08-26-2013, 02:27 AM | #21 | |
TWG Chaos
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Re: Fair Use / Copyright Law & FFR
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EDIT: However, there is something in the back of my mind that still tells me that just because 'Peppy' has yet to be caught dosen't mean what he is doing is legal. I don't know. I'm gonna reread this doctrine and try to find out what I can on that instance.
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08-26-2013, 12:30 PM | #22 |
no
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Re: Fair Use / Copyright Law & FFR
i would think that osu! is popular enough that some record company is going to catch wind and could take legal action against osu! if they so chose. however, this hasn't happened yet for osu! so in reality, what is the likelihood that this could happen to FFR? FFR is more under the radar than osu! is (look at the player count), so there should be even less of a chance of legal action being taken against FFR under the same circumstances.
can one of the admins comment on what osu! is doing and how it compares to FFR in terms of using copyright material? this is a pretty big deal and it could mean a lot for FFR's future. |
08-26-2013, 01:53 PM | #23 | |
TWG Chaos
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Re: Fair Use / Copyright Law & FFR
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Well, keep in mind FFR is non-profit. We do not profit off of anything on this website so we are WAY WAY lower on the radar, perhaps not even on the radar at all, in all honesty. I know nothing about osu! really besides what people are telling me, I'd like to hear a comment about this as well.
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08-26-2013, 02:33 PM | #24 |
no
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Re: Fair Use / Copyright Law & FFR
even if you don't know much about osu!, the important thing to note is that osu! uses whatever it wants in terms of content and the staff evidently doesn't care if it's copyrighted or not.
i don't know if this has been touched on in this thread or in other places, but i'd like to point out that when FFR was told to take down copyrighted content in the past, it was when copyright law hadn't established itself like it has now. at this point in time, it's more mature so things are different now from what i have seen. Last edited by Fission; 08-26-2013 at 02:37 PM.. |
08-26-2013, 04:06 PM | #25 |
TWG Chaos
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Re: Fair Use / Copyright Law & FFR
And that is a really dangerous approach for osu! to take.
And as long as FFR did comply with such a request, honestly there isn't much of an issue I see in my eyes. Like, if a user submits a file that we do not have permission for, the submitter agree sthat however spectacular their file is, it can be removed at any time in the senario where a record label / copyright holder of said works requests the removal.
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08-26-2013, 04:28 PM | #26 |
no
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Re: Fair Use / Copyright Law & FFR
i know it's dangerous, but the fact that it remains unchanged in it's offering for this long speaks pretty loudly.
also, i wouldn't mind some kind of agreement like the one you described between ffr and the simfile author as a supplement to the already in-place permission system. |
08-26-2013, 04:28 PM | #27 |
¯\_(ツ)_/¯
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Re: Fair Use / Copyright Law & FFR
Keybeat was infinitely smaller than osu! when it was told to take down the konami/bemani songs, didnt read thread whatsoever except to skim this page but just because you have a small community-driven site doesn't mean it won't be targeted. I saw you say stuff like that has changed, too, and if that's true, then great Keybeat was definitely a couple of years ago, close to the same time FFR was down and told to provide proof for resonance
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08-26-2013, 04:29 PM | #28 |
Kawaii Desu Ne?
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Re: Fair Use / Copyright Law & FFR
From the perspective of people on the osu forums:
https://osu.ppy.sh/forum/t/150066/hi...yright&start=0 |
08-26-2013, 04:33 PM | #29 |
no
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Re: Fair Use / Copyright Law & FFR
i never said FFR won't be targeted, i said the likelihood is much smaller. you can't deny that osu! has been stepping on much bigger toes than konami/bemani for years now. as was already stated, if copyright holders still want to be really possessive, files will just get taken down.
the only problem i could see to this is everybody submits files that there isn't explicit permission for and lots of files start getting taken down. EDIT: btw, that osu! thread is mostly speculation with nothing definitive to back it up. Last edited by Fission; 08-26-2013 at 04:47 PM.. |
08-26-2013, 04:44 PM | #30 |
Kawaii Desu Ne?
