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06-27-2014, 06:38 AM | #1 |
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D7 Should be split into two different groups
In my opinion, assuming the upcoming 10th Official Tournament has 7 divisions, there should be another division for the high d7 players to be placed in or d7 should be split into high and low groups based on skill.
I find it unfair that low d7 players have to drill off against the best players of ffr when they have no chance of being in the top 3 ranks unless a miracle occurs like some of the best players wind up not being able to play or don't sign up. Last tournament's d7 had 29 placed players and the tourney before that had 13. Previous to that, there were only 6 divisions with division 6 having a whopping 59~ players. I believe a new division was created to make players more evenly matched for their division, but think d7 today is growing and this year the number will probably be even bigger making the last division off balance again. Maybe something should change with this to make things more fair for dedicated players who wound up getting stuck in the final division because they are at too high of gameplay skill to be placed in division 6. Your thoughts? |
06-27-2014, 06:56 AM | #2 |
[Nobody liked that.]
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Re: D7 Should be split into two different groups
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06-27-2014, 07:02 AM | #3 |
Mrow~
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Re: D7 Should be split into two different groups
inb4 ten divisions in 2018
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06-27-2014, 07:32 AM | #4 | |
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Re: D7 Should be split into two different groups
Quote:
Regarding the skill gap, you have to remember that there has always been a skill gap between low D7 and high D7 - it's just more obvious now because there are more low D7 players than before. Having an eighth division won't necessarily solve the problem. The very bottom of D7 will have problems winning unless they skill boost quite considerably, the now low D8 will also have problems winning unless they skill boost considerably. At that level, it becomes progressively more difficult to skill boost. Having an additional division will just change the type of people who will have more trouble getting top 8/16 in a tourney. As for the number of players, I don't think there's as many D7 players as there are D5/D6 at the moment. I felt that the requirements for D7 previous tourney was a little too lax, but that's just me I guess. I can imagine that there are 50-55 D7 players now, but I'd say only 30-40 would participate. There will still be more D5/D6 players - the average FFR player on the forums alone is mid D5 to low D6. FFR players outside the forums would usually fall in the D1-D6 category, so there wouldn't be an off-balance any time soon. The main reason why I'm against it is because of how little files could be used to measure a skill at that high of a level. Other than 94+ AAAs, the only files that could be used are DP, RATO and vROFL. RATO is basically a luckshot at a very high level, DP even moreso, vROFL is just silly. Maybe if there are more files at that level, we'd be able to measure an 8th division. As it is there just aren't enough files to determine that high of a level. You can argue that alternate engines and rates can be used, but not all players can play optimally on R^3. smartdude, Dynamo and Dossar are just a few who do better on Velocity/Legacy over R^3. tl;dr 8th division is excessive, not enough files can be used to determine D8, etc. |
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06-27-2014, 08:09 AM | #5 |
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Re: D7 Should be split into two different groups
Hmmm yeah you make a lot of great points Ez. What about there being a high and low d7 that play the same song but are ranked apart from each other?
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06-27-2014, 09:58 AM | #6 |
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Re: D7 Should be split into two different groups
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06-27-2014, 08:10 AM | #7 | |
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Re: D7 Should be split into two different groups
Or better yet, bracked division based tournaments
edit: to be more concise Quote:
Everyone gets a chance to compete against others on their level and the results are seemingly more accurate quote Last edited by Mourningfall; 06-27-2014 at 08:20 AM.. |
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06-27-2014, 08:50 AM | #8 |
Rhythm game specialist.
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Re: D7 Should be split into two different groups
FFR has gotten complacent in a divisional placement system, where in other games/rhythm games, there are either two flights/divisions or simply no divisions at all.
If FFR's Multiplayer was more stable for people, you could run a legitimate bracket tournament with seeding and no divisions that way. Unfortunately, you just can't get that lucky. |
06-27-2014, 10:31 AM | #9 | |
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Re: D7 Should be split into two different groups
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06-27-2014, 09:46 AM | #10 |
FFR Player
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Re: D7 Should be split into two different groups
since when has the meaning of tournament shifted from "let us find out who is the best" to "let us find out who is the best within an infinite and arbitrary set of population subsets the ultimate extension of which is to give everyone a trophy and a pat on the back and tell them they are a winner just by playing the game"
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06-27-2014, 09:59 AM | #11 |
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Re: D7 Should be split into two different groups
i mean if the reason for which hosting a tournament is that everyone can feel like an inclusive member of this great big family and community and that we are all winners praise be to the lord kumbaya then fine whatever but please do not confuse and/or mix this with the concept of competition or maintain the pretense that the two aren't mutually exclusive
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06-27-2014, 01:07 PM | #12 | |
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Re: D7 Should be split into two different groups
Quote:
The fact that players often go out of their way not to improve prior to an FFR tournament in an effort to manipulate divisional placements in their favor tells you there's obviously something wrong with the current setup. It should logically be one division but that'll never happen. Although I agree that the skill gap from lowest D7 to highest D7 is far greater than any other division, barring maybe D1 but even then I think D7 is larger. edit: actually D1 skill gap is probably the smallest in terms of average time it takes to progress to the next division. From a snapshot, lowest D1 (someone that can't pass Free Space) compared to highest D1 (which I'm assuming would be someone that can AAA files in the 20s or low 30s), the skill gap is quite large. However I've yet to see a player invest more than 6 months of time actively playing the game and not reach at least D2. Players at the bottom of D7 would need several years of playing the game, almost religiously, in order to reach the skill level of samurai or Dossar. Last edited by One Winged Angel; 06-27-2014 at 01:24 PM.. |
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06-27-2014, 01:25 PM | #13 | |
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Re: D7 Should be split into two different groups
Quote:
Granted it can be done with the decent amount of time the tourney takes, but if two people skillboost the same amount, yet one started higher than the other and are competing in the same division, they should still warrant similar awards. I feel like the Official Tournaments should support improvement rather than stagnation and sandbagging. Example: Player A boosts from low D5 to low D6 in the tourney, Player B boosts from high D5 to low-mid D6 and is still able to beat out the player who boosted more. Player B places third and gets goodstuff, while Player A places 6th and gets shafted (aside from vRofl, but still). Last edited by Deidara837; 06-27-2014 at 01:31 PM.. |
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06-27-2014, 02:08 PM | #14 | |||
Rhythm game specialist.
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Re: D7 Should be split into two different groups
Quote:
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Last edited by TC_Halogen; 06-27-2014 at 02:15 PM.. |
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06-27-2014, 06:04 PM | #15 | |
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Re: D7 Should be split into two different groups
Quote:
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06-28-2014, 05:27 AM | #16 |
D7 Elite Keymasher
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Re: D7 Should be split into two different groups
Idk man i'm a D7 drop out
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06-27-2014, 09:53 AM | #17 |
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Re: D7 Should be split into two different groups
Its also unfair that any other division has low and high that have to face off as well. But if you have divisions that is what has to be done. I mean low d6 and high d6 are FAR off in skill and nothing is done about that, same with D1, etc
Just let it be, they are in D7 for a reason.
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06-27-2014, 10:14 AM | #18 |
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Re: D7 Should be split into two different groups
because having an official free-for-all tournament is the best way to keep a dying site healthy and alive
divisions keep the circlejerk in one small division |
06-27-2014, 10:25 AM | #19 |
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Re: D7 Should be split into two different groups
well yea but then the point of the tournament is to keep the circle jerks rolling and the site alive
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06-27-2014, 10:31 AM | #20 |
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Re: D7 Should be split into two different groups
divisions help people gauge how well they're doing and how close to the circlejerk they are
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