TWG CLXXVIII: Danganronpa [Game Thread]

[Mondo Owada]

Originally Posted by Makoto Naegi

No way you didn't do this on purpose.

Maybe

[Kyoko Kirigiri]

This preface is just to repost this, since the original post was caught in the filter.

Originally Posted by Mondo Owada

Also, I think Taka was the Identity wolf kill.
Vote: leon

This is weird to me. And not necessarily even in an alignment-indicative way, just strange. Why is Mondo assuming an Identity Wolf kill? That requires a correct identification guess, which is much more challenging than either other possibility. A regular wolf kill would only require avoiding doctor/blocker, whereas the IW kill would require the same avoidance + identity guessing. And if I'm understanding the Acquisitioner mechanics correctly, they have to give up their previous account. So it would stand to reason that one kill was a normal wolf kill, and the other was an Acquisition.

[Kyoko Kirigiri]

Unless I'm misunderstanding that "wrong way" thing, and he interpreted it as first as meaning there was no Acquisition. Which actually seems like a more likely reading now that I think about it.

[Mondo Owada]

Originally Posted by Kyoko Kirigiri

This preface is just to repost this, since the original post was caught in the filter.



This is weird to me. And not necessarily even in an alignment-indicative way, just strange. Why is Mondo assuming an Identity Wolf kill? That requires a correct identification guess, which is much more challenging than either other possibility. A regular wolf kill would only require avoiding doctor/blocker, whereas the IW kill would require the same avoidance + identity guessing. And if I'm understanding the Acquisitioner mechanics correctly, they have to give up their previous account. So it would stand to reason that one kill was a normal wolf kill, and the other was an Acquisition.

I only know the identities of maybe four people in this game, and taka was one of them (as well as Celestia). I'm assuming (and feel free to call me out on it if you disagree) that the identity wolf can also guess the identities of these players, if I can. I'm not great at the whole "who's who" game and generally don't bother trying. Which means the people I do know are being somewhat obvious about it. Which means the identity wolf also knows them. Which means I'm suss of everyone I think I know until they die, because why not.

[Kyoko Kirigiri]

Originally Posted by Mondo Owada

I only know the identities of maybe four people in this game, and taka was one of them (as well as Celestia). I'm assuming (and feel free to call me out on it if you disagree) that the identity wolf can also guess the identities of these players, if I can. I'm not great at the whole "who's who" game and generally don't bother trying. Which means the people I do know are being somewhat obvious about it. Which means the identity wolf also knows them. Which means I'm suss of everyone I think I know until they die, because why not.

Honestly, that makes less sense to me than what I thought you meant in that second post--that you misread or misunderstood the Acqui, and had assumed that the flip meant both kills had to be wolves (technically, this could still be the case I think, but it seems unlikely). The way I see it is that an identity kill is objectively more difficult than a regular wolf kill--it's equally subject to being stopped by rolepower, but has the additional requirement of player identification. And there's no obvious reason to think the Acqui didn't steal someone's account.

Basically, wolfkill + acqui seems more likely than wolfkill + ID kill or acqui + ID kill. But like I said, it's not really alignment indicative either way; it just seems a relatively unlikely outcome. It does, however, sync with your vote--since Chihiro has blocked Leon twice, that might mean the regular kill was blocked and ID kills occurred instead. An alternative possibility as suggested above would be that the Acquisitioner failed to jump accounts last night, but I at least like that your vote matches your theory.

[Mondo Owada]

Can you provide original content or is everything you say a rehash of what someone else says/an announcement of game mechanics. Yes I think the regular kill was blocked.

[Leon Kuwata]

Originally Posted by Mondo Owada

Can you provide original content or is everything you say a rehash of what someone else says/an announcement of game mechanics. Yes I think the regular kill was blocked.

You must be on some hard drugs to think that me as a wolf would submit myself doing the kill again knowing that Chihiro was blocking me

common_sense.jpg

[Leon Kuwata]

This game is increasingly disappointing and we're just spinning our tires in the mud
My shit vote on Hagakure is really going places

[Leon Kuwata]

We've lynched the seer two games in a row now, I think town can handle winning without them alive

[Chihiro Fujisaki]

Originally Posted by Leon Kuwata

My shit vote on Hagakure is really going places

Until he or Sakura post they're both wasted votes. Just let them modkill themselves...

