jTWG LXXIII: An Excursion to Zimbabwe

[Charu]

Originally Posted by _Zenith_

Fine, not ALL of town wants Tiloco dead.

But now I'm really starting to consider taking a ban and asking for a replacement.

If you're active and able, please do not do that.

And yes, it's day time.

[tiloco217]

night is over

[_Zenith_]

Originally Posted by Charu

If you're active and able, please do not do that.

And yes, it's day time.

I'm only reading bits and pieces. I mean from my point of view, it seems like Lurker and CK are following Tiloco whom I still believe is top wolf candidate. I still have my sights on CK because some posts are just worded utterly wrong and doesn't read town at all.

Really need to get a tl;dr version of this game because everything is so back and forth. Last time I checked this game it was at 780 replies and now it's nearly 1000.

[tiloco217]

Also, I may be aggressive but most of the time I am aggressive in defending people as you can see by the pages of me defending choof and this argument with charu is about me defending lurker (which I shouldn't even have to do but whatever). You aren't reading the thread and have no right to essentially say that I am being a dick to people when I am just defending my points (although I will admit I probably went a little overboard recently it was not enough to warrant that response from Zenith imo)

[tiloco217]

It would be nice if you would stop being salty and actually give legitimate reasons on why you think I am mafia over GS (by that I mean reasons outside of you don't like me personally) although I understand that you need to read the thread first

[_Zenith_]

Originally Posted by tiloco217

It would be nice if you would stop being salty and actually give legitimate reasons on why you think I am mafia over GS (by that I mean reasons outside of you don't like me personally) although I understand that you need to read the thread first

1) I hate players who use "stop being salty" as a defense from them being called out about being a complete asshole. I'm not salty, I just think you're picking your words against people really poorly (in that sense Charu is too but his is more "I'm going to throw my head at a brick wall").

2) I just re-read the thread and what other reasons do you have on GS besides the fact you and him are claiming the same role? I don't know whom to believe more effectively as you both have some good examples and some poor examples such as your shitposting as you claimed Tracker and GS was more serious about the counterclaim. Both of you aren't clear.

3) Continuing to read more as I plan on elaborating posts and really reading players as of right now.

[Charu]

Originally Posted by tiloco217

So we are 12 hours in and I have maybe 1 read I would say I am confident in :/ If you guys want to shitpost at least make it worth my while

The one read I am kind of confident in is riotpolice so I'm gonna go ahead and vote on him. I think the way he decided to become serious about the game so quickly is weird for him. I actually read his calling out choof for the claim pretty null but him staying out of shitposting instead of trying to meld back in seemed like hew as trying too hard.

I am going to give a slight town read to both choof and charu but those are very tentative. I like choof for playing similar to how he played last game which I initially was reading as null because as mafia he would want to mimic that game but him bringing up anecdotal fallacies is not something I think he would do if he was trying to mimic his last game.
Charu I like because this is very similar to his live game in that most of what he says is lighthearted and meaning less (also we are mason partners)

I think I will also throw a bit of pressure onto Gradient because I think his initial couple posts seemed pretty awkward. The posts were sort of like lurker last game but it came at a weird time and his recent posts aren't nearly as aggressive. I would like to know how much you have played before by the way

Originally Posted by gold stinger

Ok. So. Looked over the thread, I see a lot of different play styles, a couple play styles that are the same, it appears there is some confidence in voting riotpolice, just not sure if that's the right decision. He's obviously very interested in staying in this game for right now, so it shows that he must be playing an important role other than townie, but whether that's a blue or a wolf, I'm not entirely sure.

If he can't make a hard claim for a blue role without setting someone else off, then I will know that he's a wolf. But then again, that would mean that whatever hard claim he makes for said role, it's going to open wide the person that actually has said role. Based on that deduction, I can conclude that riotpolice does not have a blue role. unvoteing, and going on riotpolice.

the edit was separating the giant block of text, making it easier to read.

Alright, looks like Tiloco and Gold Stinger at the start of the game wanted Riot dead, so I can't use that as a means to call out one or the other, but I will note that I like Gold Stinger's vote here better because that's exactly what he should be thinking as a town player. Would a first time wolf, with no wolf chat yet, do this?

Tiloco voted for Riot because Riot became "Too serious" too soon. Excuse me, what? I never knew that was grounds for getting lynched.

Originally Posted by gold stinger

A bit extra in-case it wasn't clear in the final reasoning I had if it's needed.

