World of Warcraft

[Tokzic]

Thorim's the first difficult boss in Uld-25, and sadly, there is no perfect strategy.

For arena, here's some tips:

- Set up ORA or whatever assist mod you use so that every DPS attacks the same elite. Pick someone who chooses targets quickly.

- Have everyone make a "/tar Dark Rune Evoker" (i think that's the name of the mob rofl) macro - they need to die first.

- Kill Champions when there are no Evokers up.

- Focus on single-target but give a healthy amount of AoE as well.

We had 9 in tunnel, 16 in Arena.

[Squeek]

We've only done it on 10 due to a lack of people for 25 man raids but here's our strategy.

Split the raid 60/40. That means 6/4 in ten man and 15/10 in 25. You probably have more flexibility in 25 though, since 6/4 is the only combination possible in 10.

You want all your strong AOE people out in the Arena--especially a solid AOE tank like a DK. The first and most important rule is that you do not cluster up in the middle like some people suggest. Spread out around the center and leave the tank in the middle. If you get the orb on you, move. That's it.

There are four types of adds and they die in this order: Evoker, Champion, Warbringer, Commoner.

Evokers heal and bubble. You must remove the bubble (Spellsteal, Purge, etc) and cancel any and all heal casts.

Champions whirlwind. Keep melee away from them and range them down.

Warbringers have a 20% haste aura. Kill them or MC one to give your raid 20% haste (also an achievement).

Commoners do nothing.

Everyone waits until the tank has sufficient AOE aggro (DnD is enough) and during this time, the tank and everyone else single-targets down the Evokers and any Champions that might be up. Then open up AOE. If you ever have leftover adds when a new wave spawns, this problem will compound, so it's best to take care of adds as quickly as possible.

As for the tunnel group, they need to be fast but not too fast. Ideally they finish in 3:01 though that's hard to time properly. Thorim's hard mode is engaged if you do it too soon but you won't have enough time to kill him if you take too long in the hallway, especially since the arena team gets overwhelmed if you take too long.

[tsugomaru]

At Yogg, I was constricted halfway across the map and no one came to pick me up. When I was finally iceblocked out of it and ran to the other side of the map, I found out why no one could save me. Everyone was constricted as well. It's absolutely not fair, it's so difficult to manage it.

~Tsugomaru

[Grandiagod]

Originally Posted by Squeek

The first and most important rule is that you do not cluster up in the middle like some people suggest.

We cluster up and we 3 shot it our first downing, and 2 shot it our next on 25.

You just have to get a couple really good tanks and have me healing

[Grandiagod]

also

* The Yogg-Saron encounter has received the following changes: Death Ray no longer hits players who are under the effect of Malady of the Mind, Guardians of Yogg-Saron no longer use Dominate Mind, the spawn rate of Guardians of Yogg-Saron is more forgiving, and these Guardians will no longer spawn if a player that is protected by Hodir’s Flash Freeze hits an Ominous Cloud.
* In the opening sequence of Ulduar you can now see Liquid Pyrite from farther away.
* The Flame Leviathan encounter has received the following changes: the bonus health Flame Leviathan receives per tower has been reduced, the ejection height from Flame Leviathan has been reduced, the snare effect of the Tower of Frost has been removed, and the cannons on Demolishers and Siege Enginers should now break Flash Frozen vehicles in 1 shot.
* The XT-002 Deconstructor encounter has received the following changes: the health of the heart has been slightly reduced in heroic difficulty and the rate at which Gravity Lapse and Searing Light are cast has been reduced.

Nerf nerf nerf nerf

[Squeek]

Yeah, it's not exactly fair when you're left with 2 DPS during the brain phase and you have to do 400,000 damage but you're both constricted and there's no DPS left to break you out =/

Also, they nerfed Phase 1 properly, but they need to focus on Phase 2. We did Phase 1 without the nerf but the difference was clear without the Guardian's MCing the tanks as they ferried them to Sara.

They know most of the raid DPS is going into the Brain, so why do they make the outside team require huge DPS to survive until the Brain team returns? If one DPS gets Constricted, you're pretty much done.

[Grandiagod]

I don't think many raids give you a fair chance of winning when only 2 dps are alive =(

[ImEric12]

Again with all the complaining! Yogg is the final boss of the instance, not counting the next to impossible guy. He's supposed to be really, really hard. Back in BC or vanilla, even the crazy good guilds wouldn't have downed him for weeks yet.

[Squeek]

Originally Posted by Grandiagod

I don't think many raids give you a fair chance of winning when only 2 dps are alive =(

This isn't 'alive'. This is 'only'.

Two tanks, three healers, five DPS. Three DPS go into the brain. How many are you left with?

Originally Posted by ImEric12

Again with all the complaining! Yogg is the final boss of the instance, not counting the next to impossible guy. He's supposed to be really, really hard. Back in BC or vanilla, even the crazy good guilds wouldn't have downed him for weeks yet.

I'm saying he's broken. Guild like Ensidia are good at exploiting design flaws in dungeons to achieve world firsts (read: how they did Hodir's hard mode before it was nerfed to 3 minutes). Now, I'm not saying they're doing that to beat fights normally, but it goes to show they're good at thinking outside of the box that Blizzard has set up for how something should be done in order to get it done. We have hardly the raid composition, gear, or experience that a guild like theirs has.

It is yet another prime example of a 10-man fight being harder than the "heroic" version of the fight. Due to the composition required for Ulduar, you simply don't have the DPS you need for Phase 2 if you stick with two tanks and three healers. However, you can't do Phase 1 without two tanks and three healers (well, we can't at least).

