On the Removal of Crowdpleaser from Level Ranks

[VisD]

41/78 is a majority

[SK8R43]

Originally Posted by VisD

41/78 is a majority, yes

41/73

5 people are undecided and dont count. only 73 people technically voted lol

[kmay]

Small majority... And that's like telling me to step a JS file in order to know bad JS. No. There is no reason to step a file to be able to judge the playability of it. I'm still waiting for you to say something to change my mind. There has been nothing of value from your posts.


You have said nothing substantial this entire time. There is a reasonable connection about overcoming obstacles. There is no way a new player will play a 94 and expect it to be easy. The pattern is do-able 300 people have done it. The vibration pattern does go to the song. Its all stepped well. Its technically fun and an enjoyable song.

So please make a point and stop just saying mine are not right. Learn to argue and debate please.


Vibrating, or overlay, could be considered skills that should not be hidden but showcased. Reasonably of course. That's why vRofl is token. CP is not stamina draining and can be whored. I mean I guess if you're Haku you could whore vRofl :P

[VisD]

I was being charitable and included the undecideds, but if one wanted a stronger aye case then yeah 41/73

[ilikexd]

Originally Posted by Hakulyte

At one point in time, simfile artists made a few batches of files with hands in them because the vast majority of players adapted to playing spread. If somehow we manage to have a large group of players being able to vibrate and get somewhere with this, it's possible that on long term the game evolves into raw scoring + vibrating files. So, try again with this thread once raw scoring gets implemented and people aren't afraid to lose FC on something they can't do physically.

Vibrating is really unique. You tense up your brachioradialis which inadvertently causes your arm to rapidly shake; you don't actually do the action by shaking your arm or hand itself. It's not really trainable (perfectible/improvable) in speed because it's just a singular movement that only slightly varies in speed based on individuals' anatomy. Pretty much everyone can only do it at 180 BPM 16ths, give or take 5 BPM. And I think it's just impossible or near impossible for some due to anatomy. It's also really luck-based because sometimes your arm will just stop shaking for a fraction of a second, or you don't register keytaps. It's really entirely different than the other two skills (one-handed trilling and wristjacking) which are entirely what comprise speed. It's really not something I think that should be utilized in charts intended for a broad audience.

[ilikexd]

Originally Posted by SK8R43

41/73

5 people are undecided and dont count. only 73 people technically voted lol

Do you know what the word 'majority' means?

[SK8R43]

Honestly though. For the very few people that do care about my opinion. If CP isnt going to be in public ranks anymore just remove the whole file. Dumping everything into the token levelranks when it isnt a token doesnt even make sense...
I voted no, the file is cool and not really that hard to practice/get good at. Its really easy to get a SDG with a few misses as KMAY stated already which indicates its not THAT hard of a file. Yes its close to impossible to AAA without overlay/DS, but who cares anyways..its a 94 and most people wont even be able to AAA 94's anyways with practice. Mastering this game doesnt even matter, just leave it.
As already states as well, why would a new player be playing a 94 anyways?

[arcnmx]

Agreed with removing stupid charts. The whole "if it wouldn't be remotely accepted now it probably shouldn't be there" argument seems fair.

Then again level ranks are useless and need a complete revamp anyway so who cares.

Originally Posted by SK8R43

As already states as well, why would a new player be playing a 94 anyways?

AFAICT most new players just repeatedly spam CP, DP, and RATO :P

[kmay]

If you want to be considered good at the game and able to FC all the charts. You should be able to get ONE song that has a short vibrating section.... If you want to be amongst the elite. You should be well rounded.

[SK8R43]

Originally Posted by kmay

If you want to be considered good at the game and able to FC all the charts. You should be able to get ONE song that has a short vibrating section.... If you want to be amongst the elite. You should be well rounded.

Yup. And honestly the trill isnt even THAT hard. hell ive clean fcd it in isolation a few times with pure vibrating.

[ilikexd]

Originally Posted by kmay

Small majority... And that's like telling me to step a JS file in order to know bad JS. No. There is no reason to step a file to be able to judge the playability of it. I'm still waiting for you to say something to change my mind. There has been nothing of value from your posts.

Vibrating is just different from anything. Not sure what "bad js" is supposed to mean.

Originally Posted by kmay

You have said nothing substantial this entire time. There is a reasonable connection about overcoming obstacles. There is no way a new player will play a 94 and expect it to be easy. The pattern is do-able 300 people have done it. The vibration pattern does go to the song. Its all stepped well. Its technically fun and an enjoyable song.

