are violent video games ruining the youth of tomorrow

[devonin]

Re: are violent video games ruining the youth of tomorrow

What's interesting to note is that in a surprisingly large number of types of crime, crime rates in terms of how many crimes -happen- are actually decreasing, and in some cases are at their lowest in decades, but crime rates in terms of how many crimes -are reported in the news- are skyrocketing.

I remember a stat that around 2002, incidents of child abduction were at their lowest rate they had been since the 1970s, but the rate of child abductions reported in the news was up 600%

We've created a climate of fear that makes us think things are dramatically worse now, when in fact it seems to be that in many cases, things are better, but we hear more about each individual case, creating the illusion that things are worse.

[tpl2000]

Re: are violent video games ruining the youth of tomorrow

Ahh, the conspiracies. I just figure that the producers of CNN and the like want to get their money's worth out of the reporters by forcing them to report the worst possible things (and as many as possible out of those).

may edit later. must go to sleep.

[MixMasterLar]

Re: are violent video games ruining the youth of tomorrow

Ahh, the conspiracies. I just figure that the producers of CNN and the like want to get their money's worth out of the reporters by forcing them to report the worst possible things (and as many as possible out of those).

That's pretty much it. Most News programs aim to entertain. You cant really tell me otherwise either:Only visually attractive reporters are on CNN (for the most part) and they always want to sit around and talk about a subject after they report it in a fasion that is ment to keep people watching.

This goes for all crimes, not just ones with games involed. People dont want to turn the news on and see someone say "it's getting better" .....they wouldnt keep watching, would they?

[FreezinIce]

Re: are violent video games ruining the youth of tomorrow

That's pretty much it. Most News programs aim to entertain. You cant really tell me otherwise either:Only visually attractive reporters are on CNN (for the most part) and they always want to sit around and talk about a subject after they report it in a fasion that is ment to keep people watching.

This goes for all crimes, not just ones with games involed. People dont want to turn the news on and see someone say "it's getting better" .....they wouldnt keep watching, would they?

Makes perfect sense since 90% of all news networks are owned by about 6 entertainment industry giants (ect. AOL Time Warner) Why else would CNN spend 4 days covering a kiddnapping when stuff like the War on Iraq is going on? Stuff like this is a dead giveaway to anyone willing to consider what they're seeing.

[devonin]

Re: are violent video games ruining the youth of tomorrow

I think it is sad and a little frightening that you display such a total buy-in to what is going on. To see someone say "It just proves how much the media is fear-mongering because they spend time on a kidnapping while the war is on" shows just how effective the actual thing going on here is.

How you can look at "THE WAR ON TERROR!!!!" and say that -anything- else is fear-mongering in comparison shows how well the media has distracted you from what is actually going on. They've got the country so fightened of everything, that the population at large will support anything (including the illegal and unwarranted invasion of another soverign nation) that looks like it could promise to make you safe.

[Coolgamer]

Re: are violent video games ruining the youth of tomorrow

Are violent video games ruining the youth of tomorrow? i think they are because violence has increased dramatically in the last 20 years

Are books secretly killing people in their sleep? I think they are because the amount of people who died in their sleep rose 5% in the last twenty years, and book sales have increased by 35%!

Seriously, this is one of the WORST logical fallacies I have ever heard, and I've heard some good ones.

http://www.nizkor.org/features/fallacies/

Here, I'm sure it's somewhere on the official list of logical fallacies, but I don't have the time to look.

Hey, you know what else has risen in the last twenty years?

1. Depression.
2. Rate of mental disorders.
3. Pollution and toxic chemicals.
4. Lead paint in children's toys.
5. Availability of mood-altering drugs
6. More drugs given to children to "fix their moods".
7. Better access to firearms and other lethal weapons.
8. More people watch TV.
9. More people watch movies as well.
10. A war that has been going on for the last few years sure affects mental health.
11. An unending amount of depressing news.
12. Holy christ global warming!
13. Sweet jesus ZERO TOLERANCE in schools!
14. OMFG DRUG WAR!

