Serious Judging System Suggestion

Re: Serious Judging System Suggestion

We are actually in the process of reconstructing the system so that it does become a bit more manageable. The lateness in the previous batch was absolutely inexcusable, and we're all aware of that.

I personally am not fond of a SAP reset as a simfile artist being that it was relatively difficult for me to find time to chart, and I don't want my cap to be dropped at all. Others might not share the same sentiments as I do, though.

Another potential issue with this: the simfile artists who frequently get their files accepted with high SAPs are being choked down due to a reset, which means acceptance rates on the first few batches could be substantially lower to the point where we might not support file releases. Looking at this current acceptance list here, we had 52 files accepted and eligible for SAP. Out of those 52 files, 42 of them come from artists who have (or NOW have) enough SAP to submit four files.

If for any reason FFR wants to revert back to six files per weekly release (and I really hope we don't shift this way), we would need at least 24 files to sustain a month's worth of releases. Resetting people's SAP effectively reduces the files by half (potentially more with our 5-cap artists) in a batch period.

Either way, there is a lot to be weighed in.

Re: Serious Judging System Suggestion

heck no

recent batch delays were caused by tons of coinciding personal failures, not due to simfile volume

Re: Serious Judging System Suggestion

Don't reset SAP. Eliminate it. Cap ALL personal submissions 2 two files per batch per person.

>but people can make multiple accounts and exploit it

Well we can check IPs for new, unknown simfile artists. If an IP matches a person with another account, completely disregard the submissions from the new account

I may not have a high SAP and may not be able to submit as many files as other people right now, but as a second person who has a ton of files in the game and obviously cares or cared about the amount of simfiles submitted (me and hi19 being the other so far in this thread), I would rather have QUALITY over QUANTITY. Lowering the cap to 2 files no matter what will force people to submit their best files. That means less files to judge, and less of a chance shitty files make it into the game.

Re: Serious Judging System Suggestion

This. Pretty much that.


Like, if the cap was removed I would send a shit ton of files, chances are they would be 5-7 rating. However, I rather be limited and try to push for 7-9's.

Like, if anything adjusting the cap would be better by like adding +1 file per whatever, instead of removing it ONLY if there is a significant lack of files.

Re: Serious Judging System Suggestion

quality and quantity aren't mutually exclusive

Re: Serious Judging System Suggestion

...or you could just push for 7-9's even without a cap?

If you are aware that an abundance of effortless charts have become a problem, then try to show effort yourself.

Re: Serious Judging System Suggestion

I've never submitted, and nor have I participated in a batch, but this seems like the most solid idea in terms of infrastructure of the system, but also removes the reward aspect which is bad for incentive to step... but I like it.

Edit: And as xiz has stated more openings lower quality as well! this is bad. 2 is a good number, will make people try really hard to get 1/2 or 2/2 files to be super-ballers.

Re: Serious Judging System Suggestion

If that method reduces the amount of files submitted, it will also reduce the amount of files released on a weekly basis. That is one more good thing. I have 700 or so AAA's and have played around 1200 files in the current game. The amount of files I have to play to catch up and have my average rank and other stats be what they should be, makes this game incredibly intimidating to play now. If I feel this way, just imagine what people new to the game would feel like once they figure out how rankings are calculated

Yeah I took breaks for long periods of time and it is my fault there is so much shit on the plate for me to deal with if I want to look competitive again, but you guys were releasing 6 files per week at times before the official tournaments. Really? Yeah yeah trying to drain the queue

If we placed a hard cap of 2 files per batch and released 3 files per week for the next few YEARS, I don't think one person would complain

Re: Serious Judging System Suggestion

No..

If a higher standard is needed, stricter judging/acceptance cutoffs can be implemented, not restricting everybody's submission caps. It's quite possible to make more than 2 "super-baller" files per period, and stepartists' intention shouldn't be to send as many files as possible to the batch when you KNOW they aren't good.

So one of the cons is Rebirth0 is intimidated by more charts in the game. What about the pros, such as: more charts in the game? Seriously, I'm being really blunt here, but I'm really confused by these arguments.

Re: Serious Judging System Suggestion

I'm just going to cut this argument short and say that the restructure that is being worked on is likely not going to be reducing the number of files that people can submit. As it was said earlier in this thread, quality and quantity are not correlative in this case. All reducing the cap does is spreads out the higher quality files that people finish in longer intervals. If you were to finish files 1, 2, 3, and 4, with files 2 and 3 being the best quality, you would opt into sending 2/3 first and then 1/4 second since they're all finished files intended for submission. Simply assuming that the files will be thrown away because people have to choose between submissions is an illogical implication.

Re: Serious Judging System Suggestion

You'd hope the judges are competent enough to realize files 1 and 4 are lesser quality and would reject them. Implementing this submission cap would lower the number of files needing to be judged, and would lower the amount of judges, making better decisions more likely to happen, assuming the right judges are in place

And if you really think you want to let people submit 5+ files per batch, then enforce stricter judging. Right now if I was judging a 70 file batch, I would tell myself "I AM ONLY ACCEPTING X AMOUNT OF FILES." There will be deserving files that would be left out, but that's why you're called a judge. Make the decision to pick the absolute best files.

It makes it a two round judging process, but it is a good method. That's somewhat how it was done when me, jimerax, and Tass were the only judges. Tass was simply the "head" judge and judged only the files we accepted and determined what would go in the game based on those. (I definitely wish me or jimerax were the ones with final say, but it was Tass and Tass always knew best)

Re: Serious Judging System Suggestion

It had nothing to do with judges at all. It had to do with people submitting files that they completed. If files 1/4 are sitting in reserve and are the weaker of the files, they're eventually going to be submitted and eventually get rejected, as you just said. You shot yourself in the foot with your own point, Rebirth.

At your bolded point: NO. This is completely senseless; setting a fixed amount of accepted files is beyond acceptable. Whether you want to realize it or not, the community as whole, as improving at their simfiling rhetoric. There is no reason to stifle the amount of files accepted because of forcefully restrictive judging -- there's a reason why people with 5 file submission caps can submit that much: they've proven to be really strong simfile artists. I for one am not going to sit here and disallow files from people who have worked their way up to submit a larger amount of files because they have consistently provided good quality to the game.

That is highly subjective, and we're not going to delve into that any further.

That was then, and this is now. Things have changed, and the process is more streamlined with a larger group of people that can be split into smaller groups. I wasn't a fan of how Tass was responsible for dictating the final say of what got in game -- he was very subjective and would reject files for really unfair reasons, and that's not how things are going to be run over here.

Re: Serious Judging System Suggestion

My argument is geared towards lowering the amount of files that go into the game, partly because the game is getting too massive, partly because there are still pretty weak files getting into the game, and partly because your judges shat themselves, my guess because there are too many files to judge. I never said, and I don't even have the authority right now to say, any of my ideas are going to be implemented. But you're also refusing to acknowledge my points could actually be an issue with the game. That's a very Tass-like tendency.

Your streamline method obviously doesn't work anymore either as your judge group completely blew up from what seems like being overworked. I'm sorry my old and broken ideas aren't to your liking

When game managing and judging I acted on behalf of the community, with the communities thoughts in mind. That's how I still act. Ask the community how you should do this going forward. I think simfile artists would understand if submissions were capped to give judges less of a hard time

Re: Serious Judging System Suggestion

Perhaps I was unclear.

I don't send shitty charts. I work hard to produce good charts. (Sure they might come back bad but I still work on 'em to fix them)

I was talking about people as a whole if that opportunity was open.