Ethereal Rebellion (Pad Pack)

[~Zero~]

I am getting rid of deep inside there's something i never really liked about it anyway :/

Edit after a quick look it seems like we have 14 accepted files....

[gnr61]

will those whose files took a month+ to judge get some chance to make adjustments...
also, and i know it's a personal preference, i 100% disagree with saying short freezes are universally bad or ugly or funny looking in pad charts, i just don't see any basis for that claim at all ?_?. and if you think you can't hear those ding ding dings on pad u are quite mistaken (they're the most prominent sound rofl, thats why theres so many accentuating elements in place there).

the minijacks in the ending runs of hora don't actually go to repeating sounds they are just there to add difficulty in semi-accurate spots to accentuate the climactic-ness of that part of the song compared to other streams (see also: mines).

musically (and at 140 bpm) chained minijack-jump-minijack seems to work best and anything else seems either abrasive (losing one jack to make a jump+16th note pattern) or just wrong musically (losing the jump itself). not sure what to do here.

[TC_Halogen]

Originally Posted by gnr61

i 100% disagree with saying short freezes are universally bad or ugly or funny looking in pad charts, i just don't see any basis for that claim at all ?_?

I base my theory off of actual official charts (i.e. ITG 1/2/rebirth), and it's a perfect basis for a claim.

In all honesty, if you have to resort to a tiny freeze that is shorter than 1/32nd of a beat long, and it doesn't hold a REASONABLE place in the chart (like a stop that you don't want to show with mines), it shouldn't be there at all.

Accenting with tiny freezes is completely useless because people won't notice it until after they hit the step, and then they'll wonder what that was for. That's why I say they are funny looking; a player is hitting these ridiculously small freezes and they can't realize what they are going to because their steps on pad completely mask this.

Originally Posted by gnr61

the minijacks in the ending runs of hora don't actually go to repeating sounds they are just there to add difficulty in semi-accurate spots to accentuate the climactic-ness of that part of the song compared to other streams (see also: mines).

There's better ways to use climax theory than jacks though. They simply don't fit with the ending of the song well enough. If you had something in the song to follow that could actually justify the use of jacks (maybe staccatos, or actually notes repeating in pitch?), then I could understand.

Originally Posted by gnr61

musically (and at 140 bpm) chained minijack-jump-minijack seems to work best and anything else seems either abrasive (losing one jack to make a jump+16th note pattern) or just wrong musically (losing the jump itself). not sure what to do here.

I can see where you are going with this, and I actually understand this point. However--you can still have a musically accurate pattern while losing the jump and jack by making a pattern where a certain step stands out. An example of this is to have a simple pattern (like a 16th note trill) turn to a different pattern for a moment (maybe a cross) while still keeping a good pattern flow--the cross acknowledges the louder sound in this example.

Your only issue about doing this is that your patterns before this jump are very spread out. Being selective about your patterns is key for a song that uses a lot of runs.

Your main problem with this is putting a jump where you have it in the chart makes the pattern a lot more forced than it should be. A 16th note jump jack at 140 is a bit choppy.

[gnr61]

i get what you mean with the ending jacks, and i'm already using other climax techniques there (crosses/mines) so i can take those out...i'll have to look at that jumpchain part again though because unless a cross would have the amount of impact and specific musical feeling i want (kind of doubt it..) i might have to keep that.


"Accenting with tiny freezes is completely useless because people won't notice it until after they hit the step"

i really don't know what you mean by this at all, lol, when i hit those minifreezes, i hear the very loud, very prominent dings they go to and i don't need to mentally backtrack in the least. when used right, it should be immediately apparent what they are going to and in this case it absolutely is and the chart makes no sense without them. the assumption you seem to be making is that minifreezes can only be used to accentuate very subtle sounds and thus the steps on the pad render them inaudible, which just isn't true.

maybe i'm misunderstanding you?

[ddr_f4n]

I'm gonna agree with TC_Halogen on the mini-freezes. Personally, I COMPLETELY DESPISE THEM. Why? These are pad files. Freezes are meant to be held on. Making them so short completely defeats this purpose. The only time I'd agree to such things are for KB files, and even then, I find them completely pointless.

They are there for a certain purpose. Use them properly.

[gnr61]

well keyboard files shouldn't exist anyways since stepmania was made to be played on pad so i don't even know why you would advocate their use in those either

[~Zero~]

mini freeze haters

[Patashu]

I'd rather use minirolls

[MastaofRomandJul]

I have a mixed feeling about mini freezes because after playing Hardware Store multiple times on pad, there is a good and a bad about the file, or just mini-freezes in general (my apologies if I'm stating nothing but the obvious):

Mini freezes do something for pad that jumps do to for spread files, accent beats. You throw them there, you see a freeze, you know a beat is coming, and I guess mentally, it will get you in the song more, or just notice it's there, but this is just my speculation. Obviously the idea of making expert charts for songs is to go with it as much as possible without overdoing it (only in a pad file's case), so you won't be putting jumps or anything. So the problem is, steppers who are trying there best to be good steppers end of wanting to accent every beat they find, and sometimes even go as far as to repeat types of patterns at parts of the song that are the same and jack beats in the song in the middle of streams (9volt's Turri ~Panta Rhei~ chart is an example here). There just comes a point where it's a little to much and the file doesn't seem so freeform and fun after all. In Hardware Store's case, it's still pretty fun considering how stepable the song is and the patterns it has like good placement of candle-lights and crossovers in the middle. The mini-freezes seems overdone but keep in mind, we're accenting beats and in a sense, making an excuse to not make JS in a pad file. This is what I call SSS, Spread Style Stepping. It's not making spread patterns, but accenting beats are looked at like spread files. In a spread file, it would probably make sense to put a jump wherever there is a single-note hold. The thing is though, at least in ITG's case, the quick freezes become a viewing issue for me sometimes, and sometimes I'll just do something and get a miss because I don't see what I need to do.

