TWG Turbo V: No One Pretends to be the Seer Game Thread

[Precarious]

Back. I'll try to get caught up quickly. As always, if anyone wants to abridge anything, it's appreciated.

[MixMasterLar]

I keep glancing back and I notice the people making posts are not the same people who lurk

[Precarious]

Originally Posted by MixMasterLar

I keep glancing back and I notice the people making posts are not the same people who lurk

Maybe I'm misunderstanding what you're trying to say, but isn't that self-apparent? Aren't posting and lurking mutually exclusive anyway?

[Precarious]

Originally Posted by Hakulyte

Like geez, you just rolled wolf last game and you're saying that. Why would you encourage a behavior that failed last time? (from a Town point of view)

It didn't fail last game. There wasn't enough game to evaluate the pros and cons of that approach, but if anything the conversation broke Arnt. If you want to attribute that specifically to DFR, fine, but an active thread is one that is forcing people to participate, and that's precisely where and how wolves get exposed.

Understand that one of the mafia communities I've played at in the past in Forum Games on Kongregate. This was the most recent game I participated in there. It was only six pages long, and two of those pages were nothing but "Sign" and "Confirm" posts. Despite the fact that I had a witch absolutely pinned, the other town players failed to even appear to vote, which blew the game. And I've actually seen worse inactivity there. Believe me when I say that whatever risks are entailed by an active thread (and I'll concede that it's irritating having to catch up when I'm afk for a few hours), an inactive game is universes worse.

If you'd prefer to dispense with some of the non-game posts (chatting about whatever), fine, your playstyle is obviously your own. But activity is the town's best weapon, particularly in a game with very limited night powers. Can that backfire? Of course. But the alternative is barely a game at all.

[AragakiAyase]

Been away, will be able to post soon I hope

[Hakulyte]

Shower taken check.
Dinner eaten check.
Win of the day in a game we don't care about check.
TWG reads, reset.
Ready to play? check.

Originally Posted by Precarious

It didn't fail last game. There wasn't enough game to evaluate the pros and cons of that approach, but if anything the conversation broke Arnt. If you want to attribute that specifically to DFR, fine, but an active thread is one that is forcing people to participate, and that's precisely where and how wolves get exposed.

Understand that one of the mafia communities I've played at in the past in Forum Games on Kongregate. This was the most recent game I participated in there. It was only six pages long, and two of those pages were nothing but "Sign" and "Confirm" posts. Despite the fact that I had a witch absolutely pinned, the other town players failed to even appear to vote, which blew the game. And I've actually seen worse inactivity there. Believe me when I say that whatever risks are entailed by an active thread (and I'll concede that it's irritating having to catch up when I'm afk for a few hours), an inactive game is universes worse.

If you'd prefer to dispense with some of the non-game posts (chatting about whatever), fine, your playstyle is obviously your own. But activity is the town's best weapon, particularly in a game with very limited night powers. Can that backfire? Of course. But the alternative is barely a game at all.

Good post. Good points. Strange game with vigi/witches, I don't have much to say about it tbh, because I don't think that would particularly be relevant to this game.

Let me reread this entire thread and make a long list of not really important events, but that catched my attention. Most of these are not going to be important, but it doesn't matter. It's probably still better than doing nothing.

[Precarious]

Originally Posted by Hakulyte

Open unrelated question just for thinking purposes.



Why didn't we all follow the title? Is it really a bad strat to not pretend to be the Seer?

I don't think anyone took the title seriously. After the opposite title saw a game canceled, I viewed it as a tongue-in-cheek "let's not screw this up again" sort of thing.

The pros and cons of mass seer claiming have kind of been discussed, but the point is that if everyone posts a greencheck, it means the real one is out there (even if it's not usable yet), yet the wolves can't identify the seer. It also gives us something to talk about. Whether or not that's worth the drawbacks (trouble challenging pretend greenchecked people; the issue of how to evaluate the current greenchecks) is debatable, although I think (as I've said before) that this strat does more good than harm.

[juckter1]

Originally Posted by MixMasterLar

I might proved pretty relevant, I don't know yet.
I'd expect you to be pretty neutral to people who didn't check, but to view them favorable strikes me as odd.

