respect to the members of this community who value thoughtful discussion, you have no place in Critical Thinking or anywhere else on the forums.

You may not stomp around insulting our users if you cannot overlook something as baseless as a person's age.

If you have something to contribute, please do so. Do not assume that just because the average user on the internet is a certain age, that average user falls into your stereotype of that given age group.

Where in any of my posts did I say that they fall under a stereotype?

I just said that I shortened my answers to questions to make it easier for everyone to understand. You are putting words in my mouth and accusing me of insulting people that is no where to be found.

When are you going to answer the questions I asked you? Or do you feel that I insulted you because you got put into a situation you can't mentally answer?

[xWnLx Crisco]

Originally Posted by devonin

Well, the problem with that is that you don't just state your opinion in a 'critical thinking' thread. Here you have to give your opinion, give your reasons for the opinion, and if you're feeling really clever, pre-tackle some of the obvious objections to your opinion, or if nothing else, be prepared to respond to them in a useful and reasonable way.

I mean, some of the epic essays that have gone between Kilroy_X and myself aren't necessarily typical of what should be going on here, we just both take our debates seriously and tend to adhere to proper form moreso than is strictly necessary.

I can understand that but I am in between work and different forums. There is simply no time to sit and type a long response to a single question when I constantly have people coming in my office looking for me.

[stretchypanda]

Originally Posted by xWnLx Crisco

When are you going to answer the questions I asked you? Or do you feel that I insulted you because you got put into a situation you can't mentally answer?

Well, I didn't feel insulted until this comment came along.

I also felt addressing the issue of your baseless insults (your assumption that, even if the average age of a user in THIS THREAD were 15, people could not understand your thoughts if you put them into well-organized statements is not only wrong, it is insulting, don't give me that **** about "dumbing it down out of courtesy") was more important that responding to your completely missing my point, which is that no one is asking you to choose sides, I am simply pointing out that while you seem to hold very strong opinions, you are not expressing them well.

Now, you are welcome to continue your semi-trolling in this thread, or you are welcome to contribute at a time when you can actually compose your thoughts, since you seem to be too busy right now. It's a forum. We're not going to cry if you can't and don't immediately respond to arguments, questions, etc. No one is asking you to "write an essay", we are only requesting that you follow the rules of this particular forum.

[xWnLx Crisco]

Rule 2. Do not take anything personally. No flaming.

You : Well, I didn't feel insulted until this comment came along.


Treat me like a child and the same will be in return.

[Chrissi]

Originally Posted by xWnLx Crisco

Rule 2. Do not take anything personally. No flaming.

You : Well, I didn't feel insulted until this comment came along.


Treat me like a child and the same will be in return.

Being snappy with staff is not at all reccomended.

[ffrrocksya]

Yeah. Abortions should be stopped. It's murder.

[devonin]

Originally Posted by xWnLx Crisco

Rule 2. Do not take anything personally. No flaming.

You : Well, I didn't feel insulted until this comment came along.


Treat me like a child and the same will be in return.

She did not flame you. She pointed out your inflammatory trolling remarks. She did not feel insulted until -you- claimed that she was not able to 'mentally answer' your question.

The thing you aren't supposed to take personally in rule 2 is someone stating disagreement with your point.

Rule 2 isn't a carte blanche for you to launch ad hominem attacks against her intelligence and then get righteously indignant when she calls you on it.

[xWnLx Crisco]

Originally Posted by devonin

She did not flame you. She pointed out your inflammatory trolling remarks. She did not feel insulted until -you- claimed that she was not able to 'mentally answer' your question.

The thing you aren't supposed to take personally in rule 2 is someone stating disagreement with your point.

Rule 2 isn't a carte blanche for you to launch ad hominem attacks against her intelligence and then get righteously indignant when she calls you on it.

Oh is that so but I insulted the youth of this forum?

Nice double standard we have going here.

When were you able to add to the written rule? I directly copied and pasted that rule but you just went ahead and added to it.

The funny thing is she still hasn't answered those simple questions and tries putting it to the side because I have better things to do than write a response to a simple question or statement.

[devonin]

Originally Posted by xWnLx Crisco

When were you able to add to the written rule? I directly copied and pasted that rule but you just went ahead and added to it.

Right...I explained what the rule was referring to. If you care to dispute my interpretation of the rule: namely that "Don't take things personally, no flaming" is a rule against "Getting flamey and angry at someone stating disagreement with your point." I'm happy to wait for some kind of moderator adjudication on that.

Here's the thing though. Rule two says "Don't take things personally." (Full stop) "No flaming." (Full stop) While the two are connected, they can and should also be taken seperately.

So even if Stretchypanda took some personal umbrage at the implication that you needed to dumb down your points so the forum would understand them, she is also a moderator, and was pointing out that making such implications is also trolling, and bordering on flaming. This is her bailiwick, and she is allowed if not required to do so.

Then you further called her intelligence directly into question because she felt that doing her moderator duty and making sure you understood the rules of the forum was more important than doing her participant duty and answering your questions. This was an outright ad hominem attack, and she was (to me) well within her rights both as a forum member and a forum moderator to call you out on it.

[xWnLx Crisco]

Originally Posted by devonin

Right...I explained what the rule was referring to. If you care to dispute my interpretation of the rule: namely that "Don't take things personally, no flaming" is a rule against "Getting flamey and angry at someone stating disagreement with your point." I'm happy to wait for some kind of moderator adjudication on that.

Here's the thing though. Rule two says "Don't take things personally." (Full stop) "No flaming." (Full stop) While the two are connected, they can and should also be taken seperately.

So even if Stretchypanda took some personal umbrage at the implication that you needed to dumb down your points so the forum would understand them, she is also a moderator, and was pointing out that making such implications is also trolling, and bordering on flaming. This is her bailiwick, and she is allowed if not required to do so.

Then you further called her intelligence directly into question because she felt that doing her moderator duty and making sure you understood the rules of the forum was more important than doing her participant duty and answering your questions. This was an outright ad hominem attack, and she was (to me) well within her rights both as a forum member and a forum moderator to call you out on it.

Well if someone is going to tell me the rules they better know them.

I can play your little games by belittling me in ways that only you and I would understand.

I have not flamed anyone or personally insulted a group or person. I tried to make my debate respones fair to everyone but you "called" me out saying I was trolling you and your intelligence. Which I have not done.

[Chrissi]

Originally Posted by Chrissi

Being snappy with staff is not at all reccomended.

...

[devonin]

Edit: I had spent a great deal of time writing out a longwinded post here. It just isn't worth the time or effort. You've decided you're being wronged despite the moderation staff telling you that the reverse is true.

I'm done with this topic entirely. "Is Crisco participating in this forum appropriately" is not germane for this thread, this forum, or really this site. If the moderators feel someone is stepping outside the bounds of the forum, they'll be removed. If one mod saying so wasn't enough to convince you, I suspect it would only be a matter of time before another chimed in as well.

Meanwhile, back to the actual topic at hand?

[GuidoHunter]

xWnLx Crisco, just shut up.

Another post to continue your derailment of this thread and I will personally ban you. Hell, you might receive a nice vacation for the crap you've been spewing lately from stretchy or any of the other mods, but I've got a Rangers game to get to, so I've not got the time to do anything but tell you to shut up.

Post on-topic or don't post at all.

Oh, and heed Chrissi's words; she speaks the truth.

--Guido

http://andy.mikee385.com

[Chocaholic]

The goverment should abortions are wrong.no matter who you are. Its wrong. We killing our own.