12-1-2011, 12:41 PM | #601 |
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Re: Is it wrong to be gay?
parades consist of Gays, and gay right supporters. I'm sure some of them are actually protesters too, much you westboro at Soldiers funerals. I have no problem with homosexuals, I do however have a problem with flamboyant homosexuals who strive to make it obvious they're gay. I smoke pot, I don't strive to make it obvious I do it a lot, pretty much the same concept. Also, my views. I believe being gay is nothing but a mere fetish, much like one liking feet, scat, or loli, whatever gets your aroused I believe it should be kept behind closed doors.
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12-1-2011, 12:45 PM | #602 | |
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Re: Is it wrong to be gay?
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Set aside feeling for a sec, and ask yourself why do you think they would go beyond just stating a matter of fact? Why are they never "just gay" and act normal? I suggest that our society in general does not see homosexuality as "normal". It sucks but everyone, gay or not, knows homosexuality ought to be perceived different, not considered as the norm but something... unorthodox in the aspect of living. Do read my previous post before continuing on to reading this next part of my argument. Now... you and I can agree that this 'action', "forcing a lisp or wearing outlandish bullshit", is nothing more than a defensive way to prove someone's point, their knowledge. It can get distasteful, even for me most of the time, but people usually never take the time to see things in a bigger picture, but would rather fall into actions like: OH FUC, he/she is gay. Let's attack them because I feel they are different from me and that I think being straight is the ONLY way.Or: I'm gay, people should care about that. I'm very proud that I am. I'm different and they should accept me. Let's prove ALL straight people that they are wrong for thinking their way is the ONLY way.To make my argument short, I'll go ahead, reveal my point, sum it all up and say: I believe most people act too much on things that's perceived "different", "out of the normal", "unorthodox". What I mean is that when one will see something different, immediately they will judge, or hate or even abuse it. But one who opposes this action will act just as much, thinking ALL of people who thinks homosexuality is wrong, is wrong. Some straight people will go as far ahead as adhering hatred and indifference towards the homosexual community, but some gays have made the homosexual community feel more like a cult, rather than something as simple as a state of being. But what can we do? This has been going on since the start of humanity.
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12-1-2011, 01:00 PM | #603 |
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Re: Is it wrong to be gay?
I don't mind people openly showing their flamboyancy in public although it can get annoying when lines are crossed. What irritates me about some people are the type of gays who attempt to "convert" others to be gay as if the world has to be gay. At least that was the message I perceived from the gays that I have to deal with back in high school. This is similar to how some people attempting to convert others to believe in a different religion, which is extremely frustrating.
And to answer the question of the thread, what constitutes "wrong"? That is solely up for the individual to determine. Personally, I believe that being gay isn't wrong for reasons that won't matter to all of you because we choose what is "wrong" and what is "right" in our lives. EDIT: By "wrong" and "right", I am only speaking in terms of what one believes. Last edited by iironiic; 12-1-2011 at 01:07 PM.. |
12-1-2011, 02:23 PM | #604 | |
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Re: Is it wrong to be gay?
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It happens all the time, and it happened here in this thread. What I am trying to get across is that everyone is entitled to an opinion, whether we will agree or not. Just avoid partaking in trying to prove your point, because there is no solid proof what is absolutely right and absolutely wrong anyways. It's pointless on both sides if you all think about it.
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12-1-2011, 03:35 PM | #605 | |||||||||
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Re: Is it wrong to be gay?
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nat·u·ral/ˈnaCHərəl/ Noun: A person regarded as having an innate gift or talent for a particular task or activity. Adjective: Existing in or caused by nature; not made or caused by humankind. Adverb: Naturally: "keep walking—just act natural". It doesn't just exist within mankind, and is therefore natural. [quote=Mike Weedmark;3580826]Nature always selects for the survival and reproduction of the fittest. Homosexuality goes as against the grain on that one as it's possible to go. It pisses on and says **** you to the grain. There is nothing nature squashes out of existence faster than the genes of two people who don't reproduce.[/code] So why is going against the grain of reproduction bad? What's negative about it? If I don't have a kid what's wrong with that? Is it the same as a couple who gets together and can't/won't reproduce? If not why? Why should I give a **** if my genes don't get carried down? Quote:
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EDIT: Holy shit I forgot I'm the OP of this thread. How time flies~ Last edited by fido123; 12-1-2011 at 03:40 PM.. |
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12-1-2011, 04:21 PM | #606 |
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Re: Is it wrong to be gay?
