Official Tier Point System Thread

[raskanally]

we could just make Tiers for every 2 difficulties after 6.
The first few difficulty levels of the game are just warm ups.
I think from about 6 on the different patters start to emerge.

Tier 1:13-12
Tier 2:11-10
Tier 3:9-8
Tier 4:7-6

and if need be a tier 0 with the really ridiculous songs.

[nois-or-e]

Originally Posted by One Winged Angel

The first with VD/C files, the second with C/VC, third with VC/FMO, fourth with FMO/FGO, and the fifth removing some of the lower FMOs and adding in higher FGOs and FSOs.

Assuming your people with only a few fmo aaas would still be within the threshold of the VC/FMO bracket, as opposed to being thrown in with the people beasting FGOs

I'd imagine that a line would have to be drawn between graduating from one tier to the next. . .

[One Winged Angel]

Oh yeah for sure, you'd have to gather quite a hefty sum of points from any given list in order to be bumped up to the next one lol

We'd brainstorm numbers in the new thread if something like this were to be adopted but I'm thinking at least 500 points from any given list (assuming that we're not going to scale down the difficulties for tp value and each list is going to have a cumulative total of around 800 points up for grabs)

[i love you]

I am really loving this discussion. Keep it up guys!

PS: I would like to be the one who makes the new thread if you guys do not mind. There is something I really want to do/plan out before the thread is actually made. Give me at MOST 3 days. If you guys do not see a new thread open by the end of Friday then feel free to just make the thread anyway. In the meantime, please continue to post your thoughts about the new system on this thread.

[nois-or-e]

@ ily: done ;D

This is a really healthy discussion leading towards what could be a whole new system in which tier points are created to include players of all skill levels.

[Emithith]

I think all fmo/fgo/fso songs should be tiers. I also think that only a handful of the harder VCs should be tiers. Nothing lower. We could call them skill points, but tierpoints make sense too.

[Xayphon]

Imma put my few cents in here too, sorry if some sentences are a bit wack and not well written


First of all, the Tier Points table needs to be modernized. It just looks too plain and simple and it needs a rewipe. Maybe a Tierpoints list
with the style of the "Beta Level Reader" (BLR is available for Vets only as of now), showing extended Tier Point statistics, e.g.
Total Tierpoints, Bonus Tier Points, current Tier Level (if you remember these T0, T1, T2 etc thingies) and direct links
to the Tier Point threads or FAQs in the forums or something to prevent a flood of threads like the standalone stuff. Can't think of how
it should look like and more.


Secondly: Imo, Tier Points shouldn't be just representing how skilled a person is. It should be some kind of motivational aspect for the player,too, so he/she is willing to keep playing.
Tier Points are, in my eyes, a reward of getting good scores. And a reward usually is supposed to make people happy or motivated, no?

Of course this requires additional thinking and discussing, but I'm sure it adds a better sense to Tier Points.

I couldn't think of any good ways of how to implement this idea, but I was thinking of something like this: Take the old designations for Tier Levels
[Beginner Tier/Advanced Tier/Master Tier/God Tier] and split the whole Tier points system into those areas. Splitting the TP table into 6 (just like we always have 6 divisions in tourneys) is harsh, so let's just take 4,
for example.

I was thinking of something looking like this:



-----GOD TIER-----

[xxx songs with high x/8 and x/9 requirements]

-----MASTER TIER-----

[xxx songs with high x/7 and low x/8 requirements]

-----ADVANCED TIER-----

[xxx songs with x/6 and low x/7 requirements]

-----BEGINNER TIER-----

[xxx songs with below x/5 requirements (if we are going to have those)]

just for example




At this moment you may be asking yourself "What's so motivational about this?"; Well, imagine you're a beginner player like back in the days, and this kind
of system has already been implemented. If you get high song requirement points, you would be like "holy shit yes I got my first GOD TIER point !!" or something.


Not only does this add some kind of motivational system; - Because it seems like a lot of people don't know how good they actually are, this
kind of list would give the user a basic idea of their own skill level.

Another motivational system would be Tier Point get pop-up windows. Of course I don't want every single Tier Point get to pop up on the ingame screen like when you get a skill token, but it could be made as a small popup window on the down right, like as if someone gets online on Skype/AIM/Steam or w/e, saying "You just earned a TP! [enter random text here]!". It could be included in BW.


(Yeah, I know that the current scoring system pretty much destroys my idea but w/e, it would look nice!!!)


Ya.


e: longest post I've ever made derp

[raskanally]

i like that idea Xayphon.

also you could have the results screen show their current tier and point they have.
Maybe display it as kind of like an EXP bar in MMO's.
Have it span the bottom of the results screen so you know how close you are to maxing out your current tier.

EDIT: what if after they get around 80% or more of the tier points for their current tier they can choose whether to move up to the next one or stay and max out the one they are on?

[igotrhythm]

Raskanally, we already have those on our profiles under our AAA and FC bars. (Though, it is kind of a downer to have to leave the game to check your tier requirements.)

I personally disagree with there being multiple levels of Tier Points on the grounds that then there would be even more interminable discussion about which songs in the lower levels should grant these devalued points. I mean, look how much we're going back and forth over the current list, and you want to make MORE lists?!

