TWG CLIX: Form your special exclusive groups now! - Game Thread

[Hakulyte]

Originally Posted by danceflashrevo

Probably wouldn't lynch haku tonight unless someone convinces me otherwise. Charu this list you're putting out is fun to read lol

Can you make a read list before EoD?

You're kind of low activity-ish/Null to me and I'd like to know where you are with everyone in general.

[Charu]

PAGE 13

Making a mental note and written note that Juckter appeared on this page at 6:05 AM server time. (It's been awhile since he last saw his posts in these string of pages and also said he was going to "catch up later")

inDheart comes back and agrees that Freez is being bad (AKA: Falling over themselves). Now call this "bias" but at this point, I would like to think any wolf would see that Freez is a bad apple and they should immediately make themselves not be affiliated with such a person.

As such, sorry inDheart, no town points for you. The deed has been done and Freez has gone way too far in the red for any sort of bashing to be read town, hee hee hee.

But I give you a tiny town point at least, but I know you're smart enough that if you were a wolf you would do exactly what I just said.

inDheart also dabs on that he's noting Haku's play at the moment "in case something feels different later".

Fair enough I suppose, that's a null statement.

But here comes DFR with his cute "Grill me plz" post. I love how he questions why Shadow shrugged off the interaction. God damn dude, I think you're town.

Originally Posted by roundbox

Gradiant is town
Calm down with all the posting holy shit

Actually don't like this post. Comes in suddenly, calls someone town with no explanation, and as far as I can see, doesn't post again this page. ARE YOU A WOLF, ROUNDBOX!?

mellon comes back too, making a nother mental and written note that she appeared here at 10:29 PM Server time.

Pre, repeats for the third time why I should be read as the role I am and not any other scenarios. Note this was in reply to Freezin's shoddy attempt of painting me as someone to lynch after a few phases. (So it's sort of warranted)

I like Gradiant's little prod at roundbox, I don't know if he felt the way I did, but that little dab of a poke is pretty cool.

AND YET ANOTHER PERSON comes back. Making a mental and written note that he appeared here at 1:37 PM Server time.

But... hmmm...

Originally Posted by ShadoWolfe

... What? You're fucking amazing, you know that? Your ability to see pears as pineapples is astounding. Go back and read that section again, but this time try reading it with your glasses on, or maybe even just with your eyes open. -sigh]-

In other news, why didn't you mention Gradiant in that great summary of the "a lot of actual content" that happened?

Mister, you DID kind of shrug it off (you even unvoted). Hmmmmmmm...

Originally Posted by FreezinIce

Not to discount your points percarious (because they make sense) but you have a bit of misinformation I want to correct. Per the topic post, sk has to be the last alI've to win, not kill 4 people. Just correcting that on the off chance it's relevant later

...lol, okay. (I'm definitely biased right now, I'll admit this, but I can't see you any other way)

inDheart - Wolf Lean x2.5
Hakulyte - Town Lean x2
R.E. Aryxi/_Zenith_ - Town Lean
Shadowolfe - WEAK Town Lean
danceflashrevo - Town Lean
Gradiant - Town Lean x3.5
FreezinIce - 90% Sure Wolf
DaBackpack - WEAK Town Lean
Precarious - Town Lean x5
roundbox - WEAK Wolf Lean
botchi246 - N/A
XelNya - WEAK Town Lean
juckter1 - Town Lean
mellonxcollie - Town Lean

[Charu]

PS to Page 13:

Juckter1 did NOT catch up in a reasonable matter on that page. I should probably put him back to Null for that.

[Charu]

PAGE 14

Originally Posted by Hakulyte

Are you guys ready for more drama?

I love how relevant this quote is in the coming pages. Hee hee hee

...Wait a...

Originally Posted by Hakulyte

I just said what I thought about the hypothetical world where I'm a wolf.

I have no idea what FreezinIce is doing this game.

I'll let you judge that.

WHOA!!! Did... did Haku just bash Freezin? HEAVENS LORD, HE'S GROWING!!!

Originally Posted by ShadoWolfe

What does this mean? Are you saying you suspect them of being a scum team?

