Mother of god?

flashMaster10 · 03-24-2007, 10:00 PM

i was playing mother of god and i got thinking. for the people that think jesus is god, how can there be a mother of god? discuss

**blindreper1179** · 03-24-2007, 10:05 PM

if jesus is god. then virgin mary is the mother of god.

IaMtHeEaStErBuNnY · 03-24-2007, 10:07 PM

dude i tried one of these god issues last night, look at the thread "what IF god was one of us?"... they get a bit touchy on this subject, obviously they assume were trying to start controversy instead of GENUINELY trying to have an intelligent conversation... some ppl can just be petty... supremely petty... i can just guess that this thread will be closed in a lil while, with some degrading comment from a mod telling you that this isnt suitable material for a post... but u know what, at least we tried...

but to the question, before this is closed, im not exactly sure about it... im an athiest... i dont believe in any god or higher power... but it does get you to thinking about the validity and history of it all... if god is the supreme being, the first... the creator of all life and the cosmos, etc... how could there be a mother of god... certainly she would reign even more supreme right??? so in fact SHE would be god... its a good question flash... whats your point on it???

RandomPscho · 03-24-2007, 10:17 PM

I think most theists would say god has been and always will be so there is no need for a 'mother.' A mother in this case is the equivalent to a creator...

slipstrike0159 · 03-24-2007, 10:17 PM

Here's my take on it, some religions believe that there is infact a heavenly mother with a heavenly father (God) and that she is just not discussed because it would only allow us to use her name in vain like society does so often with God's name. Also, i dont know what to believe on the matter, but it could be possible for God to have parents if you believe in the Mormon plan of salvation and an infinite past. So in my opinion, yes, there could be a mother of God but it is a touchy subject because everyones belief on the matter comes from their own assumptions and connections since there is no book that i know that speaks of it (nothing like the bible or the book of mormon is what i meant).

IaMtHeEaStErBuNnY · 03-24-2007, 10:23 PM

hmmm... interesting take on the mormon POV... and i do believe to this day people do take both god and the MOG name in vain... ive heard a couple times the phrase "oh heavenly mother of god........." and such... but in fact, if what i said before might be true, and the MOG is the ultimate, she would in fact be god and jesus would in fact BE the god that has been revered... i dunno if that makes any sense to the rest of you, but in my mind it kinda does... idk... this is a thinker lol... props flash!!!

**Neonatrias** · 03-25-2007, 04:32 AM

I was raised a Catholic, and do still believe in a sort of high power, but cannot justifiably claim to be a Catholic. Still, I'll do my best to explain my take on this.

As I was taught it, Jesus is a part of the Trinity -- that is, God the Father, God the Son, and the Holy Spirit (I'm not sure if this can be 'God the Holy Spirit.' I've never heard it as such.). Catholicism simply labels these into God, Christ, and the Holy Spirit. Supposedly three sections of the same being, each with different purposes. From what I can figure (Prayers, Biblical teachings, etc.), the Father -- God -- is the creator, residing in Heaven and supposedly answering all our prayers in some way or other. The Holy Spirit is on earth at this moment, and will only return to Heaven at the end of time.

Christ, the Son, is still God. Catholicism teaches that he was also human. 100% God, and 100% human. Strange, illogical, but that's the way the teaching is, so we'll assume that to be true for the purposes here. Obviously, if Christ is going to be walking around on earth, he would need a physical body, yes? Therefore, when we apply the term "Mother of God" to Mary, we mean that Mary gave birth to Christ's physical being. The spirit of Christ had already existed, as a part of God -- that part was not "born."

Make sense, kind of?

Also, on the terms of an actual "mother of God" (That is, one God, one ultimate deity, born by another being) there are a number of philosophical arguments regarding God. One of the most common concerns the necessity of a "first mover." It argues that the universe operates on consistent causes and effects, sort of like dominoes. However, if we look back to this first mover -- God -- who started God? The first mover must have had someone move him, right?

Most arguments for the existence of God hit a roadblock when it comes to the "beginning of time." It's simply because we cannot comprehend what we do not experience -- No human has ever experienced anything outside of existence. If we knew what things were like before the "beginning," we might have a clearer view or some idea on which to define our "first mover."

I know this post went off on a lot of tangents, but I tried to encompass everything within the original post, given that it did leave open a lot of loose ends.

Reighn · 03-25-2007, 10:35 AM

Neonatrias,

Nice, breaking out St. Thomas Aquinas on the people, lol. The Five proofs are interesting to say the least. They argue that everything has rhyme and reason and did have a begining, atleast our physical universe. Nothing moves without a mover, nothing creates itself without a creator, contingent beings and necessary being must coexist for survival, the degrees of perfection, and lastly, the laws of nature, physics, everything work on such a complex level, there had to be an intelligent designer.

rel89 · 03-25-2007, 10:47 AM

And here I thought this was a thread about the song 'Mother of God'.
Good song.

