R^n: Shifting Paradigms - Page 9

**aperson** · 05-12-2006, 09:19 PM

Realize that autogenned doubles are actually more annoying than usual because they move back and forth between sides and you often have to do **** all on one hand.

Z3ratul · 05-12-2006, 10:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by aperson

Realize that autogenned doubles are actually more annoying than usual because they move back and forth between sides and you often have to do **** all on one hand.

If you play the files with turn mods on (especially supershuffle), it pretty much solves that. I'll play the same file six times on each mod... there's your etudes Dore. ^_^

BTW, solo is much tougher than I initially predicted- I'm glad I kept all my old DDR packs. I've found three methods so far:

A) Using two finger index.

B) Using a six finger spread with your two ring fingers taking left and right, and your middles fingers now taking upleft and upright.

C) Using your four finger spread. On solo, it makes for an interesting spread-index hybrid.

I'm sure there's other methods, but there are the ones that are working best for me. Not gonna attempt anything of this one-handed, but I could definetely see that being plausible. One handers would have each finger cover two keys?

Anyways, I'm best with a plain two finger index (on solo), but I'm trying to learn six finger spread. Trills between ring and middles fingers are a pain in the ass though. However, it makes doubles a ton easier. I'ma keep playing, this is pretty fun re-learning all this.

EDIT: Sorry if this is a hijack from the initial topic, but it's where the discussion seems to be heading.

braintrust · 05-12-2006, 10:16 PM

For solo/double I think it's easiest to reassign keys. For solo I usually reassign so it's like o2jam without the space bar, and for doubles I just add two keys in (I change it up from time to time, and I've only tried doubles on kb like three times). So really solo/doubles is more than just adding arrows, it completely changes how the game is played.

Z3ratul · 05-12-2006, 10:28 PM

Haven't played o2jam >.<

How's it set up there?

braintrust · 05-12-2006, 10:34 PM

SDF is left hand and HJK JKL are right (it's been a while, it might be shifted one key right or left). Space bar is then kind of like the turn table on Beatmania. I use SDF and JKL for solo and have tried many many different setups for doubles. NOthing seems to work wonderfully for doubles. It's just hard no matter how you cut it.

**talisman** · 05-12-2006, 10:59 PM

skor made an interesting doubles charts to one of his stratovarius files... I remember trying to play it and failing.

**Moogy** · 05-12-2006, 11:08 PM

If you're going to make doubles charts for StepMania, just make BMS files for a IIDX sim. Same thing, except not retarded.

dascookieman · 05-12-2006, 11:14 PM

ATTN: Solo is fun as hell

**Snapps** · 05-12-2006, 11:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Moogy

If you're going to make doubles charts for StepMania, just make BMS files for a IIDX sim. Same thing, except not retarded.

Most people will try to make it more like SM and not like IIDX if they have no idea what an IIDX file is like.

Yesssss · 05-13-2006, 02:14 AM

I guess most of the people here are willing to play solo.
I'm not. The arrow placement is really weird one handed.
Take a genuine stream that goes from right to left to right. It would be 69857475896 on the numpad. Try doing that one hand and see just how awkward that would be.
I could get used to it, but it's still too awkward for me to find much fun in it.

Edit: It would also be the same with index.

So in order to make the files friendly for non-spreaders, the arrow patterns would have to be much different than a normal simple file.

Okay so maybe I will try it if the patterns aren't too simplistic.

Edit2: a 6 leading to a 9 and vice versa is the only thing that is confusing. Make them very minimal in transition files.

dascookieman · 05-13-2006, 02:29 AM

Well since it's like starting over playing something new you could just play it spread...
I have not tried doubles yet but I assume it's pretty retarded, solo on the other hand is really funny. 8th are like a million times harder then 16ths rofl. I played about 1 hour and passed stratofortress and a couple of other random pretty streamy files, but I had a hard time passing boss machine because of the 8ths in the beginning lol.

Yesssss · 05-13-2006, 02:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dascookieman

Well since it's like starting over playing something new you could just play it spread...

