What's with the hostility towards Christians?

[qqwref]

Originally Posted by Squeek

I have the feeling you're going to reply to this with resentment and claim that I put too much "faith" in scientists, but that's because historians and scientists have a system that allows EVERYBODY to discredit them! Want to prove that water is not H20? You can! You won't, but you can try!

This is a really good point. And, for related reasons, if you provide undeniable evidence to the scientific community, they will actually say "OK, you're right". Scientific theories aren't written down in an ancient book somewhere - they're actually constantly updated, whenever someone does an experiment and determines that the current theory doesn't quite fit. If you know where to look (typically the paper that first proposed the theory), you can find the data that supports scientific claims.

And then we come to one of the reasons why I have a problem with Christianity. Try to tell the Christian community that you did experiments and have actual evidence that they're wrong (such as objects which are carbon-dated to >10000 years old, for those who believe in Genesis as a literal historical work), and they will at best ignore you for decades or centuries, and at worst torture or kill you. When Galileo proposed his theory of a sun-centered solar system (which explains the movement of the planets better than any other theory), the Church sentenced him to house arrest and forced him to recant his ideas. It took until 1992 - almost 350 years after Galileo died - for the Vatican to officially concede that the Earth was not stationary.

[Bolth mannn]

Originally Posted by Dorby

The only reason I look down upon them is because they

1. Believe in someone that never existed
2. Some (not all are like this) base their life off of christianity, once again, something that is not real, it did not happen, etc.
3. Think less of others because they are not christian i.e. my ex's father disowned his own daughter because she married into a different religion... that's just going too far.

1) do you have proof he never existed?
2) again, do you have proof?
3) I too, agree that is going too far, thats not how all christians act.

sure christians dont have physical proof, thats where faith comes in. christianity actually has a lot of evidence to support it. the only thing noone is entirely sure about is about jesus/big man in sky.

but theres heaps of evidence that support some of the stories in the bible.

sure we might not have proof, but neither do you, so dont say with certainty that it doesnt exist.

[Izzy]

Originally Posted by Bolth mannn

sure we might not have proof, but neither do you, so dont say with certainty that it doesnt exist.

Nice logic..
How can you have faith in something because there's no proof it doesn't exist.

[dean_machine]

Originally Posted by Bolth mannn

sure we might not have proof, but neither do you, so dont say with certainty that it doesnt exist.

Are you serious? You should look into apologetics either on the internet or in books. There's plenty of proof.

[Bolth mannn]

Originally Posted by Izzy

Nice logic..
How can you have faith in something because there's no proof it doesn't exist.

thats what faith is. believing in something we have no proof of.

if we all 'knew' god was real, christianity would be more like a clan. religion is based on faith.

EDIT: dean, list up some evidence then.

[dean_machine]

Originally Posted by Bolth mannn

thats what faith is. believing in something we have no proof of.

if we all 'knew' god was real, christianity would be more like a clan. religion is based on faith.

EDIT: dean, list up some evidence then.

I'd rather not, but since you say you're a christian you really should know that it's true and it would be good for you to find out all you can yourself.

[Bolth mannn]

What is the meaning of life?

if your an atheist, there is none. you live life, then you die, then thats it.

cause honestly, if theres no meaning to life, we should all kill ourselves to get it over with, all lifes going to bring is more troubles and pains.

whats the point?

oh and dean, every atheist argument Ive read on the internet so far is counter-claimed. so unless you can list some evidence that PROVES theres no such thing as christianity, im going to stick with my belief.

[Squeek]

Originally Posted by Bolth mannn

What is the meaning of life?

if your an atheist, there is none. you live life, then you die, then thats it.

cause honestly, if theres no meaning to life, we should all kill ourselves to get it over with, all lifes going to bring is more troubles and pains.

whats the point?

What is the meaning of life?

If you're a Christian, there is none. You live life, then you die (and go to heaven, the better place that you all strive to go to). Then that's it.

Cause honestly, if you're just going to go to heaven anyway, you should just all kill yourselves to get it over with, all life is going to bring is more sin.

What's the point?

ps - you're the ones telling us there's a magical being in the sky. Burden of proof lies with you.