CP trill isn't some obstacle that can be overcome. Nobody is really vibrating at 240 BPM 16ths. Some of the best can burst up to 200-220 for an extremely short time and with luck, but getting to that point is only because somebody was already anatomically predisposed to be capable.

The pattern is not doable. If by 300 people have "done" it, you mean 300 people have AAAd the trill by vibrating, you are grossly mistaken. Take a look at Dossar's video of him attempting to AAA the trill on isolation. He's considered one of the best at vibrating and he plays the CP trill on isolation hundreds of times in a row, only to AAA it a couple of times because of perfect frame luck and physical movement luck.

The vibration pattern doesn't go the song. It isn't stepped well because it has ghost notes and inconsistent layering in the first half, notes, jacks, and bursts that go to nothing or almost nothing, and many misrhythms.

Don't understand what "technically fun" is. What?

Originally Posted by kmay

Vibrating, or overlay, could be considered skills that should not be hidden but showcased. Reasonably of course. That's why vRofl is token. CP is not stamina draining and can be whored. I mean I guess if you're Haku you could whore vRofl :P

Overlay is a very roundabout, borderline cheating method of playing a 4-arrow game. DSing/overlaying vROFL is hardly an example of anything that this game should be. It is the epitome of a joke.

[TheSaxRunner05]

If there were 100 AAA's on DP tomorrow, we'd take all the scores off because they were cheated.

Since most of the top scores on CP are cheated (obtained in a way against FFR's rules), remove it from the level ranks to solves the issue.

Cheated scores ruin the point of the level rank in the first place.

[SK8R43]

lol the cp trill CAN be overcome. Ive practiced it hundreds of times, started off shitty and after a week or two of pure practice i was clean to almost clean fcing it 1 out of every 5 tries.


Every file in this game does NOT need to be aaa'd so i dont see why fcing the trill vibrating isnt good enough?

[ilikexd]

Originally Posted by SK8R43

Yup. And honestly the trill isnt even THAT hard. hell ive clean fcd it in isolation a few times with pure vibrating.

If you can only FC it a few times out of what is presumably dozens of attempts, then it is THAT hard. And that's just in total isolation where you're practiced and singularly focused. Now consider it with the entire chart and the time it takes to get to that point in the chart and the other bizarre bursts earlier on. And then consider the fact that you're only saying FC, not AAA.

[ilikexd]

I mean, wow. That's ridiculous.

The trill in CP is literally, 100%, no questions, the single hardest part of any chart in the entire game excluding vROFL.

[SK8R43]

Originally Posted by ilikexd

If you can only FC it a few times out of what is presumably dozens of attempts, then it is THAT hard. And that's just in total isolation where you're practiced and singularly focused. Now consider it with the entire chart and the time it takes to get to that point in the chart and the other bizarre bursts earlier on. And then consider the fact that you're only saying FC, not AAA.

It doesnt need to be aaa'd like i just mentioned. Rato and DP will never be AAAd as well and are still public.

And lol no, it takes people hundreds of retries to get aaas ALOT easier than that, it just takes patience, that DOESNT mean its THAT hard.

[kmay]

Done it is meaning FC. And just because its hard doesn't mean it should be moved. I see no reason that "oh vibrating that fast is hard" and like I've said. DDR has four pads but is played with two feet. I played index. I felt spread and one hand was cheating due to the use of 3/4 fingers.


Utilize your resources. And what god says that using your skill to obtain a score is cheating? You're not using a bot. Its your skill.


And bad js, is referring to the fact that I dont need to step a file to know how it plays. There are definitely some bad files and awkward patterns in songs all over FFR.







Just to say it again, I want it removed but for selfish reasons.

[TheSaxRunner05]

For those of you who want to keep it in, what do you propose to do about all the cheated FC's?

[SK8R43]

I just looked through my SS's and after alot of practice and not being able to do the megatrill AT ALL, i actually got 10 clean, 8-0-0-1 and 5-1-0-1 on the isolation. Now i KNOW that its ALOT harder to do it on the actual file, but those were done with pure vibrating. IT CAN BE OVERCOME, no need to aaa the file, an fc is damn good enough lmao

EDIT: Leave them, cant tell which ones are cheated and which ones arent

[Hakulyte]

AAA on CP matters because people AAA'd CP.

If you're upset about FCs on CP, you should look at vROFL FCs.