Survivor (TV show)

[Charu]

Re: Survivor (TV show)

Oh no! I'm so embarrassed!!!!

[Celirra]

Re: Survivor (TV show)

Something that makes me sad that Sonja was voted out so early, and this is never mentioned, or hinted at beyond anything you couldn't possibly see unless you already knew why, but Sonja was on the same tribe as Richard almost certainly because she is a lesbian, and that was meant to push Rudy's buttons. Unfortunately, it just never came up. The whole deal with Richard coming out to the tribe (mainly Rudy and Dirk being the only ones that he's actually coming out to) would've been a lot different with Sonja there as well.

I think it's good that it didn't aggravate him further, at least given the significance of the first season. If it was that drama heavy and such, it may have ended poorly and garnered negative publicity (see: Will in WA), and given how important S1 typically is for a show, it's probably a good thing it didn't work out that way. I think it's also just as lucky that Rudy is... well, not entirely what they expected. There were still some hilarious moments due to the whole homosexual/military situation, but they weren't such in an antagonistic way, which is great I'd say.

Just imagine if someone like Colton (who I hear is actually really cool and such out of the game) was in S1 on Rudy's tribe... then it might have been really bad.

I don't really know much about this, but there were also reward challenges during the time in this episode, as well as the next one, but they didn't make the final cut, and from what I understand the rewards were fairly trivial, as the show hadn't really figured out how to give good rewards. (Compare a reward in season 34, which was literally 10 extra-large pizzas and the end of the pre-merge phase, to a reward later this season, which was literally a single slice of cheese pizza).

I think that's a testament to the shift the game has undertaken; rewards used to be focused heavily on helping your survival, be it mentally or physically. Even the one slice of pizza has that; it gives that connection to home, so to speak. Now with rewards like yacht trips and such being fairly common, it's less about helping survival and more about an actual out-of-game boon. I don't think it's better or worse either way, it's more just another sign of a shift in Survivor.

Focusing on stuff Richard says is one of the best parts about watching the first season, because it really, really shows the extra level that he was thinking on compared to almost everyone else. While I don't agree with this claim, some people say that no one has ever played a better game than he did this first season, and while I think its preposterous, you can see why people say it. There was no blueprint. Pagong had no fucking idea what they were doing, aside from arguably Jenna, depending on your sources. Tagi, for the most part, its clear who was playing the game and who was building a bowling alley in the sand, and even beyond that, you see the mental divide between Richard and the rest of his future alliance. Wiglesworth didn't know how to win, only how to go further. Sue knew how to win, she just didn't have the appeal. Rudy didn't know how to win, just that he had no choice but to stick with an alliance or he'd be a goner. Richard knew how to win, and the remaining episodes really are a Richard en-route to victory highlight reel.

I'll discuss the whole Hatch = best player ever ordeal once I'm done my S1 rewatch, but I'd say that I disagree, though not too heavily. I think it's something that's impossible to really prove the merit of, because no season will be quite like S1 again, as there will always be the so-called blueprint to follow.

If going from a "Richard controlled the masses better than anyone!!", you could easily argue that Boston Rob did the same in RI, maybe even better; I know RI was a shitshow and some say the season was literally designed to give BRob the win, but I don't consider that diminishing of BRob's strengths.

If going from a "He innovated ____ so he's the best!" perspective, then many people did that. Cirie (I think it was her anyways) came up with the splitting votes strategy to avoid getting idol'd; Russell Hantz, love him or hate him, brought a whole new strategy to the game that's been seen often since; Sandra brought and perfected the UTR strategy (mostly UTR anyways), etc etc.

I think it's really impossible to tell if Hatch in S1 was the best player ever, because there will never be another chance to ever compare it fairly, and it's so different from everyone else that it can't even be put on the same level. Just like anyone who invented anything really; it's hard to call them the best at ___ because there's so many factors in place. Is Bill Gates the best OS developer? Did the first brewery make the best beer ever? Sure, neither of these are exactly to the point, but the gist of it is that I don't think it's all that possible to argue whether or not he was the best player ever.

Also you just reminded me that I need to go back to sucks sometime, I really should brush up on my strategy.

Man, this turned out to be longer than I thought it would be.

I love it when things turn out to be longer than I thought.

