Suicide.

[mhss1992]

Originally Posted by Reincarnate

darkshark: This description actually applies to me. I've always had some sort of emotional/physical struggle going on -- my mom abandoned the family and my father was killed. I had friends, but in many cases, they were surface-level -- and my true friends were few in number. I also went into a fairly large debt (luckily I am able to afford it with my job and everything) because of the stuff that went on with my family. Friends may be present, but they may be too uninvolved or scared to GET involved. They may not be able to really provide much solace. Counselors may come across as mere venting-receptacles. Even if you reach out to those closest to you, sometimes it just isn't enough.

I've contemplated suicide a few times, to be honest -- but in recent years, those thoughts have gone away as I've gained more friends, a girlfriend, a new life, an education, revisited hobbies, etc. Life is good again.

During those dark times when I've felt alone and burdened, suicide felt like a VERY attractive, viable option. When you feel very alone in the world with nobody who can empathize with your way of thinking -- or when everything in your life seems to be out of your control and going downhill -- it can be very tempting to just put an end to your misery, especially if it's chronic. But the thing that kept me from ever doing it was the notion that pressures are often temporary. Whenever things get dark, they always get better later if you are willing to reach out and either get help or work to improve your situation in some way.

Wow.
I guess those difficulties somehow made you overcompensate to become what you are today, right?

My past was considerably less difficult. Just lots of bullies, bullies, bullies and no friends. I still have to deal with my crazy mother, though. Nowadays, I still have a certain trauma of hearing people laugh behind me (even though they're almost never laughing at me) and feel humiliated very easily when people are better than me in some way. Anyway... I don't even know why I'm telling you this.
I never thought about committing suicide, though.

[5.points]

Originally Posted by mhss1992

How exactly does that not qualify into the things I described?
She decided to commit duicide because she believed that there was no hope left, thinking it was pointless to keep trying.

What I was trying to say is there are understandable reasons. In your post when you say how suicides are when people see their pain as not worth enduring and it's pretty much from "stupid reasons" you seem to not understand when kind of pain these people go through.

I completely agree that a fair share of suicides are from people who give up easily, but humans can only take so much pain, sometimes suicide can seem so tempting. Its something you wont understand until you actually get that low.

[mhss1992]

Originally Posted by 5.points

What I was trying to say is there are understandable reasons. In your post when you say how suicides are when people see their pain as not worth enduring and it's pretty much from "stupid reasons" you seem to not understand when kind of pain these people go through.

I completely agree that a fair share of suicides are from people who give up easily, but humans can only take so much pain, sometimes suicide can seem so tempting. Its something you wont understand until you actually get that low.

Suicide is the easy choice. I believe it's always possible to improve the situation somehow... Unless I became tetraplegic. I guess I'd rather die in this particular case. That doesn't mean it isn't a stupid decision, though... Who knows what one could still intellectually achieve in this situation?

Originally Posted by Yieldsign

and here's my stance:

regardless of whether or not suicide is selfish, it is always acceptable/permissible, and our legislation should reflect that. in the end, there is only one person who has control over his own life, and that is himself.

i think the implications of prohibiting suicide are frightening. you're essentially legislating "psychological harm" which is, at least for NOW, far too dubious and arbitrary to incorporate into law in such a manner.

I have to agree.

However, there are some bad circumstances... What if the person wants to commit suicide due to some crazy religious belief or some lie other people convinced them of? What if they're at a really altered mental state when they make this decision? They could look back (if still alive) and realize how absurd it was.

It's not a simple matter...

[BethanyBangs]

People commit suicide because there's something in their life that's bothering them, and they probably feel that they can't tell anyone about it.

An example is my stepsister, she was depressed for a while, and she didn't text me for days when she was at her mom's house. Weeks when she came back she told me she tried to kill herself. That she took about 30 painkillers and passed out. Threw up and peed blood. But she didn't die. So i guess it wasn't her time..