I find it interesting that people are still making the reproduction argument. Did you know that population growth is a bad thing?
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12-1-2011, 05:13 PM | #607 | |
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Re: Is it wrong to be gay?
In response to genetics, natural selection, evolution, etc...
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The rest of everything you guys have said has to deal with behavioral issues and is not something that I want to address directly, because it would take too much of my time and isn't worth the individual attention. What needs to be recognized is that the issue most people have is with people's behavior, and not really their orientation. Being gay /= behaving obnoxiously. Hopefully this thread will raise that awareness, which is why I find it relevant to still comment on it even though the issue of whether it is right or wrong has been addressed to the fullest. Last edited by RubiedCross; 12-1-2011 at 09:36 PM.. |
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12-1-2011, 07:06 PM | #608 | ||
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Re: Is it wrong to be gay?
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Fido, in general, you spent a lot of time nitpicking my post, putting words into my mouth, and missing the main points. I was arguing that homosexuality is fine as long as it's not the pointless, aggressively flamboyant kind. You seem to be looking for an opponent, which I'm not. And for the record, encouraging people to use wikipedia for their own personal information isn't the same as giving it academic clout, which no forum post has the authority to do anyway. But, the article you posted, academic or not, accompanied by any colloquial dictionary definition you want, still doesn't prove homosexuality is natural. It's one of nature's exceptions, not one of its rules. Animals have homosexual sex because they're dumb as shit, are complete slaves to their instincts, and have no restraint whatsoever. Comparing them to humans who do it consciously and willingly is insulting to homosexuals, but also a false analogy. But like I already said, people need to get off the nature arguments anyway. Their relevance is zero. Last edited by Mike Weedmark; 12-1-2011 at 07:39 PM.. |
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12-1-2011, 07:19 PM | #609 | |
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Re: Is it wrong to be gay?
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The only time I ever agreed with gays having to stay in the closet was with Don't Ask Don't Tell, simple because there are homophobes in the army, as with anywhere else, and Lt. Dangle (Ha) saying he's gay could get him beaten, left behind, shunned, what have you, and the army is absolutely no place for things like that, theyre supposed to be a team. So, as pathetic as it was before it was repealed, it probably did save a hell of a lot of problems. Other than that scenario where getting shot is not just a possibility, but a probability, I dont think it should be wrong for gays, straights, or whatever to say how they are because (as mentioned) unless you have to put your lives in the hands of someone who might be a homophobe, you can say "Im gay, and if you dont like it, f*ck you." EDIT: Holy hell, VBZ started me off on the first post instead of the last for the first time in forever, I had no idea that was 600 posts ago rofl. Oh well, theres my two cents, I'm not gonna take it back now xD
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Chris Huntress 1:37 pm I aaa'd vROFL without any lube Last edited by FallenXxRaven; 12-1-2011 at 07:22 PM.. |
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12-1-2011, 07:22 PM | #610 | |
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Re: Is it wrong to be gay?
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@FallenXxRaven: I agree with you 100%. What I think (was a long time ago) was trying to say was when gay people tell people they're gay because THEY ARE GAY AND PROUD~ It's ok to act normally and talk about a couple endevours, but when somebody talks about being gay for the sake of being edgy or taboo or OH SO PROGRESSIVE, I think that's degrading, and causes some people to think most or all gays are like that. Last edited by fido123; 12-1-2011 at 07:28 PM.. |
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12-1-2011, 10:03 PM | #611 |
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Re: Is it wrong to be gay?
Modern society isn't ready for gays to talk about their intimacies yet. I'll give it 50 years before it's socially acceptable. Lets keep in mind that women getting the right to vote is a thing of the past 100 years as well as people keeping household slaves, I have faith that society will gradually learn to accept homosexuality just like we regard african americans as normal individuals (for the most part :/ but that's another topic) when before they were basically tools for white people, not even allowed to use the same bathrooms.
