TWG CLX If Emblem was a bad employee Game Thread

[andy-o24]

Re: TWG CLX If Emblem was a bad employee Game Thread

Haven't really taken the time to read Haku yet, MML. That'll come eventually. This game is mentally exhausting.

-o24

[danceflashrevo]

Re: TWG CLX If Emblem was a bad employee Game Thread

First off, that's bullshit and you know it. He's piss easy to read.

I disagree but good for you I guess. @ soda: that looks really neat is it regional because I've never seen it o: @ reads: yeah d/w i'm still awake for the night. i need dinner #2 anyways because they had no rice and not much orange chicken left at panda ;;

[MixMasterLar]

Re: TWG CLX If Emblem was a bad employee Game Thread

Haven't really taken the time to read Haku yet, MML. That'll come eventually. This game is mentally exhausting.

-o24

Have you not been following the thread?
Did you seriously go up to bat for someone you hadn't "taken the time to read" yet?

Game is really exhausting though. Wouldn't be satisfying if it wasn't.

I disagree but good for you I guess. @ soda: that looks really neat is it regional because I've never seen it o: @ reads: yeah d/w i'm still awake for the night. i need dinner #2 anyways because they had no rice and not much orange chicken left at panda ;;

It's all up and down the East Coast for sure. Past that, I don't know. It is a small company

I look forward to a reads list. Meanwhile I am going to step away from the game for awhile.

[andy-o24]

Re: TWG CLX If Emblem was a bad employee Game Thread

If I hadn't been following the thread, I wouldn't have known Haku started posting with analysis instead of shitposts. What I meant was I hadn't really considered how to read Haku yet (scum, null, town). Classify is maybe better than read here?

-o24

[danceflashrevo]

Re: TWG CLX If Emblem was a bad employee Game Thread

Still rocking irrelevant stuff but I live in upstate South Carolina but haven't seen it :/

[Precarious]

Re: TWG CLX If Emblem was a bad employee Game Thread

Okay, finally caught up. I probably shouldn't have subbed in, because I started a new job this past week and my schedule has kind of been wrecked, but I'll make do. There's a lot of stuff that's happened today so far that's worth commenting on; I'll be posting on several things that caught my attention.

[danceflashrevo]

Re: TWG CLX If Emblem was a bad employee Game Thread

2) storn42 - Town.
3) Yoshl - The argument that I had with him was purely play style. I don't think he's indicative of anything from that. His actions in this game have seemed very townie because of the intent in the posts. He projects it very well.
4) wineandbread - I've liked his tone and his posts #901 and #1239. They seem pretty good, especially the second one. However he's been quieter than I would've expected but I'd still give him a pass. Town.
5) roundbox - Null. Quiet.
6) MixMasterLar - I feel like you might be scummy because of #1269. Your interactions with both andy and haku were poor in my opinion. The one to haku because you jumped so quickly to "is the gamble that you're voting for your partner?" and to andy because I feel like he's fishing for a newer player to say something that he might not perceive as scummy and then everyone jumps on his ass for it. Plus I feel like your reaction was a little exaggerated to the fact that AA died. Then I think about aggression but I feel like you're pretty outgoing in general so I wouldn't be shocked if this was your wolf game.
7) XelNya - His EoD was pretty good, he definitely gets a pass for now.
8) Precarious - Null. Quiet.
9) Vendetta21 - Null. Quiet.
10) Hakulyte - Null because I can't read you. Initially I town read you but your most recent interactions and posts have been kinda awkward in my opinion. One thing sticking out to me being the Pazzaz thing, but I could understand why you might perceive the roll to be potentially scum.
12) ShadoWolfe - Voices initial concern on haku on #1167 but brushes it off as a sleepy haku. I really don't like the progression here though. Then the tipping point for him to finally vote comes on when Haku said nice timing. I feel like there must've been a better post to do that on? Idk it just reads very weird and not town to me.
13) Pazzaz - Town. I believe his claim, and I believe he's town sided.
15) Andy-o24 - Was town for d0, then now he's posting kinda strangely, such as the WIFOM post #1169. However, through his and MML's interactions I don't think it's w/w and it's more probable in my mind for mml to be the wolf.
16) gold stinger - Town, I liked his reads list, nothing has made me change my initial belief of him being town.
17) inDheart - Null because he's still catching up. I don't really think any of his interactions have been indicative of anything but once he catches up I'm sure I'll have a better impression.
19) _Zenith_ - Null. Haven't seen to much to decide yet.
20) Tokzic - Null. Quiet.

[danceflashrevo]

Re: TWG CLX If Emblem was a bad employee Game Thread

Ew that was formatted like garbage mb lol

[andy-o24]

Re: TWG CLX If Emblem was a bad employee Game Thread

> Go Advanced
> Preview Post
> Good. Hot.
> ????
> Profit

-o24

[Precarious]

Re: TWG CLX If Emblem was a bad employee Game Thread

Ok, I've been thinking about the consequences of what I'm about to say, I hope this provides clarity. I thought about keeping this a secret but I will have to say this before the EOD incase I die so here's the truth.
I couldn't speak D0 but instead I received the ability to switch the positions of two people at the beginning of N1. I switched AragakiAyase and Charu. This is why several people reacted weird, they thought AA was gonna die or atleast not that Charu was gonna die. So if I die as town, AA is confirmed town (or the wolves tried to kill one of their own lol).

