TWG Turbo 35: A Small Gathering [GAME THREAD]

[mellon_collie]

Originally Posted by leetic

So I'm assuming you're not Seer?

If you aren't gonna answer this question, I will switch my vote to you

This post especially is really really bad in hindsight

[leetic]

Originally Posted by mellon_collie

I just mean that since I know my own alignment, I know that the final count looks like
XelNya - 4 (leetic, Roundbox, XelNya, Raeko)

leetic is the only unknown there for me.

And you have to consider that, if you're town, from your perspective it's only a 25% chance that I am the wolf here because nobody off the wagon has flipped. Unless you think that going for XelNya over roundbox or Zenith was particularly wolfy, but eh

[_Zenith_]

Originally Posted by leetic

That's basically what NKA is though, and I have caught a few wolves from that alone. It's more the other side, when instead of asking "who would have motivation to kill roundbox?" I'm asking "who would have the least motivation to kill roundbox?"

I would actually care to discuss it more post-game if I'm being frank

I think the weight of the benefit from doing so is lost in a solo wolf game

[leetic]

Originally Posted by mellon_collie

what does this mean?

Some of Zenith's posts would be really bold for a solo wolf to do, as they attract attention for little gain (the push on me for instance) while you seem mostly content to stick to the background here. It's balanced out by a good portion of Zenith's posts being wolf-motivated while less so for you, but I guess we'll find out when Zenith makes this large post they've been supposedly working on

[leetic]

Originally Posted by _Zenith_

I would actually care to discuss it more post-game if I'm being frank

I think the weight of the benefit from doing so is lost in a solo wolf game

Solo game actually makes it more usable as you don't have to worry about partner dynamics. Still, I do agree that it's usually better to get a pattern of kills before holding any conclusions from them to a high degree of certainty.

[_Zenith_]

From my perspective and where I'm at right now:

Mellon (green lean)
Lar (green lean)
Leetic (greenish lean)
Haze (wolf)



Mellon is getting the green lean from me because of the general vibe I'm getting from experience playing with her, and it shows it posts like

Originally Posted by mellon_collie

How can you be right without information? The point of the game is to gather information over time and make connections. It's great to be right on gut instinct but that's not a very reliable method of catching wolves

And if he is acting wolfy anyways why wouldn't you go for that?

and this was her read on Lar at the time of post, which is very similar to how I've seen Lar so far

Originally Posted by mellon_collie

He's just playing like how he would normally play and I don't see anything suspicious. Making points about lots of different things and doesn't seem like he's pushing any specific agenda

I disagree with this post, our seer's opinion on where we should look today has the same weight as XelNya, the other town player that died, concreted by there never being additional info from a seer result and him not surviving to act as a clear. If you're going to operate on this logic, you should really also consider what Xel was doing.

Originally Posted by mellon_collie

I think focusing on our dead seer's reads is important but I like this read too :thinking:

This was a town post to me

Originally Posted by mellon_collie

This seems overly complex for what to me seems like a pretty simple situation

I think roundbox was the obvious kill there, otherwise the wolf would be making more work for themself. Even if he was blocked every night, the wolf will have to deal with him in thread and that seems way too powerful for a wolf to just leave someone with if they can kill them instead. They would have had to work around an obvious clear player which is way harder to do than just getting rid of him.

idk but I don't think we can really read much into that kill. I think everybody here can agree that nobody in this game but especially roundbox would not have claimed seer as town, so we all knew he was telling the truth, he was dead no matter who the wolf is



I mean it does make it more convenient when we are not both playing at the same time ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ But lol no I wouldn't do that. I'd kill him no problem, but there would be a reason!

Lars is more town for me and probably stronger of a town lean than raeko is:

Originally Posted by MixMasterLar

Didnt mean to be gone so long, did family stuff after Captain D's, basically kicked everyone's assess at Bust A Move/Puzzle Bobble 2




Oh yeah I do remember you. I was Raeko's backup and followed the game. The CFD at the end was crazy but honestly it's her fault for not being more active

❤️ You Raeko


LMFAO ok man invite

This is try-hard for the first phase and what content we have but probably a townie try-hard. Leetic is a newish player IIRC and I think this is them not knowing where to go in the game. A wolf chat would probably soak up idle thoughts like this so it

Also Leetic is my check so like, obviously reading as town

Speaking of which any of the vets thinking that HypoCop is fishy here can go bellyflop on a jellyfish. If you're new and don't know what that means then note I said -if- and keep moving.





