Make Stepmania Great Again

[Celirra]

Originally Posted by Hakulyte

tl;dr: Most of the information you could potential want as a new player is already here, it's just a matter of pointing them in the right direction.

Do you think the front page on FFR should have some sort of "First time playing StepMania?" link with explanations pointing out to all these sticky threads for the sake of conveniency?

The crux of the argument really boils down to, contrary to most "popular" games you do kind of have to use your research skills to find what you want; there's not a good megathread/textdump/google doc/whathaveyou (maybe I should make one or something...) that would make it easy. Sure you can point people in the right direction, but having a doc you could just link easily, say with an embedded link to the newest version of xwidghet's build or whatnot.

Originally Posted by MooMoo_Cowfreak

Naw but really, I would like to see this game grow but this game is incredibly niche, and rhythm games have really left the public eye. I don't think it's going to get much bigger anytime soon, and I'm fine with that!

I agree to that much; I really don't expect massive growth. It's more maybe having the ability to keep a steady stream of people to counteract those who leave so it doesn't shrink.

Originally Posted by Dinglesberry

Make stepmania come with xwidget, work with Mina and make til death the default them, integrate the game with online play so it's basically like osu in terms of profile, leaderboards etc - If I were to design it, I'd make someone configure their profile first time the sign in, set your key binds, speed mod, scroll dir, note skin (include lots of the common noteskins) etc - I feel like the most logical thing would be to encourage spread play right off the bat, rather than having arrow keys be default.

Of course, to implement a leaderboard, there would have to be a standardized song list.. Ive noticed that stepmania online is working on a pack search/a way to index individual files I suppose, from the news post, so perhaps it would be possible.

That's the kind of thing that would be great if done right, but I feel that much development is beyond the scope of most people here to really pull off to an extent where it would be good unfortunately. Ideally, yeah that would be perf.

Originally Posted by Staiain

Basically I need to put up even more effort to get new people to try out the game (AND STAY) when they stumble upon my strim, sure thing man I'll be putting more effort into that than ever

Didn't intend to blame/push pressure onto you in any way, apologies (it did somewhat come off that way, oops); I more used you as an example of the kind of thing that is helping the game and community and what we really need. I'd say you're the primary source of new players actually playing Stepmania, so massive props for that!

[lofty rhino]

Where my necromancers at?

[sunn0glasses]

Originally Posted by Travis_Flesher

All very interesting considering this is one of the simplest, most simple and such a basic level game that is combined with music on again, such a simple and base level. This game should be core material not only for so called rhythm gaming enthusiasts but for planet earth. Think about just how core the four arrows being tapped to the beat of a song is man it is surreal when you think about how just basic level this is nothing more than a rhythm game that can be played on any computer. If you know what a game is, you should know about this game. If you know what music is, you should know about this game. The statistics are astonishing that the small communities dedicated to the 'press 4 buttons to the beat of a hit song' genre have such dwindling and mixed reviews. Furthermore I reiterate by saying it is astonishing that stepmania needs be made great again when it's just so simple and core of a game in terms of just how games are played in general. In closing it is just flabbergasting that this game is not literally the most popular game on earth, not even top 3, not top 10, but somewhere in the second half of the top 500 most popular videogames.

i dunno if you're being sarcastic, but i actually agree 100%. stepmania is good for your soul

tbh stepmania is not that hard to set up - plus its fuckin free. who doesn't like free games?

however, stepmania is niche as fuck, and it shouldnt be too surprising that it's not super popular.

but i've been thinking lately, stepmania has done a lot to spread music and get players listening to things they'd never think to listen to otherwise. when i got into stepmania in like 2007 or whenever, i was like 15 and hearing venetian snares and m1dy and dj sharpnel and shit like that for the first time. shit blew my mind and had big influence on what music i listen to today. that said, i feel like if stepmania is going to make any significant gains in attention, maybe the content itself is what needs to engage new players. hear me out - there's a lot of cool young alt internet kids these days, not saying i'm not one myself, but my point is there's a lot of cool young folk that spread hype within "scenes" on soundcloud, facebook groups, the internet in general. and if i had to guess what niche group of cool kids would be naturally into stepmania, it'd be ravey weeaboo ex-DDR players. but in a broader scope, i would think people who are into electronic / dance music / new music might be somewhat entertained by stepmania. maybe stepmania should have more of a presence on soundcloud? maybe more simfiles of relevent and upcoming music should be made?

i dunno, just poopin the words outta mouth so wat up

like, for example, what if a site like NESTHQ did a feature on stepmania? that'd get a lot of eyes on stepmania for a hot sec. well, how would something like that come about? probably if there was some content that would spark interest, hit some trendy shit, you know?

as with any project you want to get eyes on, it takes some delusional self endorsement, and just bein a ho

[djaero]

Stepmania? Plz, Dance With Intensity is the one and true DDR sim. Viva DWI!