And i think it is selfish. Because they don't think about the people that care for them.
Just my honest opinion.

[5.points]

Originally Posted by mhss1992

Suicide is the easy choice. I believe it's always possible to improve the situation somehow... Unless I became tetraplegic. I guess I'd rather die in this particular case. That doesn't mean it isn't a stupid decision, though... Who knows what one could still intellectually achieve in this situation?

It's unlikely that you'll achieve anything intellectual while addicted to narcotics and nothing to your name.

I completely agree with what you're saying, you just don't seem to be looking at all the circumstances. You say you would rather die then be tetraplegic? That's exactly what I was saying.

[mhss1992]

Originally Posted by 5.points

It's unlikely that you'll achieve anything intellectual while addicted to narcotics and nothing to your name.

Yeah, well, I was talking about the tetraplegic case.

[Izzy]

Your life is your own. Being able to choose for yourself what you want to do with your life should be your own freedom.

[5.points]

Originally Posted by mhss1992

Yeah, well, I was talking about the tetraplegic case.

But it's still unlikely that you would even survive in the case which I stated.

Also, in the case I stated, starting the addiction was the "stupid decision", suicide was the result.

[who_cares973]

When is suicide "acceptable"? Where do we draw the line?

im pretty sure this has been mentioned already but if not then this is what i think

when the pain caused by living outweighs the negative effects on loved ones that would be caused by that persons death. when this point is reached that is when imo someone contemplate suicide. so say someone has had horrible luck, causing strain in the families relationship with one another and also becoming a financial burden to the people that person loved. in the persons mind thinking about all this they could come to the conclusion that everyone would be better of if that person was dead. after these initial suicidal thoughts it would really only take one more misfortune to tip the scale causing that person to commit suicide. so going with this i dont think suicide is selfish just a wrong mindset when analyzing problems

[DossarLX ODI]

A question for you guys: What's so bad about being alone? I personally like quiet time by myself. In fact, living a life of solitude with internet is all I need - "going outside" with friends (read: acquaintances) for me is just a waste of time since it's not really fun and sometimes they just like to drink and smoke.

Do you guys like quiet time by yourselves? Why would being alone make you depressed? Technically I'm alone practically all the time except when I'm in school or there's something my parents want me to do or some other event like a vacation - I'm in my room reading, resting, doing bicep exercises, on the laptop, homework, whatever else. I don't have any true friends in real life to talk to but I am not depressed/lonely. If anything, online is where all my REAL friends are at, and even then that's only a few.

[who_cares973]

you have friends online. while you may not be with people physically you still arent alone. its when you feel like you have no one at all that depression kicks in and suicide thoughts linger in your head

[Without A Contraceptive]

Originally Posted by DossarLX ODI

A question for you guys: What's so bad about being alone? I personally like quiet time by myself. In fact, living a life of solitude with internet is all I need - "going outside" with friends (read: acquaintances) for me is just a waste of time since it's not really fun and sometimes they just like to drink and smoke.

Do you guys like quiet time by yourselves? Why would being alone make you depressed? Technically I'm alone practically all the time except when I'm in school or there's something my parents want me to do or some other event like a vacation - I'm in my room reading, resting, doing bicep exercises, on the laptop, homework, whatever else. I don't have any true friends in real life to talk to but I am not depressed/lonely. If anything, online is where all my REAL friends are at, and even then that's only a few.

on the real tho, theres nothing wrong with enjoying being alone. i spend a lot of time alone. i like to zone out making music alone, eat at restaurants alone, watch tv alone, etc.. doesnt mean i dont enjoy my friends tho, god damn. get real du, get some friends. drinking and smoking are parts of life. sack up and have a drink

[Shikari]

Originally Posted by DossarLX ODI

A question for you guys: What's so bad about being alone?

None, when you don't need someone to cheer you up. And, sometimes, it's hard to do it by yourself.


Edit:

Originally Posted by Glucuronolactone

Where did the "thinking" in this thread go?