If he has or had a claim for a blue role, he hasn't made the claim known in the time before making my post, which carries suspicion. It could be that he still wants to stay in this game for as long as possible, but for what? He turned the other way when challenged, clearly showing that he's hiding something and that is why he wants to stay in-game. At this point, if he's Townie, he's doing a really bad job of it.

If he makes a hard claim for a blue role now, it's going to put another in danger if he doesn't have a blue role. Evidently this would be very bad to do for a wolf right now, because it can be easily pointed out that he's lying, and he would have done it earlier with the obviousness that he is in-fact hiding a role. The fact that it would put him in greater danger to say he has a blue role he doesn't have rather than keep it away from the public, is what keeps him from sharing that knowledge.

I like this mindset a lot.

Originally Posted by lurker

Man, I thought GS blue hunting was straight up bizarre, especially since I didn't think Riot was doing anything PR-ish. I mean, sure, Riot's doing something, but it doesn't read blue. But then he goes and softclaims. Well then. Don't like either of em, really, but GS is totally new, so...
Zenith seems like he's overcompensating. I'd give him a town lean for that, given last game.
Choof's bringing a MafiaScum attitude into the game which doesn't surprise me too much, so the tone of his posts alone isn't really telling.
Tiloco's here I guess. I feel like he tried to dump all of his info and get the hell out to avoid conversation. He is viewing the thread now, though.
Charu's being a robot dog as usual. Yawn.
CK isn't being too active. Pure null at this point.
Isn't there supposed to be someone else playing?

I like how this was posted after that when choof was clearly blue hunting when he started to argue with Riot.

Originally Posted by lurker

If he was doing this intentionally as a wolf, he would be a true memelord. I mean, don't get me wrong, I think Riot's a memelord, but I feel like this sorta lowers the odds that he's a wolf. Still leaning scum on him, just not as much.

After this he switches to Gradiant, but lol, okay.

Originally Posted by Charu

Also, Goldstinger, you shouldn't rolehunt or mention PR's on the first day since as town we would love to keep our PR's. I mean, I see where you're coming from and I appreciate what you've said, but keep that in mind (which it looks like you're doing anyways, so gg no re lmao whoa wow).

Heh, I guess I mentioned it too, but I really did like his mindset even then, so that's good.

Originally Posted by gold stinger

It's a really bad idea to claim as well. Not claiming is better for everyone, but it puts him in a really unfortunate & suspicious situation.

@choof just editing some notes because of recent posts gimme 3mins

Uuuugh, I wish I saw this too when I realized it after attacking Gradiant with it.

Originally Posted by gold stinger

@choof

riot: terrible blue, or terrible wolf. Either way, desperate to stay in-game. If anyone else thinks we can do without both, I'm all for it, but it's risky d0 if it's a blue. A Hard claim is bad for everyone. A soft claim is bad for everyone. No claim is better for everyone, but bad for all of us if he isn't a wolf. Starting to feel like Choof's plan is backfiring simply because of the way riot responded to it. Is this a doublecounter to covering up his trail and pointing the finger back at choof? This circle can go on forever.

snivy: I'm thinking town. (We are all fucked if this is wrong)

zenith: eagerness is obvious bluff. Has personal hatred against Charu. Town/neutral.

choof: Strong Town, considering someone fell for a trap. May change in the future.

lurker: weak Town, considering he hasn't dug up something yet like Choof. Although that might be from the amount of previous game thoughts of people. I haven't seen much other than that.

CK: absolute Neutral, possibly weak wolf strictly based on posting habits, not wanting to get involved in conversation. That would be a gut instinct though.

Gradiant: 12 as first post - 9 players = 3. Half life 3 confirmed. Seriously though, weak/decent Townie for now? It's tough to say, and really don't know what to say. There's a lot of push, but everyone's doing it.

Tiloco: I have literally, no comment on this. Posting a lot of notifications for others and not a whole lot of opinion on others.

First reads list, funny how Tiloco for him is "no comment" and lurker it "weak town" after being called out by Lurker of it being bizarre for him to rolehunt.

Originally Posted by Cold Kitten

holy shit riot, why. that's literally the wolfiest thing i think i've seen the entire game.

especially in combination with your hardcore going serious at choof's joke claim.

