TWC, Everyone Else... Everyone Else, TWC

[blahblah18]

Ok everyone, so this thread is so everyone has the ability to voice their concerns and problems with anything TWC related. If anyone has suggestions or improvements, they should be brought forth here so they can be openly discussed in a forum that can be shown to be seen.

I don't want to see ANY FLAMING OR PERSONAL ATTACKS in here whatsoever. This is not the place for that at all!

Things decided have been that profanity should be removed from the TWG games. Even though we are on average much older then the rest of the community, we should still hold and adhere to the standards then even more so then the rest of the community. there is no need whatsoever to spend the time to go around the filter system already instantiated.

Bypassing this system results in 1 phantom for each usage. Also, to help enforce the usage of participation in the game, we have decided that for every phantom you receive over 1 in a game, that you get a 1 game ban.

e.g 2 phantoms = 1 game ban 3 phantoms = 2 game ban.

Self-voting is not a viable solution and is not allowed. Self voting will not be viewed as an actually counted vote.

If there is anything else that needs discussing, please mention it and we shall discuss it.

Thank you, and I hope that this can become a viable alternative to the lack of coordination that has existed in the past.

[Afrobean]

The thing about TWC is this: I think it should be democratic. I say we should scrap the current team and have members elected. Sure, it would probably end up being nearly all the same people, but it would be better because it would have been a group decision.

[Tps222]

What about quitting a game? 2 game ban?

[HansSky]

Originally Posted by blahblah18

Things decided have been that profanity should be removed from the TWG games.

Completely, or do you just mean "do not bypass the swear filter?"

[blahblah18]

I mean do not bypass the swear filter.

and quitting a game gets you a 2 game ban.

Thus it was written, so it shall be done

[Afrobean]

I just thought of something else important.

Talking with the dead. Tass (hell, I even thought about doing it this past game...) has used it on at least a few occasions to obtain information not actually relating to the game, but which can affect the way you think of things in said game (see the last game where Tps and I were wolves together. Tps posted a convo with Kilga, who was dead at the time, which was blatantly fake. Tass contacted Kilga and asked about Tps' explanation of a long running injoke between them and based on Kilga's responses, Tass was able to discern that Tps was lying.)

I think that anyone talking to the dead with any such intentions should be dealt with in some negative fashion. It's really not fair.

[Tps222]

I think some kind of scoring system would boost people's activity. While I would like pips back, it probably won't happen. A team-based scoring system would be nice. You recieve a certain amount of points for tasks completed ie: Guarded someone=3 point, Wolfed a blue = 3 points, Seer'd a wolf = 3 points. I'm pretty sure someone like Chardish established a fair one in some thread a while back. It should get put into play.

Then a leaderboard could be established. An overall point total, then points in certain categories, make the game competitive again. I'm sure it would renew people's interests. Every 10 games, the top 10 pointholders could go into some all-star type game(Not sure how that would work out), possibly some tournament. MVP's should be re-established again. We need an actual circuit or league, 22 games are enough practice; we need to gets serious. This means that jTWG could serve a better purpose. Not only can it teach the game, it will not have a point system introduced into it. Then, the vets who don't feel like playing a ranked game can go play fun one, which would benefit the new players as well (A new batch of players around the community would be nice).

I'm just brainstorming here, but I feel that if this was added, people would get more into these games. Display your rank from the leaderboard in some sort of sig type thing. Bans and non met post requirements, along with phantoms, will negate points from your total. Titles could be established. Have this many points, get "TWG Vet" as a title. I guess this is similar in a way to the pip-system, but much more team based. Special titles could be availble as well "TWG's Best Guardian" etc. Then, after every 5 games, people could vote titles to people "MVP", "Most Logical" "Most Helpful" etc. Give me some feedback on this idea people.

[mead1]

I agree with TPS. People would probably be more driven to win with some sort of point system. However, an "All Star" Kind of thing would probably be taking it a little bit too far. If some kind of point system was created, to avoid what the pips did (Put personal victory over the team victory), it would have to award based on keeping your comrades alive.

[Tps222]

I'm searching for Chardish's list.

[QreepyBORIS]

Aww. Self voting is gone? I think I invented that in game 2 or 3. Shame. I also was the first to ask if faking an AIM conversation was legal (it was), but I never did it.

So, I like the new phantom rule, though. And the dropping out thing is nice, too. This is all after the fact, right? Fish and the rest won't get punished, right?

All-star games? Tournaments? Dude, we only have so many players. I don't really think that's viable, unless we take TWG public, which would be a little bit goofy, since all the newbs would come in asking why they got banned from the chat. =/

A points system could be good, but I don't know how representative it would be. There would have to be lots of arbitrary things in it, too, such as getting yourself off deathrow in favor of someine else. But that's subjective, so...

I think that having team victory pips would be appropriate.

[Tps222]

http://www.flashflashrevolution.com/...hlight=#449377

I'm pretty sure Chardish can adapt his from there to fit our needs.

[talisman]

I hereby propose that a 4 post per day minimum be instituted, void in the instance of an instalynch or if extenuating circumstances arise (ie blah's mobo frying, or whatever that was). The 4 posts would have to be of some quality, and the host would have discretion over whether or not a post was quality. Quality wouldn't have to mean like a four paragraph essay, some quality posts might be as few as two sentences or something, all up to the host. Multiple posting or an obvious attempt to double post your way to get four wouldn't count, unless the host thinks it should. (Sometimes people like to split big posts into two posts about different things, or sometimes a post might come up while you're typing that is unrelated to what you were typing, and thus a new post as opposed to an edit is more appropriate.)

