The Death Penalty

[devonin]

Re: The Death Penalty

I'm curious how you can claim to feel guilt for actions when you insist that ethics and morality don't exist and don't apply to you.

Clearly you have a moral code, or you couldn't feel bad for acting in opposition to it.

[Xx{Midday}xX]

Re: The Death Penalty

Also, ethics and morality seem to be a built-in mindset to human beings. I hate the feeling of "guilt" I feel when I do something "morally wrong." It's a frustrating contradiction. My mind believes that ethics and morality are unnecessary illusions, yet my body reacts to them in the manner most people do.

Haha, sorry, no need to derail any further from the topic, I guess.

Nature is my moral code. And I despise it. I hate the nature of human beings as a whole. I'm a human being, and therefore, am subject to the laws of human nature, regardless of whether I hate the idea or not. Ethics and morality definitely apply to me. I just don't like the fact that it does.

Lol, I'm talking about ethics and morality, 15 minutes before my IB Math Exam XD.

[Zythus]

Re: The Death Penalty

Midday, go express yourself vibrantly in the Misanthropy thread. (LOL)

One is subjected by moral because one is a part of society. And in my opinion, society is contradictory in essence too. It keeps pandemonium out the door, yet, it is also a tacit manifestation of human attributes. The widely accepted forms of "acceptable" ego is mutually agreeable by all members of society.

[devonin]

Re: The Death Penalty

As an aside, because I notice you did it in the misanthropy thread as well:

'Moral' is an adjective. You say "moral codes" or "moral actions" When you want to use it as a noun, it's 'morality'

One is subjected to morality
One is a subject of morality

[Zythus]

Re: The Death Penalty

Dictionary.com Unabridged (v 1.1)
mor·al Pronunciation[mawr-uhl, mor-]
–adjective
1. of, pertaining to, or concerned with the principles or rules of right conduct or the distinction between right and wrong; ethical: moral attitudes.
2. expressing or conveying truths or counsel as to right conduct, as a speaker or a literary work; moralizing: a moral novel.
3. founded on the fundamental principles of right conduct rather than on legalities, enactment, or custom: moral obligations.
4. capable of conforming to the rules of right conduct: a moral being.
5. conforming to the rules of right conduct (opposed to immoral): a moral man.
6. virtuous in sexual matters; chaste.
7. of, pertaining to, or acting on the mind, feelings, will, or character: moral support.
8. resting upon convincing grounds of probability; virtual: a moral certainty.
–noun
9. the moral teaching or practical lesson contained in a fable, tale, experience, etc.
10. the embodiment or type of something.
11. morals, principles or habits with respect to right or wrong conduct.



I believe I justified myself.

[devonin]

Re: The Death Penalty

The noun version of that word is applied in things like

"The moral of the story is"

To say "We are bound by moral" is not correct. Because what you are bound by is a) morality or b) a moral code (Notice how it's being used as an adjective there)

mo·ral·i·ty Audio Help /məˈrælɪti, mɔ-/ Pronunciation Key - Show Spelled Pronunciation[muh-ral-i-tee, maw-] Pronunciation Key - Show IPA Pronunciation
–noun, plural -ties for 4–6. 1. conformity to the rules of right conduct; moral or virtuous conduct.
2. moral quality or character.
3. virtue in sexual matters; chastity.
4. a doctrine or system of morals.
5. moral instruction; a moral lesson, precept, discourse, or utterance.

[Xx{Midday}xX]

Re: The Death Penalty

I agree with devonin about the usage of morality vs. morals. I took the SAT, and I had something similar to that on the test.

What are you guys talking about anyway XD? English Language Arts lol. Quite the aside.

[Zythus]

Re: The Death Penalty

10. the embodiment or type of something.

embodiment means that the moral is a generality for the various collective aspects and rules of morals. So technically, it isn't wrong to say "I am bound by morals"

[devonin]

Re: The Death Penalty

But you said "by moral" not "by morals" you may think of that as only semantics, but since I think it makes the difference between correct and incorrect usage, I stand by my pointing it out.

[ddr_f4n]

Re: The Death Penalty

Getting a little off-topic, aren't we?

Anyways, everyone should have some kind of moral code. Otherwise, we'd all go out committing every kind of sin and break the 10 commandments (if you're not religous, then I'll just that we'd all be evil). This is why we are all human. This is why we control our actions and stay in school. This is why the death penalty is wrong. If we use it, others will think of us without a "strong" moral code. We'd feel bad to kill someone, regardless if he/she is a murdurer or not. Every problem can be solved without killing each other. We are just too lazy to think of a reasonable solution, and don't think that killing is reasonable.

[Zythus]

Re: The Death Penalty

This is like misanthropy thread all over again. And yes Devonin, I'm pondering how to counter your nihilist accusations.

Fair enough to the morals/moral. Might have been a typo since it does sound funny without (s).

[devonin]

Re: The Death Penalty

Anyways, everyone should have some kind of moral code. Otherwise, we'd all go out committing every kind of sin and break the 10 commandments (if you're not religous, then I'll just that we'd all be evil).

The misanthropy thread has some great things to say about the consequences of concluding that there is no such thing as morality.

Since you pretty much can't argue for an actual -objective- morality without also arguing functionally for the existence of a God or some other being to be your objective source of what is right or wrong, any ethical code we develop is necessarily subjective as a consequence.

People decide what they personally and collectively as a group want to call right and wrong, and that is their moral code. Since they are completely subjective, there really aren't grounds to question someone else's code without appealing to your own subjective ethics. If you think human sacrifice is okay, the only way I can tell you that it isn't is to say "I don't think it's okay" But why is my opinion any stronger than yours since we have no objective source of morality in the universe to appeal to?

[megmeg06]

Re: The Death Penalty

I have to take the side of Jefferson and Locke when they stated that all men have inalienable rights; life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness/property. I agree with Locke when he said that everyone is born “Tabula rasa”, and if everyone is born a blank slate then everyone would be of the same value when they are born and should therefore have the same rights. No one should be denied these rights if they don’t deny someone else these rights.
As to the question, “why is my opinion any stronger than yours since we have no objective source of morality in the universe to appeal to?” Like I said I agree with Locke, everyone is born a blank slate and only through our environments are we made different in mind. Through experiences minds are made stronger or smarter. Following the law of nature, we are under the code of “survival of the fittest”, those with stronger minds are going to dominate the others and with more experiences, comes more knowledge, and with more knowledge one can make more informed decisions which are of a greater value.

[devonin]

Re: The Death Penalty

If we are following the code of survival of the fittest, how can you possibly reconcile that with the claim that we all have the same rights?

Same rights for everybody espouses "survival of everybody, regardless of how fit" which is rather contradictory to simply "survival of the fittest"

[JonXia]

Re: The Death Penalty

I'd like to point out that the ideas of Jefferson and Locke and other great thinker and philosophers are just IDEAS not facts, in fact a lot of the time these ideas are drastically different.

We can all try to claim that I have "this right and that right" but we cannot possibly know what rights we actually have except to live or die since they are default (i.e you are living now, you are gonna die)