[raskanally]

it would def make for a lot more discussions, but we def need to find a way to give the newer players something to work towards other then when they can FC an 11.

[star reaper]

quick warning what i say here might be completely stupid but here goes. Well an idea i had for tier points would be there are say 5 types of levels with tiers in that level so lets say something like beginner level in the tier system would have 4 tier levels. So basically you could be tier one in beginner. Each tier has about 500 tier points once you get about some where like 90% or so maybe even as low as 80% which would put you in what i would consider tier 1 you can unlock the ability to gain points for the higher tier level set. and a good way to make the lower tiers help the higher ones say the masters tier will gain (if unlocked) 1 point for every ten tier points gained in the pro tier. another thing that would be nice is if skill tokens could go for tier points like ever skill token you unlock gives with it one tier point. What my idea for the skill tokens adding to tier points would be skill tokens when unlocked, such as ONI, would go to one of the higher levels or St. scarhand would give one tier point to the god level. honestly i think for the highest tier level (such as the god level) there should be a tier 0 only for that level. It would make it that levels special little achievement.

[Xayphon]

Originally Posted by igotrhythm

I mean, look how much we're going back and forth over the current list, and you want to make MORE lists?!

Let's say a more organized list of the current list, not more lists

[rushyrulz]

Screw multiple tier points for 1 song like in the current system. We should set up requirements like basic skill token requirements (FC, AAA, certain amount of goods) that are worth ONE tier point each that you can check off your list and move on from. I'm not saying that there can't be multiple tier points for any given song, I'm saying for instance that FC Maple Leaf Rag could be an advanced tier requirement and AAA Maple Leaf Rag could be a master tier requirement, each worth one tier point in their respective tier levels.

I don't really agree with star reaper with the whole "unlock the next tier" idea. However, there could be a line drawn in the sand where you 'graduate' from a certain tier and gain its respective title, however, graduation from the lower tiers wouldn't be necessary to earn points in the higher tiers (kind of like testing out of algebra). Here are some of my ideas for forum titles that could be awarded based on tier points:

Assuming there are 5 tier levels:

FFR Novice - Hasn't graduated from the beginner tier yet (Tier 4).
FFR Player - Has graduated from Tier 4
FFR Amateur - Has graduated from Tier 3
FFR Pro - Has graduated from Tier 2
FFR Master - Has graduated from Tier 1
FFR Guru/God - Has graduated from Tier 0

The line for 'graduating' from a tier would need to be drawn after the list is made of course, but I'd say above 80% in any given tier would be a good qualifier.

That's all I'll say for now, but hey if we're going to redo the tier point system, lets completely redo it.

[krunkykai22]

I'll post with a much more detailed opinion in a little while, but to respond to you Rushy, that would just make a bit more difficult. I think the multiple points are perfect, because that makes people reach a more higher level on a song and puts them in for more motivation, taking it out and only have 1 point is basically just making someone like me with Death Piano feel degraded because I will not get a AAA period. Or even RATO for that matter. Having multiple points gives me motivation to move up as slow or as fast as I want. Motivation is key for this system if you ask me.

[raskanally]

I like Rushy's idea.
Then we could use the current tier point requirements to help split them into difficulty tiers.

[justin_ator]

Kinda like I stated before...we need a ranking based on TP. It'll create more interest in them.

[rushyrulz]

Originally Posted by krunkykai22

To respond to you Rushy, that would just make a bit more difficult. I think the multiple points are perfect, because that makes people reach a more higher level on a song and puts them in for more motivation, taking it out and only have 1 point is basically just making someone like me with Death Piano feel degraded because I will not get a AAA period.

That would still exist, just not in the form it's in now. Like for your Death Piano example, passing the song could be a tier 3 requirement, passing with certain score could be a T2 req, FCing for T1 and some crazy good PA for T0. So instead of giving 9 tier points to 1 song for being so difficult, just 1 will be awarded in its respective group helping to maximize your points in that group.

[emulord]

Rushy, your idea is the best so far. Multiple tier requirements has always been kind of an emotional let down when you get good PA for your skill, and still have 3 TPs to max it out.

Also, to avoid duplication of stats, the TPs should be not FC or AAA based. Stuff like (9 or fewer) or (50% score) are better because you get more rewards for incremental skill improvements.


++Rushy's idea

[iironiic]

Two things I'd like to mention:

TPs should be based on raw scoring... but idk if that's possible to implement considering that this game is combo based scoring.

The hardest requirement should be a BF because if it was a AAA, it would make them more overrated. Yes I do agree that a AAA and a BF are two completely different scores, but I can also say that about two other scores. I personally believe that the reward of the AAA should only be that rank 1 you get, vs. max tier points.

/twocents

[DossarLX ODI]

Originally Posted by iironiic

The hardest requirement should be a BF because if it was a AAA, it would make them more overrated. Yes I do agree that a AAA and a BF are two completely different scores, but I can also say that about two other scores. I personally believe that the reward of the AAA should only be that rank 1 you get, vs. max tier points.

Definitely in agreement with this. Whether you want to AAA or song is your prerogative - When I had a lot of flags, I decided to fix them even though I "already have the max requirement".

I'm really sick of AAAs now coming from all my plays, and tier points should be based more off of how you can DO on a file, not "hur hur I didn't get a random good this run!"