Now come on now bro, you know exactly what he meant right there. It's pretty clear cut what he meant too. (PS, no he definitely wasn't saying that, only saying Freez was scum).

Originally Posted by Precarious

Yeah, you're right. Doesn't affect the analysis though.

Okay, congrats dude, you're in my STRONG town pile. You're most likely town in my eyes at this moment.

Gradiant being very weary here, but I still like his aggressive prods. He might even join in the STRONG side of side soon, hee hee hee.

Originally Posted by DaBackpack

Freezinice and Haku are probably never on the same team here

and honestly I have freezin and gradiant both as town rn

EEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEH!?

Let me stop you right there son, because what post is THIS!? You're implying with this that you actually see Gradiant as a wolf then. Well then, I sure hope you list a reason why!

inDheart - Wolf Lean x2.5
Hakulyte - Town Lean x2
R.E. Aryxi/_Zenith_ - Town Lean
Shadowolfe - WEAK Town Lean
danceflashrevo - Town Lean
Gradiant - Town Lean x4.5
FreezinIce - 90% Sure Wolf
DaBackpack - WEAK Town Lean
Precarious - STRONG Town Lean
roundbox - WEAK Wolf Lean
botchi246 - N/A
XelNya - WEAK Town Lean
juckter1 - Town Lean
mellonxcollie - Town Lean

[Charu]

Please note juckter1 is null in that one, I didn't update it, sorry.

[Charu]

Originally Posted by Charu

EEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEH!?

Let me stop you right there son, because what post is THIS!? You're implying with this that you actually see Gradiant as a wolf then. Well then, I sure hope you list a reason why!

Meant to say Haku here, sorry! Woo, two mistakes in one page, I'm slippin'!!!

[danceflashrevo]

Yeah haku, I posted one pretty recently but I'll find it and update it, albeit i'm not sure of too many updates that i could make.

[danceflashrevo]

1. inHard (inDheart) - town from what i've seen, nothing sticking out
2. Hakuright (Hakulyte) - haku, town for now
3. R.e.ally Xi (R.E. Aryxi) - null, zenith - i've liked his content thus far. a lynch would be in poor taste.
4. SurelyWolfe (Shadowolfe) - eh, null, not sure what to make yet.
6. Charuzard (Charu) - charu
7. Greatiant (Gradiant) - town in my book, i've liked town and content, but idk what to make of this secondary interaction w/ freezin just yet
8. FreezeInIce (FreezinIce) - probably where my vote will end up. didn't like the grad interaction. very ad hominem, very snarky, very... unnecessary.
9. DaKnapsack (DaBackpack) - town, actual content.
10. PriCARius (Precarious) - still null, im not quite sure how to read precarious because he mentions himself that his play style is heavy mechanics and theory, but that's regardless of side and i'm not really sure what else to go off. the vote on dbp feels out of nowhere and also misguided but i don't scum read him for that. update, he unvoted but eh
11. boundrocks (roundbox) - null, please post more ty dad
12. ho246 (botchi246) - town.
13. Sell?Nah (XelNya) - town. i've liked his content thus far
14. Lucker1 (Juckter1) - town. also liked his content, feel like town contributing
15. melanxcholy (mellonxcollie) - eh null, haven't seen too much content, probably will have a better read of her, roundbox, and prec next phase.

[danceflashrevo]

oh lol forgot to change the second part of gradiant's section. yeah still def town. second interaction was just bleh, as followed up by my next section on freezin.

[danceflashrevo]

rereading i think shadows kinda unlikely to be wolf. not gonna lynch him either.

[danceflashrevo]

Is roundbox's meta to be more quiet as a wolf? He should def be pressured before EoD.

roundbox

[danceflashrevo]

someone talk to me......

btw my phone keeps sending me messages to register for voting, and then i get hella tilt bc i cant.

[Hakulyte]

Originally Posted by Charu

Meant to say Haku here, sorry! Woo, two mistakes in one page, I'm slippin'!!!

Unlike you, I didn't know Gradiant + Aggressive = Town.

In my mind, that was a potential weird ass TvT centered about controling the pace of the game.

I still considered Gradiant more Town than FreezinIce, but I wanted to experiment with the idea that FreezinIce could have been Town.