(also sorry guys i actually sleep these days hence the lack of mega posting)


in any case
i'm kinda reading tiloco greenish right now. he made a post earlier that stuck out to me as towny and i'll have to find that later but yeah
choof i'm kinda reading green on. his reaction to riot's noticing his joke claim seemed pretty town to me.

that's about all i've got so far cause i suck (sun)

Originally Posted by Cold Kitten

oh wait my vote is still on choof? fuck that

i want to put it on riot but i think it's a little early for a wagon lmao

[twgv]unvote[twgv]

Wow, okay.

Originally Posted by tiloco217

I actually did not like GS's reads list there. He had all but 3 people in the game as town but still was unwilling to call anyone mafia. Seems like he is trying to appeal to people

I hadn't even considered riot not claiming today but I guess it makes sense. At best a role lives through the night and at worst he is mafia and whoever has to counterclaim him can at least give some info (aside from finding a mafia). That being said I would say that it is pretty likely that he is town because the mafia willingly trading one of their own for a pr isn't very good.

Lurker is probably town. He was pretty snarky in the last game and early in this game but he decided to stay serious and even get a reads list now that we are finally being active. I think that as mafia he has no reason to step outside of what is expected of him in a time where pressure is going all over the place while staying pretty strongly off of him.

I am going to be going home from school so I will finish my ideas later (maybe)

Didn't like his reads, and then says Lurker is town, how funny. Wouldn't mind if Riot didn't hard claim, but the thing is Riot was already close to hard claiming from his previous post that it might as well have been a hard claim anyways.

Originally Posted by gold stinger

If I had to make a 100% call I couldn't, just simply because there isn't enough evidence, that's just the way I work. I won't make a 100% call unless I have some sort of bulletproof evidence, which from the looks of it never happens unless someone slips up.

To each their own though. Maybe you just don't like it because I didn't profile you well enough in it, and it feels like I kept it from you. Honestly, I still haven't a clue at where I'd consider you. Maybe alongside Gradiant.

If I was forced to point fingers at people I'd point fingers at riot, Zenith, and possibly CK. (gut instinct Charu, .-.)

I don't like people who are too quiet. Just feels like they're trying to avoid catching themselves onto suspicion in words.

I like this post a lot, I loooooooooooooooooove this mindset.

Originally Posted by Gradiant

of course. The only things to come out of this is if riot is a wolf, the other wolf played with riot before, thinks they're shit, and is gonna bus (the bussing possibility why I'm not writing Charu off. He's shown he doesn't care about the number of wolves left in his team when he busses his partners, because it's happened to me the last two times I was wolf with him (salmonella and smash bros.)) OR, lmao, riot thinks he's a lost cause and wants to out a pr early if he knows his partner can handle themselves (which is dumb and even less likely). I will say I think Riot is stupid, but I don't want to vote him because of his mess. He's not 100% wolf because of this but this is a pretty bad town move.

Choof's fine I think, same with Goldstinger. The people I'm weary of are Charu, Riot, Lurker, and Tiloco. Riot because explained. Charu is known to buss heavily and I no longer feel I can read him reliably. I don't trust any reads from him anymore. Lurker because the reasoning for the vote on me felt like just some slop to get a vote out there. Completely misunderstanding me comparing riot to redblaster, but also saying that the person I was posting about at the time was still leaning scum for them. Idk. Tiloco, you were pushing Riot to hardclaim his role which is pretty not town for obvious reasons I have stated in an earlier post. You've gone back against this saying you guess, but only after it's been pointed out by Choof that it's dumb. I'm good with Tiloco

I fucking LOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOVE this post.

Originally Posted by Gradiant

Choof has done nothing to warrant a scum read so whatever. Your putting Charu as town I've already pointed out has flaws. You also said you want to pressure me for shitposting which everybody else has done and for a post you misunderstood. You do have a vote on riot, but the multiple posts saying riot has to hardclaim (not just one post) makes it look less like you think he's a wolf and more you trying to get a role out of him for the wolves. Riot's not really towny but you are even less so. That's good enough for me at the moment for a vote on you. Nobody else has done enough to warrant a lot of suspicion.

MMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMM

Originally Posted by tiloco217

So that was probably one of the shitiest responses you could have had because it shows that you did not read my posts before hand and just now skimmed them. I had a town read on choof, your opinion on charu is based on information that I don't have (him bussing in the past), my vote on riot was before he claimed he had a role and I have since read him town, I rescinded my mafia read on you and moved you into null which I announced after your reaction post to me calling you mafia admitting that I had miss-remembered the situation.