Thankfully the heterosexual vs. homosexual war isn't as furious as segregation was in the 60's, but if we can learn anything from that time, it's that we can overcome this 'homophobic era' just like we can learn to accept blacks as equal members of society. Of course there's still some controversy today, but it's nearly a complete 180 from where we were 50 years ago. The new generation needs to be raised on the belief that homosexuality isn't a bad thing, instead of the stuff we all learned when we were kids: God will hate you if you're gay and you'll go to hell. We can pick and choose what we want to cite from the bible, but in the end I don't really care since there's often contradictions, for instance: 'If a man lies with a man as one lies with a woman, both of them have done what is detestable. They must be put to death; their blood will be on their own heads.' (Leviticus 20:13) vs. "Test all things and hold fast to that which is good" (1 Thessalonians 5:21) So I'm confused by the bible, and therefore won't use it as my guide seeing as I don't have any reason to believe what it says beyond trying to read and understand the bible (and I went to catholic school for 8 years). So without religion to fall back on, I turn to logic and science in an attempt to find answers for myself. I don't know maybe if I fail to find what I'm looking for with science and logic I'll turn elsewhere for answers as I mature.
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12-2-2011, 02:35 AM | #612 | ||
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Re: Is it wrong to be gay?
If I had a nickel every time I feel I'm least noticed on FFR, I'd probably be very rich by now.
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If someone thinks being homosexual is wrong, dirty, hateful to God, condemning you to Hell, stupid, etc., what they think is nothing more than an opinion. An opinion really shouldn't phase anyone but the one who made it. Acting upon their opinion, however, is where I feel it's "irrational". Gay prides, banning same-sex marriages, mental and physical abuse towards gays, gay prides, discrimination, gay prides etc. alike is where I don't agree with. But in the end, unfortunately, people spend way too much time trying to prove their opinion is right, seriously, and again, that's where the line is crossed between opposing parties. Quote:
Like you are trying to say yourself, there is still controversy today. I wouldn't be surprised if there are still people out there who still disagree with women or African American rights. And disagree with me or not but I stay firm to my argument: EVERYONE is entitled to an opinion, UNTIL they act upon it. Look, people will nitpick others for something that hits the senses as "different", unorthodox", "irrational", "right or wrong". This what you call "homophobic era" suggests indifference towards someone who simply holds an opinion.
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12-2-2011, 06:33 AM | #613 |
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Re: Is it wrong to be gay?
Although I agree with your philosiphy, in practicailty some opinions just don't hold any ground. If I said all Phillipino's regardless of where they live don't celebrate Christmas, that's my opinion right? Do Phillipino's celebreate Christmas? YES! Does the argument they don't celebrate Christmas deserve any reasonable consideration or hold any sort of ground? NO! What that person is saying is false. Everybody can have their own opinions but some opinions are wrong, and came about due to faulty logic and emotion. Everybody is entitled to their opinion but their opinion can be wrong. If somebody tells me their opinion and it's flat out wrong, their opinion means shit. If an opinion is built off any sort of logic, reason, and rational, regardless with how much I disagree with it, I will respect it and know that they can be right and I can be wrong. If soembody's opinion is wrong, they should rethink it. I've never heard a logical or rational explaination about why homosexuality is wrong out of a religious context, therefore until somebody gives me an opinion against it that isn't wrong and horseshit, I will assume nothing is wrong with homosexuality. People's negative opinions on homosexuality I believe to be far more often than not to be caused by simply being uncomfortable with the idea of two nakid men in a bed. It's 100% fine to think that's repulsive, but it doesn't mean you have to hate people for it, and if you do, you're a biggot~
Do you perhaps want to have this discussion over MSN or something? I don't think a forum is going to do this discussion to much justice due to the complexity of it. Last edited by fido123; 12-2-2011 at 06:36 AM.. |
12-2-2011, 01:31 PM | #614 |
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Re: Is it wrong to be gay?
"Also, my views. I believe being gay is nothing but a mere fetish, much like one liking feet, scat, or loli, whatever gets your aroused I believe it should be kept behind closed doors."
Rushy is a straight man, right? Have you ever gotten around by the thoughts or images of mutiple men having sex with 1 woman? I'm assuming yes. Do you call yourself gay because of it? No, although a specific part of that turn-on involves other men. Have you ever been turned on by the thought of 2 women making out? Again I'm assuming yes. But you don't call yourself a lesbian, so why does it turn you on? Both these things could be considered fetishes (although I'm pretty sure fairly common ones, so I'm not sure if the term 'fetish' really applies), and they both involve things that potentially question your own sexuality. Yet in neither case do you consider yourself a homosexual, and in 1 case you specifically wouldn't like the homosexuality aspect of it, (ie: probably a turn-off if you found out those women are homosexuals,) which begs the question: why do you call yourself straight? If I had sex with another woman, I wouldn't call myself a lesbian. I wouldn't call myself bi-sexual. If I had a threesome with a man and a woman, I wouldn't call myself bisexual then either. There's obviously something about men that I like that women just...don't evoke in me, and I don't think ever will. There is an emotional component in romance and love that sexual acts don't need to involve. I have never fallen in love with a woman and I have never had a crush on a woman, and that is why I call myself straight. Why are you straight? |
12-2-2011, 01:46 PM | #615 | ||
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Re: Is it wrong to be gay?