"Hey Raeko just like message me when I start getting votes k thx"

Oh God



As a rule this is true
There are some exceptions but generally I never regret voting out the slackers on the early phases



It was a shit post, a funny way to start the phase

I've seen towns, wolves, third party fractions, and co-hosts do it over the years



Had my hopes up
Sorta agree on the Zenith read but don't want to just have you come in only after being voted and only really pushing the one who made the vote, if you feel me

So I want to take note that this is a doubled down effort on a seer claim, which as we know Lars isn't the seer, but doubling down and possibly protecting the seer at such an early point in the game kind of really steers him into he has towns best interests in sight.

Originally Posted by MixMasterLar

Overall actually pleased there's some real discussion in the game right now

I think I'll be honest and state that I feel I can read Xel better in later phases, and voting for him this early just feels like I would only do so to make a point against his subpar play

Which I'm not above doing, like screw dipping out on a phase, but we only get so many games a seasons these days I hate to not play to win

This also may be the most genuine town post in the entire thread

Running through MMLs iso and I haven't seen anything to put here that was worth commenting about in a negative way, I'm pretty good about MML being strong town here.



Leetic is someone I have concerns about, mainly the concern that I might regret putting him into my town circle because he fits in everyone elses and I still have fear that a good wolf could actually be the most active in game and win it, and it has felt stronger because of EoD but not stronger in this phase so far. If I had to claim a read it's probably a PoE town lean.

Isolating Leetic is really a chore, we already know half of his posts are returning questions after someone makes any sort of individual thought so taking that as it is, he's engaged and is top poster. There's nothing glaringly suspicious to latch onto, maybe some takes and thoughts that others have chimed in on already, I just have had this horrible gnawing feeling this game could see a very active wolf and I'm nervous of the reality in which Leetic is it so I'm reserved while also noting that there is credible game solving and effort through Leetic which I can accept and give him that town lean. Really like... SK vibes you know?

Originally Posted by Haze with a Z

I thought you all were implying they were wolf for it and it feels like blindly voting them is the same as rng.

At this point in the game, Haze is just an obviously newer player and most the interactions up to this point aren't opinions or takes, it is reactions and questions. I think we're missing something with Haze and I think they're a bit UTR in comparison to the rest of us.

Originally Posted by Haze with a Z

My current solution is that wolves are less likely to want to talk to me so I am going to vote people who don’t talk to me.

This is such a "huh" post for me, the interactions after are a bit odd. This is post #217, a couple people interacted with it, some of us didn't and it actually drew some iffy vibes from Haze. I think this was the moment where Haze felt like they had attention on them and tried to shrug it off by continually being "lost".

Originally Posted by Haze with a Z

I doubt you’d like my alternative vote any better tbh

This post into this next post

Originally Posted by Haze with a Z

unvote

Tbh I kinda just feel obligated to vote and now I feel like I’m messing up others by voting and that it would be better to wait til later

I don't like a VT that isn't confident, and that's what I'm seeing here. Instead of trying to convince roundbox that the vote on me was worthy or even okay to consider, he defeats himself and then stops voting altogether, which thankfully other people came in and commented on why doing that would be a bad idea but this happening doesn't make me feel good about Haze.

Originally Posted by Haze with a Z

Everyone is being contradictory. I’ll vote at :30

Again just very weird





I think I'm comfortable in parking my vote on Haze, perhaps even throughout EoD, though I would listen to anyone's thoughts and other cases here. I think the combination of the being newer, can kind of latch onto someone else for cover rather easily, and a less informed kill on roundbox (this is purely my opinion here, I do not expect any of you to follow me with this logic) here points me more in the direction of seeing Haze's slot go. I also think comparing everyone left, I'm left with a much stronger town vibe within Leetic/Raeko/MML than I do replacing any one of them with Haze. Maybe a better way of putting it is I have less anxiety that I'm getting played here with Haze which is what I'm concerned about and this would be the most influential outcome for me and my thoughts at this time.