[wickedawesomeful]

Originally Posted by Bolth mannn

1) do you have proof he never existed?
2) again, do you have proof?
3) I too, agree that is going too far, thats not how all christians act.

sure christians dont have physical proof, thats where faith comes in. christianity actually has a lot of evidence to support it. the only thing noone is entirely sure about is about jesus/big man in sky.

but theres heaps of evidence that support some of the stories in the bible.

sure we might not have proof, but neither do you, so dont say with certainty that it doesnt exist.

You can't validate a claim by saying there's no proof it's wrong. If there's no evidence of any existence at all, we CAN say with certainty that it doesn't exist.

[wickedawesomeful]

ps. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Big_Lie

Originally Posted by Joseph Goebbels

If you tell a lie big enough and keep repeating it, people will eventually come to believe it....

[Dr Tran]

absent of evidence is not the evidence of absence

[Squeek]

Originally Posted by Bolth mannn

but theres heaps of evidence that support some of the stories in the bible.

sure we might not have proof

Contradictory statements! I love it! But even without the second line:

Show me this proof.

You can't just write something like this without backing it up. Let's see this evidence.

[Bolth mannn]

lol the classic response:

show me proof he doesnt exist
show me proof he DOES exist.

need I say more.

us christians have our reasons that none of you atheists would understand seeing as you block off all views so quickly, and you wont even give us any evidence so whatever.

im tired of arguing over religion.

oh and squeek your response to my messege is flawed.

committing suicide is the equilavent of murder and you can not get into heaven by committing suicide.

and there is more meaning to life when you are a christian, dont say something like 'no its not, cause blah blah said so', your not a christian so you cant counter-claim this with certainty.

PS: im not telling you anything, you believe what you want, theres no proof against christianity.

thats my end in the argument, they may not be very strong points but unless you are/have been a proper christian, you cant post in this topic effectively.

[Grandiagod]

Originally Posted by bolth mannn

lol the classic response:

Show me proof he doesnt exist
show me proof he does exist.

Need i say more.

Us christians have our reasons that none of you atheists would understand seeing as you block off all views so quickly, and you wont even give us any evidence so whatever.

Im tired of arguing over religion.

Oh and squeek your response to my messege is flawed.

Committing suicide is the equilavent of murder and you can not get into heaven by committing suicide.

And there is more meaning to life when you are a christian, dont say something like 'no its not, cause blah blah said so', your not a christian so you cant counter-claim this with certainty.

Ps: Im not telling you anything, you believe what you want, theres no proof against christianity.

Thats my end in the argument, they may not be very strong points but unless you are/have been a proper christian, you cant post in this topic effectively.

burden of proof lies with the people making the claim.

You claim there is a god where no evidence exists.

Fffffffuuuuuuuu

[Squeek]

Originally Posted by Bolth mannn

us christians have our reasons that none of you atheists would understand seeing as you block off all views so quickly, and you wont even give us any evidence so whatever.

Again, this is not true. It's not that we ignore you. We demand proof, and you deny giving it to us. We have a proof-oriented view of life. Things that don't make sense to us demand lots of evidence to be confirmed as truth. Surely you don't believe everything people tell you, right? You demand proof for things you do not believe are true

oh and squeek your response to my messege is flawed.

committing suicide is the equilavent of murder and you can not get into heaven by committing suicide.

So don't commit suicide. Just kill each other. You're going to heaven either way, right?

Yes, it's sarcasm. You're the one telling me my life is meaningless though. Pretty sure that's not a very nice thing to say. Pretty sure Jesus wouldn't approve of that.

and there is more meaning to life when you are a christian, dont say something like 'no its not, cause blah blah said so', your not a christian so you cant counter-claim this with certainty.

Why is your life more meaningful because you're a Christian? That doesn't make any sense. Let's say I become a multi-billionaire and head a project that ends world hunger. Just because I'm not a Christian, this still makes me worth less than you?

