Clear some stuff up

[y0ttabyte]

Originally Posted by -Yukari-

I am surprised moderators are allowed to be so openly accusatory and rude with absolutely no solid evidence (as shown here). I suggest the staff choose more carefully who this community's role-models / good examples will be.

I think this is a very good point. I think any accusation without reasonable justification should be punishable whether it happens to end up being accurate or not. Point out any suspicious activity to mods and let them deal with it... otherwise it just makes the community look awful (and probably drives a lot of skilled players away).

All this talk about getting a webcam is also a waste of time too Yukari, Rubix posted many videos showing him play legitimately, but the hordes still continued to give him a hard time.

[SnS]

Originally Posted by Mr.Nothing

I'm surprised people dont call bs on my "one time fluke" AAA on Seven. Made me so happy

Video or it didn't happen.

[Adamaja456]

jesus, that was fun reading those pages of hate.

First off, i seriously dont know why people like pressing f5 or ESC or whtever key so the game doesnt record.
Personally, it makes me more skeptical because nobody truely knows how many FFR games a person plays. And i don't like it when people delete there replays. Just keep them all there for christs sake.

Originally Posted by -Yukari-

That's fine, no talented player will have 100% support.

Shash. Oh ok


I dunno, it just seems like your going through alot of trouble telling people your legit but when a respected person wants a vid, you basically say no.

I seriously don't know if your legit or not. Id rather not say which way im leaning.

whatever.

[DarkManticoreX2]

lol CT.

Just get a vid up sometime before the convention. Which is on march 29th. That gives you about 2 months.

Here's the specs. Hands, Screen, Talk once during the song (Say Manti is an internet brat idc), Show programs after you finish playing, Get less than 5 (6) goods on HB.

Do all this, and post it. If you succeed, let me be the first to Apologize and say "Welcome to FFR"

[devonin]

Shash. Oh ok

Let's rephrase: No talented player who didn't start off demonstrably average inside the community will ever have 100% support.

Holding everyone to the standards of Shashakiro, and insisting that they -must- start out no better than average, and then slowly improve over time on the forum in order to be accepted at face value seems pretty ridiculous to me.

We just need to accept that there are other games that build very similar skillsets, and that sometimes, it so happens that there will be people who find adapting to the individual changes to be a fairly quick and easy process.

That doesn't mean they cheat, or they hack, or they aren't legitimate. I rather like the idea of innocent until proven guilty, and "You did really well, really quickly" shouldn't be cause to accuse someone of illegitimacy entirely on its own. I mean, I'd think that "Show us some SM screenshots" to back up the claim that they already had a high degree of skill coming in would be a better way to try and test for legitimacy than to demand highly specific video evidence.

I mean...it -is- just a game after all. This isn't someone coming in day 1 of the official tourney and AAA'ing every song in expert to win actual cash.

[Coolboyrulez0]

I believe she/he is a hacker because he/she is overly defensive and aggressive when we accuse her/him or prove a fact.

Also calling manti a brat is not too smart. He's a very well known and respected player.

Call me a ****** a dumbass or something but this person is clearly BS in my book.
Even if I am wrong I will not appologize to this person that has no respect regs.

[Adamaja456]

Originally Posted by devonin

Let's rephrase: No talented player who didn't start off demonstrably average inside the community will ever have 100% support.

I agree with that statement.

[devonin]

I believe she/he is a hacker because he/she is overly defensive and aggressive when we accuse her/him or prove a fact.

You're a cheat and a liar, and I don't take any explanation you would give me to suggest otherwise even remotely seriously.

Tell me how you -wouldn't- be defensive and aggressive in this situation?

I completely sympathize with -Yukari- here. Yes, they have a lot of very good scores very quickly. Yes, by the paranoid standards of this community it looks suspicious. However, that completely explains why when confronted about this so soon after showing up, -Yukari- was defensive.

While it was only a matter of course before someone made the public suggestion of illegitimacy, and in this case it come from someone who is well known and respected around the site, I don't see how an accusation of cheating without anything but implicative evidence should be any more okay just because it came from someone everybody knows.

A question came up in my tournament about -Yukari- for posting a number of sightread AAAs on songs that while not extraordinarily hard, were nevertheless not easy by any stretch, and Tasselfoot stated that at no point in playing did -Yukari- trip a single protocol designed to detect the use of hacks, trainers, etc. That was good enough for us, and I'll never really understand why that consistantly fails to be good enough for the community.

When the administration of the game say "Looks legit to us" the community should take its cue from that, and not continue to insist that it can't be.

[omgitznpv]

Originally Posted by Coolboyrulez0

I believe she/he is a hacker because he/she is overly defensive and aggressive when we accuse her/him or prove a fact.