To sum it up, it's okay to do it, but 64th holds? That's overdoing it a little. I mean where the lyrics go from one singer to multiple singers for a moment, you could've just put a candlelight section or crossover in those streams. So in Hardware Store's case, it is overdone.

Also, lol for my post being a review of the chart at the same time.

[TC_Halogen]

*sigh*

I'm never going to understand why people here like to use tiny freezes like that. >_>;

I mean, I try to never ever use a freeze shorter than an 8th note long now. It may be just a personal perference, but it's really annoying to me when I see freezes that are 1/32nd or 1/64th note as accents. You don't do this.

And Sigma, I agree with you COMPLETELY.

[buizel8888]

Minifreezes are cool, and puppet is still gay.



PS Hora was a good file. Not gonna lie.

[gnr61]

"It may be just a personal perference"
it is

"You don't do this"
ya wrong

i think yellow arrows look weird why would anybody want to use those in a stepfile seriously there are ways to capture a 16th note that don't look that gay


sry i'm goin da the way with defending my file against biased aesthetic preference :>

[Cherubi]

mini freezes may not be necessary but they're being used by the artist conforming to his own style. it's his structure and telling him to do otherwise would be wrong. i wouldnt reject a file for personal creativity since being biased is too easy for pad files.

[~Zero~]

Just a little tid bit of information.... 14 files accepted 6 more needed...kthx (dont make me put my other ddr edits in here :/ )

List

All my Turn - Revolver
Bass Speaks Canine - Zimlord
BLN - Oni
Bloody Tears - Xiao
Blythe - Kommisar
Freedom - ~Zero~
Freestyler - Monst3rJoe
Happy Hardogs - Zimlord
Hardware Store - Xiao
Heart of Witch - Oni
Life is a Construct - Halogen
Mr. Bear - Revolver
Senorita - ~Zero~
Taekwonburi - ~Zero~

----------------------------------------------

Songs for considering or i havent played yet

New Colors of Sorrow and Flowers
Tokimonatakanimekat
Treme-vook of war
Tricky Tricky
Zexon (Sorry aj Oni probably didnt play this yet)

------------------------------------------------
Quick Review

Odyssey - The file was good until the gimmicks hit and i felt that they didn't fit at all
Zexon - Was good as far as I remember except that gay gimmick >:P
Tricky Tricky - Needs to be cut more and do stuff AJ said

[Wyde]

So you didn't like Uranus then? =(

Will hopefully be sending yet another re-do of Tsugaru 180 soon. Should be in accordance with all the judges suggestions/critiques by the time I'm done with it.

[Oni-Paranoia]

Originally Posted by TC_Halogen

*sigh*

I'm never going to understand why people here like to use tiny freezes like that. >_>;

but it's really annoying to me when I see freezes that are 1/32nd or 1/64th note as accents. You don't do this.

Agreed

Originally Posted by gnr61

"It may be just a personal perference"
it is

"You don't do this"
ya wrong

i think yellow arrows look weird why would anybody want to use those in a stepfile seriously there are ways to capture a 16th note that don't look that gay


sry i'm goin da the way with defending my file against biased aesthetic preference :>

Me and Aj know pad files, by using 16ths as an example to defend your file is stupid. Complete difference in using common 16ths and rarely seen freezes that don't even look like freezes x1.

By that matter Hora was a bad file. Despite the fact that you whore looking to the right side and crossing that direction and the dumb use of some of your 32nd holds (at the end), that file isn't worth defending. Its too technical to even be "fun". Your down runningman with crosses should have been on 4ths and 8ths, not 16ths.

You really need to understand that there's more to pad than just knowing what crosses and double steps are.

[Lain_Iwakura]

minifreezes were cool (read: uncool) in SMG2

[Oni-Paranoia]

Originally Posted by Lain_Iwakura

minifreezes were cool (read: uncool) in SMG2

KB pack v.s. Pad pack

Technicality v.s. fun

~Zero~: "Files can be too technical to be fun"

[ddr_f4n]

So I guess that you guys don't like those gimmicks eh?

I guess I'll get rid of them and re-submit. Is that all that needs fixing judges?

[~Zero~]

Originally Posted by ddr_f4n

So I guess that you guys don't like those gimmicks eh?

I guess I'll get rid of them and re-submit. Is that all that needs fixing judges?

I think so and maybe if you want to tone it down a bit that would be cool. Its a bit on the overstepped side, not to much though.