Official Tournament Round 5 Song Discussion

[TC_Halogen]

Originally Posted by qqwref

2) Fix it and add 50 points of raw score to everyone in that division

Not only would I have to add 50 points of raw score, but I'd have to manually edit all of the PA counts to reflect the proper scores (adding two perfects, since presumably anyone can hit the first step of a song with two perfects). Not to say that this is a particularly hard task, but it's certainly not something I want to do during the tournament round. Regardless of that, a player would still have to replay the song again even if the dashboard lists a AAA, because changing the display of the dashboard does not change the recorded score of a particular song.

I'm not entirely dismissing this idea, but is it worth updating the chart immediately?

[qqwref]

I dunno, I mean, I'm not in your position, and I don't know how long it would take to fix ~10 scores (thank god this is round 5 and not round 1, though!). But if you're going to modify the chart during the tournament it should be done ASAP.

(PS: recorded scores aren't important here - people are historically fine with replaying a song after it's fixed, and the real issue is how this affects the tournament.)

Edit: didn't realize there were two extra notes instead of one, but yeah, when I said 50 points I meant to credit everyone with perfects on the extra notes. So it's actually 100 raw.

[Silvuh]

Yeah, I don't know how I forgot to add silence to FH; I guess I thought I'd do it when I sent in a fix, but I had totally forgotten about it until now. Sorry about this.

So I added the silence just now and removed two notes from two four-note burst things at the beginning (the sounds weren't very loud anyway), so the file will still have 1097 notes and it can be uploaded right away.

And in case you don't want to do that, I also sent a version of the original steps with 1099 notes that can be uploaded after the round is over.

Just sent both of those to the FFR submission e-mail. Either way, sorry for the mistake.

[Xiz]

My opinion is obviously biast since I am in D2... I would really prefer if the chart is NOT modified. As much as it would make it a better file, and this may seem selfish? But I have already learned the file a certain way.... I dont know, but since the tournament has already started I rather keep things the way they are, as annoying as it might be.

[TC_Halogen]

Well, it looks like Silvuh provided a file with the first solution you mentioned, qqwref.

Silvuh: can you send the file to me through FFR PMs, please?

EDIT: Xiz: the modifications are really light -- it shouldn't detrimentally affect how you play the file.

[Xiz]

Originally Posted by TC_Halogen

Well, it looks like Silvuh provided a file with the first solution you mentioned, qqwref.

Silvuh: can you send the file to me through FFR PMs, please?

EDIT: Xiz: the modifications are really light -- it shouldn't detrimentally affect how you play the file.

I know, I know. I'm just bitching <3
2 more notes I can get a good on D: lolz

[qqwref]

Originally Posted by TC_Halogen

Well, it looks like Silvuh provided a file with the first solution you mentioned, qqwref.

Great!

Originally Posted by Xiz

2 more notes I can get a good on D: lolz

It's just an isolated jump at the start of the file

[arcnmx]

D2's chart is a bit slow for my tastes but it's probably my favourite song of the round. D4 gets my vote for favourite chart, it's pretty fun to play if a bit long.

Originally Posted by Silvuh

So I added the silence just now and removed two notes from two four-note burst things at the beginning (the sounds weren't very loud anyway), so the file will still have 1097 notes and it can be uploaded right away.

This sounds like a decent compromise.

[Xx{Midnight}xX]

Go Silvuh makin' da fixes~

As a note I can't say with anything I agree with how D5/D6 was charted

Like it just feels like you over-layered it for difficulty for the purpose of the tourney and I can't stand stuff that feels this way, also a lot of the patterns have cute little anchors that make it rather dumb if you asked me.

In my opinion, the short hand of what I want to say is those charts pretty much feel like they were rushed nonsense from steppers who easily know and could have done way better. I'm just highly disappointed I guess. (I'm also extra sad that there's another Vocaloid chart I'm probably never going to want to play despite the song being quite awesome. But that's just my inner Vocaloid fan speaking here.)

The charts this round and last round (For D5+) have made me question sort of what the judges think a quality chart is now days. So it's left me confused is all. I don't understand how charts like that can be perceived as "good work" when they hardly (subjectively that is) represent the song in any way.

[Razor]

*adds Halogen to list of people who can step dubstep/drumstep correctly*

h4h4

but srsly,

Into Your Eyes, best file this week.

Crow's Ghost was beyond overstepped and the some of these nutty 48th bursts were really uncomfortable and awkward. Also I don't get the [13][24] spam to every drum roll in the song.

Infinity was great. A bit of hard pain and weird up arrow jacks, but perfectly fine from the first time I saw in the batch. Cool stuff.

[TC_Halogen]

Thank you guys for the positive reception on Into Your Eyes.

To be quite honest, I am a little surprised to see so many people preferring Into Your Eyes over Beatrice. Beatrice was an excellent file and I almost feel like it's being overshadowed; speaking impartially, I very much feel like Beatrice and Futari, Hajimari. are more enjoyable/fun than Into Your Eyes is.

Move It Groove It (Standard): The mini-jacks in the chorus are a nice touch and follow the lyrics really nicely. The jumps for the echoed synth just before the final chorus was a really cool addition that I never even considered in my Heavy chart, haha. Clever structure.

Futari, Hajimari: Such a great song, and the chart is fantastic to boot. The small flourishes of 32nds and occasional grace notes really match the song's energetic feel; despite being an easier chart, Futari is incredibly fun to play. In addition, the song is just awesome.