Also calling manti a brat is not too smart. He's a very well known and respected player.

Call me a ****** a dumbass or something but this person is clearly BS in my book.
Even if I am wrong I will not appologize to this person that has no respect regs.

Before I say everything, I just want people to know that I'm leaning towards the "yukari is not bs" side.

CBR, shut up.

I understand perfectly why somebody would do something like this. If one was to have a shroud of doubt surrounding them, one would probably want to clear that. This is basically the situation, and I see nothing wrong with it. Yukari basically wants to clear up everything so that people think of him/her as a legitimate player.

Think about this. If someone keeps up in your face accusing you of something you didn't do, you'd want to shove them away, right?

Just because someone shows up and is able to do some incredible thing doesn't mean they're a hacker. I mean, come on, guys. Innocent until proven guilty. Accusing somebody without full proof could cause some negative things to happen to that person. Unless you're at least 90% sure (with proof and such), don't go out and call people hackers.

HELLBEAT. First FMO AAA. I don't really see anything wrong with that. Heck, if all of you that are good at this game try enough, I bet you could do it too. Short enough, and only a fraction of the song is relatively difficult.

[Coolboyrulez0]

Originally Posted by devonin

You're a cheat and a liar, and I don't take any explanation you would give me to suggest otherwise even remotely seriously.

Tell me how you -wouldn't- be defensive and aggressive in this situation?

I completely sympathize with -Yukari- here. Yes, they have a lot of very good scores very quickly. Yes, by the paranoid standards of this community it looks suspicious. However, that completely explains why when confronted about this so soon after showing up, -Yukari- was defensive.

While it was only a matter of course before someone made the public suggestion of illegitimacy, and in this case it come from someone who is well known and respected around the site, I don't see how an accusation of cheating without anything but implicative evidence should be any more okay just because it came from someone everybody knows.

A question came up in my tournament about -Yukari- for posting a number of sightread AAAs on songs that while not extraordinarily hard, were nevertheless not easy by any stretch, and Tasselfoot stated that at no point in playing did -Yukari- trip a single protocol designed to detect the use of hacks, trainers, etc. That was good enough for us, and I'll never really understand why that consistantly fails to be good enough for the community.

When the administration of the game say "Looks legit to us" the community should take its cue from that, and not continue to insist that it can't be.

I see what you mean but personally I wouldn't be defensive or aggressive at all.
I'd just ignore them and mind my own buisness.
By making a thread about saying how you aren't BS is just putting yourself out there.
I don't want to argue with the smartest poster on this site but I hope you understand my point.
And personally I really don't care if she/he is a hacker but its just odd be sooo good at a game in such a short time. I've been playing for almost 2 years now yet I am not remotely as good as this player... It's just odd to me.

CBR

PS: Wow, CBR made a educational, contributing post.
EDIT: omgitznpv read this post. Comprehend. Thanks.

[afronova1127]

i dont think you hack and i hate how people keep pointing fingers at everyone, if you hack, youll be found out, if you dont you dont, keep playing, as far as people saying you hack because youre too defensive, thats a bunch of bs, if i just started playing and people said i hack id get defensive too because itd freaking piss me off, rock on, who cares

[devonin]

I see what you mean but personally I wouldn't be defensive or aggressive at all.
I'd just ignore them and mind my own buisness.

However, when someone -wants- to become part of the community, and respected members of the community are giving you crap, a little defensiveness is to be expected.

I'm also pretty sure that -Yukari- intends to take Manti up on his offer. The real question will become "If -Yukari- plays ball here and makes a legit vid, will everyone accept it as valid proof and lay off?"

I suspect the answer is "Manti will, but someone else will take up the claim."

[phe0nixblade]

Originally Posted by -Yukari-

There is never going to be a top player EVERYBODY believes is legit

No one thought Shashakiro was bs.

[Coolboyrulez0]

Originally Posted by devonin

However, when someone -wants- to become part of the community, and respected members of the community are giving you crap, a little defensiveness is to be expected.

I'm also pretty sure that -Yukari- intends to take Manti up on his offer. The real question will become "If -Yukari- plays ball here and makes a legit vid, will everyone accept it as valid proof and lay off?"

I suspect the answer is "Manti will, but someone else will take up the claim."

See I don't care what the community thinks because I think most people of this community are undereducated bastards. I lost my respect for most of the community a long time ago.

If Yukari posts a legit video of course I, and probably every other person will accept it.

Btw,
This person reminds me of BemaniChris and MrRubix.

BemaniChris got accused made a video and then got accused even more and left.
And MrRubix I forgot what happend to him. He was also in a huge crossfire.

Anyways, I just feel like dropping this topic because its not worth it to me to argue about some new good player, legit or not. It's a waste of time and now I am going to play Stepmania.