[Celirra]

Re: Survivor (TV show)

YES CELERY

I've seen almost every season of Survivor, I haven't finished this season yet though thank you for the reminder

I might join you in some rewatching too ^^ I've been wanting to do that

We could totally just like, marathon a season or two one weekend.
Only if it's a good season though

like Cagayan

or Vanuatu

[Celirra]

Re: Survivor (TV show)

I actually have to skip tonight (wow skipping on day 2, smh), because my internet is shit right now so I can't stream episodes.

Oh well, at least it's almost the weekend, so I can make up for it

[the sun fan]

Re: Survivor (TV show)

Cao Boi invented splitting the vote, not Cirie.
Cirie was the first to orchestrate a splitting of the votes that resulted in a plurality, rather than a majority, sending someone home, and this was in the final 6 of Panama.

[Celirra]

Re: Survivor (TV show)

Ah right my bad, I have a habit of giving cirie a ton of credit in general anyways, so that may have clouded my memory. Still, the point stands despite a lack of fact-check

[the sun fan]

Re: Survivor (TV show)

Yeah, I knew what you meant.
I'm just a no-life nerd

[Celirra]

Re: Survivor (TV show)

Actually I thought about it a bit, and I don't think I gave Richard enough credit in that brief best-winners talk; I still retain it's hard to compare, but he's definitely a top tier player. I'd wager there is a good chance he would do very well in a new season if he didn't have his reputation (aka if it was his first game).

also still getting meme'd by internet

[Celirra]

Re: Survivor (TV show)

Season 1, Episode 2: The Generation Gap

Richard’s comment on how, if Rudy knew he were gay it’d be difficult, is interesting. I think it’s interesting that the whole homosexuality talk in this episode went the way it did, in such a comfortingly calm way. It was a nice change of pace from [insert modern politics], and shedding such a positive light on it is really sweet to me. I really respect how Rudy came around so well on his… not necessarily intolerance, but lack of experience maybe…?... in regards to it, and ended up seeing Richard as more than that. Also, such a good Rudy quote:

“Me and Richard got to be pretty good friends… not in a homosexual way, that’s for sure”

I think Rudy is such a sweetie, and how he doesn’t care about how being friends with… someone so taboo within his social circle is a great trait.

I really wonder how the Ramona story would’ve changed if not for her sickness and such, and also wonder what the producers’ intended purpose for her was.

Man, this Greg first confessional, even if not comedic in nature, is so great. It seems so damn forced and stereotypical, as if he’s just reading off a script. Funny guy. If not for the whole pagong’ing element and such of Borneo, I could see him having the charisma to win S1 or other old seasons. “It causes a bit of friction; a bit of chaffing, if you want to put it in island terms.”

As an aside, there’s more mature humour in this season than I remember and than I’m used to in Survivor. I dig it, I like the largely uncut nature.

On another note, I wonder if BB really evolved from E1 to E2, or if it was just convenient editing. It seems like he’s just… much more negative in E2 than E1. It makes sense for the plotline and such and explains well why he got voted home (editing magic!), but I do wish there wasn’t such a drastic shift from positive to OTT NN.

Ramona: “Oh I’ll swallow everything.” will ya now

BB’s intentional losing strategy, whether or not it was for strategic purposes, is the most potentially strategic decision he made I think. Too bad that he’s candidate numero uno to get voted; imagine if someone more well liked proposed it (eg. to get rid of BB). Imagine how they’d be heralded as such a strategist! Truly the Richard Hatch of Borneo. As much as I dislike the whole tonal shift of BB, his ending positive lean is really nice and more well fleshed out than some… “villains” so to speak of newer seasons, in which it’s a case of once negative, always negative. Complex Personality is always good.

I don’t mind the BB vote-off, he probably would’ve gotten on my nerves later on. I feel like Gervaise would’ve gone home if BB didn’t come off as obnoxious and rude(I doubt Ramona would’ve gone home seeing as people excused her poor work ethic by her well-being, bunch of softies!), and I think Gervaise is maybe.. Lucky he was so under the radar, considering he effectively lost the challenge for Pagong (even if it was largely Stacey’s proficiency at swallowing that was a win for Tagi vs a loss for Pagong), which was pretty important for a lot of them, just barely less important than quality of camp life. I like Gervaise though, so no real complaints anyways.