Basically, I had assumptions and I didn't want to take for granted that FreezinIce is wolf because I've been wrong many times in the past about my reads.

I was doubting myself and that XelNya post about my avatar certainly didn't help.

tl;dr: I'm being dumb and got distracted by XelNya to the point that I was more busy thinking about how much I hate him than what was going on at this very moment.

[Charu]

PAGE 15

Originally Posted by DaBackpack

precarious can you produce actual reads instead of making raw commentary?

Originally Posted by DaBackpack

reading into Charu's claim is a waste of cognition, and it's analyzing it is an easy to way feign investment in the game imo

Nice town read on Freez and then throw a vote at argueable the strongest town. FYI, he was responding to Freez, your town read, about his bad deductional skills.
'
Of course I banter with you, and...

Originally Posted by DaBackpack

maybe, but there was also no way you were ever going to be lynched, so it would be incredibly easy for him to 'defend' you from a nonexistent outcome

Read above.

Granted, I guess at this point, I myself didn't really read deep into the convo's so I kind of dismissed them as mechanical talk too. But it was mainly just to drill in to Freez I feel after this re-read.

I can forgive you... for now... But still, that town read on Freez man.

Originally Posted by ShadoWolfe

I'm going to have to reread later, but I gave him towny points for that whole exchange last night. When I pushed on him repeatedly, his responses seemed natural. I didn't like the fact that he refused to acknowledge calling you suspicious at all, but still looked town for the exchange.

His tone/attitude shift wasn't suspicious to me, though, because I was the one who initiated it. I went from, "you're fucking scummy!" to "It's nice to meet you, /unvote" in one post, so it also seemed natural that his tone would shift in responsr to mine.

I think you're pushing on town rn tbh, but there's no harm in that because it lets us all decide where the both of you stand and continues to generate useful info.

???

What da fuk, our mind meld is gone. WHERE DID YOU TAKE THE REAL WOLFE!? He was doing his 180 shit before you started to drill him, y'know. I have no idea where your town read is coming from. I heavily disagree about him sounding natural. That was one of my nags I wanted to scream at you all this phase but didn't because I didn't feel I had a good grasp at the players yet.

Originally Posted by ShadoWolfe

Yeah, I had noted the same. It makes me especially wary because he had done the same thing last game and ended up flipping wolf. Filling long post after long post with nothing but Charu is no way to go about hunting scum.

Precarious, where you at, buckaroo?

Legit, are you a wolf? You had such a good start, now your regressing back. You, of all people, should know why Pre made such a mechanical post like that.

Also...

Originally Posted by ShadoWolfe

Kind of mindmelding with DBP, so I'ma force myself to step back for a moment and also acknowledge that there's definitely a world where he could be inactive wolf (as per meta) who then comes in strong with a wolfread and a vote to deter too much analysis on himself.

Wat... sounds like something you would do in his steed, LMAO. Oh my god, are you actually a wolf?

Originally Posted by mellonxcollie

I found ShadowWolfe's jump on Freezin to be very strange for a number of reasons. That post kind of came out of nowhere. It seemed like his points were reaching a lot, and he intentionally left out the context of several quotes to suit a narrative that he seemed to already have established. It didn't seem as... inquisitive? as I would expect from a human player.

I am suspicious of anyone who claims that something is 100% confirmed when it isn't. Precarious seems very confident and sure of himself for someone who should be questioning everyone/everything around him

Ugh... not you too?

Originally Posted by roundbox

DaBackpack is not mafia aligned
Will this hold up?

ONLY TIME WILL

You're going on my wolf list buddy, holy shit my dude. Stop coming in, proclaiming a read, and then getting out. FUCK.

Wow, all most of my town reads vanished. Thanks Freez for stirring the pot, motherfucker!!!

inDheart - Wolf Lean x2.5
Hakulyte - Town Lean x2
R.E. Aryxi/_Zenith_ - Town Lean
Shadowolfe - Wolf Lean
danceflashrevo - Town Lean
Gradiant - Town Lean x4.5
FreezinIce - 90% Sure Wolf
DaBackpack - WEAK Wolf Lean
Precarious - STRONG Town Lean
roundbox - Wolf Lean
botchi246 - N/A
XelNya - WEAK Town Lean
juckter1 - Null
mellonxcollie - Null

[inDheart]

Originally Posted by Precarious

This all started with my argument with DBP. I think we can agree on that? Here was DBP's town read post, from way back.



