How come god created the tree of knowledge?

[Leatherhead]

that wasn't the same thing :I

[Doug31]

I hope anyone that's old enough to be on this site that answered, "Whats the bible?" was trying to be funny. Anyway, I've never even read it, but I still don't believe it.
P.S. there should be an apostrophe in "Whats" in the poll.

[sjoecool1991]

God did know eve would eat from the tree, He's omniscient.

[RandomPscho]

God did know eve would eat from the tree, He's omniscient.

Then you must ask why he would make a 'test' if he already knew the outcome, and what he would do after.

[slipstrike0159]

Because if he didnt give us the opportunity to make our own mistakes then we would be doing what satan wanted which was to force all of us to be righteous. Plus the fact that all life is as a test, and how would you like to have a teacher give you a test and then immediately give it away before you looked at it and told you that you got a C when you sure you were going to do well?

[RandomPscho]

Because if he didnt give us the opportunity to make our own mistakes then we would be doing what satan wanted which was to force all of us to be righteous.

Is he really giving an opportunity if the outcome is already predetermined?

Plus the fact that all life is as a test, and how would you like to have a teacher give you a test and then immediately give it away before you looked at it and told you that you got a C when you sure you were going to do well?

But he would already know before you even take the 'test' how you did, what you did right and wrong, and the consequences. The choices in the test are an illusion because the outcome is already known and inevitable.

[slipstrike0159]

Look, it is not 'predetermined'. It doesnt happen or it isnt chosen to happen before it actually does, but because of his omnipotence he isnt limited to being in one time period, he knows what will happen but that doesnt mean he can or will change it. It also goes back to a discussion i was having earlier, if he would have not even let us take the 'test' then there would be no outcome because it wouldnt have happened.

[RandomPscho]

Maybe I am not understanding something. Could you please explain to me how if the outcome is already known, how is it not predetermined? He already knows what your choice will be, so it is not really a choice that you are making, only an illusion of one.

[slipstrike0159]

You are still making the decision to go through with the action regardless if you know the outcome or not. No one 'determined' what would happen before hand, he just know all that is, was, and will be. If you yourself still dont take the action to produce the outcome that someone already knew would happen, then there wouldnt be the result that was known ahead of time in which case he would know that you didnt make that decision making it still your choice. Its like if you knew that when your friend mixed two elements that they would explode, regardless of if you knew before or not, it still happens if he chooses to do it or not. And besides, he doesnt tell us because if we didnt experience it ourselves then we would learn anything. What is life? a learning experience in which you use that knowledge to pass the 'test'.

[RandomPscho]

But he would already know whether or not you do the action, and whether or not you change your mind to do the action before any of this occurs, so you changing what you think will happen is already known.

Its like if you knew that when your friend mixed two elements that they would explode, regardless of if you knew before or not, it still happens if he chooses to do it or not.

But you are forgetting if I was god I would already know what he was going to do, as I am all knowing. I would know if he chooses to mix the elements or not and what would be the result of whichever I know he will choose.

I am not talking about him intervening or him making us learn our own lessons etc.

[slipstrike0159]

Originally Posted by RandomPscho

Then you must ask why he would make a 'test' if he already knew the outcome, and what he would do after.

Is he really giving an opportunity if the outcome is already predetermined?

Im sorry, maybe i misread what you were trying to ask. From what i understood, i thought you were wondering whether an opportunity was given or not and what he would do after. Well... you cant deny that the opportunity was given because obviously you wouldnt be any sort of an individual thinker if you didnt, and the whole point is to make your own mistakes and learn from them. Then, what he does after is judge us on our bad decisions (which he knew would do) but then determine whether or not we should be punished for them decided upon what we did to repent for it because of what we learned from making the wrong decision and for learning why it was the wrong decision in hopes to not make it again.

[Laharl]

God is, contrary to what your parents told you, not omniscient. If your pastor tells you that he's omniscient, tell him that he is wrong.

The reason we have free will is simply because we do. It's a necessary part of being able to think, period. God created us to be able to think, therefore, we have free will. He can't take that away from us without changing the types of beings we are. If He cannot control our will, He cannot know everything. Free will isn't free if it's destiny.

Now, what about predetermination? There is a fine line between that and destiny. Destiny means it will happen. Predestination means God tasked you with doing something and He's as sure as someone can possibly be that you will do whatever task it is because He understands your core being. However, you have free will. You can go against it, which means someone else will have to rise up to take that place, whether it be immediately or sometime later in the future.

There's a difference between knowing all things and having all knowledge.