[the sun fan]

Re: Survivor (TV show)

dead thread
plz not be dead, thread

[dAnceguy117]

Re: Survivor (TV show)

im a survivor im not gon give up im not gon stop im gon work harder

[dAnceguy117]

Re: Survivor (TV show)

this is a fun show I watch it with sunfan sometimes and listen to him analyze while I drink beer and nod

[Celirra]

Re: Survivor (TV show)

Season 1, Episode 3: Quest For Food

100% hindsight I know, but note two things from the opening via the Tagi side:

Firstly, the conflict between Rudy and Stacey is emphasized. This is good to take note of because it shows that either there will be some kind of culmination of the argument, and/or one of the two will go home in this episode (effectively reminding the audience of what possible negatives people have, and reminding them of who should be relevant to them this episode).

Second, the reminded characterization of Richard about him being homosexual. Reinforcing the complex nature of the character is often a good sign to tell who would be a winner in editing (why would they waste effort like that on someone who doesn’t go far/win?), especially when he’s nigh the only person with this kind of focus. Also interesting is the resurgence of the Rudy good-guy angle in regards to Richard. The editing that makes the audience like a character (Rudy here) is a good way (notably in old survivor, less consistent in newer seasons) to also figure out who could potentially be going home. Very rarely do good guys go home over an antagonist (unless it’s season-wide antagonism), which draws away from a chance of Rudy being voted off. Pair this with point number one for obvious connections. That said, Stacey had some positivity via editing for winning the challenge, however I’d consider the tie to the person getting the winner’s edit to outweigh the positivity from winning a challenge; the challenge winner must be emphasized, however social elements do not necessarily have to be.

Honestly, Stacey is more game aware than I remember with the Sue not voting with them analysis. That said, I think both Stacey and Sue did a good job in general with the social/strategy dynamic.

TAPIOCA GONE WILD

Something about Dirk preaching christianity to Richard is really… well, I feel like it’s a good example of something that could have gone much more wrong if the people involved weren’t so mellow.

“You don’t meet many 23 year old guys who are virgins” and then the internet era was brought along. Good ol’ 20th century culture.

Anyways, forget the whole Dirk x Richard comment earlier, I forgot that shit hit the fan later on. The dynamic of Dirk becoming scummy via editing (overly preachy, creepy vibes with Kelly, “pent-up sexual frustration”, and now the anti-homosexuality) and against Richard notably draws another pair for rivalry (much like Rudy x Stacey), and also since the popular player is well-known as such and unlikely to be voted off soon (Richard), it shows poorly for the other end of the rivalry (Dirk).

The SUPERPOLE 2000 is hilarious for so many subtle reasons, but to list one it’s really just how proud of it Sean really is despite the silly name. In regards to Sean, similar notes to Dirk with the antagonism against Richard, plus his illustrated pairing with Dirk furthers both of them looking poor hand-in-hand.

Greg is great, his trap is hilarious and just like Sean being big about his pole, Greg being subtly proud of the trap is hilarious too. “Rats aren’t bad, rats are rats” I really hope Greg has pursued rat culinary skills, he seemed very into it and I wonder if he has a good rat gravy recipe.

The idea of being told about a challenge ahead of time and told to build something in preparation is super cool to me, and I wish it was still done. Sure, there’s balance issues with it, but fuck it, it makes for cool challenges.

Colleen is so cute, ahh. Just an aside but it’d be fun to hang out with her and talk with her.

It’s funny how the idea of talking about who to vote for as mentioned by Richard was an unpopular topic, given how integral to Survivor strategy it is in nigh all other seasons.

The conch of truth is the dumbest thing, sure it’s a cute gimmick but gosh is it dumb. I’m glad it didn’t stick. I know Lord of the Flies is a common comparative line and the conch is a nod to that, but even still… not a fan.

Anyways, not a lot to say about Stacey other than she made the (later on common) mistake of being too pushy while also not being terribly useful. From what I’ve seen, it’s usually a sure sign of an early boot both in old and new seasons, but if they can make it beyond the early game it proves to be a relatively fine approach.

[Celirra]

Re: Survivor (TV show)

As an aside this thread will never die, I'm just really busy and such. Gonna try to get a bunch of watching done this weekend since I'm visiting family and will have nothing better to do (EDIT: had no time after all).

Good to see some people are taking an interest in this!

[Travis_Flesher]

Re: Survivor (TV show)

Celirra... Most likely to win a "Survivor" office betting pool.