Suicide is still an uncomfortable topic, as you can see in the divergences of opinions here, so the "thinking" goes in (trying to) come up with a rational answer for this. Plenty of people here know someone who commited suicide, so it's normal for them to try understand what's up with a suicide's mind.



Btw, I know your question was ironic, but my reply is here anyway.

[qqwref]

Originally Posted by Yieldsign

what a disgustingly boring, apathetic, and meaningless life.

Right. It's boring to do something you enjoy if other people aren't physically there while you do it, and nothing is more meaningful than smoking, drinking, and sharing small talk. And of course, no skills or knowledge you acquire on the internet could ever be worth anything.

[Yieldsign]

Originally Posted by qqwref

Right. It's boring to do something you enjoy if other people aren't physically there while you do it, and nothing is more meaningful than smoking, drinking, and sharing small talk. And of course, no skills or knowledge you acquire on the internet could ever be worth anything.

yeah because the only things you can do with other people are drinking and smoking and small talk it's not like people find love and connect with other people on a deep level or anything

seriously **** that whole "inter human experience" thing it's totally worthless when you can just sit around on the computer all day playing arrow games and making posts on a forum on topics that don't apply to yourself because you don't have a real life

seriously, i have to say that you're either lying to yourself or joking when you condone that. it's one thing to be somewhat solitary; i am extremely solitary and require a lot of alone time. it's another thing to keep yourself cooped inside hunched over a computer denying the basic human instinct for relations with other people.

[TC_Halogen]

Originally Posted by DossarLX ODI

A question for you guys: What's so bad about being alone? I personally like quiet time by myself. In fact, living a life of solitude with internet is all I need - "going outside" with friends (read: acquaintances) for me is just a waste of time since it's not really fun and sometimes they just like to drink and smoke.

Do you guys like quiet time by yourselves? Why would being alone make you depressed? Technically I'm alone practically all the time except when I'm in school or there's something my parents want me to do or some other event like a vacation - I'm in my room reading, resting, doing bicep exercises, on the laptop, homework, whatever else. I don't have any true friends in real life to talk to but I am not depressed/lonely. If anything, online is where all my REAL friends are at, and even then that's only a few.

Your definition of loneliness doesn't quite fit the typical desolation of being -truly- alone. As you've said, you use the computer/internet as an escape from those who differ from your own opinions, morals, hobbies, etc. The issue in question here is those who truly have no one to turn to simply because no one can comprehend the obstacles that their life entails, and discussion of it would be pointless because of the lack of understanding. You also have those who don't want to share their issues due to insecurities within themselves, which adds even more of an issue because even the closest of people might question you for something you do.

A person spending their spare time to better themselves (as Marcus had mentioned before) will do them better in the long run because they're striving for something that will eventually bring them to a better position. If you're alone when doing your typical hobbies, it's alright because not everyone shares the same interests as you and no one is expected to do as much. However, if the issue becomes a lack of understanding of others (almost like an implied excommunication with the rest of the world), it could be a lot more problematic.

EDIT:

Originally Posted by Yieldsign

yeah because the only things you can do with other people are drinking and smoking and small talk it's not like people find love and connect with other people on a deep level or anything

seriously **** that whole "inter human experience" thing it's totally worthless when you can just sit around on the computer all day playing arrow games and making posts on a forum on topics that don't apply to yourself because you don't have a real life

seriously, i have to say that you're either lying to yourself or joking when you condone that. it's one thing to be somewhat solitary; i am extremely solitary and require a lot of alone time. it's another thing to keep yourself cooped inside hunched over a computer denying the basic human instinct for relations with other people.

As aggressively put as this is, I do have to agree with this somewhat. Entirely relying on artificial communication rather than physical communication will not entirely rid of your problems, but it may serve as a temporary escape from the problems, which is all someone needs to get themselves in the right direction (or, alternatively, just prolong the inevitable).