Chrissi · 03-25-2007, 11:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by IaMtHeEaStErBuNnY

dude i tried one of these god issues last night, look at the thread "what IF god was one of us?"... they get a bit touchy on this subject, obviously they assume were trying to start controversy instead of GENUINELY trying to have an intelligent conversation... some ppl can just be petty... supremely petty...

Actually, it's because your thread was retarded and was not critical thinking.

pntballa18 · 03-25-2007, 01:25 PM

Does anyone think Jesus is God?

GuidoHunter · 03-25-2007, 01:58 PM

Easter, quit being a baby and keep your crying out of here.

Quote:

Originally Posted by pntballa18

Does anyone think Jesus is God?

That's like saying "Is anyone Christian?" What was the point of that question?

Neon got most of what needed to be said. Jesus is God, Mary was chosen by God to give birth to Jesus, and then did. As such, Mary is the virgin mother of God.

Now, if you are talking about the mother of the triune God, well, that just falls into the realm of complete speculation, kind of like, "If red weren't red, what color would it be?" That's not really a topic for discussion...

--Guido

http://andy.mikee385.com

pntballa18 · 03-25-2007, 02:00 PM

Christians believe that Jesus is the son of God, not that he is God himself.

RB_Dreamscanner · 03-25-2007, 02:02 PM

god needs a mother, and gods mothers mother needs a mother and so on lol

GuidoHunter · 03-25-2007, 02:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pntballa18

Christians believe that Jesus is the son of God, not that he is God himself.

You clearly don't know much about Christianity, then.

Yeah, a regular human John Doe was born of a virgin and performed many miracles such as curing blindness and leprosy, creating food, and raising people from the dead.

Totally not God.

--Guido

http://andy.mikee385.com

rel89 · 03-25-2007, 02:07 PM

Jesus=God=Satan

flashMaster10 · 03-26-2007, 08:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GuidoHunter

You clearly don't know much about Christianity, then.

Yeah, a regular human John Doe was born of a virgin and performed many miracles such as curing blindness and leprosy, creating food, and raising people from the dead.

Totally not God.

--Guido

http://andy.mikee385.com

guido i usually agree with you but... in christianity, jesus is not god and he is god. the old testament says he isnt. catholics say he is. just like in islam sunnis say mohhamed is the prophet but shia's believe in ali as the prophet.

**FishFishRevolution** · 03-26-2007, 09:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GuidoHunter

You clearly don't know much about Christianity, then.

Yeah, a regular human John Doe was born of a virgin and performed many miracles such as curing blindness and leprosy, creating food, and raising people from the dead.

Totally not God.

--Guido

http://andy.mikee385.com

Actually lots of christians believe in another God as well as Jesus. Which is kind of funny because they still consider themselves monothestic.

goat6707 · 03-26-2007, 10:16 AM

hmm... God's mom must not be that grand, for she didn't do much but birth a good son

Einstein's mom
Moses's mom
Hitler's mom
Shakespeare's mom

Mother's arent an important part of history, just the fart that meets the match to create relevant entertainment.

slipstrike0159 · 04-1-2007, 11:07 PM

I will say this, in the Mormon view of things Christ is not God. It was said that in premortality, Christ was chosen to come to Earth and atone for our sins as well as establishing the true church. Lucifer was also up for nomination so to say for the position of being the savior but in his viewpoint he wanted to come down and have glory unto himself and MAKE everyone righteous so to speak. Christ however expressed that he would give all glory unto God almighty and would atone for the sins of the world so that we may repent and live with God and Christ again. This supports the idea of Monotheism in that Christ was chosen to come down and be the literal physical son of God and with powers bestowed unto him through God by means of blessings he was able to help heal the people on Earth with such powers. Now these powers (although not as potent) can also be referred to as the priesthood as in the Mormon church. All miracles are then essentially described as coming directly from God through a medium (Christ) to the physical world. Thus showing that Christ himself is indeed not God. However, it is also believed that after leading a righteous life and doing all that God asks you will reach the highest stage of the celestial kingdom as described in the Mormon Plan of Salvation in which place you and your eternal spouse will become as God's, being able to create planets and stars such as God can. If you think of it like this then you can see that perhaps the God we know of is such a being that has reached the highest degree of glory in which he can create life and planets. Such thinking would lead someone to conclude that God has a spouse. You could then ASSUME as it has not been stated anywhere that God could have been a child of his Heavenly Father and Heavenly Mother. However, this is a shaky matter because no where does it say that God was not created from another being (no where that i know of that is) and there is every reason to believe that is the first and the last. Concluding that God has a mother then is purely an individual assumption and personal belief.
Many of the things i have discussed have come from me and not necessarily the church itself. Do not think to quote me and assume that what i said is what all mormons believe for i used my own knowledge and did not quote directly any piece of doctrine. As for my opinion, i do not believe that God has a mother but i do not hold that to be a fact and i leave the possibility open in my mind.