I know the implication is that wolves could easily make a check and fall in line, but I've seen games where that simply didnt happen. Rather someone checked or not should not affect how you place them on the Scum-o-meter at this juncture.

This comes in late as fuck, but I'm pretty sure you misinterpreted what Shado posted.

[juckter1]

Reading Shado's posts again they just seem agressive af and not really scumleaning

[AragakiAyase]

I like how haku completely ignored where I asked him for reads

[juckter1]

Yo, Precarious, do you have any reads right now?

[MixMasterLar]

Originally Posted by Precarious

Maybe I'm misunderstanding what you're trying to say, but isn't that self-apparent? Aren't posting and lurking mutually exclusive anyway?

Yes

I was hoping by pointing it out I could get Aryxi, James and Jucktal to post more. It....didnt work as well as I hoped.

Originally Posted by Precarious

It didn't fail last game. There wasn't enough game to evaluate the pros and cons of that approach, but if anything the conversation broke Arnt. If you want to attribute that specifically to DFR, fine, but an active thread is one that is forcing people to participate, and that's precisely where and how wolves get exposed.

Understand that one of the mafia communities I've played at in the past in Forum Games on Kongregate. This was the most recent game I participated in there. It was only six pages long, and two of those pages were nothing but "Sign" and "Confirm" posts. Despite the fact that I had a witch absolutely pinned, the other town players failed to even appear to vote, which blew the game. And I've actually seen worse inactivity there. Believe me when I say that whatever risks are entailed by an active thread (and I'll concede that it's irritating having to catch up when I'm afk for a few hours), an inactive game is universes worse.

If you'd prefer to dispense with some of the non-game posts (chatting about whatever), fine, your playstyle is obviously your own. But activity is the town's best weapon, particularly in a game with very limited night powers. Can that backfire? Of course. But the alternative is barely a game at all.

Really good post, guys. I doubt he rolled wolf this game.

Originally Posted by juckter1

This comes in late as fuck, but I'm pretty sure you misinterpreted what Shado posted.

I might have, but I don't believe I did.

[Hakulyte]

Originally Posted by Precarious

I don't think anyone took the title seriously. After the opposite title saw a game canceled, I viewed it as a tongue-in-cheek "let's not screw this up again" sort of thing.

The pros and cons of mass seer claiming have kind of been discussed, but the point is that if everyone posts a greencheck, it means the real one is out there (even if it's not usable yet), yet the wolves can't identify the seer. It also gives us something to talk about. Whether or not that's worth the drawbacks (trouble challenging pretend greenchecked people; the issue of how to evaluate the current greenchecks) is debatable, although I think (as I've said before) that this strat does more good than harm.

Town wins:

- 1 True statement containing proof that 1 player is Vanilla Town.
- Something to talk about.

Wolf wins:

- 8 False statements containing wrong information that everyone is stuck caring about.
- Can start doing a PoE to find the real Seer.
- Can use the fake green check claims from the other Towns against them.
- Town players may assume things that aren't true.
- TvT are more likely to happen because Vanilla Town players posted a lie.
- Wolves may appear townier if their green check is playing like a green check.
- If the Seer doesn't die, it's possible we never really find out who was the green check.

etc. etc.

It's like a gambit, you give town a tempo with the new vanilla town proof, but you completely lose the upper hand strategically speaking.

[AragakiAyase]

Originally Posted by MixMasterLar

Yes

I was hoping by pointing it out I could get Aryxi, James and Jucktal to post more. It....didnt work as well as I hoped.



Really good post, guys. I doubt he rolled wolf this game.



I might have, but I don't believe I did.

is that sarcasm

[AragakiAyase]

Originally Posted by Hakulyte

Town wins:

- 1 True statement containing proof that 1 player is Vanilla Town.
- Something to talk about.