TL;DR AragakiAyase IS CONFIRMED TOWN FOR ME

From now on I'm normal townie and will be scumhunting. I'll post my thoughts about everyone later.

No not really, that was not why I chose him. Yes, choosing a scum and a townie and the scum then dying would have been good but the chances for that happening would be pretty low. If I choose two people who are probably townies, if one of them die then I'll know the other is a townie too. I didn't want to throw my ability way and have it not affecting anything.

Not enough attention has been paid to this. I mean, people are using this as a basis to semi-clear Paz, but his initial point raised a topic that's worth investigating further.

This is why several people reacted weird, they thought AA was gonna die or atleast not that Charu was gonna die.

First off, this is stated way too definitively; if Pazzaz's role is (was) really to switch effects on N1, he shouldn't actually know this. But assuming it's just awkwardly phrased and it's just what he thinks, it instead raises an important point. There were several people who were really surprised that Charu was nightkilled--if this was because Charu died when AA was targeted (and this is reinforced by the daykill today), then that surprise is fundamentally suspicious, because it links those people to the kill. Lots of people get nightkilled for a variety of reasons, so the outcry makes more sense if those people knew Charu shouldn't have died. But the only people that could know that are are the killers themselves, Pazzaz, and potentially a watcher-type role if that exists in this game.

Having said that, there are a few problems with Pazzaz's logic, and I'm a little uncomfortable with how readily people have cleared him (although I lean toward him being town, since claim gambits tend to blow up, it's not really definitive imo). Basically, his town-town plan doesn't make a lot of sense. By his own claim, as far as I can tell, his role was enforced silence on D0 in exchange for being able to switch night effects on two players on N1. This doesn't give him any special insights or investigative information, so his plan suffers from the following problems:

Multiple people seemed to be town-reading AA strongly. This would have made AA a more likely night protection (again assuming that power exists in this game, but a doctor-type role is super standard) target. It's also not that unlikely that someone other than AA could have been targeted for a nightkill; while town reads might have made him the most likely target, the field overall still seems more likely. Pazzaz's logic seems to assume that AA (or perhaps Charu) would have been targeted, and while that's somewhat reasonable, it runs into the problem of why he chose Charu as the other player. This was supposedly so that the town-town effect would provide him with some information, but he only gets information if one of them dies. If that's the case, why not choose a potential wolf to receive the transferred deathblow? The payoff only makes sense if one expects Charu to be targeted (which would transfer death to AA), obtaining an unconfirmable town read at the expense of potentially killing a wolf. In any TWG/mafia game, town are always going to outnumber its antagonists to start. That's the basic premise of the game. As such, individual town reads aren't super useful (especially early on) in comparison to wolf reads or wolf kills. But his language choice acts as if getting a town clear was fait accompli, which again assumes information he shouldn't have.

In spite of the above, I'm still leaning town on Pazzaz, since claim gambits tend to blow up sooner or later, and his hasn't so far. But one way or another, the mechanics of his situation demand further consideration (especially since his roleclaim entailed a D0 post restriction, which if true suggests other posting modifiers may be in effect now or later).

[ShadoWolfe]

Re: TWG CLX If Emblem was a bad employee Game Thread

You are actually very wrong about the tell. I wouldn't even go as far as to assume what the tell is without an explanation from either of us who know and noticed it.

That was bad from you.

The tell is the form of which Aryxi defends himself when pressured. He always uses the same manner, style, mannerisms, tone, and almost words when he's town-aligned and being attacked. It's such a bad tell and yet, it's been decisive so many times already for Aryxi that I'm able to say the slot (at that time because I have no idea what Haku is doing right now) was town-aligned.

Okay, Zenith and Haku, I've gone through every game Aryxi has ever played (thankfully he's a new player), hoping that you were right and that Aryxi would have a magic tell that would clear him, and therefore Haku, as town.

I ended up being disappointed, because there's nothing consistent in his responses that would justify your assertion that "He always uses the same manner, style, mannerisms, tone, and almost words when he's town-aligned and being attacked. It's such a bad tell and yet, it's been decisive so many times already for Aryxi that I'm able to say the slot (at that time because I have no idea what Haku is doing right now) was town-aligned."

Therefore, respectfully, I have to conclude that you were grossly exaggerating his "tell". Like I told Haku, the main similarity between this game and any of his town games is just the fact that he gave up and left after a push on him in both this game and the last game. When I said that to Haku, you said I was wrong about the "tell" and that I should have asked one of the two people who saw it. I Since you didn't respond to my request that you pull up where AA originally mentioned the "tell", I'm going to go find it now myself. I hope you weren't lying about AA, because if his version of the tell is the same as mine then you will have my vote for lying and putting words in his mouth.