[leetic]

Originally Posted by mellon_collie

This post especially is really really bad in hindsight

Is it though? We avoided mislynching them

[mellon_collie]

Originally Posted by leetic

Is it though? We avoided mislynching them

who cares? he was forced to claim and killed in the night. He might as well have died there. You could have voted for him and maybe I would have removed my vote, anything could have happened but you chose to pressure him to claim multiple times

Yes it's really really bad

[leetic]

Originally Posted by _Zenith_

From my perspective and where I'm at right now:

Mellon (green lean)
Lar (green lean)
Leetic (greenish lean)
Haze (wolf)



Mellon is getting the green lean from me because of the general vibe I'm getting from experience playing with her, and it shows it posts like



and this was her read on Lar at the time of post, which is very similar to how I've seen Lar so far



I disagree with this post, our seer's opinion on where we should look today has the same weight as XelNya, the other town player that died, concreted by there never being additional info from a seer result and him not surviving to act as a clear. If you're going to operate on this logic, you should really also consider what Xel was doing.



This was a town post to me




Lars is more town for me and probably stronger of a town lean than raeko is:



So I want to take note that this is a doubled down effort on a seer claim, which as we know Lars isn't the seer, but doubling down and possibly protecting the seer at such an early point in the game kind of really steers him into he has towns best interests in sight.



This also may be the most genuine town post in the entire thread

Running through MMLs iso and I haven't seen anything to put here that was worth commenting about in a negative way, I'm pretty good about MML being strong town here.



Leetic is someone I have concerns about, mainly the concern that I might regret putting him into my town circle because he fits in everyone elses and I still have fear that a good wolf could actually be the most active in game and win it, and it has felt stronger because of EoD but not stronger in this phase so far. If I had to claim a read it's probably a PoE town lean.

Isolating Leetic is really a chore, we already know half of his posts are returning questions after someone makes any sort of individual thought so taking that as it is, he's engaged and is top poster. There's nothing glaringly suspicious to latch onto, maybe some takes and thoughts that others have chimed in on already, I just have had this horrible gnawing feeling this game could see a very active wolf and I'm nervous of the reality in which Leetic is it so I'm reserved while also noting that there is credible game solving and effort through Leetic which I can accept and give him that town lean. Really like... SK vibes you know?



At this point in the game, Haze is just an obviously newer player and most the interactions up to this point aren't opinions or takes, it is reactions and questions. I think we're missing something with Haze and I think they're a bit UTR in comparison to the rest of us.



This is such a "huh" post for me, the interactions after are a bit odd. This is post #217, a couple people interacted with it, some of us didn't and it actually drew some iffy vibes from Haze. I think this was the moment where Haze felt like they had attention on them and tried to shrug it off by continually being "lost".



This post into this next post



I don't like a VT that isn't confident, and that's what I'm seeing here. Instead of trying to convince roundbox that the vote on me was worthy or even okay to consider, he defeats himself and then stops voting altogether, which thankfully other people came in and commented on why doing that would be a bad idea but this happening doesn't make me feel good about Haze.



Again just very weird





I think I'm comfortable in parking my vote on Haze, perhaps even throughout EoD, though I would listen to anyone's thoughts and other cases here. I think the combination of the being newer, can kind of latch onto someone else for cover rather easily, and a less informed kill on roundbox (this is purely my opinion here, I do not expect any of you to follow me with this logic) here points me more in the direction of seeing Haze's slot go. I also think comparing everyone left, I'm left with a much stronger town vibe within Leetic/Raeko/MML than I do replacing any one of them with Haze. Maybe a better way of putting it is I have less anxiety that I'm getting played here with Haze which is what I'm concerned about and this would be the most influential outcome for me and my thoughts at this time.

Haze is a bit of a bold target, even if it's a teensie bit of an OMGUS. I do have them as lean town but a lot of that is more on other's interactions on them so I would like to hear more on your case. I'd like to hear your thoughts on the Haze/Raeko dynamic, as I can see a world where one is pocketing the other.

[mellon_collie]

Originally Posted by _Zenith_

Isolating Leetic is really a chore, we already know half of his posts are returning questions after someone makes any sort of individual thought so taking that as it is, he's engaged and is top poster. There's nothing glaringly suspicious to latch onto, maybe some takes and thoughts that others have chimed in on already, I just have had this horrible gnawing feeling this game could see a very active wolf and I'm nervous of the reality in which Leetic is it so I'm reserved while also noting that there is credible game solving and effort through Leetic which I can accept and give him that town lean. Really like... SK vibes you know?

SK vibes... hmmmmmmmmmmmm

Makes sense in a game with only one wolf

I have similar feelings about leetic in many ways

[leetic]

Originally Posted by mellon_collie

who cares? he was forced to claim and killed in the night. He might as well have died there. You could have voted for him and maybe I would have removed my vote, anything could have happened but you chose to pressure him to claim multiple times

Yes it's really really bad

And if I voted him he'd be near insta lol. XelNya is an easier loss than whoever would have been killed in the world we mislynched roundbox anyway.

