[High School Math - SAT]

rzr · 05-6-2008, 05:49 PM

There are 30 students. They can choose to study Italian, German, or both. The amount that choose to study German is 3 times (3x) the amound that choose to study Italian. The amount that choose to study both is equal (=) to the amount that choose to study only one subject. How many students study just Italian?

a) 6
b) 9
c) 15
d) 20
e) 24

P.S. This is not homework, but an SAT question I remembered that's really bothering me and some friends.

P.P.S. I said a (6).

Relambrien · 05-6-2008, 06:04 PM

HEADS UP. The College Board stated several times on the SAT exam that questions were not to be discussed at all during or after the test. You can't even give the essay question until you get your scores back. But considering the un-enforceability of that rule, I don't know what the mods want to do here.

But anyway, I'll go ahead and give my work, highlight it if you want to see it. That's a precaution until I find out what the mods want to do with this thread.

Yeah, I got this same question. Except it wasn't three times, it was three more. Three more students study German than Italian

The question states that the number of students who study both subjects is equal to the number of students that study only one.

That means 15 students study only one subject, Italian or German, and 15 study both. Because of that, we only need to find two numbers which add up to -15-, rather than 30, whose difference is three. Those numbers are nine and six. Since we know there are three more German students than Italian students, German has to be nine and Italian has to be six.

rzr · 05-6-2008, 10:53 PM

I didn't bother because... well, it's like the law prohibiting one from ripping the tag of your pillow. Or tying alligators to fire hydrants. Or putting tomatoes in New England clam chowder. If they can enforce it, I will except my punishment humbly.

I read your white text. I actually haven't taken my SAT yet, my friend told me the problem and we came to the same result you did, just in a different way.

GuidoHunter · 05-6-2008, 11:03 PM

Three things:

Quote:

Originally Posted by rzr

well, it's like the law prohibiting one from ripping the tag of your pillow.

This is a legitimate law. It applies only to pillow vendors, though, and it protects the consumer from getting ripped off.

Quote:

If they can enforce it, I will except my punishment humbly.

If someone catches you doing wrong, it's not exactly your choice to "except" your punishment.

Didn't do too well on the Verbal section, did you? =)

Quote:

There are 30 students. They can choose to study Italian, German, or both. The amount that choose to study German is 3 times (3x) the amound that choose to study Italian. The amount that choose to study both is equal (=) to the amount that choose to study only one subject. How many students study just Italian?

You transcribed the problem wrong. Choosing the smallest number, 6, that means 18 choose German only, which means 24 study both, which totals 48 students, more than there are.

Relambrien probably got it right.

--Guido

http://andy.mikee385.com

**Silver_Brian** · 05-6-2008, 11:59 PM

Ooh yeah, I remember this question. I sat for quite a while on it.

I initially thought it said 3 times too, and it messed up my work. As soon as I figured out it was three more, it was fairly easy. Yeah, I'm sure Relambrien is correct.

**devonin** · 05-7-2008, 01:28 AM

Quote:

This is a legitimate law. It applies only to pillow vendors, though, and it protects the consumer from getting ripped off.

In fact, once you purchase the pillow or matress you're actually -supposed- to remove the tag yourself, to indicate that the goods have now been purchased, and save it in case you are ever called upon to provide proof of purchase, but then nobody pays attention to that sort of thing.

**foilman8805** · 05-7-2008, 01:51 AM

EDIT: Based on the assumption that those who pick German is 3 times those that pick Italian, not 3 more. The '3 more' method has already been proven by Relambrien.

Well, right away you know there's only two logical answers, because C), D), and E) put you well over 30 students.

Then, if you think about it a bit more, if you pick 9, that means 27 kids study German. 9+27 is already more than 30. So that answer is out of the question. Logical choice is obviously A).

If 6 kids pick Italian, then 18 pick German, and the other 6 pick both. 6+18+6=30.

Bam. Done. Took me 30 seconds. Shame on you if you sat there for more than a minute, because this question wasn't designed to be hard.

GuidoHunter · 05-7-2008, 02:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by foilman8805

and the other 6 pick both. 6+18+6=30.

That's not how the originally posted problem works. The calculation according to rzr would be 6+18+24, since "The amount that choose to study both is equal (=) to the amount that choose to study only one subject."

That's why the question is faulty. According to rzr, you should have 30/2 = 15 study both, and 15 study just one. I+G = 15 -> I+3I = 15 -> I= 15/4, which isn't a possible answer.