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12-2-2011, 02:08 PM | #616 |
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Re: Is it wrong to be gay?
The only wrong thing about being gay is that they FEATURE it almost. (<< My opinion, that's not "wrong") lol It's not like straight people. I mean, I know there are some overly sexual people who are over the top about their sexuality and are straight, but it's almost a thing with gay people to talk off key or what ever that weird ass tone in their voice is. If they could just assimilate into the community like others and keep their sexuality to their bedchambers (which, needs to be an universal thing, not just gay/lesbians) everything would be just fine.
I didn't read many of the previous posts because they were just walls of text that were annoying to read for me, so bear with me if I missed anything or am off topic. Also, I find in CTs that people like to challenge any posts you make instead of just using them as food for thought. It's kinda annoying. I know it's a discussion, but.. I also have to say that it's not helping when people like the Westboro Baptist Church keep making the slurs against them. Gay/Lesbian isn't wrong, it's just not productive in furthering our species through reproduction. /2cents. I probably will come back and respond, but I gotta gather my thoughts. |
12-2-2011, 03:06 PM | #617 |
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Re: Is it wrong to be gay?
which is worse?
(NSFW) http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L2glCe-dlo8&t=2m46s or http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W8wqk6qD4r8 two extremes I know, but I find the first as equally as annoying as the second, which leads to the point that acting so over the top about your sexuality is probably never a good thing.
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12-2-2011, 03:10 PM | #618 | |
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Re: Is it wrong to be gay?
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I do want to say though, yes, opinions can be wrong. But I am ONLY regarding an opinion that reflects logic and experience, but alas I have dismissed those who create opinions 'out of their ass'. I myself DO NOT consider those as opinions, but moreso prejudice or just plain ignorance. As rushy has pointed out, ignorance is bliss: it's the root of all life problems, but it'll never go away. We can only have wishful thinking if we want to rid of it. But whatever, I'm still a homosexual. Opinions or not, it's what it is.
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12-2-2011, 04:24 PM | #619 |
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Re: Is it wrong to be gay?
Just because no one replies to your post, doesn't mean it's glossed over. If you make your point well, there's nothing more needed to be added for the sake of the topic, and especially if I agree with it, enough said.
Emithith: The discussion went there in very recent posts. How would you have any idea how many gay people act gay if the opposite of what you're saying is true; that is, if most gay people didn't outwardly act gay? You would still largely be basing it on those people who do outwardly act gay, and you could come to the exact same conclusion. Secondly, there's a very good reason for gays to act gay; so that people know they're gay. How would you like men to hit on you because they think you're gay? The reverse would happen to gays all the time if they didn't outwardly portray their sexuality in some way. It would also suck to have to specifically walk up to someone and ask 'are you gay?' before you could flirt, or if you couldn't tell at a glance if you could possibly have a shot with that girl. Furthermore, you're conflating overt sexual behaviour with sexuality. Waggling your hips while you walk isn't exactly the same thing as making out in public. Or, if you're not conflating the 2, you're essentially asking the impossible: the majority of men are attracted to women and vice versa. That means straight people will always be overt about their sexuality simply because they have a visible gender. Are you suggesting we all hide our genders? Another thing, if all sexuality were kept solely to the bedroom, finding a person to have sex with would have to revolve around something weird like nightly bedroom meet-ups or some such thing. If you could just assimilate gays and the quirks they have adopted to fit into the community, then everything would be just fine. That said, I'm sure that if I were gay I'd probably try and act specifically not gay most of the time or something in an attempt to keep my own individual identity because I'm dumb like that. |
12-2-2011, 05:18 PM | #620 | |
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Re: Is it wrong to be gay?
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Either way this is a gay right/wrong conversation, so let's not get into that. I understand it would probably be pretty damn hard to get someone if you were gay, if you can't show it, but I don't exactly mean "acting gay" I mean that higher pitched voice/accent thing. It's the most annoying thing ever, and it seriously annoys me when I hear it. TALK NORMALLY DAAAMNITTTTTT. Why do they have to talk that way to get attention? Why can't they just wear a ring on their finger or something. Or like do something less annoying. lmao |
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