There is a very very large subtle difference in the speed of my hands. My left hand alone can only do 170 bpm streams wheras my right hand alone can only do 270 bpm streams.
There's also the difference at the speed I strike the arrow once I read it.
I have to play index on C700 and even when I do, I get: Marv, Great, Marv, Great, etc.
I've practically ruined myself for two-handed play. Except for double style which I don't feel like ranting about.

Btw all this ranting was just an effect of me being stubborn and tired. I'll use spread since I can read decently. I'll just have to get used to it.

2 AM going to bed brb.

DukAmok · 05-13-2006, 03:43 AM

"very very large subtle difference"

lol

but yeah, solo keyboard should be played dfghjk or whatever similar "spread" style, playing on numpad is just really awkward.

so i think im going to go with solo as well, doubles is just too hard to play, either with thumbs or pinkies for the extra notes. 6 finger is pretty solid though. we'll see how this goes.

white_boy · 05-13-2006, 09:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DukAmok

"very very large subtle difference"

lol

but yeah, solo keyboard should be played dfghjk or whatever similar "spread" style, playing on numpad is just really awkward.

so i think im going to go with solo as well, doubles is just too hard to play, either with thumbs or pinkies for the extra notes. 6 finger is pretty solid though. we'll see how this goes.

yeah, doubles is probably too hard...and the direction of all the arrows flying just adds more confusion.

solo ftw. i cant wait till some charts are released ><.

**aperson** · 05-13-2006, 09:59 AM

If you make a double or solo chart though, make sure there is at least one singles chart. Shifting paradigms is great and all, but if you shift too fast people will just overlook it.

DukAmok · 05-13-2006, 11:53 AM

Hr2 · 05-13-2006, 12:40 PM

I'm trying solo, and uhh, if we want people to play solo we better start with non-interesting and non-innovative charts because solo is way too hard to start doing crazy stuff with yet. It'll take people a long time to get used to and making solo simfiles is annoying because you have to actually move your hands if you want to place the arrows because you don't have 6 fingers.

My hand speed is different too, I can jackhammer like 200bpm no problemo on my right hand but only like 150 on my left hand (and hit them all)

braintrust · 05-13-2006, 12:50 PM

You don't have to make it un-innovative. You just have to make it easy. It can be both.

T0rajir0u · 05-13-2006, 02:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hr2

because you don't have 6 fingers.

Iono about you but I have 10 8)

Srsly, 6-finger spread for solo isn't that hard, just takes awhile to get used to reading it. Definitely viable. Now, doubles, on the other hand, is hard no matter how you do it unless you're already good at Beatmania.

braintrust · 05-13-2006, 02:07 PM

And even if your good at beatmania it's completely different. Being good at beatmania would help, but the area between the keys is a lot more on a IIDX controller, as is the size of the keys. So yeah... doubles is just plain insane on kb.

05-12-2006, 09:19 PM	#161
aperson FFR Hall of Fame Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: Houston Posts: 3,428	Re: R^n: Shifting Paradigms Realize that autogenned doubles are actually more annoying than usual because they move back and forth between sides and you often have to do **** all on one hand. __________________

05-12-2006, 10:16 PM	#163
braintrust FFR Player Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Right outsida Chi-town Posts: 182	Re: R^n: Shifting Paradigms For solo/double I think it's easiest to reassign keys. For solo I usually reassign so it's like o2jam without the space bar, and for doubles I just add two keys in (I change it up from time to time, and I've only tried doubles on kb like three times). So really solo/doubles is more than just adding arrows, it completely changes how the game is played.

05-12-2006, 10:34 PM	#165
braintrust FFR Player Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Right outsida Chi-town Posts: 182	Re: R^n: Shifting Paradigms SDF is left hand and HJK JKL are right (it's been a while, it might be shifted one key right or left). Space bar is then kind of like the turn table on Beatmania. I use SDF and JKL for solo and have tried many many different setups for doubles. NOthing seems to work wonderfully for doubles. It's just hard no matter how you cut it.

05-12-2006, 10:59 PM	#166
talisman Resident Penguin Join Date: May 2003 Age: 37 Posts: 4,598	Re: R^n: Shifting Paradigms skor made an interesting doubles charts to one of his stratovarius files... I remember trying to play it and failing.