This is, as far as I know, DBP's gut read (at the time, for all I know it's changed) on Freezin and Gradiant. At the time, they were in the midst of their big fight.

DBP has them as both town. There is no explanation as to why. This is not particularly useful to our overall conversation. It does not tell me why DBP reads them as both town. Moreover, two early unsupported town reads is such a minor (and, if desired, easily reversible) position that it does nothing to advance the conversation. I asked DBP, several times, for reads. I never got them.

There's nothing wrong with gut reads as a personal tool. Intuition and logic are both fine as starting points, since you have to start somewhere, and no one really knows what the fuck is happening on D0 anyway. But the difference between a pure gut read and a "logical" post is that the logical post requires logic--there has to be an A leads to B. This lets other people inside your mind. It allows them to examine your argument for or against someone, and also allows them to examine you. A purely intuitive gut read needs clarification on what/why that intuition leads you in that direction. Otherwise, it has no value to the greater conversation, and no persuasive value unless other people happen to have the same gut feeling. And given that everything is somewhat unreliable on D0, mass agreement is unlikely unless something unusual happens.

If you make a gut read, you should try to support it and explain what leads to that gut feeling. That explanation is evidence. Whether it's good evidence or not is for the player base to decide.

there are, at times, advantages to not being fully transparent in your aims, and i have a hard time believing games would advance at points if everyone was being fully, completely open like you seem to suggest they be. gut reads can be touch-off points for discussion.

what dbp's post made me think, tbh, was "hmm, he has freez as town, i should check that for myself because maybe i missed something" rather than immediately "i want more details from him on why". that kind of post encourages me more to be self-effacing first, and build an actual case for myself, before calling him on it if i come up with a really opposite impression.

so, i don't really care right away for having someone's reasoning in front of me either. it is natural to investigate someone's logic if they give it, but i always do so from the perspective of whether i should be revising my own thinking on the person they're talking about. i also don't expect too many players to just be logically wrong when they call out people, though it does happen. if i take issue with someone's read, it's usually because of how they're weighing their evidence, than their understanding of the evidence itself.

that's why i feel a focus on logic is more distant from the game, and ought to be more reactive than vigilant like you've been.

[Hakulyte]

@ DFR

roundbox said he was going to be more active today.

I've yet to see that.

If you want a topic, I'm curious about your town read on Juckter1. He's Null for me and I vaguely even remember any of his posts which is not good.

I'm in the middle of isoing him.

mellonxcollie is also on a similar weird spot for me.
botchi looks fine surprisingly for now, but didn't really interact enough to go anywhere.

[danceflashrevo]

tbf it's early, and he's a vet so he better fkin come for EoD cuz that'd be bad show if he didn't

juckter surely hasn't been a sore thumb and I feel like all of his content was genuine and town toned. if he were a wolf for some reason i feel like he'd be playing a lot different.

[danceflashrevo]

stop making me paranoid of my reads god dammit fine i'll re read him

[inDheart]

Originally Posted by Hakulyte

btw, I'm really happy that you proved me you can say what you think. It's like we player rock paper scissor and you told me you always pick rock and then went for scissor when I went for paper.

the way you quoted this drew my attention to how many times prec says "that's what i think" (though it's possible he's just doing that to inject an emphatic personal touch now (not saying that's a bad thing, because after all we're likely being frustrating to you (wow layers of parens))), but it reminds me of aryxi's "nothing further" in his first game

i like that prec said a thing too

the meta talk you guys have here is interesting, so i guess if that's what prec is calling reasoning too, then ok

[danceflashrevo]

After rereading juckter my town read stands. He doesn't have a lot of content. A lot of his posts are "catching up" and "brb" and stuff but the posts that he has made have been original and seem to put himself out there, and I simply don't think he would do that as a wolf. One example of this is he goes out of his way to defend gradiant. inb4 they're wolf bros but I find that very unlikely.