Wolf wins:

- 8 False statements containing wrong information that everyone is stuck caring about.
- Can start doing a PoE to find the real Seer.
- Can use the fake green check claims from the other Towns against them.
- Town players may assume things that aren't true.
- TvT are more likely to happen because Vanilla Town players posted a lie.
- Wolves may appear townier if their green check is playing like a green check.
- If the Seer doesn't die, it's possible we never really find out who was the green check.

etc. etc.

It's like a gambit, you give town a tempo with the new vanilla town proof, but you completely lose the upper hand strategically speaking.

pretty much all your wolf wins rely on assumptions that really shouldn't be there

1st point: no one should actually use the extra checks to play their game. People who are faking their checks know their's are fake and really shouldn't be trying to find the seer (unless you're a wolf), therefore you shouldn't care about the other checks either.
2: ??? I fail to understand how it's any different if people don't say anything at all, because for all the wolves know the real seer hasn't said anything. and if everyone throws something out, then it's very similar to if no one says anything.
3: no one should actually take a fake green check itself as a reason to scumlean person. how someone interacted with said green check could be something, but it really depends
4: how is this any different from normal
5: ... it's a lie meant to help the real seer, do you understand this
because it seems like you don't, if you did then you'd realize that again, fake checks in this setup really shouldn't be a good reason to scumlean someone
6: ... again, people shouldn't be taking other people's checks seriously
7: the seer, could, you know. out? and if they didn't have people faking checks, then we'd never know anyway if the seer dies.


I really don't know what you're on

[AragakiAyase]

Originally Posted by Hakulyte

If I am the Seer, then James May is green.

if you really thought it was that bad of an idea, why did you name a check right away instead of saying something

[Hakulyte]

I thought that doing it was better than not doing it considering the chain of claims already started before I got in the thread.

[MixMasterLar]

Originally Posted by AragakiAyase

is that sarcasm

Actually no. Post seems really townminded and I think a wolf wouldn't out in that much thought this at this point in the Game.

Do you not like it? Why not? Do you not feel it's Alignment Indicative or that it indicates the opposite of alignments?

Originally Posted by Hakulyte

Town wins:

- 1 True statement containing proof that 1 player is Vanilla Town.
- Something to talk about.

Wolf wins:

- 8 False statements containing wrong information that everyone is stuck caring about.
- Can start doing a PoE to find the real Seer.
- Can use the fake green check claims from the other Towns against them.
- Town players may assume things that aren't true.
- TvT are more likely to happen because Vanilla Town players posted a lie.
- Wolves may appear townier if their green check is playing like a green check.
- If the Seer doesn't die, it's possible we never really find out who was the green check.

etc. etc.

It's like a gambit, you give town a tempo with the new vanilla town proof, but you completely lose the upper hand strategically speaking.

More like

Town wins:
Wolves have no idea who is seer. As the game goes on seer either dies by luck on wolves part or hard claims several days in while remaining "seers" confess lying; town has hopefully 4 confirmed lock-clear folks in best case and one in worst

Wolves win: only the true seer checks. He dies night 1.

[Precarious]

Originally Posted by juckter1

Yo, Precarious, do you have any reads right now?

MML seems really town, but that could be me reading to what I already know, since I know he's green.

DFR seems to have become way more forceful than in the Survivor game. Not sure how much that means, but I lean town there for sure.

AA is active and pretty aggressive, but I don't really get an overall sense of of style from their posts. Somewhere between town and null.

I'm not sure what to make of you and Shadow sparring, since there's been a fair amount of conversation of what should be an innocuous topic. It's not particularly strong, but I kind of suspect one of you is a wolf. Not a very definitive read though.

R.E. Aryxi is the most suspicious person to me right now. The Charu check thing feels lazy, but there's been no content of note after that either. It feels like they're running away from a mistake rather than confronting it, which leans anti-town.

James May is basically impossible to read because he made some non-game type posts and hasn't posted since. That's a playstyle that can be replicated regardless of alignment. With nothing else to go on there, I real null for now.

Haku disavowing the superactive style of Survivor and Canceled Turbo is a little strange, but it seems more reactionary than anything else. Floating somewhere between town and null.

[MixMasterLar]

Hey Aryxi I see ya

Come play with us we can make sand castles and throw rocks at old people in their 30s