03-24-2007, 10:00 PM	#1
flashMaster10 FFR Player Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 144	Mother of god? i was playing mother of god and i got thinking. for the people that think jesus is god, how can there be a mother of god? discuss

03-24-2007, 10:07 PM	#3
IaMtHeEaStErBuNnY FFR Player Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: in some rabbit hole... BK new york lol Age: 34 Posts: 131	Re: Mother of god? dude i tried one of these god issues last night, look at the thread "what IF god was one of us?"... they get a bit touchy on this subject, obviously they assume were trying to start controversy instead of GENUINELY trying to have an intelligent conversation... some ppl can just be petty... supremely petty... i can just guess that this thread will be closed in a lil while, with some degrading comment from a mod telling you that this isnt suitable material for a post... but u know what, at least we tried... but to the question, before this is closed, im not exactly sure about it... im an athiest... i dont believe in any god or higher power... but it does get you to thinking about the validity and history of it all... if god is the supreme being, the first... the creator of all life and the cosmos, etc... how could there be a mother of god... certainly she would reign even more supreme right??? so in fact SHE would be god... its a good question flash... whats your point on it??? __________________ Now owning 24/7... your friend, [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC], the Easter Bunny...

03-24-2007, 10:17 PM	#4
RandomPscho FFR Player Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: New York Age: 32 Posts: 504	Re: Mother of god? I think most theists would say god has been and always will be so there is no need for a 'mother.' A mother in this case is the equivalent to a creator...

03-24-2007, 10:17 PM	#5
slipstrike0159 FFR Player Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: In the shadows behind you with my assassin's blade waiting to strike Posts: 568	Re: Mother of god? Here's my take on it, some religions believe that there is infact a heavenly mother with a heavenly father (God) and that she is just not discussed because it would only allow us to use her name in vain like society does so often with God's name. Also, i dont know what to believe on the matter, but it could be possible for God to have parents if you believe in the Mormon plan of salvation and an infinite past. So in my opinion, yes, there could be a mother of God but it is a touchy subject because everyones belief on the matter comes from their own assumptions and connections since there is no book that i know that speaks of it (nothing like the bible or the book of mormon is what i meant). __________________

03-24-2007, 10:23 PM	#6
IaMtHeEaStErBuNnY FFR Player Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: in some rabbit hole... BK new york lol Age: 34 Posts: 131	Re: Mother of god? hmmm... interesting take on the mormon POV... and i do believe to this day people do take both god and the MOG name in vain... ive heard a couple times the phrase "oh heavenly mother of god........." and such... but in fact, if what i said before might be true, and the MOG is the ultimate, she would in fact be god and jesus would in fact BE the god that has been revered... i dunno if that makes any sense to the rest of you, but in my mind it kinda does... idk... this is a thinker lol... props flash!!! __________________ Now owning 24/7... your friend, [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC], the Easter Bunny...

03-25-2007, 04:32 AM	#7
Neonatrias MAЯISA Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: Urbana, IL Age: 36 Posts: 919	Re: Mother of god? I was raised a Catholic, and do still believe in a sort of high power, but cannot justifiably claim to be a Catholic. Still, I'll do my best to explain my take on this. As I was taught it, Jesus is a part of the Trinity -- that is, God the Father, God the Son, and the Holy Spirit (I'm not sure if this can be 'God the Holy Spirit.' I've never heard it as such.). Catholicism simply labels these into God, Christ, and the Holy Spirit. Supposedly three sections of the same being, each with different purposes. From what I can figure (Prayers, Biblical teachings, etc.), the Father -- God -- is the creator, residing in Heaven and supposedly answering all our prayers in some way or other. The Holy Spirit is on earth at this moment, and will only return to Heaven at the end of time. Christ, the Son, is still God. Catholicism teaches that he was also human. 100% God, and 100% human. Strange, illogical, but that's the way the teaching is, so we'll assume that to be true for the purposes here. Obviously, if Christ is going to be walking around on earth, he would need a physical body, yes? Therefore, when we apply the term "Mother of God" to Mary, we mean that Mary gave birth to Christ's physical being. The spirit of Christ had already existed, as a part of God -- that part was not "born." Make sense, kind of? Also, on the terms of an actual "mother of God" (That is, one God, one ultimate deity, born by another being) there are a number of philosophical arguments regarding God. One of the most common concerns the necessity of a "first mover." It argues that the universe operates on consistent causes and effects, sort of like dominoes. However, if we look back to this first mover -- God -- who started God? The first mover must have had someone move him, right? Most arguments for the existence of God hit a roadblock when it comes to the "beginning of time." It's simply because we cannot comprehend what we do not experience -- No human has ever experienced anything outside of existence. If we knew what things were like before the "beginning," we might have a clearer view or some idea on which to define our "first mover." I know this post went off on a lot of tangents, but I tried to encompass everything within the original post, given that it did leave open a lot of loose ends. __________________