The list goes on. To claim that some random statistic proves that something is bad is not only dumb, it's totally insane.

Description of Questionable Cause

This fallacy has the following general form:

1. A and B are associated on a regular basis.
2. Therefore A is the cause of B.

The general idea behind this fallacy is that it is an error in reasoning to conclude that one thing causes another simply because the two are associated on a regular basis. More formally, this fallacy is committed when it is concluded that A is the cause of B simply because they are associated on a regular basis. The error being made is that a causal conclusion is being drawn from inadequate evidence.

The Questionable Cause Fallacy is actually a general type of fallacy. Any causal fallacy that involves an error in a reasoning due to a failure to adequately investigate the suspected cause is a fallacy of this type. Thus, fallacies like Post Hoc and Confusing Cause and Effect are specific examples of the general Questionable Cause Fallacy.

Causal reasoning can be quite difficult since causation is a rather complex philosophic issue. The complexity of causation is briefly discussed in the context of the specific versions of this fallacy.

The key to avoiding the Questionable Cause fallacy is to take due care in drawing causal conclusions. This requires taking steps to adequately investigate the phenomena in question as well using the proper methods of careful investigation.
Examples of Questionable Cause

1. Joe gets a chain letter that threatens him with dire consequences if he breaks the chain. He laughs at it and throws it in the garbage. On his way to work he slips and breaks his leg. When he gets back from the hospital he sends out 200 copies of the chain letter, hoping to avoid further accidents.

2. When investigating a small pond a group of graduate students found that there was a severe drop in the fish population. Further investigation revealed that the fishes' food supply had also been severely reduced. At first the students believed that the lack of food was killing the fish, but then they realized they had to find what was causing the decline in the food supply. The students suspected acid rain was the cause of both the reduction in the fish population as well as the food supply. However, the local business council insisted that it was just the lack of food that caused the reduction in the fish population. Most of the townspeople agreed with this conclusion since it seemed pretty obvious that a lack of food would cause fish to die.

[ty00123]

Re: are violent video games ruining the youth of tomorrow

This is different from, say, a light-saber, which doesn't exist.

This brings up the whole question of fantasy violence vs. realistic violence in games. (Fantasy violence meaning things like magic wands and light-sabers causing harm, and realistic violence meaning things like guns and swords causing it.)

Do kids actually react in a more negative way when seeing Grand Theft Auto, in a real environment with real people, than in a Star Wars-esque setting, where all but young children know that events/objects aren't real?

[reddarkd]

Re: are violent video games ruining the youth of tomorrow

Most Violent Crimes Involving Teen's And Kids Are Mainly A Subconcious Need For Attention, Or A Lack Of Parental Influences

[devonin]

Re: are violent video games ruining the youth of tomorrow

If you have some evidence to support that claim, I'd be interested to see it. Also, please try to avoid all of those unnecessary capital letters. They make the text more awkward to read.

[lord_carbo]

Re: are violent video games ruining the youth of tomorrow

I think it is sad and a little frightening that you display such a total buy-in to what is going on. To see someone say "It just proves how much the media is fear-mongering because they spend time on a kidnapping while the war is on" shows just how effective the actual thing going on here is.

How you can look at "THE WAR ON TERROR!!!!" and say that -anything- else is fear-mongering in comparison shows how well the media has distracted you from what is actually going on. They've got the country so fightened of everything, that the population at large will support anything (including the illegal and unwarranted invasion of another soverign nation) that looks like it could promise to make you safe.

Or perhaps a climate of awareness, which can reasonably correlate to the reduction in child abductions.

[devonin]

Re: are violent video games ruining the youth of tomorrow

Or perhaps a climate of awareness, which can reasonably correlate to the reduction in child abductions.

Er...feel free to restate that in a way that actually looks like it has the first thing to do with the text of mine you quoted?

The time they spend on kidnapping, and murder, and rape, and all of these other personal and violent crimes especially since the number of many of these crimes is actually dropping seems to me to be clearly designed to a) Improve ratings for their news show and b) Keep the people frightened and off-balance to allow the forwarding of political agendas that they would never be able to get away with if the population felt safe and secure without them.

