Ingame Song Information

[One Winged Angel]

yeah I was gonna mention that everything else seemed linear up to that point, which is why I thought it was weird that it kinda just shifts gears and gets ridiculous...i.e. death piano to vrofl = 4 level gap

assuming vrofl is going to be the absolute max on the scale (99), something like death piano should actually be rated much lower if the scale were to keep a linear progression, but that would require squishing several difficulty levels together from FMO and under, and people would complain about that, blah blah blah so w.e

[jimerax]

Originally Posted by Vanilla Mnm

It's harder than RATO.

No, this is not meant to be mash FC difficulty.
those still could be the same difficulty rating, but 1 difference is fine.

Originally Posted by One Winged Angel

in all honesty, the entire difficulty scale needs reworking

the gap between a 70 and an 80 is considerably less than an 80 to a 90

for example, the difference in difficulty between classical insanity and EHHS isn't nearly as large as the gap between EHHS to CCCP, which are both 10 point gaps on the scale...not to mention the gap between CCCP and RATO, which is only a 6 point gap on the scale but is arguably larger in reality than the other two 10 point gaps

true but I don't think that's not very important on this system imo.

if we're going to follow it accurately, DP is like 60 when vrofl is 99, but it's just meh.
plus we have only a few songs in 90+ range now so we don't have to set this range that wide.

[stavie33]

Hey I'm back!!

Alright, JX, I totally agree with the FGO setup, no problems there, nice update, <3


Feldschlatt opinions? Haven't heard anything about this and it's pretty darn tough for a VC, harder than Keep in Mind and Bus Rides with People IMO, high 75 or low 76? I vote high 75

No other problems so far, the tourney songs have been fixed, I just would want Magical 8 bit Tour to be 90, but 89 is okay. Oh yeah, Almost There is not THAT bad, really?

[Vanilla Mnm]

I'd say 75 for Feldschatt.
And I agree with Almost There being a 92. It belongs there, but I think Revo should also be a 92 if Almost There is. (Maybe Revo already is, I forgot)

[Kibblre]

vROFL = 100.

Just do it.

[One Winged Angel]

Originally Posted by 0

the color of the arrows doesn't really make a difference, does it? although I agree that Silence is easier than NWE

if molto was coloured, i'd kill it

regardless, I think silence is harder than NWE...both FC and AAA

[EAGAMES]

Originally Posted by stavie33

Oh yeah, Almost There is not THAT bad, really?

no

[qqwref]

Originally Posted by foilman8805

I see the scale now as sort of exponential in terms of difficulty as it reaches the high VC, FMO, FGO range. Which is why there's such a huge skill jump even though 70-80 and 80-90 are both 10 points difference.

Everything else up until that point is a pretty linear progression.

I think the best solution to this is to just increase the difficulties of the harder songs, pushing them well over the 99-point scale. If the stuff up to mid-high VC is roughly linear, I'd prefer it stay linear all the way up to DP/vrofl (even if those might have to be given, like, arbitrary 130 and 200 rankings or whatever). I feel like FMO and FGO have become gigantic skill intervals in terms of technical difficulty (Novo/Choprite vs Erad/Gymnastics, Lolo/Reality vs Winter Wind Etude/CCCP) and I think it's kind of weird how those huge intervals are crammed into 8 or 9 difficulty points while the difficulty 8 songs (for instance) have 12 points all to their own. People don't stay in the "the hardest song I'm confortable with is an 8" phase for very long but I know a lot of people get stuck around the VC/FMO range. We definitely wouldn't be able to have a song representing every difficulty level like we do know, but I think expanding the difficulty range on the highest songs would allow for a more accurate portrayal of how hard songs really are.

[Vanilla Mnm]

Or maybe we should have something like a 15 point scale (In game that is)

[foilman8805]

Originally Posted by qqwref

I think the best solution to this is to just increase the difficulties of the harder songs, pushing them well over the 99-point scale. If the stuff up to mid-high VC is roughly linear, I'd prefer it stay linear all the way up to DP/vrofl (even if those might have to be given, like, arbitrary 130 and 200 rankings or whatever). I feel like FMO and FGO have become gigantic skill intervals in terms of technical difficulty (Novo/Choprite vs Erad/Gymnastics, Lolo/Reality vs Winter Wind Etude/CCCP) and I think it's kind of weird how those huge intervals are crammed into 8 or 9 difficulty points while the difficulty 8 songs (for instance) have 12 points all to their own. People don't stay in the "the hardest song I'm confortable with is an 8" phase for very long but I know a lot of people get stuck around the VC/FMO range. We definitely wouldn't be able to have a song representing every difficulty level like we do know, but I think expanding the difficulty range on the highest songs would allow for a more accurate portrayal of how hard songs really are.