[Dinglesberry]

Since I started getting somewhat ok at stepmania, now I only list to Plunderphonics high bpm pseudo breakcore breakbeat mixes

[Celirra]

So all jokes aside does anyone have any nifty ideas?

[Mahou]

Not really.

[sunn0glasses]

i was hoping someone would build off what i said before

here's an idea: corporate sponsorship - get sponsored by monster energy and go pro, profit etc

[Celirra]

Originally Posted by sunn0glasses

i was hoping someone would build off what i said before

here's an idea: corporate sponsorship - get sponsored by monster energy and go pro, profit etc

Wasn't sure how to expand off what you said earlier, it seemed pretty good to me. Again I'm not sure how we'd go about it.

MLG Stepmania would be neat, doesn't Osu! kinda have that going already though?

[Mahou]

Originally Posted by sunn0glasses

here's an idea: corporate sponsorship - get sponsored by monster energy and go pro, profit etc

Lol.

[lofty rhino]

Make the arrows pumpkin-spice flavored.

[EtienneSM]

Stepmania is not going to grow that significantly as a community, I think we should just accept that already. We should focus on getting an active community going if anything. So many players come and go but can't seem to hold on because they lose interest so quickly. Before we try to grow the community, we first have to prove we're even capable of withstanding a decent-sized community and keeping it consistent as possible. AGDQ basically did nothing for Stepmania, let's be real here. It benefited Staiain in terms of getting his subscribe button for twitch, more followers etc. And that's awesome but it just introduced people to the game rather than actually tried to get people to play it (Not trying to belittle his showcase, it was fine). But if the intent was to get the game around, then it did not fulfill said intent.



We don't need people forcing to get others into the game. Let them get into the game themselves if they find it that interesting. I could probably go into detail more but it's really pointless to be quite honest. This game will always be known as the game that everyone recognizes, but no one plays. And it will probably stay that way as long as this game's existence prevails.

[Dynam0]

Just be like me and play occasionally until you're 85

[choof]

play casually
there's practically zero way that people are going to play stepmania over o!m or even bms

[Reincarnate]

IMO:

Stepmania's success in the past was strongly correlated with the success of mainstream games like DDR and Guitar Hero. But that's only because it was considered a sort of novelty at the time.

Most people at this point have tried it, and if it didn't hold their interest then, it isn't likely to do so now.

The skill level of the people who've stuck with the game has also risen significantly to the point where new players are probably going to get too discouraged to even bother. It's fun to play with a community that is growing alongside you, but if you're on your own, it's a lonely road of catch-up. People will simply lose motivation and interest.

Besides, a game that is very laptop/desktop-centric is at a disadvantage compared to the recent trends of mobile phone / console gaming. Platform strategies that may have worked in 2008 may not be as effective now.

The fact that there isn't a good built-in multiplayer / server type thing for Stepmania this late in the game is also a major letdown.

It's also not noob-friendly in the slightest. If you're a first-timer, you have to figure out what to read, figure out what to install, how to install it, how to trouble-shoot it, where to get songs, which songs are of good quality, etc... or you can say fuck it and go find something on Steam/PS4/XBox/etc that you can just launch and play immediately.

Overall, Stepmania has a lot of factors working against it, and I don't see any efforts being directed into any of those factors. Maybe I'm wrong on that, but it's just what I see.

Unless there is $omehow a plan to get a $hitload of work done, you're better off stimulating the community you already have. Focus more on retention rather than expansion, IMO.

