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10-22-2010, 05:46 PM | #1 | |
Sectional Moderator
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Iraq war documents leak shows US is ****ing awful.
http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2010...military-leaks
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10-22-2010, 07:40 PM | #2 |
Giant Pi Operator
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Re: Iraq war documents leak shows US is ****ing awful.
Every war is ****ing awful. It needs to be stopped altogether, not just US conflicts. It's not like some wars are nice and civil while others are brutal. They all have to do with killing our fellow beings because some leader on the other side of the world doesn't like what some other leader said about something.
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10-23-2010, 03:43 AM | #3 |
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Re: Iraq war documents leak shows US is ****ing awful.
Yes, the US is ****ing awful. The US has been responsible for the most awful things that have happened over there. The US military are the only ones doing anything awful over there. The US has done nothing useful there.
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10-23-2010, 11:53 AM | #4 | |
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Re: Iraq war documents leak shows US is ****ing awful.
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Stop for a second and turn on your empathy switch before you blindly defend your country. Note that 66,000 non-combatants died at the hands of the US in a unilateral war that is not internationally supported where the only lasting change and objective we fulfilled was building bases near their oil drilling sites. Put yourself in the shoes of an Iraqi for a second: the White Man has come to your land and has killed more innocent people than not in a war that you don't understand and has only caused problems and in general made your life worse. Now while you're sitting in the position of empathy and pondering this war from the inside the question you really have to ask is: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=603EdqmOYzw
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Last edited by Vendetta21; 10-23-2010 at 11:58 AM.. |
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10-23-2010, 05:53 AM | #5 |
<3 Jumpstream <3
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Re: Iraq war documents leak shows US is ****ing awful.
First off, I will say that Bush did the right thing in retaliating against Al Quaeda. I don't believe that the war had to push so much on Saddam Hussein instead of Osama Bin Laden though. This war was a ****ing mess. We could have captured Laden long before Saddam if we had only thought correctly. Instead, yes we hung a top named terrorist in his own country THAT WAS ****ING TELEVISED NON THE LESS. Complete and utter bull**** that we went after the 2nd most wanted. This terroism on the US started with Osama, why not get him first? Its not like we couldn't have gotten Hussein seeing as him and his sons were completely stupid :/
But to read about these reports, just reminds me of the World Wars. It's brutal, distasteful and just down right wrong. But, what can WE do about it? it's the military. >.> |
10-23-2010, 11:05 AM | #6 | ||
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Re: Iraq war documents leak shows US is ****ing awful.
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IMO the American government should have stayed out of all this **** completely. Last edited by fido123; 10-23-2010 at 11:11 AM.. |
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10-23-2010, 12:07 PM | #7 |
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Re: Iraq war documents leak shows US is ****ing awful.
Reason 1 why I don't believe in God: religion = war ; war = death ; death = bad, therefore religion = bad. (amongst other reasons, but I realize this is a topic to be discussed at a later time.) 2 cents.
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10-23-2010, 12:16 PM | #8 | |
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Re: Iraq war documents leak shows US is ****ing awful.
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But don't confuse the parlor tricks for creating morale with the fascist dominoes that actually tip us into wars. Anyways being a Dawkins athiest is trite and boring and a waste of your time and thoughts.
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10-27-2010, 02:16 AM | #9 | |||
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Re: Iraq war documents leak shows US is ****ing awful.
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The problem with this is that most people are very deluded about these topics, with very little possibility of encountering a reliable source of information they trust. Quote:
Opinions are what bring out the diversity in people, but that doesn't necessarily lead to aggressive fights. There are plenty of ways of taking advantage of disagreements in positive manners. Quote:
"religion = war" Fallacious. Religion is a set of principles and beliefs. War is simply a means of aggressive disagreement between extremists of each side. These extremists are not usually not accurate representations of the religion itself. 82% of Americans are Christian. Does this imply that these 82% of people are always at war? "war = death" War may cause death, but that doesn't mean they are equivalent. "death = bad" While death is generally considered to be a negative impact on humanity, it is part of the life cycle. Death cannot be so black and white to be immediately classified as "bad," as all things in the universe are to some degree beneficial and detrimental. You merely assume that in the specific case that war is usually bad and causes pointless destruction, that you separate the two cases and then combine them by transitive property, which is fallacious. "religion = bad" So you basically just combined relative concepts that weren't even necessarily true with equal signs, and then mathematically declared them to be the exact same thing, and hence assuming that the transitive property was a legal application here. Despite common sense knowledge about the benefits of religion, moderation in every day life, balance and clear separation between principles of faith and reason, and the eccentricity of special extreme cases, you decide to connect nonsensical arguments and ideas in order to arrive at the final conclusion that you are against religions. Next time, you should look at things from as many perspectives as possible before you judge, and actually apply arguments that make sense. As a person that is against religion, isn't it ironic that you don't actually apply any logic or reasoning to back up your faith-based environmentally-impacted observed opinions?