[Nikkis]

I have to disagree with you Laharl. If you say that free will can't exist if it's destiny, then I suppose I don't believe in free will. I believe it's all a divine plan for some great outcome of eternal peace on Earth. I believe we can do whatever we want, but no matter what we do, we follow our destiny. Whether God knows every little thing that's going to happen, I think he knows the general outcomes, like the predetermination. I haven't given it too much thought yet.

-Nikkis

[slipstrike0159]

Originally Posted by Laharl

Now, what about predetermination? There is a fine line between that and destiny. Destiny means it will happen. Predestination means God tasked you with doing something and He's as sure as someone can possibly be that you will do whatever task it is because He understands your core being. However, you have free will. You can go against it, which means someone else will have to rise up to take that place, whether it be immediately or sometime later in the future.

There's a difference between knowing all things and having all knowledge.

Well i agree in the fact that predetermination means it was given as a task or it was told before hand. That though isnt the same as knowing it will happen but not saying anything or establishing that it will.

[Leatherhead]

free will has been given to all people for they don't have to worship God, he wanted people who would CHOOSE to follow not because they had to, so he gave them free will, to see who are the followers and who chooses to ignore him. Destiny is pre-determined fate, right? Well, you still have free will, you just don't know what your fate is, so if your fate was to die in an automobile crash, you wouldn't know, so let's say you found out and chose to walk, WHOOPS, person ran a red light and slams into you while crossing in the cross walk. BOOM DEAD

Say you choose to ride the bus, right when you get off, WHAM, drunk driver.
Say you decided to drive, WHOOPS, same guy who ran the red light and slammed into you. God knows all, he knew you before you were born, he knew how you'd grow up, who you date, how you behave, how you die. Just because your fate was determined before you were born doesn't mean you have no free will.

[Laharl]

yes it does.

You can't have free will if something is fated to happen. If ANYONE literally knows POSITIVELY WITHOUT FAIL each and everything that will EVER happen, there is no such thing as free will because we're just acting out said person's will and not our own. Everything we think and do is therefore known, if it's fate, and is not free.

The concept of free will is that we are able to have someone ask us a question and be able to say "Yes" or "No" depending on our own whims. "Do you believe in God?" I can say yes or no, regardless of what I actually feel. You can't determine my answer before hand. I haven't thought of it yet. You can have an educated guess based on what you know about me, but you can't be positive until I say it.

Understand?

God doesn't know who each and every person that "will be saved" (for lack of a better term) will be until they absolutely finish their life. It's not possible for Him to know.

[slipstrike0159]

Ha! you are talking about what is and what is not possible for God to do? He does know because he is not limited to be in any part of time because time is an earthly measurement of how things age.

[hairyhabenaro]

I'm sure i'm repeating what someone else already said, but i'm too tired and lazy to go check.

One of God's personality traits is justice. Putting the tree of the knowledge of good and bad allowed Adam and Eve and their future offspring to show respect and thankfulness to their creator who gave them everything. Satan, who had givven humans nothing, challenged God's authority to rule, and lied to Eve to get her to also rebel against God. Now God (because it's only fair) is allowing mankind to rule themselves.

[shazam_2011]

Originally Posted by hairyhabenaro

I'm sure i'm repeating what someone else already said, but i'm too tired and lazy to go check.

One of God's personality traits is justice. Putting the tree of the knowledge of good and bad allowed Adam and Eve and their future offspring to show respect and thankfulness to their creator who gave them everything. Satan, who had givven humans nothing, challenged God's authority to rule, and lied to Eve to get her to also rebel against God. Now God (because it's only fair) is allowing mankind to rule themselves.

VAlkyrie Profile took what I wrote a half page paper on, and put it into a single sentence:

GODS DO NOT HAVE HUMAN TRAITS.

God is described as a force outside time and space, not an actual conscious being, although when people claim to speak with God, they claim to see a normal person no less distinguishable from the crowd as you and I, however what they are most likely experiencing, if they were actually conversing with God, would be their subconscious taking what just happened and making it more understandable as to what the human brain describes as a "normal" person.

Think of it this way.

God is a 27 year old nerd playing The Sims. Who are the sims? We are.

As to how this pertain's with the OP's question, the tree was not for God, but for Adam and Eve, as in a way showing that they are lying, deceitful, unworthy creatures.

Adam and Eve were supposed to be the embodification of the Male and Female consciousness, and if this was the case, Heaven's would be completely empty, if Man and Woman sinned knowingly even moments after God commands them not to.

Ever told one of your Sims to take out the trash, but instead they decide to have a quick plate of nachos?

[dancefloorkilla]

Shazam is indeed correct Adam and Eve made what is called Original sin which is what all of us have in us . And eve didnt take the apple for no reason they say Satan who was in the form of a snake told Eve to take an apple form the tree of knowledge and give it to Adam thus creating Original sin.