[DarkManticoreX2]

Devo, You're a great critical thinker, But you don't know much about the game.

Lets put it this way. FFR has 3 frames to hit a perfect, Upper, Center, and lower frame. The center frame equates with what would be a marv in Stepmania. A Stepmania player would then be accustomed to hitting the center frame of FFR's note system.

FFR Scoring:mmStepmania Scoring

Average:mmmmGood
Good:mmmmmmGreat
Perfect:mmmmmPerfect----This note and all below it are overlapped in a 2 framer
Perfect:mmmmmMarv
Perfect:mmmmmPerfect-----------This note is overlaped by the second in a 4-framer
Good:mmmmmmGreat
Good:mmmmmmGood

Now, Because FFR gives priority to the second note and not the first, This is where ave-misses stem from. A 4-framer (As seen in VB, K8107) Do not affect the center perfect frame in FFR. So avemisses will not overly affect a stepmania player accustomed to hitting arrows in the marv window.

Hellbeat on the other hand has a 2 framer. With a 2-framer, all the perfect windows are overlapped by the second arrow, making it impossible to get a perfect. This is where Transition comes into play. A person just coming over from SM, would not be accustomed to hitting a note so early. Especially in the 8 day interval from which -Yukari- played her first game. Had it of been a few weeks I'd understand, 8 days seems like an unreasonably short period of time to be so used to the quirks of the game. Which is why I became suspicious of her in the first place.

[phe0nixblade]

Oh p.s. I don't think he's legit, but whatever, his scores are good, but not super good.

[Coolboyrulez0]

Originally Posted by DarkManticoreX2

Devo, You're a great critical thinker, But you don't know much about the game.

Lets put it this way. FFR has 3 frames to hit a perfect, Upper, Center, and lower frame. The center frame equates with what would be a marv in Stepmania. A Stepmania player would then be accustomed to hitting the center frame of FFR's note system.

FFR Scoring:mmStepmania Scoring

Average:mmmmGood
Good:mmmmmmGreat
Perfect:mmmmmPerfect----This note and all below it are overlapped in a 2 framer
Perfect:mmmmmMarv
Perfect:mmmmmPerfect-----------This note is overlaped by the second in a 4-framer
Good:mmmmmmGreat
Good:mmmmmmGood

Now, Because FFR gives priority to the second note and not the first, This is where ave-misses stem from. A 4-framer (As seen in VB, K8107) Do not affect the center perfect frame in FFR. So avemisses will not overly affect a stepmania player accustomed to hitting arrows in the marv window.

Hellbeat on the other hand has a 2 framer. With a 2-framer, all the perfect windows are overlapped by the second arrow, making it impossible to get a perfect. This is where Transition comes into play. A person just coming over from SM, would not be accustomed to hitting a note so early. Especially in the 8 day interval from which -Yukari- played her first game. Had it of been a few weeks I'd understand, 8 days seems like an unreasonably short period of time to be so used to the quirks of the game. Which is why I became suspicious of her in the first place.

I couldn't have said it better.
I have been playing actively FFR for 1.5 years.
And stepmania for almost 2.
Yet I still haven't got used to the AV misses.

And he/she got used to it in a week?
...There is something fishy.

OR it is an alt but I don't believe in that possibility.

[omgitznpv]

Originally Posted by Coolboyrulez0

most people of this community are undereducated bastards

hi

Uh, Manti, think about it, it's one 2-framer.

[stargroup]

Originally Posted by Coolboyrulez0

See I don't care what the community thinks because I think most people of this community are undereducated bastards.

Just so you know, you're one of them.

Originally Posted by Coolboyrulez0

I lost my respect for most of the community a long time ago.

Why, because people disagree with you?

[-Yukari-]

Oh yeah, Manticore, how will the webcam thing work?

Thanks Devonin :)

And, as for the 2-framer, it's very easy to hit if treated as a jump. The exact pattern in that section is (and this is coming by memory):

Right, Down, Left, Right, Down, Left, Right, Down, Left is your 2-framer, then it's Left, Down, Right, Down, Left (left-handed crossover). If you hit the Down before the Left at the right time, and hit the Left at the same time, you will Perfect the Down and Good the Left because you hit it at the same time as the Down, which was earlier, so it will be Good, which is what you want. Not rocket science :)

Also, I'm not trying to prove myself with that information right there..... I just thought somebody might actually be able to use it, it worked for HammyMcSquirrel, so it might work for you too. EDIT: Be careful with that strategy though, I painfully, painfully avflagged HELLBEAT on the jack using that strategy =/ I think that means you need to hit on the down arrow's middle Perfect frame :)

Tell me how the webcam thing's gonna happen Manticore.

EDIT:

Her

and

She

are just about done :)