I am convinced that you did not have any of these reasons in mind when you originally voted on me. gradiant

MMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMM

Originally Posted by gold stinger

The only way riot was going to be able to prove himself as a human without doubt is the way in which I highlighted in my deduction (this very same scenario). But that would be a really dumb move considering the position we are currently in now - it puts another player at risk if they want to counter the call, it puts him in position to get NK'd, and now we barely have a jailer left. I would have preferred for him to keep shut about it, and hope that the L-1 didn't work so that there was a sliver of a chance that wolves wouldn't know how to go about getting rid of riot with a random jailer still in play.

So, Gradiant, why are you calling out riot even after confessing his hard claim? He's going to die sooner or later with a call that early, but you're insisting that he's still a wolf, why? If he doesn't get killed off early, that just raises suspicion that he is a wolf. I don't think there's any real reason to keep pursuing the action of trying to get rid of him.

Feels really awkward to continue trying to call out a hard claim that I believe the majority of us already know that it's not going to happen now given the circumstances. I'd call out Tiloco, but it's kind of trivial considering that riot's already put himself in the open. I'd pick Charu, but that would be a gut reaction & a fearkill against him. Zenith is showing up as townie for me, riot is obvious, Lurker & CK are null to me, just because I believe Lurker has every right to suspect me after what went down, and CK hasn't been posting enough.

Another town mindset, I'm so mad I didn't go rage mode when I first realized no one should be calling Riot wolf at all unless a CC happens, which it didn't.

Originally Posted by tiloco217

Sorry for that becoming a bit of a stream of thought.

the tl;dr of it is
Gradient's still mafia
riot's town
choof is back on my radar
zenith is probably town

Originally Posted by tiloco217

actually in my skimming it looks like I missed the rest of the post that choof made with the 4 lurkers with a mafia in them. He actually gave quite a few strong opinions in that post so I think I am going to put him back in my town leans. whoops

Also I wanted to mention that I liked lurker defending against policy lynches and I didn't like charu's reaction to lurker doing that. I think lurker is making the game way harder for himself with the way he is playing if he were mafia. Charu's reaction was just a lot more serious then I was expecting. He seems to be the type of person that normally wouldn't care if someone called him out.

lol

[Charu]

Okay, I don't think I need to read anymore, Tiloco is a wolf boys, every post I've looked at from Gold Stinger in the beginning day phase as been entirely town minded with no amount of being neutral and no way he could talk to his wolf buddy.

No way, no fucking way.

[Charu]

Okay, I don't think I need to read anymore, Tiloco is a wolf boys, every post I've looked at from Gold Stinger in the beginning day phase as been entirely town minded with no amount of being neutral and no way he could talk to his wolf buddy.

No way, no fucking way.

[Charu]

Originally Posted by Cold Kitten

reads

lurker: uhhhh pretty much null, leaning towards town. he had some weird interactions this game and it doesn't feel like he's given a lot of actually helpful information.

cold kitten: i suck sorry guys

zenith: i think you're probably town. you've made some mistakes this game so far, but i think you realize them and i hope you'll change them come next game

riotpolice: so far, un-cc'd PR. other than that, i'd be reading you so wolfy.

tiloco: i said it in my stream of consciousness post, but i'm reading you pretty town right now. your posts have felt helpful and towny to me. probably my top green read right now, maybe alongside choof.

gold stinger: i'm hoping this is just you being new, but i can't be sure. your posts have felt EXTREMELY mechanical to me. like to a fault. you seem like you're trying to be helpful without actually being helpful. i just can't figure out if that's you not knowing how to the play game very well or what, but yeah. it's freaking me out a little bit. for that, you're definitely a wolf lean for me.

charu: i have basically no idea how to read you wheeeeeee. i guess if i had to pick anything, i'd give you a slight town lean, but that's about it.

Gradiant: i've said it before, but i think you're being really awkward this game. you're kinda doing the same thing gold stinger is, i think. being very mechanical with your posts, seeming helpful without actually being helpful, etc.

Choof: you're my other towniest read, i think. you've seemed like you're really trying to be helpful and push town in the right direction. you and tiloco are for sure my top town read right now.

This strikes me as odd because after reading through Day One, I found that Gold Stinger was giving thoughts and thinking like a town should. For a first time player, this is great, like extremely great.

[Charu]

Originally Posted by tiloco217

(by that I mean reasons outside of you don't like me personally)

Just a disclaimer, I do not hate you as a person, please-please-please do not make this out for me hating your guts. I do not hate your guts, just... want to throw that out the way, okay?