[Chihiro Fujisaki]

So...the majority of you have no connections with Sayaka and have done very little to solve or influence the game...

I've decided to change my strategy to vote for someone I think has potential as both a wolf and acquisitioner... I choose you, Makoto Naegi!... Kyoko is a close second choice...

[Mondo Owada]

Makoto is likely to be acqui in my mind but I don't really see a case on him as maf. Care to elaborate or nah.

[Leon Kuwata]

I thought there'd be something when I came back
Looks like I have to be the change I want to see

[Chihiro Fujisaki]

Originally Posted by Mondo Owada

Makoto is likely to be acqui in my mind but I don't really see a case on him as maf. Care to elaborate or nah.

He railed on you for suggesting that the normal wolf kill was blocked...and then after my claim was keen to go with the "simplest explanation" that Leon was a wolf who was blocked...it's potentially opportunistic...unless Leon flips wolf...then I would like Makoto...

I didn't like his "breaking news" that it's bad to lock clear anyone either...but other than that... it's more a lack of good things...than that anything stands out as bad...

[Kyoko Kirigiri]

Preface to hopefully keep the post from being removed.

Originally Posted by Mondo Owada

Can you provide original content or is everything you say a rehash of what someone else says/an announcement of game mechanics. Yes I think the regular kill was blocked.

So you said. But there is value to that kind of analysis. The issue is this:

Originally Posted by Leon Kuwata

You must be on some hard drugs to think that me as a wolf would submit myself doing the kill again knowing that Chihiro was blocking me

common_sense.jpg

There's not a compelling reason to believe that the regular kill was blocked (this doesn't exonerate Leon, but it does seem to be the most important element of your case against them). Realize that I would have voted for you already if your worldbuilding didn't match your vote...but it does.

And if I'm generous and assume your ID reads are correct and that others have come to the same conclusions, then, yes, the death of identifiable players seems more likely to be deliberate than a product of chance. But Chihiro announced their Leon block yesterday, and has been suspicious of Leon basically the entire game. It would make little sense for the wolves to proceed forward in that manner. That doesn't mean they didn't, and Leon can mechanically be a wolf regardless of last night's player action breakdown, but it feels like your reading of last night is determined by your view of Leon, and not the other way around.

[Kyoko Kirigiri]

Wait a minute...

Originally Posted by Mondo Owada

Uhhhh because it was like too obvious who celestia was??
I didn't say anything yesterday but they were probably the only person in the game that I could confidently identify, and I'm sure I'm not alone.

Emphasis here is: "they were probably the only person in the game that I could confidently identify."

Originally Posted by Mondo Owada

I only know the identities of maybe four people in this game, and taka was one of them (as well as Celestia). I'm assuming (and feel free to call me out on it if you disagree) that the identity wolf can also guess the identities of these players, if I can. I'm not great at the whole "who's who" game and generally don't bother trying. Which means the people I do know are being somewhat obvious about it. Which means the identity wolf also knows them. Which means I'm suss of everyone I think I know until they die, because why not.

"I only know the identities of maybe four people in this game, and taka was one of them (as well as Celestia)."

That's a BIG change, and one that conveniently suits your current narrative.

Mondo Owada

[Byakuya Togami]

I've been asleep for most of the day these past couple days. I've kept up with the thread, but I didn't have the energy to post and engage.

I'm going to iso Leon and see what all the fuss is about.

[Byakuya Togami]

Kyoko, why would a wolf announce that they knew other people's identities?

[Kyoko Kirigiri]

Originally Posted by Byakuya Togami

Kyoko, why would a wolf announce that they knew other people's identities?

Why wouldn't they? I'd assume everyone is trying to figure out who everyone else is, and announcing that doesn't make someone more or less likely to be a wolf. Even identifying the accounts suspected could influence the game state, but someone saying "I think I know who some people are" doesn't really move the scales.

My issue is that Mondo's claim changed substantially to fit his current narrative. This isn't a "I suspected X, and now I don't" sort of scenario: the original ID claim was a hard announcement in the service of his then-narrative. When it became beneficial for him to build an ID case so as to support his worldbuilding, his ID claim changed. He asked to be called out on it--well, I'm calling him out on it.

[Byakuya Togami]

Leon, now that Toko's dead, do you have any other wolf reads?