TWG Penalty Thread

[cedolad]

In this case then, I'll revoke my request for ban. But I just would like to add, I'm taking a formal break from TWG.

[Xiz]

If being agressive is bannable, my actions against Halogen in the current game is ban-worthy then. (I know thats out of thread talk, but this situation calls for it)

As long as you keep it in thread, and prevent it from going over the top, then its perfectly acceptable.

[TC_Halogen]

Originally Posted by Xiz

If being agressive is bannable, my actions against Halogen in the current game is ban-worthy then. (I know thats out of thread talk, but this situation calls for it)

Not really OoT for context, though -- it does nothing detrimental to that game.

You were drilling me while I was still active in the game, and doing so to incite a particular response - there's hardly anything wrong with that. Yes, I do think this is pretty bad practice overall when you guys are trying to promote the game and bring new players, but no, I don't think it's a problem when it's in thread and fits the overall established tone of the game.

The difference in the case of j-rodd's ban is that I mentioned was that it was constantly beating on a player that had already left the game (which in that case, is longer contextual to the game itself). If you're trying to push really hard to incite a particular behavior while the player is active in the game and is playing an active role, that's game strategy. If you're pushing really hard to incite a particular behavior while the player is no longer active and has no rhyme or reason posting, you're targeting the player outside of the game.

Think of TWG as a sub-level of the forums itself when you're in an active game -- that game adheres loosely to forum rules in that context otherwise considered flaming is allowable simply because it is game strategy. However, once a player has been eliminated for whatever reason, you're communicating with a player who is in the level above the game now (i.e. the general forums), which means you should be rightfully subject to any and all forum rules as a result.

[cedolad]

Originally Posted by Xiz

As long as you keep it in thread, and prevent it from going over the top, then its perfectly acceptable.

Not trying to expand this discussion any further since I've revoked my request, but I am going to justify this.

It went pretty over the top. It was even brought out of the game-thread and into this thread where it needed very little discussion for either party. Yet it continued. I agree, that in no way did I directly influenced the events that took place in this thread, but I still can't help but feel guilty.

Excuse me for having a conscience, I'm going to hide in my hole.

[Charu]

Originally Posted by cedolad

Excuse me for having a conscience, I'm going to hide in my hole.

Dang it, this would've been a sick reaction post.

[DarkManticoreX2]

I do want to mention something.

The Kayla/J-rodd/Cedolad thing was one of the reasons I wanted to have one thread for TWG and another for jTWG.

jTWG's (usually) aren't nearly as aggressive since most of the players are newer and still learning the game themselves. You have one game to introduce the newer players to the format and get accustomed to the TWG mindset. The other can be for the more experienced players. The distinction can isolate out the hard to deal with people untill the new people are ready for it.

[dAnceguy117]

but the jTWG will have a few new players and the rest will be vets who missed the TWG signups. and then they're gonna be grumbly because they're not in the "real" game so they'll take it out on the new folks.

IMO new players should read up, spectate, and ask questions if they're unsure about joining. maybe play games on EpicMafia to get the hang of the mechanics first. but jTWG or otherwise, every game thread will get intense. those who don't like intensity might be better off without playing this game.

[TC_Halogen]

I voluntarily withdrew from the current game that I was in, so feel free to mark me down for an infraction on Game 108.

[Xiz]

Done.

[Crazyjayde]

I don't like the idea of a jTWG right now too, considering the newbie playerbase is sparse and hesitant to get involved. But if it ever happens on the signups that a group is divided half between new and veteran players, I think the mechanics of the said game should at least be reviewed to compensate for the experience gap (I think we had some issue in CV too?).

To be fair, I think it's up to the playerbase to step down their aggressivity within the game when confronted by newcomers. V has done just that in D1 of the current running game (CVIII) and he's usually the one to play the merciless motherfucker. Of course, you can bully some fresh players around if it's a legitimate move, but consideration and moderation is in order in those contexts. There are other ways to come to the same reactions too.
Altough, as Dance said, I concede that new players also have their part of homeworks to do, and should they sign for a game, it should be fully understood that TWG is a game of adornment and deceiving, and that it is in its nature to ambush others by all means necessary.

Also this thread is going to be BIG if we are democratically going to be handling the penalties. Fine by me, I actually prefer the idea, but every contributions should definitely have substance. Manti, I strongly advise the creation of a general discussion thread so we can avoid unecessary interventions like this earlier one.