[_Zenith_]

Originally Posted by Charu

This strikes me as odd because after reading through Day One, I found that Gold Stinger was giving thoughts and thinking like a town should. For a first time player, this is great, like extremely great.

This is my fourth TWG (j and twg) played on Forum/FFR.

I seriously applaud GS in the way he's played so far because I am still garbage compared to him And it's his first fucking game

[choof]

charu what do you think i could feasibly bring to town's table

[Charu]

Originally Posted by choof

charu what do you think i could feasibly bring to town's table

Just thoughts in general, it's all we town can do. After Tiloco claimed and Gold Stinger claimed, mechanically, unless this is god damn high level conspiracy shit, there's no way you're red.

You're pretty much locked clear.

...Obviously that's not the case for the others, but hey. Nice to see you post, I really appreciate it.

[tiloco217]

GS's claim was completely terrible. His first post in reaction was just something along the lines of "what?" and a vote for me. Then his reaction to me essentially claiming a red check on him was bringing up reasons I wasn't the tracker none of which were good and it didn't even occur to him that he could use him being town as a defense because he is mafia and had trouble looking at it through a town perspective. After realizing that nobody was going to defend him he went for the final possible play of cc'ing my role.

Aside from that you have to evaluate mine and his play side by side but it is impossible for me to try and help you by walking you through the reasons I have played more towny then him because unfortunately I can't be that unbiased in this situation. I'm not sure if I was very clear there so I am going to reword it as, I can't look at it from your perspective enough to help you here so you are going to have to go through that part on your own.

All of that being said I think this game could be as simple as lynching GS, Charu, and Zenith in that order.

Lurker is practically confirmed.

CK and GS being partners is pretty unlikely because, as she brought up, they would have had to hard bussed each other in a situation where me and charu (who would both be town in that situation) are butting heads quite a bit.

I like Choof quite a bit for his tracker claim. I have already gone in depth on why I like him for that and don't see a need to do it again.

That leaves only GS (who is confirmed mafia), Charu (who is more then likely his partner) and Zenith (who is just less towny then the other 3 at this point).

I liked Zenith enough to call him my top town during the night phase but it was almost entirely because he was playing bad with both his brief giving up period and his hammer on Gradiant. However during the night he did almost nothing and doesn't even seem to be paying very close attention to the thread since he got heavily town read, even to the point of just now admitting that he isn't even going to read through all of what he has missed even though it is vital to winning the game right now.

In short I liked him a lot but recently his play has not been nearly as towny.

Charu just doesn't want follow any sort of logic. He is immediately jumping to a conclusion and then never changing his mind about it even though I am bringing him plenty of substantial evidence against it. What's even weirder is his willingness to change his opinions. For instance he has decided that choof is confirmed town even though he spent the entire night phase debating with me, saying there is no way that choof would ever do that as town. Just because I am town doesn't mean I am right about choof but Charu was instantly under that impression. Also he seemed to believe that I would never make the play of claiming tracker as mafia but has since flipped that read because I do not agree with his plan (which, by the way, makes no sense).

All of THAT being said, I still have to go through and look at GS's interactions so those opinions might change. I definitely think it is smart to start planning out future lynches at this point though because looking at today's alone is way too short-sighted at this point. That doesn't necessarily mean that you need an auto-circle but you need to be thinking about what happens after you lynch somebody

[_Zenith_]

Choof if you haven't already, we would love your thoughts about Tiloco/Gold Stinger; especially now where there are sides being formed on what claim is more truthful than not, as well as which player looks more wolf than the other.

[tiloco217]

that post about disliking me personally was aimed at Zenith

[choof]

Originally Posted by Charu

there's no way you're red.

You're pretty much locked clear.

lol?

will do a write up but idk if i'll post it considering how quick you are to change your reads

[tiloco217]

Charu that quote post was probably the most biased post I have seen all game. You basically just said "I like GS" and "I don't like tiloco and anyone supporting him" with very little reasoning for either side.

[Charu]

I'm worn out, you want your wolf win so bad, it's disgusting.

Fine, you know what? I still don't care about this enough to focus on a town win now. You want to go after Gold Stinger? Then fine, we're going after Gold Stinger and we're going to go from there.

If he is mafia, as you say, then again I will need to congratulate him on a pretty good Wolf Game, and that'll be the end of that. Whoever you want to lynch after, if GS is mafia, is whatever, lynch me if you want so I'm not there.

I don't know why you keep saying Lurker is cleared if GS is mafia. But hey, like I said, don't care.

Gold Stinger