So, either you change the question to say "the number of people who choose to study both is equal to the number who choose to study just Italian" and get your method, or you change it to say "the number of people who choose to study German is three more than the number who choose to study just Italian" and get Relambrien's. Either way you get six, but rzr's question is impossible to realistically answer.

--Guido

http://andy.mikee385.com

**foilman8805** · 05-7-2008, 02:08 AM

Yeah, I noticed the fallacy.

I just decided that it meant that the 'both' was equal to the people who decide to pick Italian.

I'm sure the actual question was worded correctly, and clearly leads you to deduce six.

EDIT: Upon further review, the way Relambrien phrased the question makes much more sense, and I agree with going by his method. It's not that mine isn't right, but the question simply makes more sense with 3 more rather than 3 times.

Though, either way, the answer is 6.

rzr · 05-7-2008, 07:58 PM

Lol, I love you, Guido. Actually, my friend (argo15) took it. I have not yet, but I told him I would make the thread. Feel free to PM him since I got the questions and answers from him.

**Skeleton-GotW** · 05-7-2008, 08:38 PM

This has been bugging me too. I left it blank on the test because none of the answers made sense. I guess that was the right answer though haha...

Maybe they made a typo or something and meant 3 MORE people took German than Italian. Regardless, if I lose points for omitting an impossible question I'm going to be pissed... lol.

05-6-2008, 06:04 PM	#2
Relambrien FFR Player Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: Pittsburgh, PA Age: 32 Posts: 1,644	Re: [High School Math - SAT] HEADS UP. The College Board stated several times on the SAT exam that questions were not to be discussed at all during or after the test. You can't even give the essay question until you get your scores back. But considering the un-enforceability of that rule, I don't know what the mods want to do here. But anyway, I'll go ahead and give my work, highlight it if you want to see it. That's a precaution until I find out what the mods want to do with this thread. Yeah, I got this same question. Except it wasn't three times, it was three more. Three more students study German than Italian The question states that the number of students who study both subjects is equal to the number of students that study only one. That means 15 students study only one subject, Italian or German, and 15 study both. Because of that, we only need to find two numbers which add up to -15-, rather than 30, whose difference is three. Those numbers are nine and six. Since we know there are three more German students than Italian students, German has to be nine and Italian has to be six.

05-7-2008, 01:51 AM	#7
foilman8805 smoke wheat hail satin Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: LA baby Age: 35 Posts: 5,704	Re: [High School Math - SAT] EDIT: Based on the assumption that those who pick German is 3 times those that pick Italian, not 3 more. The '3 more' method has already been proven by Relambrien. Well, right away you know there's only two logical answers, because C), D), and E) put you well over 30 students. Then, if you think about it a bit more, if you pick 9, that means 27 kids study German. 9+27 is already more than 30. So that answer is out of the question. Logical choice is obviously A). If 6 kids pick Italian, then 18 pick German, and the other 6 pick both. 6+18+6=30. Bam. Done. Took me 30 seconds. Shame on you if you sat there for more than a minute, because this question wasn't designed to be hard. Last edited by foilman8805; 05-7-2008 at 02:16 AM..

05-7-2008, 02:08 AM	#9
foilman8805 smoke wheat hail satin Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: LA baby Age: 35 Posts: 5,704	Re: [High School Math - SAT] Yeah, I noticed the fallacy. I just decided that it meant that the 'both' was equal to the people who decide to pick Italian. I'm sure the actual question was worded correctly, and clearly leads you to deduce six. EDIT: Upon further review, the way Relambrien phrased the question makes much more sense, and I agree with going by his method. It's not that mine isn't right, but the question simply makes more sense with 3 more rather than 3 times. Though, either way, the answer is 6. Last edited by foilman8805; 05-7-2008 at 02:15 AM..

05-7-2008, 08:38 PM	#11
Skeleton-GotW Lol Hellbeat Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: Here Age: 33 Posts: 212	Re: [High School Math - SAT] This has been bugging me too. I left it blank on the test because none of the answers made sense. I guess that was the right answer though haha... Maybe they made a typo or something and meant 3 MORE people took German than Italian. Regardless, if I lose points for omitting an impossible question I'm going to be pissed... lol. Last edited by Skeleton-GotW; 05-7-2008 at 08:40 PM..

Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)