Just so you know, I was a Catholic for 17 years of my life. I was raised Catholic, went to the modern-day version of Sunday School, earned all the religious awards with Boy Scouts, went to a Catholic school, was Confirmed, partook in church choir, and was a member of a church youth group for 3 years after I graduated from Catholic school. My life did not change when I quit the church. It simply meant that I didn't spend an hour listening to mindless chanting in a building every weekend. I questioned my faith (as several leaders of my church and youth group told me to) constantly and never received proper answers. Things in the religion just didn't make sense to me, and the explanation I was given (you just have to have faith!) were not sufficient. I was thinking about leaving long before I actually did. Then I did and I never looked back.

im not telling you anything, you believe what you want, theres no proof against christianity.

Ok, so, you're basically saying "I HAVE PROOF AND I KNOW YOU'RE WRONG!" and then saying "I'M NOT SAYING WHY!". It's obvious why you won't say--you don't have any proof. I, on the other hand, have about a hundred pieces of evidence against individual stories in the Bible. A lot of the hyperbolic events in the Bible were so big that they would've left archaeological evidence. None of them have. You would think people outside of the Bible would've written stories about these events. There are none. This alone is extraordinary proof against the Bible-- a book whose only proof comes from within its own pages.

thats my end in the argument, they may not be very strong points but unless you are/have been a proper christian, you cant post in this topic effectively.

And even if I weren't a Catholic before, why does that make me completely unable to post in this topic? That's completely unfair. The archaeology team that searched the desert that Moses supposedly lead people through for 40 years and found no evidence of a mass-exodus through didn't have to be Christian to disprove that story. All they needed was to hear that such an event happened, test to see if it did, and report their findings. If you don't believe their findings, you can go to the desert yourself and look for signs of mass-exodus and 40 years of wandering. That's the beauty of science I've been trying to explain to you. Anything you think is wrong about science, you have the ability to test for yourself. But, you're clearly too close-minded to bother.

[-zeroSKILL-]

yey for Agnosticism.

and also yey for being one of the people thats hostile towards extremely religious people. if you try and force your ideas on me, ill ****ing punch you. if not, we're cool. B)

PS
first time i think i've ever read anything squeek has posted that i agree with.

[qqwref]

Here's the thing about the Christian God. You say "there's no proof He doesn't exist", but how is that any reason to believe in God? There is also no proof the Muslim Allah doesn't exist, and the Jewish God, and all of the Greek/Roman, Pagan, Norse, Hindu, and Egyptian deities, and many many more besides those. And each one has (or had) holy writings and thousands of devout followers. Why not believe in those too?

I contend we are both atheists, I just believe in one fewer god than you do. When you understand why you dismiss all the other possible gods, you will understand why I dismiss yours. - Stephen F. Roberts

[Draigun]

I wanted to post how I feel about this whole debate, but Squeek pretty much covered anything and everything I'd have to say about it.

And it's true.. the counter-debates always end up simply being "Well you don't have proof." Rarely will anyone change someone's opinion, so the best thing to do is just let them believe what they want to believe. Don't force your religion on anyone else, and (we're far from it, but) don't try and govern the lives of other people based on one religion. If you want to follow the rules that your text has set forth, then follow them. Don't punish others for wanting to follow something different. [EDIT: Predicting arguments against this, I realize you'll just say "well what if I follow the work of SATAN and I want to go around murdering everyone." Keep it within reason. I'm atheist, but I've always followed my own rule of "as long as it's not purposefully hurting another".]

When you eventually do die, we'll just have to see (or not see) who's right.

+1 for Squeek's argument.

[Tokzic]

Originally Posted by Bolth mannn

lol the classic response:

show me proof he doesnt exist
show me proof he DOES exist.

need I say more.
PS: im not telling you anything, you believe what you want, theres no proof against christianity.

So I have a blue alien that lives in my closet. He wears a green hat with pink polka dots and he floats around the room when we're alone. However, I'm the only one who sees him. He is incredibly shy and turns invisible when other people are around.

According to your broken thinking, you have no evidence to prove that he does not, therefore he must be real.

There is no difference between this and god and jesus whatsoever.

[ieatyourlvllol]

Basically...

The inability to prove the existence of something does not necessarily guarantee its nonexistence.

The inability to disprove the existence of something does not necessarily guarantee its existence.

it's a mystery oooo