[leetic]

Originally Posted by mellon_collie

SK vibes... hmmmmmmmmmmmm

Makes sense in a game with only one wolf

I have similar feelings about leetic in many ways

Funny thing is last game I was an SK and actually won lol. Having played and won both, SK play is very different to solo wolf play, as for the former you have to play a midground game the whole way through while in the latter you have a bit more freedom.

[mellon_collie]

Originally Posted by leetic

And if I voted him he'd be near insta lol. XelNya is an easier loss than whoever would have been killed in the world we mislynched roundbox anyway.

near insta is not insta. what happened instead was the chaos of everyone scrambling because of a claim

Usually when you have a PR in a game you let them do their thing and just don't even talk about it in the thread at all, don't plant seeds of paranoia in their head or threaten them with votes if they don't claim near EOD....

[leetic]

Originally Posted by mellon_collie

near insta is not insta. what happened instead was the chaos of everyone scrambling because of a claim

Usually when you have a PR in a game you let them do their thing and just don't even talk about it in the thread at all, don't plant seeds of paranoia in their head or threaten them with votes if they don't claim near EOD....

If you're town and right about your read on MML a wolf could've hammered. And no, letting a PR get mislynched is not an acceptable outcome, if we're gonna lose them anyway we should at least take someone out of the PoE with them.

[leetic]

Originally Posted by mellon_collie

I'm sorry ;_; I don't really have any better ideas and Lar is my top town read

I still don't hate a Zenith vote or a Xel vote

It does seem like you're trying to downplay your involvement with the EoD events. I mean, after this post, what exactly did you do?

[_Zenith_]

Originally Posted by leetic

Haze is a bit of a bold target, even if it's a teensie bit of an OMGUS. I do have them as lean town but a lot of that is more on other's interactions on them so I would like to hear more on your case. I'd like to hear your thoughts on the Haze/Raeko dynamic, as I can see a world where one is pocketing the other.

Strange, maybe cause it's you you were omitting the possibility but I think he's pocketing you way more than he's pocketing Raeko

Raeko is typically a generally helpful individual so I can see newer players gravitating towards her, even unsure players too for similar reasons



Right now my main commitment on Haze is that I think Haze slot being hit here opens the door for town to peek into where true motives for the wolf would operate and land us in the position we are in (assuming that Haze is a town hit here). I think Haze could be a UTR wolf that got the utr pass from not making stances and latching onto other people while people that are talking right now are being looked at harder than he is.

[mellon_collie]

Originally Posted by leetic

If you're town and right about your read on MML a wolf could've hammered. And no, letting a PR get mislynched is not an acceptable outcome, if we're gonna lose them anyway we should at least take someone out of the PoE with them.

why would a wolf hammer if roundbox hadn't claimed?

I sincerely don't think roundbox would have claimed if you hadn't been so pressuring. Yes he was on the chopping block, but it was you making that threat with your vote if he didn't claim that he felt forced his hand

[mellon_collie]

Originally Posted by _Zenith_

Strange, maybe cause it's you you were omitting the possibility but I think he's pocketing you way more than he's pocketing Raeko

Raeko is typically a generally helpful individual so I can see newer players gravitating towards her, even unsure players too for similar reasons



Right now my main commitment on Haze is that I think Haze slot being hit here opens the door for town to peek into where true motives for the wolf would operate and land us in the position we are in (assuming that Haze is a town hit here). I think Haze could be a UTR wolf that got the utr pass from not making stances and latching onto other people while people that are talking right now are being looked at harder than he is.

This is fair, I did give Haze a pass for it being his first game on FFR and because we played in the MU champs game together last year. That might be where the pocket-y feeling comes from, though I was pretty open about doing that

It is possible that Haze kinda slipped through my sights because I keep giving him a pass for that and finding other suspicious above him

[mellon_collie]

Originally Posted by leetic

It does seem like you're trying to downplay your involvement with the EoD events. I mean, after this post, what exactly did you do?

I reacted as best I could to what was happening? when roundbox claimed I switched my vote to his vote because I believed his claim. That's about it idk what else I was supposed to do

[Haze with a Z]

Hi I’m here sorry for being asleep for a while.

I gotta multitask til I finish human geo hw due at the same time but then I’ll move to my iPad