03-25-2007, 10:35 AM	#8
Reighn FFR Player Join Date: Mar 2007 Posts: 4	Re: Mother of god? Neonatrias, Nice, breaking out St. Thomas Aquinas on the people, lol. The Five proofs are interesting to say the least. They argue that everything has rhyme and reason and did have a begining, atleast our physical universe. Nothing moves without a mover, nothing creates itself without a creator, contingent beings and necessary being must coexist for survival, the degrees of perfection, and lastly, the laws of nature, physics, everything work on such a complex level, there had to be an intelligent designer.

03-25-2007, 10:47 AM	#9
rel89 FFR Player Join Date: May 2006 Location: Minnesota Age: 35 Posts: 2,046	Re: Mother of god? And here I thought this was a thread about the song 'Mother of God'. Good song.

03-25-2007, 01:25 PM	#11
pntballa18 FFR Player Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Hossin Age: 32 Posts: 3,357	Re: Mother of god? Does anyone think Jesus is God? __________________

03-25-2007, 02:00 PM	#13
pntballa18 FFR Player Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Hossin Age: 32 Posts: 3,357	Re: Mother of god? Christians believe that Jesus is the son of God, not that he is God himself. __________________

03-25-2007, 02:02 PM	#14
RB_Dreamscanner ☭Retired Top One Hander☭ Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: New York. Age: 30 Posts: 1,789	Re: Mother of god? god needs a mother, and gods mothers mother needs a mother and so on lol __________________ "The Communist vision is the vision of man without God" Retired, Finished at rank 295, Top one hander on FFR

03-25-2007, 02:07 PM	#16
rel89 FFR Player Join Date: May 2006 Location: Minnesota Age: 35 Posts: 2,046	Re: Mother of god? Jesus=God=Satan

03-26-2007, 10:16 AM	#19
goat6707 FFR Player Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: Yellow Jacket Country Age: 35 Posts: 114	Re: Mother of god? hmm... God's mom must not be that grand, for she didn't do much but birth a good son Einstein's mom Moses's mom Hitler's mom Shakespeare's mom Mother's arent an important part of history, just the fart that meets the match to create relevant entertainment.

04-1-2007, 11:07 PM	#20
slipstrike0159 FFR Player Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: In the shadows behind you with my assassin's blade waiting to strike Posts: 568	Re: Mother of god? I will say this, in the Mormon view of things Christ is not God. It was said that in premortality, Christ was chosen to come to Earth and atone for our sins as well as establishing the true church. Lucifer was also up for nomination so to say for the position of being the savior but in his viewpoint he wanted to come down and have glory unto himself and MAKE everyone righteous so to speak. Christ however expressed that he would give all glory unto God almighty and would atone for the sins of the world so that we may repent and live with God and Christ again. This supports the idea of Monotheism in that Christ was chosen to come down and be the literal physical son of God and with powers bestowed unto him through God by means of blessings he was able to help heal the people on Earth with such powers. Now these powers (although not as potent) can also be referred to as the priesthood as in the Mormon church. All miracles are then essentially described as coming directly from God through a medium (Christ) to the physical world. Thus showing that Christ himself is indeed not God. However, it is also believed that after leading a righteous life and doing all that God asks you will reach the highest stage of the celestial kingdom as described in the Mormon Plan of Salvation in which place you and your eternal spouse will become as God's, being able to create planets and stars such as God can. If you think of it like this then you can see that perhaps the God we know of is such a being that has reached the highest degree of glory in which he can create life and planets. Such thinking would lead someone to conclude that God has a spouse. You could then ASSUME as it has not been stated anywhere that God could have been a child of his Heavenly Father and Heavenly Mother. However, this is a shaky matter because no where does it say that God was not created from another being (no where that i know of that is) and there is every reason to believe that is the first and the last. Concluding that God has a mother then is purely an individual assumption and personal belief. Many of the things i have discussed have come from me and not necessarily the church itself. Do not think to quote me and assume that what i said is what all mormons believe for i used my own knowledge and did not quote directly any piece of doctrine. As for my opinion, i do not believe that God has a mother but i do not hold that to be a fact and i leave the possibility open in my mind. __________________ Last edited by slipstrike0159; 04-1-2007 at 11:09 PM..

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