You can't honestly tell me that there would be nearly as much support from Americans for all of the rampant rights abuses that have become legal, and for all of the military action on other nations if they weren't being constantly bombarded with yellow and orange "terror alerts"

Seriously...there has -never- been a lower than "yellow" terror alert since that system was instituted. There's never been one time where there was only a "General risk of terrorist attack"? Ever? That's ridiculous.

If they are seriously trying to say that "At no time, ever, in years, has there been anything less than a significant risk of impending attack" then that should show them that they are doing something -seriously- wrong.

[slipstrike0159]

Re: are violent video games ruining the youth of tomorrow

What's interesting to note is that in a surprisingly large number of types of crime, crime rates in terms of how many crimes -happen- are actually decreasing, and in some cases are at their lowest in decades, but crime rates in terms of how many crimes -are reported in the news- are skyrocketing.

I remember a stat that around 2002, incidents of child abduction were at their lowest rate they had been since the 1970s, but the rate of child abductions reported in the news was up 600%

We've created a climate of fear that makes us think things are dramatically worse now, when in fact it seems to be that in many cases, things are better, but we hear more about each individual case, creating the illusion that things are worse.

Just to back track a little bit, i think its worth considering that the increase of media output maybe just a side affect of things getting better. I mean really, the news reports on new things that happen that dont normally happen right? Well in this case, it would suggest that it is becoming more uncommon and so its taking its natural course of more publicity until almost every crime gets televised because of lack of commonplace. Addressing all the cases and stepping up measures due to these crimes also helps awareness to continue trying to keep those types of crimes down.
If anything, its a good sign.

Also, the only legitimate arguement that the anti-videogamecrime side can really make is that the increase in video games decensatizes the children today more than it used to. ALL THAT DOES is make them feel more justified when they are ALREADY COMMITING the crime. There is a line someone has to pass to commit a crime (especially a violent crime) and in no way does violent video games push them over the line, all it does is make them feel a little bit better when they are walking over or on the other side of that line.

[devonin]

Re: are violent video games ruining the youth of tomorrow

I mean really, the news reports on new things that happen that dont normally happen right? Well in this case, it would suggest that it is becoming more uncommon and so its taking its natural course of more publicity until almost every crime gets televised because of lack of commonplace. Addressing all the cases and stepping up measures due to these crimes also helps awareness to continue trying to keep those types of crimes down.
If anything, its a good sign.

And yet the result of all of this constant publicity for crime is that for the -majority- they come away with the impression that this is the most dangerous time to live in ever, and that crime is dramatically on the rise.

While I can grant that a climate of fear may make people more cautious and thus contribute to an overall reduction in crime, wouldn't it make -more- sense to say "Crime is on the decline because people are more careful, and more aware, so keep up the precautions because they are working" instead of "OMG CRIME IS HAPPENING EVERYBODY PANIC!!!" Both seem like they would accomplish the same ends, but one seems more than a little more respectful of people.

[Relambrien]

Re: are violent video games ruining the youth of tomorrow

While I can grant that a climate of fear may make people more cautious and thus contribute to an overall reduction in crime, wouldn't it make -more- sense to say "Crime is on the decline because people are more careful, and more aware, so keep up the precautions because they are working" instead of "OMG CRIME IS HAPPENING EVERYBODY PANIC!!!" Both seem like they would accomplish the same ends, but one seems more than a little more respectful of people.

It seems you overestimate people. In my experience, whenever someone says "This situation's getting better, good job," the resulting effect is that people feel more relaxed, like they don't have to keep working towards improving it as much. And then it just ends up getting worse, until once again you hear "The situation's worsening! Do this!"

[devonin]

Re: are violent video games ruining the youth of tomorrow

But surely if you make it clear that the -reason- things are getting better is -because- of the caution and diligence, that it shouldn't be too tough to see how you need to continue doing that.

I guess I may be overestimating people, but it makes me sad that thinking that to be the case is an overestimation.