06-20-2016, 07:44 PM | #21 | |||||
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Re: Milo's post-Orlando speech, 100% worth watching
I love this diagnosis
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I'm willing to accept a correlation between the first two. But bringing in -murder- is a different issue altogether. And before you bring up ISIS, that there is a difference between terrorists and people practicing a religion Where I am getting this from is actual data about American mass shootings Sorry this image is from the same source --- they compiled the data into a picture This is just from 2015, but you can find statistics from even further back. Currently Muslims make up 1% of the US population. Quote:
and yeah P.S. there's a difference between the Middle East and America not just in religious denomination, but the intensity of the teachings, the fact that the governments often enforce those teachings, and a whole slew of things. surprise, I actually despise religious idealogy like that. I find homophobia detestable, and the fact that Eastern gvts. enforce the death sentence is one of the biggest procedural travesties committed in modern society. The issue I have with this is that there is a difference between hating a religion and hating people who celebrate that religion and assuming they are out to get you. Literally in the first minute he makes the "argument" "hey yeah Muslims want to kill all of the other minorities." No, not really. In the East, sure. But this is not the East, and to assume that "they think homophobia is punishable by death over there, so they coming over here are going to take matters into their own hands" is a different case altogether. I won't disagree with you on the "idealistic dysmorphia" part, but again, this man was able to legally buy a gun Quote:
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06-20-2016, 07:48 PM | #22 | |
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Re: Milo's post-Orlando speech, 100% worth watching
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hey the world is lawless and "what we believe" is what forms our government and social change |
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06-20-2016, 07:50 PM | #23 | |
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Re: Milo's post-Orlando speech, 100% worth watching
no one thinks "a person who follows this religion is going to murder people"; clearly when I say "50% of british muslims think homosexuality should be illegal" this is also saying that 50% do not think this. however the intensity of homophobia in a given religion is a probabilistic statement about the likelihood of one person acting on these religious doctrines. no causal claim is necessarily true unless you're just describing a physical mechanism and even then, why you'd even think someone believed in necessary causation I have no idea.
anyway, when I say it "does not matter" i am very obviously saying that your belief does not change the truth of a statement. lots of people implicitly believe that their belief somehow adds to the truth of a position. and I am saying that no matter what you say you believe, this will make none of our positions more true or less true. most of what you've wrote is redundant, and not worth addressing since I've already replied to it and you only thought it was worthwhile due to an incomplete understanding of what I wrote in reply. were I to reply to all of your most recent post I'd just be repeating myself. Quote:
so, yeah this is a gross ignorance of the intensity of homophobia vs. nominal inclusion in the category "homophobia" pastor billy or whatever might loudly proclaim how I'm going to hell but he isn't going to say I should be put in jail 50% of british muslims, however, do think this Last edited by Arch0wl; 06-20-2016 at 07:56 PM.. Reason: oh god you said 'shitlord' unironically |
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06-20-2016, 07:51 PM | #24 | |
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Re: Milo's post-Orlando speech, 100% worth watching
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1) this is a response to a mass shooting, and 2) the proposed change is a response to a mass shooting |
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06-20-2016, 07:52 PM | #25 |
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Re: Milo's post-Orlando speech, 100% worth watching
I'll agree that several of the core teachings of Islam are despicable but it's a stretch to say that "we should be afraid of Muslims" and especially that "they are the biggest threat to our safety as Americans"
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06-20-2016, 07:53 PM | #26 | |
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Re: Milo's post-Orlando speech, 100% worth watching
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I specifically used the phrase "to your face" because this has happened, to my face. Where is the ignorance when it literally happened to me? Unless I'm misreading something and this is not what you are referring to.