Beatrice: One of the four "diamonds" in the last batch, Beatrice really just brings all of the elements of a fantastic stepfile into a very small two minute package. The pattern fluency is great, the layering is perfect, the pitch relevance is nice and the file just never seems to let down/get boring. Fantastic file and anyone who had criticisms about your charting style certainly can't pull those same critiques now.

Into Your Eyes: own file. Five minutes of drumstep with many elements intended to trip you up. Speaking impartially away from my own file, I would say that this is the third best file of the round (putting Futari as second and Beatrice as first).

Crow's Ghost: My least favorite file of the round. However, it's not a bad chart under any circumstance -- certainly overcharted, but done so in a way that is very consistent. This chart certainly packs a punch in terms of difficulty, and the difficulty spike at the end of the file definitely makes it replayable. Will I play this file and try to take it down? Sure. Will I enjoy trying to take it down? Taking down an 81 always feels nice, so yes. Will I play it again after AAAing it? Probably not.

Infinity: This chart is absolutely brutal. The jumpstreams on their own pose a lot of difficulty due to some incredibly split-heavy patterns, and to make matters even worse, the jumpstreams are VERY long. If you felt like the jumpstreams were cake, you're forced to contend with large gluts of 190 BPM 12th note jumps, some of which anchor for short distances; if THAT wasn't bad enough, the piano solo just trashes you with some a nasty near-paradiddle jack pattern. After I AAA this one, I will -never- play it on FFR again, that's for damn sure. However, I will definitely keep playing it on SM, where it belongs.

[qqwref]

Originally Posted by TC_Halogen

Crow's Ghost: [...] the difficulty spike at the end of the file definitely makes it replayable [...] Will I play it again after AAAing it? Probably not.

That's not what people usually mean when they say a file is replayable It's usually meant as 'fun to play over and over again' rather than 'may take me a few tries to AAA'. And remember that the vast majority of people are not going to just AAA it and be done... so idk, kind of mean to put a file like this ingame when almost nobody will enjoy it after a week or two.

[DossarLX ODI]

[Xx{Midnight}xX]

Originally Posted by qqwref

It's usually meant as 'fun to play over and over again' rather than 'may take me a few tries to AAA'.

True word man. Very true words. If it isn't fun, it's not worth replaying for more than a statistic.

Like I said earlier, the chart is [very] memorable for the wrong reasons.

Originally Posted by qqwref

so idk, kind of mean to put a file like this ingame when almost nobody will enjoy it after a week or two.

Oh my god yes thank you.

I'd lower that time table to more like a week maximum though. But close enough.

[igotrhythm]

Originally Posted by DossarLX ODI

Well said, Professor Dossballs.

[TC_Halogen]

Originally Posted by DossarLX ODI

Yeah, yeah, yeah, I know, haha. I did that voluntarily and actually wasn't sure if I should have.

I didn't want to make it full three-framers, nor did I want to have an inconsistency (it was 2-2-3 before). At 190 BPM, neither solution is right because it's in the middle of the clean BPMs for 16ths (150 for 3, 225 for 2).

It's certainly worthy of a FFFFFFF moment, just like some of the bursts of Into Your Eyes are FFFFFFF because 165 BPM is the worst BPM to even attempt frame fixes on and I never want to do it again.

EDIT:

Originally Posted by qqwref

That's not what people usually mean when they say a file is replayable It's usually meant as 'fun to play over and over again' rather than 'may take me a few tries to AAA'. And remember that the vast majority of people are not going to just AAA it and be done... so idk, kind of mean to put a file like this ingame when almost nobody will enjoy it after a week or two.

qqwref: I meant replayable for others in the initial context, not for myself. It's got a replay factor for those trying to improve because the ending is considerably harder and is worthy of practicing. For a current tournament player, or any D5 player, the ending is rewarding to handle. However, it doesn't faze me in terms of difficulty, and the overall structure makes me not want to play it.

With that being said -- others might enjoy the file because of the huge difficulty increase at the end (insert "oh shit" factor here) while others might not be a fan of how it's charted (insert "this is a dump" here). I fall in between, slightly away from dump because I don't believe this is a dump file, just one that is overly-aggressive.

[DossarLX ODI]

Just for future reference, 190 bpm snaps better to an 180 bpm interval than a 225 interval. You basically have a RATO speed jack there that most players are going to barely hit as all 3 framers to AAA with transitions in and outside of out.

Edit: That interval also makes for two 4 frame 8th jacks in a row. You turned that part into 225 bpm literally, lmfao

[One Winged Angel]

Originally Posted by DossarLX ODI

Just for future reference, 190 bpm snaps better to an 180 bpm interval than a 225 interval.

???

150bpm = 16ths always three frames apart
225bpm = 16ths always two frames apart

Anything in between those BPMs will be some sort of messy combination of two and three frame intervals

[qqwref]

180 bpm = 16ths alternate 2-frame and 3-frame intervals, all 8th intervals are 5 frames.

It's not as clean as 150 or 225 but it's still a very stable pattern.

[DossarLX ODI]

I'm talking about 8th notes. 5 frames apart = 180 bpm 8th notes. In that part with the 3 note 2 frame jack, there are two 4-frame 8th notes, turning it into a 225 BPM section for that short burst of time.

Not trying to sound mean or anything, but that speeds it up tremendously from 190.