List of Aryxi's responses to attacks:

Turbo 4 (aka Aryxi's first game):

DaBackpack
rude

Turbo 5:

If you could elaborate on why you think I'm a wolf that'd be cool

Turbo 6:

Huh?? Why do you dislike me? I was going to vote haku just out on a hunch but got preoccupied and i ended up missing eod

Turbo 7:

Nice meme but it's a lame one.

There's nothing that sticks out to me in said chaos for me to try to pick something out, which is why I didn't say anything. If there is nothing that sticks out to me then it is unnecessary to say anything at all. Nice meme.

Eh, i'm going to get lynched d0 again so Ima just leave for the night. Night all.

This game:

Another mislynch if more votes are placed on me but whatever mang

Sorry to keep you in hold homie but i promise to have a full detailed post explaining my reasons for the previous posts. I need just need some rest and after I'm off tomorrow I'll have my post up as promised. This game requires alot of energy i don't normally have

He responds as differently as you could expect from the same person. Nothing in his "style" or "mannerisms" is identical. So much for that. On a different note, I never realized how little Aryxi posts in this games. Finding these was easier than I thought. If anyone wants to confirm that these were, in fact, his responses and that I'm not nitpicking or altering them at all, please simply click on the arrow next to the relevant quote and read the context.

[Precarious]

Re: TWG CLX If Emblem was a bad employee Game Thread

AragakiAyase was discovered dead, with a single arrow lodged between their eyes.

AragakiAyase's Role PM is as follows:

AragakiAyase, you are Rolf. You are a child who has joined the Greil Mercenaries as a budding Archer. Your inexperience often shows, both in camp as well as on the battlefield.
You are too young to know much, and are vanilla town.
Not included in initial PM: Rolf has a Loved Modifier.

Several things here. Does "Not included in initial PM" mean AA was unaware of his own modifier? If this is the case, then there may be personal and global effects that we're not aware of. Not much that can be done about that, but it's worth keeping in the back of our minds.

More to the point: it's highly likely that AA was killed by a wolf (although this speaks to the inexperience of the wolves if so; a wolf daykill is more dangerous if saved, as it can collapse a LYLO situation into an instant loss). Now, while dayvig roles are fairly common (at least in other mafia communities, I can't speak for custom here), wolf daykills are much rarer, and anonymous wolf daykills are unheard of (precisely because they're so powerful and balance-breaking). That suggests that an item was used, and as has been pointed out, item sharing and corpse looting are not in effect. It's possible that this was planned, then, but given the Paz claim, it's likely that the wolves were caught off guard by the lack of an AA death. That means AA's content on both days (but especially today) probably points to a wolf or wolves.

There is one other possibility, though. Can a vanilla town player still have an item? It's worth noting that AA was an archer, and died via an arrow shot. I would argue it's possible that he was otherwise vanilla, but possessed a shot that somehow was reflected back at him, either by item or ability (I'm not familiar enough with FE to identify a cross-mechanic for this--a physical shield? A reflect spell?).

[storn42]

Re: TWG CLX If Emblem was a bad employee Game Thread

I dont think the idea of a gunsmith is that far off... if I'm remembering correctly the gunsmith gives someone a gun and that person got to shoot someone ant any point in time. That means if we have a gunsmith claim we know that the person he gave the gun to is likely a woof. So here is my crazy plan. The gunsmith claims, we lynch the gunsmith after he tells us who the woof he gave the gun to is.

Btw this plan is probably overtly stupid in some way so you know.

[Precarious]

Re: TWG CLX If Emblem was a bad employee Game Thread

Quick gut reads:

YoshL is town. His play is both thoughtfully aggressive and actually considers the game. The latter is hard to do honestly if you're playing an aggressive wolf.

Andy feels wolfish to me. Way too many red flags, and his tone/style of play seems to jump around too much.

Shadow is town, if only because I have trouble imagining a wolf pouring through that many older games.

Zodiac feels town. Weird absence early, but his play since appearing reminds me too much of his previous game.

Xel seems town after EoD.

One of Haku and MML is a probably a wolf, given the antagonism, although a town-town fight is possible.

DFR is likely a wolf, given the weird game to this point and AA dying soon after pushing for DFR pressure.

***

Better reads based off of more than instinct will come after I get some sleep.

[Precarious]

Re: TWG CLX If Emblem was a bad employee Game Thread

I dont think the idea of a gunsmith is that far off... if I'm remembering correctly the gunsmith gives someone a gun and that person got to shoot someone ant any point in time. That means if we have a gunsmith claim we know that the person he gave the gun to is likely a woof. So here is my crazy plan. The gunsmith claims, we lynch the gunsmith after he tells us who the woof he gave the gun to is.

Btw this plan is probably overtly stupid in some way so you know.

A gunsmith/gift giver/whatever type role seems like it would clash with the (Items cannot be passed from one player to another) clarification in the OP, although it's possible that just refers to starting items and not to gifted items if a such a role exists.