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06-20-2016, 07:53 PM | #27 |
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Re: Milo's post-Orlando speech, 100% worth watching
If you want to make this about homophobia, then I think most rational ppl would agree with you that religious homophobia is problematic
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06-20-2016, 07:56 PM | #28 |
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Re: Milo's post-Orlando speech, 100% worth watching
yeah conceal carry is not a bad idea. but neither is closing gun show loopholes and expanding background check denials to terrorist watch lists.
i have no problem with guns in the hands of responsible adults, i do have a problem with guns in the hands of suspected terrorists. |
06-20-2016, 07:58 PM | #29 | |
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Re: Milo's post-Orlando speech, 100% worth watching
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otherwise, way too broad since even US senators have been included on the list |
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06-20-2016, 07:59 PM | #30 |
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Re: Milo's post-Orlando speech, 100% worth watching
was referring to broader context of the quote it originated from, and why you were bringing it up in the first place
Last edited by Arch0wl; 06-20-2016 at 07:59 PM.. |
06-20-2016, 08:00 PM | #31 | |
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Re: Milo's post-Orlando speech, 100% worth watching
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"your belief does not change the truth of a statement" Yeah when we're talking about fucking physics or statistics if you are asserting that "concealed carry is the solution" is A FACT, then yeah beliefs matter because you are positing an opinion |
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06-20-2016, 08:00 PM | #32 | |
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Re: Milo's post-Orlando speech, 100% worth watching
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car crashes, heart disease, and cancer are the biggest threat to our safety as americans. I'd say maybe feminism too but I already listed 'cancer' Last edited by Arch0wl; 06-20-2016 at 08:02 PM.. Reason: I'm kidding about feminism. it's only a threat to the safety of truth and rationality |
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06-20-2016, 08:01 PM | #33 | |
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Re: Milo's post-Orlando speech, 100% worth watching
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and oohhhh boy he brought up feminism |
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06-20-2016, 08:02 PM | #34 |
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Re: Milo's post-Orlando speech, 100% worth watching
*with respect to violence
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06-20-2016, 08:06 PM | #35 | |
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Re: Milo's post-Orlando speech, 100% worth watching
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statistics will be the methodology to determine what solutions are best for social problems to say "this applies with statistics but not when you look at the available solutions to a social issue, which will be analyzed using behavioral data / statistics" is ignorant of the very words you're using 'opinion' and 'fact' are false dichotomies, all inductive judgments are 'opinions' ranging from "adderall is effective for treating ADHD" to "concealed carry is an effective solution for shooters". the only 'facts' that exist are analytic statements in CS, math, logic and so on. all behavioral claims are probabilistic, and I am saying your position does not have evidential ground to stand on. |
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06-20-2016, 08:09 PM | #36 | |
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Re: Milo's post-Orlando speech, 100% worth watching
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as educated adults, there isn't any real difference further, I am not asking people to think 'critically'. I am asking people to think period. critically would imply the replies so far evidence some baseline amount of thought and I'm still looking for that. |
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06-20-2016, 08:12 PM | #37 | |
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Re: Milo's post-Orlando speech, 100% worth watching
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06-20-2016, 08:12 PM | #38 |
soleil ardent
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Re: Milo's post-Orlando speech, 100% worth watching
Maybe everyone isn't quite as proficient as arguing as you, but that doesn't invalidate their opinions, jesus christ
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06-20-2016, 08:16 PM | #39 | |
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Re: Milo's post-Orlando speech, 100% worth watching
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a) relevant b) correct EDIT: with respect to the gun control debate. Statistics are just numbers that you get from input, you can spin them however the fuck you want, and even if you account for "reasonable factors", there is always a chance you are leaving variables out, or ignoring ANOTHER prescription with other data When I say "statistics are fact" I mean that they are computations, [b]not that they prescribe a solution to a problem" I mean ffs just look at macroeconomics. Literally a bunch of statistical methods that people posit are true because of "relevant computations" but in reality don't have strong predictive power. To say that statistics in the social sciences produces an answer, which, if I have reservations with, "my opinion doesn't matter" is so goddamn wrong Providing statistical analysis by its very nature requires selection of variables and omission of others. The complete analysis of this fact is required in order to make strong assertions about predictive power. Statistical analysis means to provide a model of the world which we cannot capture completely. You aren't spitting numbers into a machine which says "concealed carry is correct". Conclusions from information are performed by human beings, which can be challenged. As I said, I'm not totally opposed to accepting concealed carry, but it's completely bullshit to say that "it is wrong" to disagree with EDIT: a conclusion derived from statistics
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Last edited by DaBackpack; 06-20-2016 at 08:18 PM.. |
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06-20-2016, 08:17 PM | #40 |
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Re: Milo's post-Orlando speech, 100% worth watching
Finally an Arch Ego-boosting thread that appears to be working! Congrats
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