If a player fails to meet the four post minimum they are removed from the game without replacement. This means that there will be a peer pressure element to make sure everyone meets it or else the game ends a day sooner, something humans do not want. And no wolf would obviously ever like to lose one of their own to inactivity.

[Tps222]

Breaking the post requirement should produce an additional 1 game ban, and there banned status in the title of the Username: ("Banned from TWG:1 game")

[talisman]

No need to be overly harsh... the crap you'd get from everyone else would be enough reprimand.

[QreepyBORIS]

TWC is in the beginning of the topic title. It is also at the end of the topic title. TWC is the alpha and the omega? Are you relating yourselves to gods? Are you equating yourself to God? What are your intentions? It this tricky subversion?

[nickadeemus]

I know that the split sign-up times are a pretty fair way to decide who gets to play, but what about something that isn't based on being able to be at your computer at certain times of the day.

For example (taken from a different TWG sign up):
The host asks "Give me a five letter word. Whichever words come first alphabeticaly, those players will win first spots in the game. However, if you give the same word as another player, you will be moved to the bottom of the list."
Basically, the host asks for everyone who wants to play to PM them something to fit his/her request, and there is a 24 hour window to do so. Then the top X amount of players are in the game. This also allows the host for extra creativity in choosing a fashion for players to sign up.

I know the current way to sign up is very quick and efficient, but it may not be fair to everyone. Signing up the aforementioned way may take half a day longer or so, but a slightly extended pause between games seems almost necessary at this point anyway.

My thoughts.

[stretchypanda]

Two things:

First, the trouble with the points system is undeserved value can be placed on people who play, and live up to posting standards that have been set, but still don't contribute. I think, rather than points, the MVP award should be reinstated, and given to anyone who contributed to a victory. I.E: if any number wolves survive to win a game, all three are listed on a sticky or something for that game, with a brief description of how awesome those people are. Or if a blue picks correctly, leading to an eventual human victory, s/he is given credit.

This will serve two purposes. One: it will give well-deserved credit to hard-working players. Two: it will encourage players to be active, thoughtful, creative, and respectful.

Second: I know how annoying it is when someone only posts to say s/he will be inactive, but I think four well-developed posts is asking a little much. I know some of you always seem to have a million things to say, but posting a chat log and then not really saying much about it is not a well-developed post. The minimum should be low enough that busy people (Hi, Kilga) or people who like to watch the proceedings and make one big post once they feel they have enough information (Guido) do not feel excessive pressure to make their presence known. Requiring any more than one or two posts is going to lead to a lot of people scraping for things to say, especially wolves. We want quality here, not quantity.

[talisman]

honestly I think four is a very reasonable number... it's not hard to do, except maybe in the early stages of day one. And getting wolves to scrape for things to say is a good thing... it makes them have to play the game that much more carefully. And they don't have to be well-developed. It could just be a paragraph saying you agree with someone and adding another reason or observation why. Or maybe quoting someone and asking a question about a specific point they raised, or pointing out a logical fallacy. It doesn't have to be four posts of brilliant analysis, just four posts expressing your ideas.

Guido, by the way, made well more than four posts per day in the last game he was in, and didn't wait for the deadline at all or watch and then make big posts. He was pretty much posting the whole way through. Not sure what you're getting at there...

And if people think they're going to be too busy during the game, perhaps they should reevaluate their decision to sign up. It doesn't take that much effort to make a nice small quality post four times a game day, though, maybe only ten to fifteen minutes, and I know you people are online long enough for to manage that.

[stretchypanda]

Talisman, the point is not to make this game impossible to win for the wolves.

And posts SHOULD be meaningful. Quoting and agreeing is not a meaningful post, and you know that. Posts like that are met with derision every time. Like I said, if you're going to impose such a high minimum, you're going to be faced with a lot of empty posts, and that will provoke people to criticize their fellow players.

And, from what I've seen of my boyfriend's style, he likes to take his time and compose well-thought out posts. This may have changed, but I was scraping for an example of a player who is still active (I like to wait a while before posting one big post, then adding to it later, but I'm going back into "retirement", so I'm not a good example). I also wasn't talking about anyone who waits until just before deadline. No one who composes good posts waits until just before the deadline to make a single post per day.

EDIT: I think there have been incredible improvements in activity as it is. Just because a thread goes several hours without an update does not mean people have lost interest.

[Afrobean]

I think there have been incredible improvements in activity as it is.

Not when you have people like LD and Kilga playing the "I must be green because I never post" card.

A posting mininum is NOT to make the game impossible to win for the wolves. It just makes sure that the wolves won't be able to go "oh i'm gonna be innactive because i'm green. haha you won't lynch me, stupid humans" Also, it will force all players (reguardless of their role) to help out their side. If a person can't make the deadline, then they deserve to be criticized. I was grounded one game and still managed about 2-3 posts per TWG day. The only time I had for TWG was my 40 minute lunch period which I spent reading the thread, then posting. This is a testament to the fact that if people are innactive, they are that way by choice, and that is not a choice that we want people to be able to make.