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10-23-2010, 12:18 PM | #10 |
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Re: Iraq war documents leak shows US is ****ing awful.
If it makes you feel better, I joined the military to go to college.
On topic: Geneva Conventions. I've heard from numerous peers of mine that, when downrange, there are quite a few soldiers that don't follow Geneva Conventions. Which is sad. But I don't think people should blame the entire military on breaches of the Conventions. I was at MEPS (the processing station for the military), and I was sitting with a bunch of kids out of high school. I was talking to them, and the majority of them had the 11B MOS, which in laymen's terms, is an infantryman. Now, I would never take that as my job because I scored too high on ASVAB. But when I asked them why they took infantry as their job, about 95% said that they wanted to either "blow **** up" or "kill terrorists." And that's exactly what they (think they) are doing. |
10-23-2010, 12:20 PM | #11 |
Sectional Moderator
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Re: Iraq war documents leak shows US is ****ing awful.
In your experience would you say that Generation Kill miniseries pretty accurately creates the image of the modern day solider?
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10-23-2010, 12:19 PM | #12 |
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Re: Iraq war documents leak shows US is ****ing awful.
I'm not an American and I admit I don't follow up on much of what's going on in that country. Call me ignorant but I'm just wondering, why is the war still going on?
Common sense has to agree with Fido here. Its obvious 9 years later that this isn't about 911, it isn't about nuclear weapons, or about oil, so why has the Obama administration fail to end this like he said he would? The only thing that this war has done for america is spend billions of tax dollars on a cause that's unclear. It's completely distasteful to read an article like this and know that the people who should be presecuted won't be held accountable. |
10-23-2010, 12:25 PM | #13 | |
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Re: Iraq war documents leak shows US is ****ing awful.
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The war was about "spreading democracy" in the Middle East. Except what we we're trying to do was we we're trying to create a pro-Western government in Iraq that had some sort of weak coalition government because we feared that a majority Shia controlled parliament would end up creating a like-minded political bloc with Iran (hint: this is what happened in the end.) So we're pulling out because we really can't do ****, and they essentially have a "democracy" it's just not the one we preferred for our interests and also not one that will stay a true "democracy" for too long. But we still have people occupying the bases that are strategically located near oil fields. We are still busting up Oil Workers unions, and we are still flooding corporate investment in that seems to be poised to take advantage of the resources and the workers. The more you read about the Middle East the more you see how oil seeps from the pores of conflict.
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Last edited by Vendetta21; 10-23-2010 at 12:38 PM.. |
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10-26-2010, 11:22 PM | #14 |
Old-School Player
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Re: Iraq war documents leak shows US is ****ing awful.
Oh hey. I'm just gonna leave this here.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KXUssG6_Ecc Watch it and perhaps you will learn a few things about the military. Oh, and if you have time, view this as well. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5rXPrfnU3G0 |
10-26-2010, 11:29 PM | #15 |
FFR Veteran
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Re: Iraq war documents leak shows US is ****ing awful.
Does it matter? Complaining about our screw-ups overseas will not get us anywhere. They're the government, they have power that you can not believe. No civilian will stop any of this from happening.
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10-26-2010, 11:53 PM | #16 |
Old-School Player
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Re: Iraq war documents leak shows US is ****ing awful.
Unless we all actually teamed together, but pfft.
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10-27-2010, 12:06 AM | #17 | |
One Among The Fence
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Re: Iraq war documents leak shows US is ****ing awful.
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I absolutely agree with this. No one here is saying that war is not a bad thing, but the chances of billions of people actually banning together to stop this thing is absolutely impossible. The truth is this was started years ago, and now there is no turning back. We will have to continue this war and use our military forces even if this mean there will be more horrible things happening. War cannot be stopped and will always be around. Religion does not = bad. People = bad. Edit: and again this -V
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10-27-2010, 01:01 AM | #18 |
Sectional Moderator
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Re: Iraq war documents leak shows US is ****ing awful.
I can't really pose a counter-argument to isolating yourself from reality because you can't create a great deal of impact. The point really is just trying to increase awareness of your place in existence for it's own sake so you aren't pretending that you're living in a world you are not. All intellectual endeavors are mostly hubris by themselves.
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10-27-2010, 01:06 AM | #19 | |
One Among The Fence
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Re: Iraq war documents leak shows US is ****ing awful.
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10-27-2010, 12:02 AM | #20 |
FFR Player
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Re: Iraq war documents leak shows US is ****ing awful.
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