05-12-2006, 11:08 PM	#167
Moogy 嗚呼 Join Date: Aug 2003 Age: 34 Posts: 10,303	Re: R^n: Shifting Paradigms If you're going to make doubles charts for StepMania, just make BMS files for a IIDX sim. Same thing, except not retarded. __________________ Plz visit my blog ^^^ vintage signature from like 2006 preserved

05-12-2006, 11:14 PM	#168
dascookieman FFR Player Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: we wrestle polar bears Age: 36 Posts: 3,248	Re: R^n: Shifting Paradigms ATTN: Solo is fun as hell __________________

05-13-2006, 02:14 AM	#170
Yesssss FFR Player Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: In a Lawnmower Age: 35 Posts: 2,522	Re: R^n: Shifting Paradigms I guess most of the people here are willing to play solo. I'm not. The arrow placement is really weird one handed. Take a genuine stream that goes from right to left to right. It would be 69857475896 on the numpad. Try doing that one hand and see just how awkward that would be. I could get used to it, but it's still too awkward for me to find much fun in it. Edit: It would also be the same with index. So in order to make the files friendly for non-spreaders, the arrow patterns would have to be much different than a normal simple file. Okay so maybe I will try it if the patterns aren't too simplistic. Edit2: a 6 leading to a 9 and vice versa is the only thing that is confusing. Make them very minimal in transition files. __________________ YOU JUST WON THE GAME! CONGRATULATIONS! Last edited by Yesssss; 05-13-2006 at 02:31 AM..

05-13-2006, 02:29 AM	#171
dascookieman FFR Player Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: we wrestle polar bears Age: 36 Posts: 3,248	Re: R^n: Shifting Paradigms Well since it's like starting over playing something new you could just play it spread... I have not tried doubles yet but I assume it's pretty retarded, solo on the other hand is really funny. 8th are like a million times harder then 16ths rofl. I played about 1 hour and passed stratofortress and a couple of other random pretty streamy files, but I had a hard time passing boss machine because of the 8ths in the beginning lol. __________________

05-13-2006, 03:43 AM	#173
DukAmok FFR Player Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: Corona, CA Posts: 1,841	Re: R^n: Shifting Paradigms "very very large subtle difference" lol but yeah, solo keyboard should be played dfghjk or whatever similar "spread" style, playing on numpad is just really awkward. so i think im going to go with solo as well, doubles is just too hard to play, either with thumbs or pinkies for the extra notes. 6 finger is pretty solid though. we'll see how this goes. __________________

05-13-2006, 09:59 AM	#175
aperson FFR Hall of Fame Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: Houston Posts: 3,428	Re: R^n: Shifting Paradigms If you make a double or solo chart though, make sure there is at least one singles chart. Shifting paradigms is great and all, but if you shift too fast people will just overlook it. __________________

05-13-2006, 11:53 AM	#176
DukAmok FFR Player Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: Corona, CA Posts: 1,841	Re: R^n: Shifting Paradigms ok __________________

05-13-2006, 12:40 PM	#177
Hr2 FFR Player Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Pennsylvania Age: 35 Posts: 2,350	Re: R^n: Shifting Paradigms I'm trying solo, and uhh, if we want people to play solo we better start with non-interesting and non-innovative charts because solo is way too hard to start doing crazy stuff with yet. It'll take people a long time to get used to and making solo simfiles is annoying because you have to actually move your hands if you want to place the arrows because you don't have 6 fingers. My hand speed is different too, I can jackhammer like 200bpm no problemo on my right hand but only like 150 on my left hand (and hit them all) __________________ Last edited by Hr2; 05-13-2006 at 12:54 PM..

05-13-2006, 12:50 PM	#178
braintrust FFR Player Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Right outsida Chi-town Posts: 182	Re: R^n: Shifting Paradigms You don't have to make it un-innovative. You just have to make it easy. It can be both.

05-13-2006, 02:07 PM	#180
braintrust FFR Player Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Right outsida Chi-town Posts: 182	Re: R^n: Shifting Paradigms And even if your good at beatmania it's completely different. Being good at beatmania would help, but the area between the keys is a lot more on a IIDX controller, as is the size of the keys. So yeah... doubles is just plain insane on kb.

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