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Re: Fair Use / Copyright Law & FFR
Also, I found the thread that I started on osu about copyright but it didn't get much attention:
https://osu.ppy.sh/forum/t/140306?hilit=+copyright I do find it a little silly that osu can get away with it while (possibly) making money while we at ffr have to acquire permissions for every single artist even though ffr isn't making a dime. EDIT: Yeah, I know it's only speculation. I just wanted to give people a broader perspective on other people's views on the topic. Last edited by reuben_tate; 08-26-2013 at 04:49 PM.. |
08-26-2013, 04:58 PM | #31 | ||
shots FIRED
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Re: Fair Use / Copyright Law & FFR
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No, from what I recall, stargroup took down Konami songs on his own accord due to not wanting to take any chances (that's what he told me when I asked him why years ago). Correct me if I'm wrong, but I don't think he received any demands to take them down by force. |
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08-26-2013, 05:00 PM | #32 |
¯\_(ツ)_/¯
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Re: Fair Use / Copyright Law & FFR
Oh wow I honestly thought there was a post about it or something and they were doing it a little bit at a time, sorry about that x.x
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08-26-2013, 05:07 PM | #33 | |
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Re: Fair Use / Copyright Law & FFR
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EDIT: osu! might actually host these files centrally, but it has proven to be resilient much in the same way sites like mega.co.nz are (they forfeit all responsibility) Last edited by Fission; 08-26-2013 at 05:11 PM.. |
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08-26-2013, 05:09 PM | #34 | |
soleil ardent
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Re: Fair Use / Copyright Law & FFR
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08-26-2013, 05:10 PM | #35 |
Kawaii Desu Ne?
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Re: Fair Use / Copyright Law & FFR
Decided to scour more of the osu forums, I'm pretty bad at searching so this is pretty much everything you're gonna see from their side. Don't know if this will give anyone more insight or not on the situation.
https://osu.ppy.sh/forum/t/107567?hilit=+illegal https://osu.ppy.sh/forum/t/30831?hilit=+copyright https://osu.ppy.sh/forum/t/65442?hilit=+copyright https://osu.ppy.sh/forum/t/116468?hilit=+copyright https://osu.ppy.sh/forum/t/140636?hilit=+copyright |
08-26-2013, 05:32 PM | #36 |
no
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Re: Fair Use / Copyright Law & FFR
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08-26-2013, 08:01 PM | #37 |
stepmania archaeologist
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Re: Fair Use / Copyright Law & FFR
While FFR may fall under fair use, keep in mind that companies can and will pull a copyright claim on you even if you are using their work fairly. Look at all the youtube videos that are technically fair use but are taken down for copyright reasons. And if they do take legal action, either you have to hire a good lawyer and plead your case in court - and hope the judge agrees with you, because otherwise you will have to pay a LOT of money - or come to a smaller, but still significant, settlement. Basically my point is that, just because the law is on your side, doesn't mean what you're doing is a good idea.
tl;dr let's keep getting proper permissions
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09-7-2013, 05:12 PM | #38 | ||
TWG Chaos
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Re: Fair Use / Copyright Law & FFR
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(I have experienced both instances, in 2007 and 2012 - and my how things are better now then they were back then) And while your statement is somewhat true, since remember there is no profit being gained what so ever in any way, shape, or form, I can guarentee that all they will do in a worst case senario is send a C&D letter. If FFR dosen't comply after 2(ish) requests, then legal action would be expected. So I guess after thinking this over, I see something like this happening: - If a lack of response has been given after 3 requests (with at-least 2 different meathods of contact), the user must attach their emails within the submission folder showing documentation proof of an attempt to contact. - At any time the users file can be removed from FFR at any time without warning. - (Perhaps these files should never be tokens either, in-case they do get removed) Keep in mind we have been talking about worse case scenario. On another note, since we credit each artists with homepage links and little facts about them when songs are released (assuming the homepage keeps getting updated like before) we can be considered musical bloggers, which is another area we can fall into in regards to copyright law.
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