Blizzard nerfed Phase 1 because it was stupid. The way most people do it is to kill the add away from the clouds and have the tank carry it to Sara. The clouds are hard as hell to avoid because they lack tangible edges, so leaving your entire raid in the middle is just asking for failure (this is coming from someone who has never once died in Heigan, never once stood in a Void Zone, Fire Wall, etc. I'm never the one who dies from 'standing in the fire'). So the tank who is carrying the add to the center just has to worry about getting it there without touching a cloud. However, the add would then only have one target available for Mind Control. So, you have this tank away from the entire raid Mind Controlled and we're unable to dispel it. The add doesn't get blown up on Sara and the MC'd tank walks into every cloud in the room, spawning three billion adds and wiping the raid.

Does that sound fair to you?

ps - Blizzard specifically stated that they intentionally overtune boss encounters when they first launch new content just so they can see how much they have to scale it back.

[Grandiagod]

Originally Posted by Squeek

Blizzard specifically stated that they intentionally overtune boss encounters when they first launch new content just so they can see how much they have to scale it back.

That's Blizzard code for "We make it how it should be but people bitch and cry so we nerf content to make more money off of bad players."

Oh no, Yogg is hard. Son, if this were BC or vanilla you'd be incredibly lucky to see more than one phase of him your first month.

That being one of the huge reasons Wrath annoys me now. Bosses should take weeks to kill, not an hour of wipes.

[Squeek]

Originally Posted by Grandiagod

That being one of the huge reasons Wrath annoys me now. Bosses should take weeks to kill, not an hour of wipes.

You know, I keep hearing people say this.

Why do you want almost-impossible bosses?

From a developer standpoint, nobody should want 'weeks to kill' bosses. There are plenty of people who will realize that it will take weeks to kill and then just say 'screw it we'll just not do it'. Then you've basically spent all this money developing this super-awesome boss that only a tiny fraction of your playerbase is actually killing.

I'd venture to say the number of players who have killed Yogg is still <1%.

I don't think he should be a walk in the park. I just don't think the encounter should be so heavily RNG-based. I don't think any encounter should be heavily RNG-based, but that'll never happen.

I know comparing it to the cakewalk that is Naxx is a bad idea, but just look at Naxx. You have your easy bosses, your hard bosses, and lots in-between. However, despite being the boss of the zone, Kel'Thuzad is easy as hell as long as you follow one rule: stay 10+ yards away from everyone else. 'Course, if your raid composition is 100% melee dps, you're screwed. Bring the player, not the class right? For a while we didn't even raid with any melee dps because they always make encounters harder for the healers. Fortunately Ulduar is much more balanced in this regard.

All I'm saying is I know he's the final boss and I know he should be the hardest but your definition of "hard" is my definition of "broken". The fact that you must send almost all of your DPS into him despite the number of raid-killing things happening above-ground is absurd. If one damn Constrictor picks up one of the two remaining DPS (which is what happened... repeatedly), you're done. It's a wipe. You have no chance.

I do, however, think the 'don't look at the skulls' idea is brilliant. Everything about that is right. And all they'd need to do to fix phase 2 is to lower the HP of the Crushers. 400,000 is far too high for two DPS to handle, especially since more and more spawn while you're trying to kill the first one, which lowers your damage more and more.

[Grandiagod]

Originally Posted by Squeek

Why do you want almost-impossible bosses?

Because i have the skill and dedication to figure it out and kill them, so **** people who don't. I know it doesn't make sense from a developer's standpoint, but I don't have to care at all,.

And RNG is seriously my favorite part of boss encounters. Without RNG **** would get so boring and a lot of great moments I remember where we beat the odds and killed a boss wouldn't exist.

"5 HEALERS IN A ROW, TERON, OH GOD STOP IT"

When I see people cry about wiping on Yogg their first week on him I sigh to myself and remember a month and a half of Kael wipes. Then I get angry and want to hit the whiny scrubs

[Squeek]

I'm whining because it's broken.

And if you want a challenge, just do hard mode. Leave 'super NOOB EASY MODE LOL' to us.

[Grandiagod]

If it's possible to do at all, it's not broken.

[tsugomaru]

Squeekspot.com

Guides for the casual raider because Tankspot is at fault for being super super super geared.

~Tsugomaru

[Kagome]

I like how my raiding group raids half as much as 90% of raiding guilds but we're still much, much better then all of them.

[Squeek]

Originally Posted by tsugomaru

Guides for the casual raider because Tankspot is at fault for being super super super geared.

Like I was trying to say, they're not 'at fault'. They just don't understand the difference between a strategy guide and a list of abilities the boss does in a voiceover of a video of their guild killing the boss.

[Grandiagod]

or maybe their guides were made for competent geared people, not you :3

[Squeek]

Sorry that we haven't farmed EOE25 / Sarth2D25 for every single drop for every single one of our group members yet.

We thought maybe Naxx10 + Naxx25 gear would be enough for Ulduar10, considering the progression is supposed to be Naxx10 -> Uld10.

Though almost everyone in our run was entirely Naxx25'd before we even started.

Edit: Though we won't be trying again this week since we already used all the time we had allocated to Uld10, I think we might be able to do it next week. We hadn't gotten to phase two in our previous run, so now that we have experience we should be better at it.

For example, I asked our tank today if he knew he had to pop in and interrupt the channel of the -20% damage debuff and he had no idea. Not like it would've worked anyway since the two ranged DPS would've needed to stop DPS for a second to let him do it, which we didn't know about either.

I still think it's stupid.

[NFD]

I'm lazy but I want to play again so could somebody link me the 10 day free trial thing or are they not doing that anymore because that would suck.