[V-Ormix]

stepmania the movie:

some one would have to go on a crusade to plug sm in movies/pop culture media in such a way that makes people think gr9 movie but what the fuc were those people playing in that one scene? was that ddr with der fingerz?

staiain def is at the forefront on twitch with sm, but would be nice to get more keyboard warriors to tour the country with their lap tops and have strategic places/events to show up at and play around people... maybe even make a live skit around it xD or go to bars and bet people stupid money that they can't beat u to a duel 8u

iunno just wishful thinking but some one with unimaginably even more free time and finance to do some of these things would have to be really driven :v

[SKG_Scintill]

I forgot Make Touhou Great Again

[Celirra]

Originally Posted by EtienneSM

Stepmania is not going to grow that significantly as a community, I think we should just accept that already. We should focus on getting an active community going if anything. So many players come and go but can't seem to hold on because they lose interest so quickly.

[...]

This game will always be known as the game that everyone recognizes, but no one plays. And it will probably stay that way as long as this game's existence prevails.

Nah I know the community isn't going to grow into a massive behemoth, I think we all accept that. I think the crux of the issue is about whether people losing interest so quickly is mostly due to the game, the genre, or other elements here or there (whatever that may be). Obviously, if it's either of the two former points, then there's not much or anything that can be changed at all. But if there are some other things either deterring or that can be changed to keep people stuck in, I see no harm pursuing them; not for the sake of exponential growth, but to reach a sustainable amount of new players coming in.

Originally Posted by choof

play casually
there's practically zero way that people are going to play stepmania over o!m or even bms

Many of us play SM over o!m or bms or [insert VSRG here], whether it be due to SM filling a niche, or us being too deadset on our old ways. There's appeal here I think and with it comes potential.

Originally Posted by Reincarnate

[...]
The skill level of the people who've stuck with the game has also risen significantly to the point where new players are probably going to get too discouraged to even bother. It's fun to play with a community that is growing alongside you, but if you're on your own, it's a lonely road of catch-up. People will simply lose motivation and interest.

Besides, a game that is very laptop/desktop-centric is at a disadvantage compared to the recent trends of mobile phone / console gaming. Platform strategies that may have worked in 2008 may not be as effective now.

The fact that there isn't a good built-in multiplayer / server type thing for Stepmania this late in the game is also a major letdown.

It's also not noob-friendly in the slightest. If you're a first-timer, you have to figure out what to read, figure out what to install, how to install it, how to trouble-shoot it, where to get songs, which songs are of good quality, etc... or you can say fuck it and go find something on Steam/PS4/XBox/etc that you can just launch and play immediately.

[...]

Unless there is $omehow a plan to get a $hitload of work done, you're better off stimulating the community you already have. Focus more on retention rather than expansion, IMO.

Apologies for generalizing so much, but just for the sake of simplicity, main factors as you listed:
1) difficulty curve issues/discouraging and lonely to improve on own
I think this is one of the main factors that would be very difficult to change, since it primarily relies on a huge bulk of new players starting at roughly the same time, and them building a sort of community around themselves. I agree that there's not much we can do for this.
2) Laptop-based rather than mobile
I never even considered this but it's definitely true sadly. Though speaking of which, there seem to be a sizable amount of people who play VSRGs on mobile devices so at least the genre isn't dead.
3) Built-in multiplayer functionality
Definitely on devs or programmers in the community to decide whether this is really worth their time. I'm sure it would help a lot, but in a world where everyone is at very different skill levels online might not even be great or worth it most of the time.
4) Noob-friendliness
So I think this is something we can actually work on as a community; I think it's been mentioned before but having more starting songs that are high quality, having a decent textdump somewhere that's easy to find and access, etc.
Agree on the retention over expansion to an extent.

Originally Posted by V-Ormix

staiain def is at the forefront on twitch with sm, but would be nice to get more keyboard warriors to tour the country with their lap tops and have strategic places/events to show up at and play around people... maybe even make a live skit around it xD or go to bars and bet people stupid money that they can't beat u to a duel 8u

I'd say in an ideal world at least one of these things would happen, stepmania betting sounds pretty neat.

[SKG_Scintill]

Originally Posted by Celirra

stepmania betting sounds pretty neat.

no

[Jousway]

Originally Posted by EtienneSM

AGDQ basically did nothing for Stepmania, let's be real here. It benefited Staiain in terms of getting his subscribe button for twitch, more followers etc. And that's awesome but it just introduced people to the game rather than actually tried to get people to play it (Not trying to belittle his showcase, it was fine).

ton of new users started to play sm after his showcase, even on reddit atm a ton of new users are like "hey I saw staiain play" even till this day, sounds to me you're just jelly B)