[Rubin0]

Survival is the most basic instinct of every living organism. If you think of it from the perspective of a person who is suffering from deep and chronic depression, survival may be too painful, so in their mind suicide is a kind of survival through death. When our limbs become too infected to function, we remove them. If a mind is attacking the body, constantly infecting the body with negativity, the only way to save himself/herself is to stop the brain from functioning.

[Reincarnate]

Originally Posted by DossarLX ODI

A question for you guys: What's so bad about being alone? I personally like quiet time by myself. In fact, living a life of solitude with internet is all I need - "going outside" with friends (read: acquaintances) for me is just a waste of time since it's not really fun and sometimes they just like to drink and smoke.

Do you guys like quiet time by yourselves? Why would being alone make you depressed? Technically I'm alone practically all the time except when I'm in school or there's something my parents want me to do or some other event like a vacation - I'm in my room reading, resting, doing bicep exercises, on the laptop, homework, whatever else. I don't have any true friends in real life to talk to but I am not depressed/lonely. If anything, online is where all my REAL friends are at, and even then that's only a few.

Here's the thing -- humans are social creatures. We've evolved that way -- we feel happier and are generally more successful at any metric we choose when we're with others. Especially if you read Gladwell's book Outliers, it's all the more apparent that nobody ever makes it alone.

Of course, there's a difference between living an introverted/solitary lifestyle and being alone. You can live a solitary lifestyle and still have people to talk to when you wish -- people who can help you. When you're suffering alone, you have no one else to help you but yourself. You may even have friends you can talk to, but none of them may be close enough to really empathize with you. This can be a problem if a mind is so lost and confused that it justifies/talks itself into an irrational framework that ultimately results in suicide.

I don't think there's anything unhealthy about having friends online, but you also have to keep in mind that online communities are temporary. People come and go -- and eventually leave for good. I've been a member of plenty of online communities, but the people I encounter are only a part of my communicable life for a few years. It's hard to make "good friends" in such a small time. Are you okay with the notion of temporary friendships?

[Mechablob]

(Sorry if what I'm about to say has already been suggested in this thread) It's obviously a difficult subject to discuss: people are going to think those that have committed, or tried to commit suicide are selfish, however, you can easily claim that those that want the person suffering with depression to not kill themself is also selfish. I can understand why people may feel both concepts are selfish - why would somebody want to lower the morale of their family and friends; why would somebody want another person to live on suffering (be the reason to the suicide depression or a terminal illness)?

When you consider both of these, it's difficult to conclude if suicide is selfish or not - well, I think so anyway. Maybe one side should be more accepting of whatever course is taken?

Maybe the depressed person has no other worthwhile contacts? Let's assume the family have all passed away and that the friendships have disbanded (I'm taking into consideration what UnkownMan has said) - surely that isn't the end as that allows many opportunities (meeting new people and join different communities, for example). I am aware that the temptation of not trying to achieve anything may seem strong, but as the clichéd saying goes - and it's cliché due to popularity and relevance, not just because it's "naff" - "there's light at the end of the tunnel."

[jchinzilla]

Originally Posted by Rubin0

If a mind is attacking the body, constantly infecting the body with negativity, the only way to save himself/herself is to stop the brain from functioning.

that is not the only way. the brain is said to have plasticity, meaning that it's flexible in its ability to change and adapt to new/different modes of thinking.

what i would like to say is that most of us are too busy in comparing ourselves to others. we think "if i only had more money i could finally do so-and-so," or "if i had a lover i could experience such joy." while there is nothing truly wrong about these desires there is something screwy to me about needing more things/people just to experience some fleeting gratification.

and that's what should be realized: that everything is fleeting, it will pass, everything is impermanent excluding the constant flow of stillness. OKAY so that was my cliche amalgamation of trite platitudes resulting in redundancy. however, i still stand by this realization (it is not my own - people have been giving this message for millennia)

ANYWAYS, i'm not sure what else i should say at the moment but just know that it is possible to change how you look at the phenomena that surrounds us all