[DarkManticoreX2]

Originally Posted by Crazyjayde

I don't like the idea of a jTWG right now too, considering the newbie playerbase is sparse and hesitant to get involved. But if it ever happens on the signups that a group is divided half between new and veteran players, I think the mechanics of the said game should at least be reviewed to compensate for the experience gap (I think we had some issue in CV too?).

To be fair, I think it's up to the playerbase to step down their aggressivity within the game when confronted by newcomers. V has done just that in D1 of the current running game (CVIII) and he's usually the one to play the merciless motherfucker. Of course, you can bully some fresh players around if it's a legitimate move, but consideration and moderation is in order in those contexts. There are other ways to come to the same reactions too.
Altough, as Dance said, I concede that new players also have their part of homeworks to do, and should they sign for a game, it should be fully understood that TWG is a game of adornment and deceiving, and that it is in its nature to ambush others by all means necessary.

Also this thread is going to be BIG if we are democratically going to be handling the penalties. Fine by me, I actually prefer the idea, but every contributions should definitely have substance. Manti, I strongly advise the creation of a general discussion thread so we can avoid unecessary interventions like this earlier one.

That was the TWC thread, but it was outdated anyway.

Dance will not appreciate another sticky!

[dAnceguy117]

I'd rather have 50 stickies than run jTWGs. the guide needs to be better and stand out more. other than that, whatever maaaan

[FoJaR]

can someone link some of the jrodd posts?

because without seeing them i cant really believe that anything said merits a ban.

[yo man im awesome]

Originally Posted by FoJaR

can someone link some of the jrodd posts?

because without seeing them i cant really believe that anything said merits a ban.

Believe me, they were far into the realm of straight up flaming/trolling. He had the bad coming to him. Most/all of the posts have been deleted at this point.

Isn't the thread for it either.

[FoJaR]

Originally Posted by TC_Halogen

Not really OoT for context, though -- it does nothing detrimental to that game.

You were drilling me while I was still active in the game, and doing so to incite a particular response - there's hardly anything wrong with that. Yes, I do think this is pretty bad practice overall when you guys are trying to promote the game and bring new players, but no, I don't think it's a problem when it's in thread and fits the overall established tone of the game.

The difference in the case of j-rodd's ban is that I mentioned was that it was constantly beating on a player that had already left the game (which in that case, is longer contextual to the game itself). If you're trying to push really hard to incite a particular behavior while the player is active in the game and is playing an active role, that's game strategy. If you're pushing really hard to incite a particular behavior while the player is no longer active and has no rhyme or reason posting, you're targeting the player outside of the game.

Think of TWG as a sub-level of the forums itself when you're in an active game -- that game adheres loosely to forum rules in that context otherwise considered flaming is allowable simply because it is game strategy. However, once a player has been eliminated for whatever reason, you're communicating with a player who is in the level above the game now (i.e. the general forums), which means you should be rightfully subject to any and all forum rules as a result.

see, i dont think that's true. TWG is as much about using what you say to frame yourself in other peoples' minds as it is about voicing opinions about other people.

yes, the dead person cant respond, but that's part of TWG.

[FoJaR]

Originally Posted by yo man im awesome

Believe me, they were far into the realm of straight up flaming/trolling. He had the bad coming to him. Most/all of the posts have been deleted at this point.

Isn't the thread for it either.

so you're going to ban him based on posts that nobody outside the game can review?

nope. dont like it.

[dAnceguy117]

the posts are in this thread. that's why they warranted a twg ban and a forum ban.

[FoJaR]

ah i see, STATEMENT REVOKED.

but i do think that in game talk shouldnt be under any kind of scrutiny

[FoJaR]

i think trolling and flaming in game are perfectly fine.

[FoJaR]

and while jrodd did get overheated, i think he's right.

if you request a replacement, you get a 1-2 game ban.

if you do it more than once in the span of a few games, you can take a month off.

honestly the whole replacements list seems like a bad idea to me, because it encourages people to join games when they might not really have time, because in the back of their mind there's the thought that "there's always a replacement if i cant finish the game"

yeah sometimes REAL LIFE things come up, but unless it's something that was completely unforseeable (car accident, house burning down, etc) then you should get a ban.