I like that. I personally don't have a problem with expanding the difficulty range over 99, and it really would return everything to the desired linear form. There is a kind of cleanliness about having the scale go from 1-99 though. Ultimately it's up to jx, but I second your idea.

[Kibblre]

Originally Posted by Vanilla Mnm

Or maybe we should have something like a 15 point scale (In game that is)

That would inspire more RATO-like songs.

Unless you LIKE RATO-like songs, that's a bad idea IMO.

[Vanilla Mnm]

RATO being a 16 on a 15 point scale? It's just more of a way to make the difficulty spans smaller. I guess you could say. Like on a 15 point scale, Almost There, CCCP, Winder Wind Etude, etc all being 15s.

[One Winged Angel]

Originally Posted by qqwref

I think the best solution to this is to just increase the difficulties of the harder songs, pushing them well over the 99-point scale. If the stuff up to mid-high VC is roughly linear, I'd prefer it stay linear all the way up to DP/vrofl (even if those might have to be given, like, arbitrary 130 and 200 rankings or whatever)

exactly this

[jimerax]

FYI, I use 1-99999 scale "secret difficulty order number" on FFR database.
The numbers are large enough because they shouldn't be duplicated.
so if I have to expand current 1-99 scale I'll just use that scale instead.
also the scale doesn't always have to be linear, it sometimes could be quadric, or exponential.

notes
Magical 8bit - could be 90, but not changing by now. could be changed by people's scores in the future though.
Feldschlatt - 75 is fine, PA/AAA'ing is difficult though.

[leonid]

IMO, using more than three-digit difficulties will make things too complicated.

You can automatically get 0-99 scale by dividing each secret difficulty by 1000. =P

[jimerax]

Originally Posted by leonid

You can automatically get 0-99 scale by dividing each secret difficulty by 1000. =P

yeah basically that's what I usually do.

[qqwref]

Lapis -The Heavens Remix- has 180bpm jumpstream and 8-0-0-1 is a top 200 score. I think it deserves to be a 10 (it is a 9 now), it's definitely harder than some of the lower 10s...

[mhss1992]

Originally Posted by qqwref

I think the best solution to this is to just increase the difficulties of the harder songs, pushing them well over the 99-point scale. If the stuff up to mid-high VC is roughly linear, I'd prefer it stay linear all the way up to DP/vrofl (even if those might have to be given, like, arbitrary 130 and 200 rankings or whatever). I feel like FMO and FGO have become gigantic skill intervals in terms of technical difficulty (Novo/Choprite vs Erad/Gymnastics, Lolo/Reality vs Winter Wind Etude/CCCP) and I think it's kind of weird how those huge intervals are crammed into 8 or 9 difficulty points while the difficulty 8 songs (for instance) have 12 points all to their own. People don't stay in the "the hardest song I'm confortable with is an 8" phase for very long but I know a lot of people get stuck around the VC/FMO range. We definitely wouldn't be able to have a song representing every difficulty level like we do know, but I think expanding the difficulty range on the highest songs would allow for a more accurate portrayal of how hard songs really are.

Yeah, I always understood the fact that it's not a linear progression, but it is a bit weird.
I mean, right now, a 50 is less than 5% as difficult as a 99. The first 60 difficulties progress very, very slowly. I mean, how can they find more than 1 difficulty to place the For Begginer songs? How do they manage to place the VDs in 12 difficulties, like you said? I sincerely can't distinguish most of them.

[DossarLX ODI]

Originally Posted by jimerax

Magical 8bit - could be 90, but not changing by now. could be changed by people's scores in the future though.

I think it should stay 89. That's already a bit high. Almost There being a 92 is also rather overrated

[foilman8805]

Originally Posted by qqwref

Lapis -The Heavens Remix- has 180bpm jumpstream and 8-0-0-1 is a top 200 score. I think it deserves to be a 10 (it is a 9 now), it's definitely harder than some of the lower 10s...

Very, very tough 9, imo. I've thought that since the first time I played it. In fact, I'm pretty sure I brought it up in this thread many months ago.

Harder than OtFD (the 9/10 cutoff, right?) without a doubt because of the jumpstream. I'm not familiar enough with the difficulty scale to place it correctly, but it's a 10.